Wayne Rooney's legacy

Mockney

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You don't have to be a United fanatic to be the club legend.

He's a scouse, played for us, became a legend. What more do you want?

Just because one transfer request in the money age of football?

It's easier to be a United loyal dog when united is the only money powerhouse. Not today, not anymore.

Rooney wrote his legendary feats in the club's history, nothing will change that, and he should be treated as a club legend.
And he will be. A few online weirdos with a bee in their bonnet intent on arguing the small print aren't going to change that. In fact the further away we get from his playing career, the more intently he'll be revered.

No one these days remembers how ignominiously George Best left the club in '74. The season we were relegated, which he'd spent largely either drunk or AWOL (or in one instant, nicked!)... Just as no one in 10 or 20 years will remember that one bit of mid-season drama where Rooney criticised our ambition whilst 2nd, but then went on to score our 19th title winning goal, as well as in the Champions League final, and then continued playing for us for another 5 years. The big shit.

The OP can huff and puff and shift the goalposts all he likes, but at the end of the day (and all the subsequent days after) the most talented English player since Gazza, who played at the highest level from 17 to 30, and ended his career as both Man Utd and England's greatest goal scorer, beating records that had stood for nearly half a Century, will be regarded as a legend in every way imaginable, by anyone who matters.

However much anyone whinges, they're howling into the wind.
 
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P-Nut

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He'll be remembered as an all time great in 40-50 years.

EDIT: To add a bit more to the above, he's got the stats of all time top goalscorer in 2 huge teams, plus his highlight reel is unbelievable. Just think, you've got the City overhead, Newcastle volley, hat-trick on debut etc. They'll cement him as one of the best players to play the game.
 

POF

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I always remember the smart money would have been on Rooney becoming the best player in the world rather than Ronaldo in their first two seasons together. Rooney's 05-06 season in particular was an improvement on what had been a really impressive first season the year before. That injury vs Chelsea at the end of the season and him being rushed back for the FA cup can't have helped him. It's fair to say he had a few setbacks that halted him when things were going really great (the injury against Bayern being another)

He's still a legend in my eyes. One of my favourite Rooney goals was just before he was about to be subbed in a match vs Chelsea in 08. You can tell he was in absolute agony and had to get off the pitch but he sprinted on to a bad pass near Chelsea's box and buried a shot past Chec. Even in his celebration he looked in so much pain but he just wanted to score that goal :D
By "smart money" you really mean "British media". Rooney was more mature at the time (both mentally and physically) but talent wise, there was no question who had the more talent.

Ronaldo had lightning quick feet, electrifying pace, great athleticism, was good in the air, was two footed and had a fantastic shot. He was very raw but electrifying.

One of the reasons why people have reservations about Rooney's career is because he was overhyped throughout. Appreciate him for what he was. A fantastic player and great goal scorer who was a level below the truly elite.

Unfortunately, throughout his career he was labelled as a world class player consistently being undermined by his own selflessness and being "played out of position".
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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By "smart money" you really mean "British media". Rooney was more mature at the time (both mentally and physically) but talent wise, there was no question who had the more talent.

Ronaldo had lightning quick feet, electrifying pace, great athleticism, was good in the air, was two footed and had a fantastic shot. He was very raw but electrifying.

One of the reasons why people have reservations about Rooney's career is because he was overhyped throughout. Appreciate him for what he was. A fantastic player and great goal scorer who was a level below the truly elite.

Unfortunately, throughout his career he was labelled as a world class player consistently being undermined by his own selflessness and being "played out of position".
He was world class though.
 

Mockney

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By "smart money" you really mean "British media". Rooney was more mature at the time (both mentally and physically) but talent wise, there was no question who had the more talent.

Ronaldo had lightning quick feet, electrifying pace, great athleticism, was good in the air, was two footed and had a fantastic shot. He was very raw but electrifying.

One of the reasons why people have reservations about Rooney's career is because he was overhyped throughout. Appreciate him for what he was. A fantastic player and great goal scorer who was a level below the truly elite.

Unfortunately, throughout his career he was labelled as a world class player consistently being undermined by his own selflessness and being "played out of position".
Eeeh...I mean, ish?... He obviously never became a truly top tier player... But at the same time, our notion of what a "truly top tier player" was, or is, has shifted massively in the era of Messi and Ronaldo...

10 years ago, no one expected top tier players to be scoring a goal a game, or even near. Let alone continuing their prime for a full decade! In the pre-R&M footballing landscape, Rooney was a spectacular player who fully lived up to his potential (if you'd said at 18 that he'd end up as Utd and England's top scorer, with every club honour to his name, most would've considered that successful) But since Ronny and Messi came to prominence (and especially since he played alongside one of them) he ended up being judged by a new metric for what a "great" player was....

Statistically - in goals, assists, big game influence, trophies, longevity, anything you care to mention - his numbers stack up against any of our other legends (Cantona scored 88 goals, didn't peak 'till 26 and retired at 30) ... But as a contemporary of Ronaldo, Rooney's "success" has been judged relatively... And by that metric (however reasonable) he's a tad lacking, for sure.
 
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kouroux

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By "smart money" you really mean "British media". Rooney was more mature at the time (both mentally and physically) but talent wise, there was no question who had the more talent.

Ronaldo had lightning quick feet, electrifying pace, great athleticism, was good in the air, was two footed and had a fantastic shot. He was very raw but electrifying.

One of the reasons why people have reservations about Rooney's career is because he was overhyped throughout. Appreciate him for what he was. A fantastic player and great goal scorer who was a level below the truly elite.

Unfortunately, throughout his career he was labelled as a world class player consistently being undermined by his own selflessness and being "played out of position".
Yes, the whole "White Pele" was OTT
 

Fridge chutney

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One of the greatest players to wear our shirt and a generational talent.

He stayed loyal, that's all that matters.

Legend.
 

NewGlory

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Amazing goal-scorer, but I can't forget the bad taste from him saying this (in 2019!):

"Van Gaal is by far the best coach I have worked with - 100 percent," Rooney told the Daily Mirror. "His tactical skills, his way of preparing and his attention to the finest of details, I found amazing. "I admired that in him.
He won EPL and Champions League under the greatest coach ever, SAF, but he says Van eff-ing Gaal was "by far" the best? WTF, seriously?
 

POF

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Eeeh...I mean, ish?... He obviously never became a truly top tier player... But at the same time, our notion of what a "truly top tier player" was, or is, has shifted massively in the era of Messi and Ronaldo...

10 years ago, no one expected top tier players to be scoring a goal a game, or even near. Let alone continuing their prime for a full decade! In the pre-R&M footballing landscape, Rooney was a spectacular player who fully lived up to his potential (if you'd said at 18 that he'd end up as Utd and England's top scorer, with every club honour to his name, most would've considered that successful) But since Ronny and Messi came to prominence (and especially since he played alongside one of them) he ended up being judged by a new metric for what a "great" player was....

Statistically - in goals, assists, big game influence, trophies, longevity, anything you care to mention - his numbers stack up against any of our other legends (Cantona scored 88 goals, didn't peak 'till 26 and retired at 30) ... But as a contemporary of Ronaldo, Rooney's "success" has been judged relatively... And by that metric (however reasonable) he's a tad lacking, for sure.
It's not about stats or matching Messi and Ronaldo in terms of numbers. Rooney has great stats. It's about being the leading player in a successful team.

Rooney was best as "a" main player rather than "the" main player. When he was "the" main player, the team was less successful.

That's the difference between truly world class players and the level below. It's also the difference between players who thrived as the main man and those who didn't.

I remember Cantona's string of winners in 1-0 wins when United caught Newcastle up to win the title, RVP firing United to Fergie's last title, Ronaldo scoring goal after goal to win game after game when United won the double, Yorke and Cole terrorising Europe during the treble season.

With Rooney, my memory of him is more a great run of 10 games where he looked unplayable and then the next 6 where he looked like he couldn't trap a football.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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Amazing goal-scorer, but I can't forget the bad taste from him saying this (in 2019!):



He won EPL and Champions League under the greatest coach ever, SAF, but he says Van eff-ing Gaal was "by far" the best? WTF, seriously?
Rooney gave a credit to LVG for his tactical skills & his attention to the detail. I don’t see that as an issue if he thinks that way, we don’t know what’s going on behind the scene, may be LVG really do show more skills in his tactical work than Sir Alex did, fair to call him the best coach for the tactical aspect but not the best manager. Sir Alex on the other hand is known for his superb man management which what makes him what he is now. Man management skills plays bigger role in longevity of the success even if it’s only sports.
 

el3mel

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Amazing goal-scorer, but I can't forget the bad taste from him saying this (in 2019!):



He won EPL and Champions League under the greatest coach ever, SAF, but he says Van eff-ing Gaal was "by far" the best? WTF, seriously?
Things like this is what make him unlikable as a character, such quote is salty and has loads of BS, but still a legend on pitch nevertheless. Keane hit at Fergie several points and it still won't affect his state as a legend imo.

LvG did feck all at United from tactical perspective to make any player think he's "by far" the best coach in comparison to Fergie. His tactics were crap, we looked terribly boring, his subs were uninspiring and players looked way restricted on the pitch. Maybe in his prime days he was a good coach but he was a crap one at United for the enterity of his second season, and Rooney managed under that version. The quote is just probably a hit at both Fergie and Mourinho for Rooney's own reasons, and maybe repaying LvG for "My captain shall always play".
 

Jeppers7

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He didn't hand a transfer request in though mate not in 2010 anyway, Rooney said that at the time and it was confirmed in Fergies book. That summer when United began contract negotiations Rooney and his agent informed them he wouldn't be singing a new contract. So fair enough maybe it's semantics but telling the club you won't be renewing your contract and this idea fans have of a player charging into the managers office and slamming down a transfer request aren't exactly the same thing. Players in the modern game never actually put in transfer requests because they end up losing money through bonuses.

If you buy Fergusons view on this episode and that it wasn't about money and that Rooney genuinely wanted to move for ambition then lets be honest he was never moving to City in 2010. They hadn't even managed to qualify for the Champions League at that point or won a trophy. Rooney publicly said that he had wanted to move abroad when/if he left United. United/Ferguson would have never sold him to City everyone knew this, including Rooney and his agent. It was never going to tabloid bollocks.

So as i said mate beyond tabloid bollocks and third party anecdotal hearsay theres been no one involved that has confirmed there was actually anything in this story. Its been 10 years you'd think someone would have commented on it by now but not a peep from anyone on either side. For me that points towards it being nonsense.

Basically Rooney wants to leave United + City are United's bitter rivals and rich = Lets link Rooney to City that will get a shit tonne of clicks.
I remember the episode really well, I live in Manchester, worked looking at OT at the time. Time has moved on and you can try and paint all the pictures you want. Obviously you have strong feelings on the matter but at the time this wasnt a wishy washy story. This came out of the blue part way into a season, and it was happening. It was everywhere at the time. Not Rooney wants to leave and might go here, here or here......it was BANG Rooney is going to force through a move from City to United.

You're trying to paint it like it was some minor speculation, this was mid way through a season. If you're Sir Alex you don't just decide mid way through a season to make it public just because he's said he won't sign a new contract especially when speculation is rife. When SAF came out in his press conference he was confirming what EVERYONE knew at the time. Then Rooney came out with his statement. But yeah sure, he had nowhere really to go to. Maybe a nice trip abroad, who knows eh? We can sort all that out later.....let's just let everyone know now that I'm not signing a new contract.

But then he changed his mind and got a massive pay rise......but it was ambition that he stayed for? Jesus do me a favour.

Really? He came out part way through a season when speculation was EVERYWHERE that he was going to force a move to City.....to confirm he wanted to leave, the manager came out and confirmed it (but he never handed in a transfer request? ((he just did it) , although at the time he had no idea where he was going to move to, the city links came from nowhere and Rooney had no idea where he would move, just decided at that point to announce he wouldn't sign a new contract......then purely on the basis of AMBITION, changed his mind?

I can't wait for that fat bloke in red (Not Rooney this time) to climb down my chimney in a few weeks with the tooth fairy and the Easter bunny.
 

Jeppers7

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great post and agree 100% particularly about him having more potential than Ronaldo back in 04/05

a fantastic player who starred in arguably our best ever side
He never had more potential...he was just more mature for a teenager and had the physique of a grown man at 16. But touch, skill, pace, ability. Ronaldo was always way ahead. He just needed to channel it. When you see Ronaldo 06-08 Rooney, as fine a player as he was, never had that level of talent.
 

predator

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I do find it puzzling how overlooked Rooney is by our fanbase. From my experience I've found that the majority of middle aged mancunian united fans do not like him, simply because he is scouse. It's sad but its true.
Some of the sophisticated ones are convinced that he held a knife to fergie and Gills head and demanded 300k a week. Has anyone actually heard about his agent mr paul stretford and what input he had in the negotiations?

We signed an 18 year old scouser who became our highest goalscorer and englands highest goalscorer whilst achieving everything possible with us (bar the FA cup if IIRC). He was our best player for a good while, he scored goals that still to this day give me goosebumps.

Trivial yes, but his social media activity tells you all you need to know about his allegiance. He is a united legend easy
 

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I do find it puzzling how overlooked Rooney is by our fanbase. From my experience I've found that the majority of middle aged mancunian united fans do not like him, simply because he is scouse. It's sad but its true.
Some of the sophisticated ones are convinced that he held a knife to fergie and Gills head and demanded 300k a week. Has anyone actually heard about his agent mr paul stretford and what input he had in the negotiations?

We signed an 18 year old scouser who became our highest goalscorer and englands highest goalscorer whilst achieving everything possible with us (bar the FA cup if IIRC). He was our best player for a good while, he scored goals that still to this day give me goosebumps.

Trivial yes, but his social media activity tells you all you need to know about his allegiance. He is a united legend easy
won the FA cup with LVG. Towards the end he outstayed his welcome for both club and country. Maybe the best thing Jose done was handle Rooney out of the club
 

spaceboyRSA

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won the FA cup with LVG. Towards the end he outstayed his welcome for both club and country. Maybe the best thing Jose done was handle Rooney out of the club
Personally I dont blame rooney for "overstaying" his welcome. It's the managers job to handle that. Also, there had been so much change after fergie left, he at least was a bit of continuity.
 

predator

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won the FA cup with LVG. Towards the end he outstayed his welcome for both club and country. Maybe the best thing Jose done was handle Rooney out of the club
Yeah, I admired how Jose didnt pander to Rooneys influence at the club unlike his predecessors who worshipped the ground he walked on. It was clear to see that he wasnt good enough for us but I cannot slate him for naively, desperately trying to stay at the club where he played the majority of his career at, in the part of the world where his 4 kids have been educated etc.
 

tonnas

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who doesnt consider him a legend is simply an idiot! He is a top 5 club legend, record goalscorer who gave everything on the pitch and sacrificed his position multiple of times whilst still being a world class player!
 

clarkydaz

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Personally I dont blame rooney for "overstaying" his welcome. It's the managers job to handle that. Also, there had been so much change after fergie left, he at least was a bit of continuity.
understandable up to a point but when he started announcing to the press he was now a midfielder with his self proclaimed 'football intelligence' and stinking the place out every week doing it, he needed dealing with. it was such a relief Jose immediately scoffed at his floaty balls to the right. As with England,, striker in the qulaifiers then kane took his place so the team changed shape before the tournament to squeeze him in
 

predator

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who doesnt consider him a legend is simply an idiot! He is a top 5 club legend, record goalscorer who gave everything on the pitch and sacrificed his position multiple of times whilst still being a world class player!
You would be surprised how he is perceived by alot of United fans.

...Because he is scouse, he will never be appreciated as highly as the Frenchman cantona, by a lot of mancunian united fans, despite being twice the player cantona was and achieving 4 times the amount he did with us.

If rooney was born in the north east like Charlton, born in Belfast like george best or born in the greater Manchester hinterlands then he would undeniably be regarded as one of our greatest ever players, if not the best.
 

Ibrahimorich

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Should've left 4 years earlier. Tainted his legacy by stinking up the place while drawing an enormous paycheck. Was shit for 25% of his United career pretty much.
 

Nick7

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Excellent player. Wasn’t good enough his last couple of years here though. Shame about the threatening to leave when he was good. That tainted my view of him.
 

The White Pele

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Should've left 4 years earlier. Tainted his legacy by stinking up the place while drawing an enormous paycheck. Was shit for 25% of his United career pretty much.
And yet people use his transfer request as another stick to beat him with.
 

SER19

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Club legend, incredible player that at is best would walk into any team. Bailed us out loads of times, wonder goals, never gave less than his all. Unfairly viewed due to being past his best and the senior player during our downfall and even then delivered now and then.

History will be kind
 

bp19992

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By "smart money" you really mean "British media". Rooney was more mature at the time (both mentally and physically) but talent wise, there was no question who had the more talent.

Ronaldo had lightning quick feet, electrifying pace, great athleticism, was good in the air, was two footed and had a fantastic shot. He was very raw but electrifying.

One of the reasons why people have reservations about Rooney's career is because he was overhyped throughout. Appreciate him for what he was. A fantastic player and great goal scorer who was a level below the truly elite.

Unfortunately, throughout his career he was labelled as a world class player consistently being undermined by his own selflessness and being "played out of position".
Easy to say all this years later now. Nothing to do with British media which is always a lame argument. I remember the same was being written here in Germany.

Rooney had immense talent and back then it was not a huge stretch to say he was more talented than Ronaldo.

Rooney wasn't really overhyped either. He was pure world class. I don't really understand why British people like to talk down their players all that much.
 
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NewGlory

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Things like this is what make him unlikable as a character, such quote is salty and has loads of BS, but still a legend on pitch nevertheless. Keane hit at Fergie several points and it still won't affect his state as a legend imo.

LvG did feck all at United from tactical perspective to make any player think he's "by far" the best coach in comparison to Fergie. His tactics were crap, we looked terribly boring, his subs were uninspiring and players looked way restricted on the pitch. Maybe in his prime days he was a good coach but he was a crap one at United for the enterity of his second season, and Rooney managed under that version. The quote is just probably a hit at both Fergie and Mourinho for Rooney's own reasons, and maybe repaying LvG for "My captain shall always play".
Agree 100%. By the way, despite Keane having said many hateful things about SAF – he never, ever, in million years ever have even insinuated that SAF is anything but a genius manager and a coach. He's said Fergie is a horrible person but always acknowledges him as a brilliant manager. And yeah - also a superb coach and tactician, because "people management" wasn't enough to win SAF the amount of trophies he's won, saying that is simply BS. SAF is 1000x greater than a battalion of Van Gaals in every way, management or coaching.

What Rooney said is in huge contrast to what Keane has done, and is very petty. So yeah - Rooney was an incredible goal-scorer, but I would rather call a "legend" (unless we are talking purely about goals) somebody who embodies the character, spirit and honor of the club.
 

Irwin99

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By "smart money" you really mean "British media". Rooney was more mature at the time (both mentally and physically) but talent wise, there was no question who had the more talent.

Ronaldo had lightning quick feet, electrifying pace, great athleticism, was good in the air, was two footed and had a fantastic shot. He was very raw but electrifying.

One of the reasons why people have reservations about Rooney's career is because he was overhyped throughout. Appreciate him for what he was. A fantastic player and great goal scorer who was a level below the truly elite.

Unfortunately, throughout his career he was labelled as a world class player consistently being undermined by his own selflessness and being "played out of position".
Most of Ronnie's shots back then hit row z more often than not, his shooting technique was bizarre, his crossing was one great cross in about 8 attempts and he was maddeningly inconsistent, which as a young player he was entitled to be. I don't think anyone could have predicted the level of improvement that came in the 06-07 season. If you saw Ronaldo in his first few seasons here you hoped he'd get to the level of someone like Figo or Ryan Giggs but it wasn't a given. I remember the consensus at the time was that Robben and Reyes were bigger talents which obviously proved to be spectacularly false :lol:

Anyway, 2006-07 season saw all that change. Rooney actually equalled Ronaldo's tally of 23 goals that season but anyone could see who was the better player then. I'd go as far to say that I don't think I've seen any other player improve so much as Ronnie did that year. As I said, Rooney to most people looked to have the bigger future before then.
 

Champagne Football

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Rooney was finished as an elite player at 27 years old, around a year before Fergie quit in 2012. Fergie dropping Rooney for Nani in our biggest game of the season in that heartbreaking defeat to Madrid in the QF of the CL, was evidence of the beginning of Rooneys downward trajectory.

Photos of Rooney stuffing his gob with chips and beer as an 18 year old, a few months after he first signed for Utd, suggested a player who did not have the professional elite mentality that the true greats of these times had such as Messi, Cristiano, Zidane.

But after Ronaldo quit, Rooney was the best player in the league when on form, and truly World class. Moyes giving Rooney a monster contract when he arrived, when Fergie would probably have sold Rooney, was symbolic of the clubs 6 year freefall with the club repeating the same mistakes with Schweinsteiger, Matic and Alexis Sanchez.
 

Jeppers7

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Most of Ronnie's shots back then hit row z more often than not, his shooting technique was bizarre, his crossing was one great cross in about 8 attempts and he was maddeningly inconsistent, which as a young player he was entitled to be. I don't think anyone could have predicted the level of improvement that came in the 06-07 season. If you saw Ronaldo in his first few seasons here you hoped he'd get to the level of someone like Figo or Ryan Giggs but it wasn't a given. I remember the consensus at the time was that Robben and Reyes were bigger talents which obviously proved to be spectacularly false :lol:

Anyway, 2006-07 season saw all that change. Rooney actually equalled Ronaldo's tally of 23 goals that season but anyone could see who was the better player then. I'd go as far to say that I don't think I've seen any other player improve so much as Ronnie did that year. As I said, Rooney to most people looked to have the bigger future before then.
There's loads of old Ronaldo performances on YouTube from 02-03 onwards. He was seriously over scrutinised back then. When you watch he was incredible, but when you remember back to how he was perceived it was a one trick pony. Rooney was very streaky all his career. His bad games were often and at times his touch was like a pub team player and hed regularly miss absolute sitters game after game. His scoring record over individual seasons he'd average about 15-16 goals as a forward. He just wasn't scrutinised like Ronaldo. Ronaldo talent was always more but Rooney was just considered on another level to the likes of Figo and Giggs and I never thought he was. I'm not sure he went on to prove he was better than them, he certainly wasn't for me. Ronaldo, we may not have imagined what he would go on to become because that's dedication and self motivation but even at 18, when he was on top form he looked like a future best player in the world. Sir Alex Ferguson used to say it all the time.
 

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Rooneys legacy is there for all to see. He is Manchester United's all time top scorer. He beat another legend who had held the record for 45+years. Think of all the players in those 45 years who hadnt come anywhere close to beating it. think of all the players prior to Charlton who had played for the club and hadnt scored that many. That is Rooneys legacy.
 

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I remember the episode really well, I live in Manchester, worked looking at OT at the time. Time has moved on and you can try and paint all the pictures you want. Obviously you have strong feelings on the matter but at the time this wasnt a wishy washy story. This came out of the blue part way into a season, and it was happening. It was everywhere at the time. Not Rooney wants to leave and might go here, here or here......it was BANG Rooney is going to force through a move from City to United.
I'm trying to paint a picture?

Hardly mate i'm simply basing my understanding of the episode on quotes from those actually involved. As opposed to tabloid speculation and gossip from people in Manchester or elsewhere which no doubt was just being regurgitated from tabloid stories anyway.

How exactly was Rooney going to force a move to City out of interest in your opinion?

Didn't work out for Heinze a few years before when he tried to go to Liverpool.

You're trying to paint it like it was some minor speculation, this was mid way through a season. If you're Sir Alex you don't just decide mid way through a season to make it public just because he's said he won't sign a new contract especially when speculation is rife. When SAF came out in his press conference he was confirming what EVERYONE knew at the time. Then Rooney came out with his statement. But yeah sure, he had nowhere really to go to. Maybe a nice trip abroad, who knows eh? We can sort all that out later.....let's just let everyone know now that I'm not signing a new contract.
Could be wrong but i seem to remember Ferguson saying he decided to go public because he was annoyed the fans were chanting for Rooney to come off the bench vs West Brom when behind the scenes he had told him he wanted to leave.

Don't know if you've read Fergusons book but it's gives a pretty detailed version of the events surrounding this episode. Worth a read if you haven't already.

Was there really any speculation about Rooney going to City before SAF went public about the situation in his MUTV interview? Can't say i remember any, again i could be wrong.

But then he changed his mind and got a massive pay rise......but it was ambition that he stayed for? Jesus do me a favour.
I don't know why he changed his mind or if the contract he eventually signed was worth more than what was on offer the two previous times he turned it down. Do you know if the contract was worth more?

Ferguson seems to think it wasn't about money, he could be lying or wrong of course. But it's all we really have to go on.

Really? He came out part way through a season when speculation was EVERYWHERE that he was going to force a move to City.....to confirm he wanted to leave, the manager came out and confirmed it (but he never handed in a transfer request? ((he just did it) , although at the time he had no idea where he was going to move to, the city links came from nowhere and Rooney had no idea where he would move, just decided at that point to announce he wouldn't sign a new contract......then purely on the basis of AMBITION, changed his mind?
Again didn't Ferguson go public before Rooney?

Rooney and/or his agent told Gill twice he wouldn't be signing another contract. He told Ferguson in person that he wouldn't be signing another contract, according to SAF's book.

So if you consider that a transfer request fair enough. But i'm almost certain he wouldn't have lodged a written transfer request and lost out on a fair bit of money. Which was my point.

I can't wait for that fat bloke in red (Not Rooney this time) to climb down my chimney in a few weeks with the tooth fairy and the Easter bunny.
You'll be waiting as long for Santa mate as you would for an actual quote from someone involved to surface, that confirms there was anything in the Rooney to City story beyond tabloid bollocks.
 
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f_to_z

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Rooney was one of the best players in the premier league during that time. Back then there were a lot of greats in the premier league that he had lots of competition to win awards. You bring the peak Rooney now and im sure he will win more awards as the premier league player quality has gone down. Who is Kane competing with for awards now as a striker in the premier league and compare it to who Rooney was competing with back then. This will give you perspective.
 

Jeppers7

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I'm trying to paint a picture?

Hardly mate i'm simply basing my understanding of the episode on quotes from those actually involved. As opposed to tabloid speculation and gossip from people in Manchester or elsewhere which no doubt was just being regurgitated from tabloid stories anyway.

How exactly was Rooney going to force a move to City out of interest in your opinion?

Didn't work out for Heinze a few years before when he tried to go to Liverpool.



Could be wrong but i seem to remember Ferguson saying he decided to go public because he was annoyed the fans were chanting for Rooney to come off the bench vs West Brom when behind the scenes he had told him he wanted to leave.

Don't know if you've read Fergusons book but it's gives a pretty detailed version of the events surrounding this episode. Worth a read if you haven't already.

Was there really any speculation about Rooney going to City before SAF went public about the situation in his MUTV interview? Can't say i remember any, again i could be wrong.



I don't know why he changed his mind or if the contract he eventually signed was worth more than what was on offer the two previous times he turned it down. Do you know if the contract was worth more?

Ferguson seems to think it wasn't about money, he could be lying or wrong of course. But it's all we really have to go on.



Again didn't Ferguson go public before Rooney?

Rooney and/or his agent told Gill twice he wouldn't be signing another contract. He told Ferguson in person that he wouldn't be signing another contract, according to SAF's book.

So if you consider that a transfer request fair enough. But i'm almost certain he wouldn't have lodged a written transfer request and lost out on a fair bit of money. Which was my point.



You'll be waiting as long for Santa mate as you would for an actual quote from someone involved to surface, that confirms there was anything in the Rooney to City story beyond tabloid bollocks.

Jesus....again I lived through it, the stories came out like an express train and then bang....the manager confirmed what the world knew. Then Rooney came out with his statement. There was nothing else, nowhere else he was going.

That's the reality of it, it wasn't Rooney is leaving at the end of the season, where might he go. It was Rooney is going to City.

You can try and rewrite it. You can claim that it's normal for mid season a manager to come out with that statement SAF came out with on the basis that fans were chanting Rooneys name ? But I lived through it.

Ffs you don't know what changed Rooneys mind..... Are you that naive, your trying to paint a picture that Rooney might have left for a foreign team only, nothing to do with city. No way. But he changed his mind because he's a thoroughly decent chap and decided maybe he was wrong and the clubs ambition wasn't lacking, despite all the evidence being to the latter, and then Rooney doing the same a few years later for Chelsea, more tabloid rubbish I'm guessing. I lived through that too, again he was leaving and going to Chelsea this time. Before we offered him more money.

I don't need quotes. I remember both episodes. There's a difference between speculation and when things are actually happening. Everyone reports the same thing.

You believe what you want, but I'll keep repeating what happened at the time, your story is so pro Rooney it's hard to fathom how you'd even believe it yourself.
 

BridgeBanter

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Apr 13, 2013
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Both Drogba and Torres were fine players on their day. But both were wildly inconsistent and their peaks didn't last long.

Drogba is overrated by many, for an out and out striker to have played as many games as he did for a team like Chelsea. And over such a long period and to have only scored more than 20 goals in a season twice is poor in my opinion.

Torres is another one who despite playing for two top teams in England as an out and out striker over 8-9 years. Only managed more than 20 goals 2-3 times. Though to be fair injuries did play a part there but again poor.

I would describe neither as a machine.
Drogba played for a team that had the best scoring midfield player in EPL history along with a collection of other strong players.

Stats don’t always tell the whole story. Anyone who watched those Chelsea teams knows that his skills and presence on the field allowed Chelsea to play the greatly effective style that they did.
 

roonster09

Hercule Poirot of the scouting world
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Drogba played for a team that had the best scoring midfield player in EPL history along with a collection of other strong players.

Stats don’t always tell the whole story. Anyone who watched those Chelsea teams knows that his skills and presence on the field allowed Chelsea to play the greatly effective style that they did.
Anyone who can remember players full career instead of just their best season would tell you that Drogba was very inconsistent and many Chelsea fans were very frustrated with him, especially after Jose was sacked, between 2007-2009 period.
 

RedDevilCanuck

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The old line that Rooney was better than Ronaldo in 2005 is BS.

Rooney was the more mature player with better decision making and more selfless.

But Ronaldo was a freak when running with the ball and had the higher ceiling. Rooney was overhyped due to the english media who desperately wanted someone to replace Owen and Becks.

Sure Rooney should have been a better pro but he is as slim as he has ever been now but was his best when he was pretty stocky so we dont really know all the information about his professionalism.

For our younger posters you should YouTube or download a full match from 2005 to 2012. Rooney routinely dominated top class center backs in an era where ball playing and pace were secondary traits after being an amazing defender.
 

RedDevilCanuck

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He never had more potential...he was just more mature for a teenager and had the physique of a grown man at 16. But touch, skill, pace, ability. Ronaldo was always way ahead. He just needed to channel it. When you see Ronaldo 06-08 Rooney, as fine a player as he was, never had that level of talent.
Thank you for a consise explanation.

Ronaldo always has the higher ceiling of talent. he just didnt have the the crazy media hype.

Look at the redcafe original thread. Most said Rooney was a fat overrated scouser and didn't want.