Incompetence. Mind, it will be temporary
VAR Decisions - PL 19/20 Season
- Thread starter edcunited1878
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Actually, the new handball rule has (for the most part) taken interpretation out of the scenario. We may not agree with how it's called now, but it's pretty clear cut these days. As for the panellists, just because they played/managed at the top level doesn't mean they are experts. In fact, some of the panellists are anything but and are responsible for sharing so much misinformation about the laws of the game that people take as fact because they put too much faith in these people. And yes, I am all for VAR, but I want it to be used correctly. You've made your argument for Kane, but there can't be any argument for Martial. It's a stonewall penalty that isn't given. So VAR got it wrong, or wasn't used. It's almost like they are misusing it so people will say "see, VAR doesn't work" and get rid of it. But it is fair to "agree to disagree" so I will just leave it at that, mind you, if you disagree you will be wrong ;-)
If he has said that, then I can only suggest corruption. I dont think you can get a more obvious penalty. The foul by Cahill was a red as well. Why dont they do like rugby when refs are positive to the attacking side and say to VAR I want to give a pen, red card but ask any reason why I cant?Well according to dermot Gallagher on ref watch it wasn’t a red for the challenge on martial and it wasn’t a penalty for the challenge on martial. Scrap it all because of they can’t get it right after 48 hours what chance have they got in 60 seconds
Said more on the actual show but pretty sure he backs his mates up on most cases
https://www.skysports.com/football/...analyses-a-weekend-of-tight-penalty-decisions
An obvious penalty was not given to Matip yesterday. Are the VAR room not allowed to give feedback if the ref doesn't ask for it?
https://www.benchwarmers.ie/footbal...inst-newcastle-whats-the-point-of-var/212712/
https://www.benchwarmers.ie/footbal...inst-newcastle-whats-the-point-of-var/212712/
That disallowed Spurs goal is the stupidest shit I've seen. Doesn't look offside at all with the picture, then they piss about with the lines and somehow manage to make one the tinniest bit ahead of the other.
Var obviously is a net benefit but things like marginal offsides and handball calls need sorting out because it's completely destroying moments in the game.
Var obviously is a net benefit but things like marginal offsides and handball calls need sorting out because it's completely destroying moments in the game.
Marginal offsides are still offside though.
Who was it if told me that var doesn’t rule out 1mm offsides & that I was scaremongering haha.
VAR is pathetic & is runining every goal incase someone in the build up is 1mm offside. Players will soon realise this & goal celebrations will be more low key just incase
VAR is pathetic & is runining every goal incase someone in the build up is 1mm offside. Players will soon realise this & goal celebrations will be more low key just incase
I will say thus far, and it is early days, we seem to be making the biggest mess of VAR I've seen, but you'd expect nothing less from the PL.
love how this old load of cobblers still gets thrown around. That'll never happen.Really? Airier looked an absolute tit with his celebrations then. Sure he’ll be less into it next tine he ‘scores’
Tech is apparently quite precise, so I say, go for it.
It would take years and years of VAR taking away many many goals for it to ever have the influence you think. The natural reaction when a goal is scored is to celebrate, that's not changing anytime soon.
So celebrations go back to being the low-key handshakes and pats-on-the-back of 40 years ago. That sounds great to me!
Big supporter of VAR, but ffs they need to get some tolerance in there. The second that happens to United I'd be absolutely livid.
Definitely makes me think twice with goals now as a fan to be honest.
How precise is it?
Not sure, read about it on reddit once, and can't find it now. Think it was posted in one of the VAR threads on Cafe, will try to find it.
Previously I was certain it wasn't really precise, but it appears I might have been wrong.
What BS is this? Its depends on their interpretation of where the shoulder starts. Fking stupid.
A margin of error has to be introduced.
A margin of error has to be introduced.
Thanks, cos I don't know. Kind of wonder if there should be a margin of error but I guess it depends on how accurate it is.
How they we even know if it was the exact micro moment where the Tottenham player made the pass? And they way the lines are drawn is so arbitrary.
That was a ridiculous intervention. We're talking about a mm here and there are a fair few assumptions here- including time at which ball was released, Add to that the lines are drawn assuming camera to be in line with that of the last defender- which is unlikely to be the case
Plus the fact they are manually moving the lines to determine the furthest forward part of the body to draw their stupid lines. Anyone who thinks that those decisions are accurate is bonkers.
Thanks, mate, that's the one.
That is one of the worst decisions I’ve ever seen. VAR does not need to be getting involved with something that tight, it’s absolutely ridiculous.
What happened to clear and obvious errors? That wasn’t clear and obvious at all.
I swear they’re trying their best to piss everybody off with VAR to ruin it
What happened to clear and obvious errors? That wasn’t clear and obvious at all.
I swear they’re trying their best to piss everybody off with VAR to ruin it
Some football version of the Umpires Call from cricket could help in that situation. Leave it with the on-field call if it is as tight as that.
In general, I agree (when it comes to subjective calls like red cards and handballs).
The problem is though that they're actively telling linesmen to keep their flags down in tight situations to avoid flagging offside when VAR can intervene. If we were to use the "on-field decision stands" model, then we couldn't have a system where we're interfering with the officials' decision making.
For example: Ball goes through, linesman thinks it's offside but doesn't flag because he's told not to because VAR can check it later. VAR check says tight offside but it's marginal so on-field decision stands. We then have a situation where the linesman thinks it's offside, VAR confirms it was offside, and somehow we're stuck with a goal that stands.
Are they though?
That call has to be so precise even the bagginess of the shirt would effect it, when the pass was played, those lines drawn on is not accurate, they’re quite laughable.
So, to be honest I have my doubts that offside is actually offside. We need goal line technology accuracy if we’re going to be splitting gnats arse hairs over offside
Put it in the bin.
Then do a VAR check to make sure it’s in there please.
Then do a VAR check to make sure it’s in there please.
Or just build an extra margin of error into VAR offsides, which would be much more easily done if that's what people want. For example, if there's overlap between the two offside lines (which are both of predetermined width) then the onfield decision stands.
Really though offsides aren't a particularly big issue with VAR. As is it's as accurate as it is humanly possible to be, which is an exponential improvement on the accuracy of offsides without VAR. If you add in the extra margin of error it will be the same but with slightly more leeway towards the attackers. Either way it's accurate enough that most people will shrug and go along with it without much objection.
It's on subjective decisions where all the confusion, bile and controversy really resides. Particularly decisions *not* given.
Agree with all that, I find myself agreeing with you quite often in this thread.
My post was more a post to those who constantly repeat offside is offside, whether it’s 1mm or not, its offside. When quite clearly, that’s not the case.
No. Linesmen are told to let the play end and then make the call(whether to raise the flag or not). In your example, if the linesman thinks it's offside, he lets the play end and then raises the flag
I absolutely love VAR, as long as the decision is accurate. It's unfair that all the team's hard work is ruined by a dopey or corrupt official in a moment of madness. Some clubs have been unfairly relegated due to bad ref decisions. However, I had difficulty separating the players in the Spurs decision today and I have some sympathy with Spurs because I am not sure it was that easy to conclude one way or the other and if I was the VAR ref I would have allowed the goal. It was so tight that even after watching replays a few times I still can't call it. But full credit to Pochettino, he didn't moan about it or blame the decision for the loss. As for goal celebrations, it's just a matter of time, but we will get used to it. In cricket it's common to wait as long as 2 minutes before celebrating a wicket and nobody complains. Cricket teams and tennis players even have review referrals which don't exist in football.
Last edited:
Yes, that goes for a situation where it doesn't lead to a goal. But if it ends up in a goal then he won't raise his flag until the ball's in the net, at which point he might just leave it down and let VAR handle it. Regardless, the instructions have interfered with his decision making, which is then used as a basis to let marginal calls go one way or the other.
All this effort spent on a minimal decision that everyone agrees is almost impossible to get right, and nobody would even blame the system for not being able to pick stuff like this up. Then watch again tomorrow when they easily disregard easy blatant mistakes from the ref, and fails to use VAR to actually try and manage the game fairly.
It was the easiest thing to predict, like ever.
The thing I just don't understand about VAR is the consistency in it.
Ball touches hand of attacker unintentionally - No goal
Ball touches hand of defender unintentionally - Goal, no penalty
Iffy penalty given / not given - VAR does not over rule because it's not "Clear and obvious"
Goal given that is 1mm offside (Arguable) - VAR over rules even though it is clearly not clear and obvious.
There is no consistency. It makes the game confusing.
The only upside I can see to it is that in a situation like Leicester yesterday, their fans got a right laugh.
Really hate it. It should only be used to over turn absolutely blatant mistakes. None of these, ooooohhh that's a bit harsh or oh he's 1mm offside if you get out a ruler and a load of design software.
It's ruining the game, If I was a linesman now I would never raise my flag. Why should I? All I can do is make a mistake, if I never flag offside then I never make an error. If I was an attacker, I'd never fully celebrate a goal (Unless it was a 30 yard screamer that has no option of being over turned).
Ball touches hand of attacker unintentionally - No goal
Ball touches hand of defender unintentionally - Goal, no penalty
Iffy penalty given / not given - VAR does not over rule because it's not "Clear and obvious"
Goal given that is 1mm offside (Arguable) - VAR over rules even though it is clearly not clear and obvious.
There is no consistency. It makes the game confusing.
The only upside I can see to it is that in a situation like Leicester yesterday, their fans got a right laugh.
Really hate it. It should only be used to over turn absolutely blatant mistakes. None of these, ooooohhh that's a bit harsh or oh he's 1mm offside if you get out a ruler and a load of design software.
It's ruining the game, If I was a linesman now I would never raise my flag. Why should I? All I can do is make a mistake, if I never flag offside then I never make an error. If I was an attacker, I'd never fully celebrate a goal (Unless it was a 30 yard screamer that has no option of being over turned).
If it's a goal VAR will have a look anyways, but no. Linesmen are instructed to make the call. The instructions don't interfere with decision making, if anything VAR makes it easier for them to make a decision in situations where they're not sure what they saw(because if they make a mistake, it's either not important, or VAR can correct it)