Was Moyes really our first choice to replace Ferguson? - Mourinho confirms he was offered the job

[Raul Madrid]

Mourinho was still a great manager in 2013. He could perhaps have had 2 or 3 great years at united like he did at madrid.

 

[always_hoping]

Hard to know how things would be nowadays if a more suitable replacement was brought in directly after Ferguson retirement. Moyes brought in was as stupid as Liverpool did in the early 90s with Souness.

Mourihno was more at his peak back then than the eventual washed up version United got years later but he always leaves a toxic environment behind and the likes of Matt Judge and Ed Woodward would still be over transfers which as we found out was swimming against the tide for any manager.

​

 

[AFIABM]

He would definitely have had United challenging, perhaps won a title as well. The club was already fecked when Mourinho came in 2016 - and in hindsight he probably over performed.

Going in the opposite direction to Van Gaal with a manager liked Mourinho was part of what demonstrated the direction the club was going in

 

[Reds Under The Bed]

Hard to know how things would be nowadays if a more suitable replacement was brought in directly after Ferguson retirement. Moyes brought in was as stupid as Liverpool did in the early 90s with Souness.

Mourihno was more at his peak back then than the eventual washed up version United got years later but he always leaves a toxic environment behind and the likes of Matt Judge and Ed Woodward would still be over transfers which as we found out was swimming against the tide for any manager.

​

Souness on paper looked an inspired choice having put Rangers back at the top of Scottish football at the time, thankfully for us it turned out to be anything but.

 

[CM]

It makes a lot more sense than the version of events that was peddled at the time. As much as I dislike Mourinho, I would've been more receptive to him being the man to follow Ferguson than the washed up version we received after van Gaal was sacked.

He likes experienced squads so he probably would've wanted to inherit the squad Ferguson left behind, which was still full of winners. By the time he got here, a lot of those players had declined or been purged in favour of younger signings.

 

[AshRK]

Our squad was on its last legs though.

We probably finish 2nd again before the meltdown.

We would have signed players though. We spent chasing fellaini and Baines in 2013 , which would have been different had Jose been there.

Our squad was definitely on its last leg but was no way 7th level bad. Jose would have worked better with Rio Vidic Evra RVP Rooney Carrick Evans Welbeck Smalling Jones compared to whatever Moyes smoked

 

[sugar_kane]

Whether Mourinho joins in 2013 or not we still end up in a complete mess - just a couple of seasons later than we did, after he’s completely burn down the dressing room and Woodward is let loose on rebuilding the squad and hiring manager after manager with completely different philosophies.

 

[ClosetDevil]

Shame we dodged the bullet once just to catch it later on.

Still, makes sense to me that Moyes wasn't first pick, and fits with some of Ferguson's previous comments. Clearly he and the club overestimated Moyes as a manager, but the idea that Ferguson saw him as the single outstanding candidate in world football never rang true.

I don't think this could be said with any real certainty.

Inheriting a diabolical team being built around Fellaini, devoid of any confidence from flailing in the league under the leadership of a manager who clearly wasn't ready to manage this club, is vastly different from inheriting a title-winning team that just won the league by a large margin.

Apples and oranges.

 

[Bert_]

Whether Mourinho joins in 2013 or not we still end up in a complete mess - just a couple of seasons later than we did, after he’s completely burn down the dressing room and Woodward is let loose on rebuilding the squad and hiring manager after manager with completely different philosophies.

It would undoubtably have ended messy. As it always does with Mourinho. But he was our best shot at maintaining title challenging form with the team that had just won a title. He wouldn't have been crushed by comparisons to SAF, he would have revelled in it. Had the ego and belief he'd do better. Let him spend the infamous "war chest" and we'd probably have had at least one more title. Then the next manager doesn't have the pressure of having to live up to SAF and inherits a team of winners. Half the battle already won.

 

[Gazza]

Yet nobody had actually appointed him. He was a good manager but not good enough. He was never anywhere close to being the outstanding candidate for the Man United job. It needed a proven winner. It got a yet to be proven loser.

Yep. The rewriting comes from those who try to make out that Moyes was hung out to dry, as opposed to being way out of depth. Even in 2013, the majority opinion on the Caf was that it should be Mourinho. The concerns and doubts about Moyes were quietened by a "your job now is to stand by our new manager" call to arms, but they were always there.

 

[elmo]

Why's he still talking about us when he just took the Real Madrid job?

 

[Robertd0803]

Why's he still talking about us when he just took the Real Madrid job?

Its his new Netflix/Prime documentary thats been released.

 

[Zoo]

Mourinho would have been shit as well and left us with long term damage. The man to get was Ancelotti

 

[lex talionis]

If I understand this right, Mourinho made a commitment to two different clubs. That's a bit shit.

 

[Dominant]

Quite obvious isn’t it? He got cold feet at the thought of being the sucker to succeed SAF directly and don’t want to risk tarnishing his legacy (He still had one then).

 

[sugar_kane]

I don’t really quite understand the story - he “signed” to be Manchester United manager, which implies something contractual and binding - then he says he’s having to back out because he’s “given his word” to Chelsea.

Which came first? Because neither makes sense if they happened second, which makes me think there’s a lot of spin going on here from Jose’s side (Fergie doesn’t really have any reason to lie about it)

I suspect he just had talks to take over, and the producers decide to make it sound like he pulled out because of “his word” without really caring whether it made sense or not.

 

[11101]

I have difficulty believing him here. One of the great managers, at the peak of his powers, is offered the biggest job in football and turns it down? I dont buy it.

 

[Offside]

I have difficulty believing him here. One of the great managers, at the peak of his powers, is offered the biggest job in football and turns it down? I dont buy it.

Wasn’t at the peak of his powers in his third season at Madrid was he? That’s exactly the reason he probably went back to Chelsea instead. Wanted to feel loved and took the safer option.

 

[davidmichael]

The problem was the club believed that 1. Sir Alex left behind a squad good enough to dominate the league regardless of the manager 2. Moyes would grow into the role and be a long term manager like Sir Alex and 3. The club were clueless from Moyes up about what was needed as they had zero winning mentality.

Back in 2013 the four biggest managers were Sir Alex, Pep, Ancelotti and Jose and players still wanted to play for Jose back then so if as Sir Alex hinted at and Evra has confirmed Ronaldo wanted to come back and the deal was in place then Jose being our manager would have sealed it along with other big names.

I’ve always believed that Jose was the only person who could have followed Sir Alex and even though it would have played out the same way as Jose has a third season meltdown everywhere he’d have won the league in our first season post Sir Alex as we had De Gea, Rio, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Rooney and RVP so had the nucleus which adding Ronaldo at that time in his career is a very strong core.

We had the likes of Smalling, Jones, Evans, Rafael, Fabio, Lingard, Zaha, Januzaj and Welbeck all 25 and under and Jose being Jose would have added established quality to the squad in positions needed as he’s a short term manager who wants immediate success and trophies and his ego wouldn’t handle not winning trophies at United.

The question should never have been who followed Sir Alex as it always should have been Jose, the real question should have been who followed Jose once he had the inevitable meltdown. We’d have had two years to work on who would come in post Jose like Ancelotti or Pochettino or even Blanc and maybe by then the powers that be would have seen the days of 20+ year managers like Sir Alex was gone.

 

[Bangor_Red]

The problem was the club believed that 1. Sir Alex left behind a squad good enough to dominate the league regardless of the manager 2. Moyes would grow into the role and be a long term manager like Sir Alex and 3. The club were clueless from Moyes up about what was needed as they had zero winning mentality.

Back in 2013 the four biggest managers were Sir Alex, Pep, Ancelotti and Jose and players still wanted to play for Jose back then so if as Sir Alex hinted at and Evra has confirmed Ronaldo wanted to come back and the deal was in place then Jose being our manager would have sealed it along with other big names.

I’ve always believed that Jose was the only person who could have followed Sir Alex and even though it would have played out the same way as Jose has a third season meltdown everywhere he’d have won the league in our first season post Sir Alex as we had De Gea, Rio, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Rooney and RVP so had the nucleus which adding Ronaldo at that time in his career is a very strong core.

We had the likes of Smalling, Jones, Evans, Rafael, Fabio, Lingard, Zaha, Januzaj and Welbeck all 25 and under and Jose being Jose would have added established quality to the squad in positions needed as he’s a short term manager who wants immediate success and trophies and his ego wouldn’t handle not winning trophies at United.

The question should never have been who followed Sir Alex as it always should have been Jose, the real question should have been who followed Jose once he had the inevitable meltdown. We’d have had two years to work on who would come in post Jose like Ancelotti or Pochettino or even Blanc and maybe by then the powers that be would have seen the days of 20+ year managers like Sir Alex was gone.

I always wanted Jose as he was the only personality at that time big enough to be fergies successor, he wouldnt have stayed forever but would have been successful while allowing the pressure to subside for the follow up managers coming in after

 

[fps]

The problem was the club believed that 1. Sir Alex left behind a squad good enough to dominate the league regardless of the manager 2. Moyes would grow into the role and be a long term manager like Sir Alex and 3. The club were clueless from Moyes up about what was needed as they had zero winning mentality.

Back in 2013 the four biggest managers were Sir Alex, Pep, Ancelotti and Jose and players still wanted to play for Jose back then so if as Sir Alex hinted at and Evra has confirmed Ronaldo wanted to come back and the deal was in place then Jose being our manager would have sealed it along with other big names.

I’ve always believed that Jose was the only person who could have followed Sir Alex and even though it would have played out the same way as Jose has a third season meltdown everywhere he’d have won the league in our first season post Sir Alex as we had De Gea, Rio, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Rooney and RVP so had the nucleus which adding Ronaldo at that time in his career is a very strong core.

We had the likes of Smalling, Jones, Evans, Rafael, Fabio, Lingard, Zaha, Januzaj and Welbeck all 25 and under and Jose being Jose would have added established quality to the squad in positions needed as he’s a short term manager who wants immediate success and trophies and his ego wouldn’t handle not winning trophies at United.

The question should never have been who followed Sir Alex as it always should have been Jose, the real question should have been who followed Jose once he had the inevitable meltdown. We’d have had two years to work on who would come in post Jose like Ancelotti or Pochettino or even Blanc and maybe by then the powers that be would have seen the days of 20+ year managers like Sir Alex was gone.

This entirely. Jose would have been able to come in, command respect, keep the big players working. As importantly, he would have been able to tell inexperienced higher-ups what exactly needed doing next, and it would have given time for people to truly understand that Sir Alex was gone and they needed to put a plan together before that inevitable Season 3 explosion.

 

[Oranges038]

The problem was the club believed that 1. Sir Alex left behind a squad good enough to dominate the league regardless of the manager 2. Moyes would grow into the role and be a long term manager like Sir Alex and 3. The club were clueless from Moyes up about what was needed as they had zero winning mentality.

Back in 2013 the four biggest managers were Sir Alex, Pep, Ancelotti and Jose and players still wanted to play for Jose back then so if as Sir Alex hinted at and Evra has confirmed Ronaldo wanted to come back and the deal was in place then Jose being our manager would have sealed it along with other big names.

I’ve always believed that Jose was the only person who could have followed Sir Alex and even though it would have played out the same way as Jose has a third season meltdown everywhere he’d have won the league in our first season post Sir Alex as we had De Gea, Rio, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Rooney and RVP so had the nucleus which adding Ronaldo at that time in his career is a very strong core.

We had the likes of Smalling, Jones, Evans, Rafael, Fabio, Lingard, Zaha, Januzaj and Welbeck all 25 and under and Jose being Jose would have added established quality to the squad in positions needed as he’s a short term manager who wants immediate success and trophies and his ego wouldn’t handle not winning trophies at United.

The question should never have been who followed Sir Alex as it always should have been Jose, the real question should have been who followed Jose once he had the inevitable meltdown. We’d have had two years to work on who would come in post Jose like Ancelotti or Pochettino or even Blanc and maybe by then the powers that be would have seen the days of 20+ year managers like Sir Alex was gone.

I've always belived that Jose should never have been let near the place, back then or when he eventually did get the job.

 

[Apokalips]

Sounds like Mourinho had agreed to go to United before Chelsea came calling.

I would love to hear the full story. Jose's post match interview always stood out to me as odd and it is clear he felt sad on Fergie's behalf for that to be how his last CL game ended.

I did have someone tell me that Jose was returning to Chelsea in around December before he did. They had work interactions with Roman and other senior execs at Chelsea but I didn't believe them enough as it sounded random and fanciful but turned out to be true.

 

[The Brown Bull]

I've always belived that Jose should never have been let near the place, back then or when he eventually did get the job.

Yeah, agree with this. I thought Jose was a good manager but I didn't want him at United. I wanted Pep to replace SAF and admit to being disappointed when he didn't.
. Moyes wasn't ever in my thoughts to replace SAF.

 

[Dominos]

Fergie lying about it would be weird though.

Seen quite a few United fans on twitter refusing to believe this too, even Ferguson's confirmation isn't enough to convince them.

For so many years United fans repeated the idea he was begging for the United job when we played Madrid in that final season, that Mourinho was bitter we turned him down, the Spanish journalist fabricated the story about Mourinho crying in Madrid that Moyes had got the job over him and United fans just regurgitated it. Now some can't accept they've been repeating mistruths for over a decade.

The evidence that we wanted Mourinho and Ancelotti has been out there since 2014, nearly everyone ignored it.

It also shows how many of the UK journos are just the mouthpiece of United who will put out whatever the club tells them to. Castles seems to be the only one who put out the correct version of events in 13 years.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

He would have failed as he did a few years later

 

[andy0]

If I understand this right, Mourinho made a commitment to two different clubs. That's a bit shit.

In 1993 I set off to drive to Sweden, annoyed that Roy Keane was signing for Blackburn. If was he was about to move, why on earth weren't United in for him.

 

[saivet]

Seen quite a few United fans on twitter refusing to believe this too, even Ferguson's confirmation isn't enough to convince them.

For so many years United fans repeated the idea he was begging for the United job when we played Madrid in that final season, that Mourinho was bitter we turned him down, the Spanish journalist fabricated the story about Mourinho crying in Madrid that Moyes had got the job over him and United fans just regurgitated it. Now some can't accept they've been repeating mistruths for over a decade.

The evidence that we wanted Mourinho and Ancelotti has been out there since 2014, nearly everyone ignored it.

It also shows how many of the UK journos are just the mouthpiece of United who will put out whatever the club tells them to. Castles seems to be the only one who put out the correct version of events in 13 years.

Also reports of SAF meeting Pep in New York, while he was on his sabbatical. Naturally, it wasn't so obvious when Moyes was appointed but like you say, none of this is much news. The Pep reports seemed like SAF was sounding him out should he retire, rather than offering him the job (was September 2012). It would be interesting to know the timings on Mourinho and Ancelotti.

 

[Zen86]

I like Mourinho as a character and for the entertainment factor, but never wanted him here. That said, he would have done a better job than Moyes that first summer. We would certainly have dithered less in the market and he would have pushed for more signings. It would have still ended the same way more than likely though, that team was done.

 

[davidmichael]

I always wanted Jose as he was the only personality at that time big enough to be fergies successor, he wouldnt have stayed forever but would have been successful while allowing the pressure to subside for the follow up managers coming in after

Exactly, it needed a big personality who the players would instantly respect to give the same amount as they did for Sir Alex whilst also having an ego that wouldn’t allow us to not win trophies

This entirely. Jose would have been able to come in, command respect, keep the big players working. As importantly, he would have been able to tell inexperienced higher-ups what exactly needed doing next, and it would have given time for people to truly understand that Sir Alex was gone and they needed to put a plan together before that inevitable Season 3 explosion.

Having Jose come in as a short term bridge from Sir Alex to the next person and having the inevitable two years to plan for Jose’s successor should have been the way to go to continue the on pitch success whilst the higher ups had less spotlight to try and figure things out upstairs, our free fall put even more pressure on the clueless higher ups as they were fecking things up on the pitch and off the pitch so were constantly reactive instead of proactive.

I've always belived that Jose should never have been let near the place, back then or when he eventually did get the job.

There was only three people back then who could follow Sir Alex which were Jose, Pep and Ancelotti and Pep had already agreed to join Bayern and Ancelotti had already agreed to join Real

Yeah, agree with this. I thought Jose was a good manager but I didn't want him at United. I wanted Pep to replace SAF and admit to being disappointed when he didn't.
. Moyes wasn't ever in my thoughts to replace SAF.

By the time Sir Alex decided to retire Pep had already agreed to join Bayern so wasn’t an option and Pep wouldn’t have been able to do for us what he did at City as City basically created the entire footballing department around Pep coming in, there’s always been talk of Pep agreeing to go to City once the build was completed and Bayern was effectively a bridge to kill time

 

[buchansleftleg]

We'd have had a 1 year honeymoon period but the second Jose wanted to rebuild and buy lots of established pricey replacements then he would have fallen foul of the leeches sooner or later.

He leaves a sulphurous trail wherever he goes!

 

[ErikElevenHag]

Nothing would have been different. United might have won the league in 2014, or gone close, but Mourinho was still on the rebound from Real Madrid where - to put it bluntly but correctly - he failed. He was a failure at Madrid and he knew it and he ran home to Chelsea and imploded. He would have imploded at United too.

You say he imploded, but before that happened he managed to win them a premier league title.

Most of us would bite your hand off for a 2 year manager spell which brings a premier league title, even if it's branded as an 'implosion'

 

[macheda14]

I like Mourinho as a character and for the entertainment factor, but never wanted him here. That said, he would have done a better job than Moyes that first summer. We would certainly have dithered less in the market and he would have pushed for more signings. It would have still ended the same way more than likely though, that team was done.

I honestly think we’d be in a much better position overall. We had a team of premier league winners, he would have got signings, the players would have bought in and we could have won a leg within two years. There were a lot of players that were done, but also others who still had two seasons if managed well.

After Jose implodes in season three. 1, the new board have some understanding on what it takes to win a league and Woodward probably doesn’t start thinking he knows about football and inserting his thoughts on it all and 2, we can probably hire a better manager than all the ones. Yes we obviously went went on to hire Jose anyway, but that was after his final point of relevance in the wider football style. We would have hired and sacked him a few years earlier than we did and moved on.

 

[jimmyb2000]

The combination of Woodward as Chief Executive and Moyes as the manager was the double whammy that hurtled the club into the mediocrity that it is still trying to escape from now.

We could have got away with Ed in charge if we'd had decent world class managers who were in their prime.

We could have got away with Moyes if we'd still had Gill or the likes in charge.

Sadly, this Laurel and Hardy act destroyed the club within 8 months to the point that not a vestige of hope remained.

We've been chasing our tails ever since.

 

[Zen86]

I honestly think we’d be in a much better position overall. We had a team of premier league winners, he would have got signings, the players would have bought in and we could have won a leg within two years. There were a lot of players that were done, but also others who still had two seasons if managed well.

After Jose implodes in season three. 1, the new board have some understanding on what it takes to win a league and Woodward probably doesn’t start thinking he knows about football and inserting his thoughts on it all and 2, we can probably hire a better manager than all the ones. Yes we obviously went went on to hire Jose anyway, but that was after his final point of relevance in the wider football style. We would have hired and sacked him a few years earlier than we did and moved on.

That team Fergie left behind was pretty done I thought, it was a miracle he managed to win the league with them. Years of underinvestment coming home to roost and I think a rebuild was needed before we could reach those heights again.

Mourinho would’ve have pushed us in the transfer window better than Moyes but would have still been hamstrung by Woodward, who fundamentally didn’t know what he was doing. Let’s also not pretend that Mourinho’s approach to transfers would have been healthy for us then.

It’s all ifs and buts at this point. We would have fared a bit better in the short term but I think we still end up in the same place.

 

[KStandBarmyArmy1993]

That team Fergie left behind was pretty done I thought, it was a miracle he managed to win the league with them. Years of underinvestment coming home to roost and I think a rebuild was needed before we could reach those heights again.

Mourinho would’ve have pushed us in the transfer window better than Moyes but would have still been hamstrung by Woodward, who fundamentally didn’t know what he was doing. Let’s also not pretend that Mourinho’s approach to transfers would have been healthy for us then.

It’s all ifs and buts at this point. We would have fared a bit better in the short term but I think we still end up in the same place.

A miracle is a bit of stretch. We had two succesive seasons hitting 89 points.

We had the best striker in the league and Rooney was still capable of performing.

Had a good keeper in De Gea who was only getting better.

Evans, Carrick, Valencia and Young who were all good and experienced players.

The likes of Rafael, Jones, Smalling who with the right coaching (and some luck) would have become great players.

We needed maybe 2 or 3 top players to build on what we had. Woodward's feck up of a transfer window cost Moyes badly and even Mourinho would have struggled.

 

[LoyalUnitedFan]

A miracle is a bit of stretch. We had two succesive seasons hitting 89 points.

We had the best striker in the league and Rooney was still capable of performing.

Had a good keeper in De Gea who was only getting better.

Evans, Carrick, Valencia and Young who were all good and experienced players.

The likes of Rafael, Jones, Smalling who with the right coaching (and some luck) would have become great players.

We needed maybe 2 or 3 top players to build on what we had. Woodward's feck up of a transfer window cost Moyes badly and even Mourinho would have struggled.

and Fergie got Thiago (and Moyes stopped deal the because he hadn't watched him before), Powell and Zaha deals done before he left as well

 

[Suedesi]

Saw the Netflix documentary last night: https://www.netflix.com/search?q=Mourinho

Fergie said Mourinho had agreed to join United, but then one evening Mou called him in tears and said he couldn’t do it because he had already given his word to Chelsea. Fergie said he understood, although he was obviously disappointed.

Mourinho has always been very emotional. I think he felt he had unfinished business with Roman, so he went back to Chelsea, only to get fired all over again.

A very stupid decision from a very intelligent manager.

I feel he may be doing something similar by going back to Madrid now.

Though the difference is that his career is on a very different trajectory these days. After Spurs, Roma, Fenerbahçe and Benfica (solid B teams by his old standards) he probably needs a big job whenever one becomes available, however much of a poisoned chalice it might be.

 

[Berbasbullet]

Saw the Netflix documentary last night: https://www.netflix.com/search?q=Mourinho

Fergie said Mourinho had agreed to join United, but then one evening Mou called him in tears and said he couldn’t do it because he had already given his word to Chelsea. Fergie said he understood, although he was obviously disappointed.

Mourinho has always been very emotional. I think he felt he had unfinished business with Roman, so he went back to Chelsea, only to get fired all over again.

A very stupid decision from a very intelligent manager.

I feel he may be doing something similar by going back to Madrid now.

Though the difference is that his career is on a very different trajectory these days. After Spurs, Roma, Fenerbahçe and Benfica (solid B teams by his old standards) he probably needs a big job whenever one becomes available, however much of a poisoned chalice it might be.

Yeah it’s Madrid or bust for him now.

 

[Suedesi]

The combination of Woodward as Chief Executive and Moyes as the manager was the double whammy that hurtled the club into the mediocrity that it is still trying to escape from now.

We could have got away with Ed in charge if we'd had decent world class managers who were in their prime.

We could have got away with Moyes if we'd still had Gill or the likes in charge.

Sadly, this Laurel and Hardy act destroyed the club within 8 months to the point that not a vestige of hope remained.

We've been chasing our tails ever since.

I think Ed with Mou would/could have worked out in 2013. For a bit anyways. As in Mou would call the football shots and Ed would leave him in peace and provide the players and handle the commercials - where he was good at.

By 2016, Ed was a different animal. He thought he was a franchise GM. He had agents and leeches around him. He thought he knew ball and obviously it was a disaster.