We are an awfully coached team

[Bristol_Red_87]

For us, having a single DM type figure will always be a struggle if we're also going to play Bruno & Pogba ahead, along with Rashford & Sancho/Greenwood out wide and Ronaldo sitting in the box up front. There's no balance whatsoever in that kind of formation. A front five, all of whom are prone to risky passes/dribbles, none of whom are that great at defensive actions and a single DM in front of the back four?

Whilst I largely agree with your point, Bruno's defensive responsibilities currently hamper our creative threat! Pretty sure he's bailed us out at least twice in the past few weeks when the rest of the midfield and defence have gone MIA.

He, along with Cavani are also the only one's who can/will press from the front. The amount or times I see Bruno do this, get beaten and then throw his arms up as if to say "why is no one else pressing?!" is incredible.

He must surely being going against instructions to do so, but I can't blame the guy.

The best way to protect our shaky midfield/defence is to stop the ball entering our final third in the first place.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Have to disagree with this. VdB worked superbly in Ajax's system because as a team they know how to stretch opponents with one-touch football (something that almost every successful team does, including United teams of old). He has a good understanding of space, and he has the technical skills to hold the ball.

Instead of McTominay, it should be VdB who Carrick and McKena groom for the no. 6 role. VdB can play great midfield splitting passes in the same way as Carrick himself did. Carrick was not a very physical player; he didn't tackle but he was a great DM because of his positioning and his eye for a pass.

There was a reason why Bayern and Real were interested in VdB. Sure, he is a systems player, but then football is a systems game. What other kind of player should there be? Ole has bludgeoned our expectations of what a team should be like, as he relies so much on individual brilliance.

Get a elite (or half-decent even) manager in and see the likes of VdB and Sancho flourish.

On Sancho I agree because he is incredibly talented. VDB isn't the player everyone wants him to be. Everyone here thinks that he's capable of being this excellent 6 when: 1) By all accounts he was a goalscoring midfielder at Ajax whose job was to find spaces and get involved in goals 2) he has barely any pace and pretty much no physicality to speak of 3) he seems to be defensively weak 4) apart from being tidy, where is this supposed class on the ball? Carrick had a genuine passing range. VDB is like Herrera - tidy but a basic passer of the ball except Herrera had a better mentality and could harry excellently.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Whilst I largely agree with your point, Bruno's defensive responsibilities currently hamper our creative threat! Pretty sure he's bailed us out at least twice in the past few weeks when the rest of the midfield and defence have gone MIA.

He, along with Cavani are also the only one's who can/will press from the front. The amount or times I see Bruno do this, get beaten and then throw his arms up as if to say "why is no one else pressing?!" is incredible.

He must surely being going against instructions to do so, but I can't blame the guy.

The best way to protect our shaky midfield/defence is to stop the ball entering our final third in the first place.

That's a good point. We really should be pressing better and it's not even just about individuals but doing it wel in unison rather than one player showing aggression and passion and the others staying back resulting in an easy pass for the opposition. Bruno definitely tries hard to do it but the unit needs to do more together.

 

[Abraxas]

Have to disagree with this. VdB worked superbly in Ajax's system because as a team they know how to stretch opponents with one-touch football (something that almost every successful team does, including United teams of old). He has a good understanding of space, and he has the technical skills to hold the ball.

Instead of McTominay, it should be VdB who Carrick and McKena groom for the no. 6 role. VdB can play great midfield splitting passes in the same way as Carrick himself did. Carrick was not a very physical player; he didn't tackle but he was a great DM because of his positioning and his eye for a pass.

There was a reason why Bayern and Real were interested in VdB. Sure, he is a systems player, but then football is a systems game. What other kind of player should there be? Ole has bludgeoned our expectations of what a team should be like, as he relies so much on individual brilliance.

Get a elite (or half-decent even) manager in and see the likes of VdB and Sancho flourish.

When have we seen this great "midfield splitting passes"? As far as I can work out that wasn't even a strength of his at Ajax where he undoubtedly played better football then he currently does. So what is the justification for this?

His passing at United has been fairly basic. Nice little lay offs occasionally, reasonable over 10 yards but we have seen nothing defence splitting. I would argue we haven't even seen much that is progressive, he has largely just ticked the ball over.

That being said, clearly that type of passing may be okay for a 6. It's not ideal but it could be okay. The problem is that is a small portion of what is required for the role. He's shown very little ability to get around the pitch or in duels, or defensively, or frankly any kind of mentality to take the bull by the horns in general.

If he's going to do anything here it will be as an 8. Where he's not the main man and can tick things over. He's not enough of a threat as a 10 and there's far too much he doesn't do to be a 6.

 

[Foxbatt]

When have we seen this great "midfield splitting passes"? As far as I can work out that wasn't even a strength of his at Ajax where he undoubtedly played better football then he currently does. So what is the justification for this?

His passing at United has been fairly basic. Nice little lay offs occasionally, reasonable over 10 yards but we have seen nothing defence splitting. I would argue we haven't even seen much that is progressive, he has largely just ticked the ball over.

That being said, clearly that type of passing may be okay for a 6. It's not ideal but it could be okay. The problem is that is a small portion of what is required for the role. He's shown very little ability to get around the pitch or in duels, or defensively, or frankly any kind of mentality to take the bull by the horns in general.

If he's going to do anything here it will be as an 8. Where he's not the main man and can tick things over. He's not enough of a threat as a 10 and there's far too much he doesn't do to be a 6.

How many games have you seen him play for United? How many full games?

 

[Abraxas]

How many games have you seen him play for United? How many full games?

I've seen the games he's played, whatever they are. You are just as capable of digging up the stats as I am. I'm sure it's an unimpressive amount but I am equally sure it's enough to pass comment on what he has done, why shouldn't it be? It's simply calling a spade a spade at this point.

I don't think it matters that much whether they're full games or appearances at this point because it's clear he has to take advantage of the limited opportunities. You have to make an impact in whatever situation is presented, it's Manchester United we're talking about. You have to put your hand up, especially when out of favour.

He'll get another go soon, he's bound to. Will he take it or will it pass him by again?

 

[meninred]

I am with those who say the midfield needs an overhaul. The top 3 teams have great managers on their side
however we should give full support Ole as he is one of our own and doesnot have a resume like them.
it is just seeing this midfield sickens me sometimes. If Ole doesnot correct the midfield in time then i may join Ole out
so far he has done okay with out being great.

 

[stefan92]

however we should give full support Ole as he is one of our own and doesnot have a resume like them.

I don't really understand this logic. Obviously loyalty to a club legend is a point you can make and see as part of "the United way", but his lacking resume? He came with few national titles to United like Klopp had before joining Liverpool. The fact that he has not added to that is simply that he failed to manage to win anything with United. This is a failure and should surely be an argument against him, but not in his favour?

There are a couple of reasons to excuse this failure so far, but I would in no way see it as a reason to keep him, that he so far failed to win any title.

 

[glazed]

I don't really understand this logic. Obviously loyalty to a club legend is a point you can make and see as part of "the United way", but his lacking resume? He came with few national titles to United like Klopp had before joining Liverpool.

You seem to be comparing winning the Norwegian league to breaking Bayern's monopoly in Germany? I would say the latter is more of an elite manager badge than the former.

 

[stefan92]

You seem to be comparing winning the Norwegian league to breaking Bayern's monopoly in Germany? I would say the latter is more of an elite manager badge than the former.

I agree that the Bundesliga has to be higher rated, but Molde also was not a title winning team in the decade before Ole coached them, so that is at least similar for the two of them. In the end it does not matter much for my point, as I was referring to his lacking resume in regard to the PL - how little it actually is, is not much difference to the point that he was not a proven PL manager before he started at United and that he still has not proven to be a title winning coach.

Also Bayern did not have an absolute monopoly like they have now, in the 2000s several other clubs won the league (2002 Dortmund, 2004 Bremen, 2007 Stuttgart, 2009 Wolfsburg, 2011 and 2012 Dortmund again), it was not that hard to beat them as it is now.

 

[Flytan]

I am with those who say the midfield needs an overhaul. The top 3 teams have great managers on their side
however we should give full support Ole as he is one of our own and doesnot have a resume like them.
it is just seeing this midfield sickens me sometimes. If Ole doesnot correct the midfield in time then i may join Ole out
so far he has done okay with out being great.

This right here is the whole Ole in vs Ole out argument in a nutshell. You have one side who sees he only has the job because of nepotism vs the other side who wants him to succeed because of nepotism

 

[stefan92]

This right here is the whole Ole in vs Ole out argument in a nutshell. You have one side who sees he only has the job because of nepotism vs the other side who wants him to succeed because of nepotism

But why? Why put the job and possible but improbable chance of a club legend (who is most likely not up to the job ) to win something,above the club's success itself?

 

[JuriM]

I don't know how many of you follow Eric Laurie on Twitter, but he has shared some tactical insight within our plays also:

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[red4ever 79]

There is nobody in here defending that we are a well coached team surely. I am yet to see any form of playing style in the 3 years Ole has been in charge.

 

[meninred]

There is nobody in here defending that we are a well coached team surely. I am yet to see any form of playing style in the 3 years Ole has been in charge.

It is true. We dont have a playing style identitiy. City is possesion based with multiple midfielders and false 9...Liverpool pressing football with wing forwards..Chelsea mainly 3 4 3 fomatiion with attack and defend together..Ole has 4 2 3 1 formation and that is it

 

[bdspeedy]

I love Ole but we have an inexperienced flight crew flying the United- Good Vibes -DC3, which is headed into a mountain in a blinding storm. Everyone is happy and smiling but we need someone at the yoke that knows how to correct our course and negotiate these hazards going forward. Keep Ole in charge of sunshine and lollipops and get some coaches who are up to United premiership and champs league standards.

 

[Lee565]

It's more than coaching, I think ole's transfer business goes under the radar for genuine criticism and his squad management us and has been poor at the club.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

Especially when they make it out as if the CL and the EPL are the only acceptable trophies for us, yet we look miles off being good enough for the EPL and are already looking like we may struggle in our CL group which consists of teams which should be deemed quite 'easy' for a tournament like the CL.

Funny stuff.

Yep.

The same people saying only the UCL & EPL matter are the ones that when we fall flat in those tournaments say, ‘well we weren’t going to win it anyway’, ‘not got the best squad so what do you expect’, ‘ole needs another [insert position here]’.

Truth be told, he really should of been trying to win the Carabao Cup this year. Even if it was just to get a trophy under his belt (albeit a minor one, but still).

When you’ve not proven you can win a trophy at this level there are no ‘minor’ trophies.

We’ve gone out in multiple tournaments to teams of inferior quality & this place falls over itself to degrade the worthiness of winning when we do.

He should have won the EL in the previous 2 years, it’s malpractice that he did not.

 

[bond19821982]

Every single game. How long has this been evident? How many touches our attackers had ?

 

[Buchan]

Another game week and yet another glaring example of our management/coaching structure being woefully inept when up against a side who are coached very well and whom play much stronger than the sum of their individual parts.

How much evidence do the ‘experts’ need that we are heading nowhere fast under the current management and how much can they enlighten us ‘plastics’ about the hidden genius Solskjaer supposedly possesses? Genuinely curious about both above.

 

[midou]

Was wondering how many minutes before this thread comes up.

For all the lack of "patterns of play" and relying on individual brilliance upfront I have to say our defense organisation is probably even worse. We cant cover people, track runners, intercept etc., so easy to reach our penalty box in seconds with a few passes.

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

Ole at the wheel and all that.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Same shit, different day. Been like this since the honeymoon period when he was appointed as caretaker. Never believed it would get better and it never will.

 

[Raoul]

We basically play football with the same panache as how Ole talks.

 

[Idxomer]

Was wondering how many minutes before this thread comes up.

For all the lack of "patterns of play" and relying on individual brilliance upfront I have to say our defense organisation is probably even worse. We cant cover people, track runners, intercept etc., so easy to reach our penalty box in seconds with a few passes.

That's the big problem, our team looks poorly organized all over.

 

[AjaxCunian]

Same shit, different day. Been like this since the honeymoon period when he was appointed as caretaker. Never believed it would get better and it never will.

This.. but still hopeful we can win this match.

 

[NZT-One]

Nothing needs to be said about our performance. Another game where I am a bit stunned how good Leicester looks in possession. So courageous and comfortable on the ball...

Seems like we adjusted the tactical outlook a bit today - looks like Sancho is providing width while Shaw wanders into midfield to support Pog and Matic. Not a bad idea I'd say. Theoretically frees up Pogba a bit.

 

[Leanshig]

I'm not saying Sancho won't prove to be a good signing, but spunking 80 million on him when we could've signed two midfielders was just a bad strategy.

 

[Idxomer]

The funny thing is Leicester aren't even that good.

The way we play has allowed them to feel comfortable and play their game which they haven't been able to do all season.

 

[MDFC Manager]

I'm not saying Sancho won't prove to be a good signing, but spunking 80 million on him when we could've signed two midfielders was just a bad strategy.

Well, our existing midfielders are good enough, let's be honest.

 

[Freak]

Why don’t the fecking board and CEO save our season by sacking the bunch of clueless cowards and get in a manager and coaching team who know what they’re doing

 

[IhabX7]

We basically football with the same panache as how Ole talks.

No lies told.

 

[MDFC Manager]

We basically football with the same panache as how Ole talks.

Haha.

At least the previous 2 managers offered more off field entertainment. Now it's just shite throughout the week

 

[VP89]

Is it just me or is every game a normal transition to the final 3rd, and then a VERY slow pedestrian passage of passing before some sort of random cross?

And I see a lot more bunching of players in the same pockets (mainly on the left side). They just move about in each other's way and get confused as to who to play 1-2s with.

When we create or score it's because they are working it out in the instances on the fly, but it's clearly not sustainable in going forward. And it keeps us vulnerable on the counters.

 

[Grib]

I mean what do we work on during the week in training

 

[lloyd2wayne]

I'm not saying Sancho won't prove to be a good signing, but spunking 80 million on him when we could've signed two midfielders was just a bad strategy.

It has nothing to do with Sancho. Out coaching is just so bad. Every good player we touch can’t do the basics right.

Even if we brought in 2 new midfielders I promise you we will be playing this shit? There’s no way around it. Making it seem like any midfielder walks in and we play better is just fantasy.

No movement, no aggression, no continuous attack, lazy defending etc. It’s all down to the manager who is truthfully out of his dept. Yikes!

 

[elmo]

Getting outplayed by Leicester and it's clear their tactics are superior, but no doubt some people on here will try to convince you that Leicester have the better team and Ole has been doing a miracle to have us finishing ahead of them the past 2 seasons.

 

[bond19821982]

I'm not saying Sancho won't prove to be a good signing, but spunking 80 million on him when we could've signed two midfielders was just a bad strategy.

Nothing will happen. Our problem will be just another position. When we will realize it's not the players ?

 

[elmo]

I mean what do we work on during the week in training

The excuse this week would be that they players were out on international duties

 

[midou]

Why don’t the fecking board and CEO save our season by sacking the bunch of clueless cowards and get in a manager and coaching team who know what they’re doing

Our board doesn't care what happens on the pitch, only that we are in CL. There is not a single person above the manager who knows anything about football, Ed is useless.
Joel Glazer: “It took me 2 years to learn the offside rule in soccer and I still struggle with it.” November 2019

If I recall correctly Mourinho said something in the lines that there is not a single person to discuss transfer targets or anything football related with, it is all on the manager.

Our only decent appointment Javier Ribalta quit after one year of being chief scout to become sporting director of Zenith.