We lack basic technical ability

Lanesy

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The game has changed, unfortunately. We are seeing less and less technical players come through. The game is all about pace and athleticism now, what you can do with a ball at your feet comes second.

Think about it - how many purely technical footballers exist in the modern game? Modric is probably the last of a dying breed. Players in the mould of a Scholes, Xavi, Iniesta are a rarity now.

Scholes openly said he never considered himself an athlete. He confessed to eating chips all the time and he’s also asthmatic. He got by by being really really good at football. But sadly, the way the game has evolved, he probably wouldn’t get a look in in the modern game.

Also, didn’t Pirlo admit to smoking and playing PS2 all day before the World Cup final? And how good was he?!

I think we’ve just been spoiled with watching wonderful, naturally gifted footballers over the years, and not just at United. We have high expectations. But the game has changed - as infuriating as that is.

The fact of the matter is the likes of Rashford, Sterling will win the majority of sprints, Fred will outrun most for 90 mins and beyond, and that justifies their selection. And on the occasion that they do something good with a ball at their feet, it’s considered a bonus.
 

Zlaatan

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I'm so confused.

How can they all be professional footballers if they lack basic technical ability??? Why is this thread even exists?

You can't have below par basic technical abilities and 2nd in the league.
Because context matters. This isn't about basic technical ability for pub players or kids, it's about the very top players in the world playing for a club that should aim to win the biggest trophies every year.

I don't want to look at teams like Real yesterday and be amazed at their first touches, one touch passing and how they are able to use both feet etc. I don't think we have to be world leading in this area or anything like that, and United have never really been about technical excellence like some other teams tbf, but we shouldn't be this far behind when it comes to such "simple" things as handling the ball. Especially when so many teams, and most of the very best teams, have started to press so hard in every area of the pitch.
 

TrueRed1999

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A coaching staff that have managed to improve almost every player in the team individually, and coach the team as a collective to 2nd place are rubbish? Okay then.
This league is one of the most false leagues I can ever remember, we are 2nd by other teams falls from grace and incredible which will be a 1 off this season, I fully expect Liverpool and Chelsea to return to full strength next season. And only good thing about City is there not Liverpool although it is still is painful. Carlos and Rene were better coaches with Experience that Carrick and McKenna do not have. Phelan brought confidence back when he returned however, I wouldn't say he was an excellent or amazing coach. Ole needs better people around him to help change how we play as most games we struggle to compose, get a string of passes even shoot the ball on target in majority of 1st halves this season which is why were 2nd but most importantly knocked out every cup apart from Europa So far. And those that called for everyone's heads and their coaches when Mourinho and Van Gaal was manager even though they still won things I am sorry to say the hypocrisy due to Ole's playing career with us which is pure sentimental.

Has there been improvement in areas yes but we are still were we were under previous managers especially when 2 players have scored more than 15 goals each and the rest are struggling at less than 7.
 

Leftback99

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This league is one of the most false leagues I can ever remember, we are 2nd by other teams falls from grace and incredible which will be a 1 off this season, I fully expect Liverpool and Chelsea to return to full strength next season. And only good thing about City is there not Liverpool although it is still is painful. Carlos and Rene were better coaches with Experience that Carrick and McKenna do not have. Phelan brought confidence back when he returned however, I wouldn't say he was an excellent or amazing coach. Ole needs better people around him to help change how we play as most games we struggle to compose, get a string of passes even shoot the ball on target in majority of 1st halves this season which is why were 2nd but most importantly knocked out every cup apart from Europa So far. And those that called for everyone's heads and their coaches when Mourinho and Van Gaal was manager even though they still won things I am sorry to say the hypocrisy due to Ole's playing career with us which is pure sentimental.

Has there been improvement in areas yes but we are still were we were under previous managers especially when 2 players have scored more than 15 goals each and the rest are struggling at less than 7.
It's amazing that every other team has 'fallen' but we're the opposite and presumably at our peak despite us having no pre season and the busiest schedule with next to no time to train between games.
 

Velvet Revolver

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I thought you’d say this, which is why I included my last line about Fred improving. I knew you wouldn’t be able to make the distinction between Fred becoming a better player on the whole, and the aspects of his game (e.g. passing) that are already well embedded and can’t really be developed in any significant way at such a point in his career. Well done for proving me right.
You can have your opinion and I will have mine. But stating a player can NEVER improve is very superior of you.
 
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Our main issue is we lack ball retention. The main reason for that is we primarily use a midfield pivot of McTominay & Fred, whilst using Bruno as a very a advanced number 10. These 3 are all fairly untidy passers of the ball, but what makes things worse is that there’s always a massive hole between the pivot & the 10, which leads to us getting overrun in midfield & struggling to keep possession in the middle for more than a couple of passes. This is even more highlighted when playing Rashford, Greenwood, Martial or Pogba in a front 3, as they are all low-press players, which places more urgency on
Bruno to press, making the gap in our midfield that much bigger. If we want to play 4-2-3-1 with those 3 in midfield then James & Cavani need to play otherwise Bruno is basically playing as a striker.

This could all be solved in the summer by bringing in a top DM, we can then move Pogba & Bruno into the 8 positions.
 
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OleTheGreat

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Yes Redcafe, its another thread of complaints and negativity.

To make my own positions clear; I am Ole-in, Pogba-out, and think our #1 priority this summer should be to try to sign Haaland.

Now the actual point - I am watching the game against Brighton and the thing that stands out to me is that - compared with virtually every other team in the league - we seem to have a lot of players who simply lack basic technical competence.
I am defining technical ability as things like first touch, ball control and passing. Things that you should pretty much take for granted in any professional footballer. We have too many players who are deficient in these areas. This isnt a thread about naming names or trying to blame specific players because I believe it is a problem with the entire squad, but there are certainly some more culpable than others. Fred and AWB come to mind - but again, they arent the only ones.

The result of this is that we rarely seem to score goals from well worked pieces of play. Most of our goals are either counterattacks, set pieces or individual brilliance. We struggle to maintain possession and to beat the press, because too many of our players simply arent comfortable on the ball.

If you look at basically any other team in the league, especially the midfielders and forwards, they are technically sound players, comfortable on the ball and able to do the basics with a 90%+ success rate. It isnt about being able to play a killer pass or take on 5 players, its about the basics;

* Simple 10-yard passes are too often sloppy/imprecise. This invites pressure and often kills any momentum.
* First touches when recieving the ball. Again, these are often sloppy, leading to the classic "second touch is a tackle" syndrome.
* Holding the ball under pressure. This makes us too easy to play against and spoils a lot of opportunities to counterattack - you beat a press by either crisp short passing, or by beating a man - we dont reliably do either.

I think there are some significant holes in the squad that need addressing, but in order to strengthen as a team, we need our players to be comfortable on the ball. This doesnt mean a £60m playmaker, this simply means players who can do the basics (and then presumably have some key strengths on top of this - we dont want a squad of Tom Cleverleys). Dont look at the other team teams in the league, look at the mid table sides. Look at the ~6th place sides in La Liga. You will not see so many players who are so uncomfortable on the ball as ours.
I completely completely agree. I think we definitely are not the team that is technically sound. I watch so many teams play in the PL, La Liga and even the Bundesliga and it often seems like we are the only ones who do not have the conviction. Watching us play is more often than not lethargic. We constantly lose the ball and the first touch problem has always been a problem with this team since the Moyes era. Even during the SAF era, we had players like Rooney who had bad touches and lost possession but the rest of the group was just brilliant on the ball. It is so painful to watch teams like Leicester, Leeds, Wolves and Aston Villa play exciting football while we play those safe passes from side to side and then Bruno launches one in hope of finding someone. City, Chelsea, Liverpool and often even Arsenal play with such finesse around the box. The interchange between the players and those deadly crosses into the box are a delight to watch. On the other hand we have United who pass from the back and Wan Bissaka or Fred gets caught on the ball and the pressure is back on us right away.

I have seen the boys do the rondo in training every time but never have I seen them do that to get out of a hard press. We are a ridiculous team in terms of ball playing abilities and finding those pin point passes. I always always end up having my hand on my head or yelling at the television. I have no idea what some of the others watch, because some of them are happy with the results and think we are improving but in my mind I have always known we aren't good enough to be second in the league and that the cups were never coming soon.

I think Ole has done a lot to set this squad right but it is now time for a coach who can tighten the ropes around these guys and get them to play a certain way. Gone are the days where we can counter attack and win football matches because these days the football is getting far more technical and a dodgy way of winning football matches can only take you so far. I think PL is now developing the La Liga style football where teams often play more ground passes and less over the shoulder passes except for those mind blowing crosses into the 6 yard box.

I definitely agree with your points and only a new manager can actually bring those changes because Ole is a forward and he only knows what forwards should do and that's probably why our midfield is struggling. Carrick hasn't been great and therefore before we actually buy players for Ole, we need to bring someone like Bielsa in and try to change the way we play.
 

OmarUnited4ever

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This league is one of the most false leagues I can ever remember, we are 2nd by other teams falls from grace and incredible which will be a 1 off this season, I fully expect Liverpool and Chelsea to return to full strength next season. And only good thing about City is there not Liverpool although it is still is painful. Carlos and Rene were better coaches with Experience that Carrick and McKenna do not have. Phelan brought confidence back when he returned however, I wouldn't say he was an excellent or amazing coach. Ole needs better people around him to help change how we play as most games we struggle to compose, get a string of passes even shoot the ball on target in majority of 1st halves this season which is why were 2nd but most importantly knocked out every cup apart from Europa So far. And those that called for everyone's heads and their coaches when Mourinho and Van Gaal was manager even though they still won things I am sorry to say the hypocrisy due to Ole's playing career with us which is pure sentimental.

Has there been improvement in areas yes but we are still were we were under previous managers especially when 2 players have scored more than 15 goals each and the rest are struggling at less than 7.
Would you excuse Manchester United fall from grace next year as you are excusing Liverpool & Chelsea this season ??

i mean come on, if other teams are shit this year, it has nothing to do with Man.United, the table doesn't lie, we have performed well in the league compared to the previous season, and of course it's not enough and not where we want to be, this team can do much more and still needs few quality additions, but we are 2nd in the league by merit, not by some dumb luck.
 

TrueRed1999

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Would you excuse Manchester United fall from grace next year as you are excusing Liverpool & Chelsea this season ??

i mean come on, if other teams are shit this year, it has nothing to do with Man.United, the table doesn't lie, we have performed well in the league compared to the previous season, and of course it's not enough and not where we want to be, this team can do much more and still needs few quality additions, but we are 2nd in the league by merit, not by some dumb luck.
Its entirely by dumb luck why we are second I cannot for one pick one game during are period where we were getting wins where I reflected afterwards that was a brilliant 10/10 game, and when are top scorers are Bruno (Fully Deserved) and Rashford (Not been Great but grafted through injuries) you have to start looking have we done amazing this season being second. I don't think we have especially when we have repeatedly given deflated performances and had to bail ourselves out of majority of games this season. I will give credit to that however majority of that has been down to luck, If Mourinho hadn't done what he normally does at Spurs which has caused the same divide we seen at United then we would probably be behind them as they have a more better attacking line up with Son and Kane than we do. If our tactical ability is as amazing as your saying it is then why has Jesse Lingard gone on loan to West Ham and now showing what exactly he is capable of. I was shocked when we were top by those brief moments of the season but then the collapse happened which I and many fans across the country saw. Am I happy were 2nd yes however we aren't competing are we and those that say we do need to take off their rose coated sunglasses. Competing means being 2 or maybe 3 points off top not the amount we are and reflects when we finished 2nd under Jose when City had won the league by miles there.
 

Abraxas

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The game has changed, unfortunately. We are seeing less and less technical players come through. The game is all about pace and athleticism now, what you can do with a ball at your feet comes second.

Think about it - how many purely technical footballers exist in the modern game? Modric is probably the last of a dying breed. Players in the mould of a Scholes, Xavi, Iniesta are a rarity now.

Scholes openly said he never considered himself an athlete. He confessed to eating chips all the time and he’s also asthmatic. He got by by being really really good at football. But sadly, the way the game has evolved, he probably wouldn’t get a look in in the modern game.

Also, didn’t Pirlo admit to smoking and playing PS2 all day before the World Cup final? And how good was he?!

I think we’ve just been spoiled with watching wonderful, naturally gifted footballers over the years, and not just at United. We have high expectations. But the game has changed - as infuriating as that is.

The fact of the matter is the likes of Rashford, Sterling will win the majority of sprints, Fred will outrun most for 90 mins and beyond, and that justifies their selection. And on the occasion that they do something good with a ball at their feet, it’s considered a bonus.
Some interesting ideas.

However, the one thing I would question is if there has really been enough time between the period when Scholes, Xavi and Pirlo were dominating proceedings to the current game in order to make a relatively general statement on the kinds of players that can excel? If there were youngsters of the quality of those players within the production line they are unlikely to have completely disappeared within that timeframe, even where the coaching and tactical ideas change. I struggle to think they simply would not have made it, which suggests they were simply never there.

I do think the idea the game has become more physical and based on athleticism is a natural consequence of the current pressing style, and it is not clear if and when that will change.
 

Hammondo

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Some interesting ideas.

However, the one thing I would question is if there has really been enough time between the period when Scholes, Xavi and Pirlo were dominating proceedings to the current game in order to make a relatively general statement on the kinds of players that can excel? If there were youngsters of the quality of those players within the production line they are unlikely to have completely disappeared within that timeframe, even where the coaching and tactical ideas change. I struggle to think they simply would not have made it, which suggests they were simply never there.

I do think the idea the game has become more physical and based on athleticism is a natural consequence of the current pressing style, and it is not clear if and when that will change.
I would not call foden or Dr bruyne athletic. In fact I would say most of city are like his Barce side.

I would argue the league in general has become a lot better technically and that purely athletic players are less popular now.
 

OmarUnited4ever

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Its entirely by dumb luck why we are second I cannot for one pick one game during are period where we were getting wins where I reflected afterwards that was a brilliant 10/10 game, and when are top scorers are Bruno (Fully Deserved) and Rashford (Not been Great but grafted through injuries) you have to start looking have we done amazing this season being second. I don't think we have especially when we have repeatedly given deflated performances and had to bail ourselves out of majority of games this season. I will give credit to that however majority of that has been down to luck, If Mourinho hadn't done what he normally does at Spurs which has caused the same divide we seen at United then we would probably be behind them as they have a more better attacking line up with Son and Kane than we do. If our tactical ability is as amazing as your saying it is then why has Jesse Lingard gone on loan to West Ham and now showing what exactly he is capable of. I was shocked when we were top by those brief moments of the season but then the collapse happened which I and many fans across the country saw. Am I happy were 2nd yes however we aren't competing are we and those that say we do need to take off their rose coated sunglasses. Competing means being 2 or maybe 3 points off top not the amount we are and reflects when we finished 2nd under Jose when City had won the league by miles there.
First i must reiterate few things so i m clear
  • ,we aren't second because of dumb luck, it's a fact we played better this season than all the teams in the PL except for city, who deserve to be top and running away with the league due to their incredible consistency throughout the season, Liverpool and Chelsea being shit has nothing to do with us being 2nd & city being top.
  • I said this and i will repeat it, again its a fact we have improved our results compared to last season, and although we improved, it's still not enough, and even though we still lack some quality players, this current squad should be able to do much better and show more consistency.

All I'm saying, just look at team and analyze the results in the league, you'll see the improvement from last season, and you'll also see it's not enough, then you'll have better idea on where we do lack (players performances, tactics, team selections, recruitment, etc...), all of that has nothing to do with other teams' performances, city wouldn't care if no one is competing with them in the league, they would just go out there and win their games and clinch the title, and they would deserve it, them winning the league wont be by some dumb luck.
 

Kag

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You can have your opinion and I will have mine. But stating a player can NEVER improve is very superior of you.
I never said he can’t improve. I said that the consistency of his passing will remain a relative weakness. No coach is waltzing into Carrington and suddenly overseeing Fred’s evolution from sloppy passer into somebody who is not. I think we should agree to disagree on this one.
 

Isotope

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It's amazing that every other team has 'fallen' but we're the opposite and presumably at our peak despite us having no pre season and the busiest schedule with next to no time to train between games.
That's what investing a half billion within 3 years can do to your team.
 

Walrus

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Yeh.. it's so easy to understand, that the standard of "poor coaching" is relative to other big teams. This is Manchester United.
But maybe the OP has to spell it out clearly for some people here.
(OP here)
Yes @Zlaatan is largely correct. Obviously the context is “for a premier league club”.

And I stress again that the spirit of what I was trying to get at, is that it’s the basic stuff that makes up 90% of a match.

We are better without the ball than with it. That is OK to an extent - arguably Leicester won the league off a similar, counterattacking philosophy. But for a club of our stature and our aspirations, it isn’t good enough.

The way the game is going, teams are pressing more and more, and if you aren’t comfortable with the ball, in your own half of the pitch, you are going to struggle.
 

Dinghy

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Look at how comfortable every single Bayern-player are on the ball. Then look at us with the spine of the team consisting of Fred and McT, with AWB at the right. Those three needs to be replaced, but then again we also need a striker, right-winger and a new CB... It just never ends, we've waisted so much money on crap, it's unbelieveable.
 

Lanesy

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Some interesting ideas.

However, the one thing I would question is if there has really been enough time between the period when Scholes, Xavi and Pirlo were dominating proceedings to the current game in order to make a relatively general statement on the kinds of players that can excel? If there were youngsters of the quality of those players within the production line they are unlikely to have completely disappeared within that timeframe, even where the coaching and tactical ideas change. I struggle to think they simply would not have made it, which suggests they were simply never there.

I do think the idea the game has become more physical and based on athleticism is a natural consequence of the current pressing style, and it is not clear if and when that will change.
You could go beyond that timeframe though. Go back 25 plus years and take players like Le Tissier, Merson, Bergkamp, Sheringham etc. Players that just oozed class and relied predominantly on their ability rather than their athleticism. Where would they fit in the modern game? Are there any players in the modern game that really fit that mould?
 

thepolice123

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The game has changed, unfortunately. We are seeing less and less technical players come through. The game is all about pace and athleticism now, what you can do with a ball at your feet comes second.

Think about it - how many purely technical footballers exist in the modern game? Modric is probably the last of a dying breed. Players in the mould of a Scholes, Xavi, Iniesta are a rarity now.

Scholes openly said he never considered himself an athlete. He confessed to eating chips all the time and he’s also asthmatic. He got by by being really really good at football. But sadly, the way the game has evolved, he probably wouldn’t get a look in in the modern game.

Also, didn’t Pirlo admit to smoking and playing PS2 all day before the World Cup final? And how good was he?!

I think we’ve just been spoiled with watching wonderful, naturally gifted footballers over the years, and not just at United. We have high expectations. But the game has changed - as infuriating as that is.

The fact of the matter is the likes of Rashford, Sterling will win the majority of sprints, Fred will outrun most for 90 mins and beyond, and that justifies their selection. And on the occasion that they do something good with a ball at their feet, it’s considered a bonus.
Yes there are less technical players now. All the City midfielders are pace merchants.
 

Bebestation

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We lack technical players in key positions.

The RW is still empty, a place for goals and creativity.

Pogba is a CM that is being used as a playmaker but doesnt have the consistency to control match after match.

We dont have a pure CDM which allows us to play two creative midfielders hence we play two defensively capable box to box type players.

Our GK wasnt exactly technically capable to come out of his line and catch a ball until he was dropped/replaced by Henderson.

I'm happy with defensively capable fullbacks in the squad like Wan Bissaka and Shaw but they should be competing with attacking fullbacks so we have two differnt options but also that they help each others weaknesses. Trippier and Wan Bissaka will give us a technically capable RB to either attack or defend.

A left footed CB partnership with a right footed CB playing passes from deep and protected by a pure CDM that drops in as a temporary back 3 would be perfect technically both attacking and defensively.

I think we are slowly getting there but it's very slow and slower than it needs to be.
 

Bobcat

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It was well reported that LvG shouted at Herrera for running into the box and scoring against Everton because he didn't stick to his position and let's not forget the stupid 'take a touch' rule our attackers had. IIRC Di Maria said in an interview that he hated playing for him because he was given no freedom to play and LvG got mad whenever he tried something.
Cant believe fecking LVG is being held up as some good example. He fecked us for years with his stupid transfers and his football was dire.

Our goals pr game under him was 1.53, worse than both Moyes and Jose at 1.69 while Ole is at 1.83 overall, 2.25 this sesason
 

Number32

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Only Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney, and Tevez who were with outstanding technical ability during Ferguson's era.
Even Gary said Phil has more technical ability than him, so why he was a starter and Phil was just a bench warmer?

I still do remember in '90s-2000's when we were being outplayed by Barca, Madrid, Juve, Bayern, and Wenger's Arsenal, because the lack of technical players. But somehow we could beat them, so no body complaint.

I have no idea why people still wants us to play like pep's Man City, even after we trashed them so many times lately.

If you ever lived in a prime Wenger's era, you would support Arsenal not United, because every non-united fans said we were boring and only rely with luck and tactics. We do agree Ferguson was the master of tactics and man management, but he never really had any recognition before he won everything. ABU's medias/reporters hated United because the way we played and won, and also United gained hundred millions supporters around the world was the result of that glory days. Most of them wanted "beautiful football" won, didn't accept any ugly wins, and I think some of posters here have the same point of view with them now.
 

kouroux

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Only Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney, and Tevez who were with outstanding technical ability during Ferguson's era.
Even Gary said Phil has more technical ability than him, so why he was a starter and Phil was just a bench warmer?

I still do remember in '90s-2000's when we were being outplayed by Barca, Madrid, Juve, Bayern, and Wenger's Arsenal, because the lack of technical players. But somehow we could beat them, so no body complaint.

I have no idea why people still wants us to play like pep's Man City, even after we trashed them so many times lately.

If you ever lived in a prime Wenger's era, you would support Arsenal not United, because every non-united fans said we were boring and only rely with luck and tactics. We do agree Ferguson was the master of tactics and man management, but he never really had any recognition before he won everything. ABU's medias/reporters hated United because the way we played and won, and also United gained hundred millions supporters around the world was the result of that glory days. Most of them wanted "beautiful football" won, didn't accept any ugly wins, and I think some of posters here have the same point of view with them now.
Because football is more than our confrontations with them and because they compete for and regularly win trophies every season. No idea indeed :lol:
It's amazing how those facts slipped your mind
 

Tom Van Persie

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Cant believe fecking LVG is being held up as some good example. He fecked us for years with his stupid transfers and his football was dire.

Our goals pr game under him was 1.53, worse than both Moyes and Jose at 1.69 while Ole is at 1.83 overall, 2.25 this sesason
I feel like fans are looking back on his reign more fondly so they can use it as another stick to beat Ole. His football was shite, that stretch of games in his second season where we didn't score a first half goal for months was the worst football I've seen at United since SAF retired. Boring zombie passing.
 

Halftrack

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Yep, my favourite performances were City and Liverpool away. We completely played them off the park on both occasions.

One of our biggest problems under LVG was creativity, bruno and pogba would have solved that issue.
LvG would never have signed someone like Bruno, as he takes way too many risks and gives the ball away too much. Pogba maybe, but he would undoubtedly have tried to coach any flair and risk-taking out of him, like he did with Ander Herrera.
 

#07

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Was thinking that watching Bayern last night. I was like woah...another level of ability vs our players.
PSG too.

Watching both teams move the ball, from back to front, should have been chastening for anyone who rates certain players on here. Just look at the ponderous way we switch play, slowly shuffling the ball across the pitch, compared to what both Bayern and PSG did last night. The biggest indictment of our side was when Bayern began shifting defenders into midfield and it didn't affect the rhythm of their play at all. Bayern defenders do in two touches what many of our players need four or five touches to achieve.

Also, its remarkable that we spent a combined £80m on Fred and Matic to replace Ander Herrera who is visibly better than both of them. Imagine we'd have just given him a new contract after Stockholm and spent that £80m on a right winger...
 

Wewinsoon

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LvG would never have signed someone like Bruno, as he takes way too many risks and gives the ball away too much. Pogba maybe, but he would undoubtedly have tried to coach any flair and risk-taking out of him, like he did with Ander Herrera.
think if he had got kroos instead than we had the chance
 

Lanesy

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Yes there are less technical players now. All the City midfielders are pace merchants.
Not pace merchants, but athletes. Fernandinho, Rodri, Gundogan aren’t great technically. De Bruyne, Foden, Mahrez are good but not at the Scholes, Pirlo, Xavi, Iniesta, Alonso level. I’d argue Bernardo Silva is probably the closest to that level in terms of relying on pure technical ability. Players who simply make the ball do the work.
 

Lanesy

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Only Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney, and Tevez who were with outstanding technical ability during Ferguson's era.
Really?! Scholes tops the lot and Tevez isn’t anywhere near that list IMO. I’d also include Cantona, Berbatov, Beckham, Veron and Van Persie

Kanchelskis, Sheringham, Carrick and Butt aren’t far off either. Very underrated.
 

Foxbatt

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Really?! Scholes tops the lot and Tevez isn’t anywhere near that list IMO. I’d also include Cantona, Berbatov, Beckham, Veron and Van Persie

Kanchelskis, Sheringham, Carrick and Butt aren’t far off either. Very underrated.
Agree with you. We had players with Technical ability. Add Yorkie, Keane, Rio and even Jesper and Cruijff though the last two didn't make it Jesper did win a CL. Ole himself had a lot of technical ability.
LVG liked players with technical ability. No one will say his Ajax side didn't have it.
I don't think we are as bad as we look. I feel it's more of a coaching issue rather than players lacking ability. It's the lack of movement that causes all our problems.
 

Wewinsoon

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Agree with you. We had players with Technical ability. Add Yorkie, Keane, Rio and even Jesper and Cruijff though the last two didn't make it Jesper did win a CL. Ole himself had a lot of technical ability.
LVG liked players with technical ability. No one will say his Ajax side didn't have it.
I don't think we are as bad as we look. I feel it's more of a coaching issue rather than players lacking ability. It's the lack of movement that causes all our problems.
I think the problem is that we still need something in middle and a real ST.
 

thepolice123

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Not pace merchants, but athletes. Fernandinho, Rodri, Gundogan aren’t great technically. De Bruyne, Foden, Mahrez are good but not at the Scholes, Pirlo, Xavi, Iniesta, Alonso level. I’d argue Bernardo Silva is probably the closest to that level in terms of relying on pure technical ability. Players who simply make the ball do the work.
Gundogan is easily one of the most technical midfielders Germany have produced in the last decade. What are you talking about? :lol:

Rodri and Fernandinho are water carriers. Obviously they are not going to measure up to the midfield greats. But compared to the likes of Makelele, Gattuso they easily pass the test.

Foden has the biggest potential I've seen from an English midfielder and he is definitely one of most technical player England have produced recently. Mahrez is several tiers below but I'd argue his technical abilities are more polished than the likes of McManaman or Sharpe.

De Bruyne will be a PL great alongside Scholes if he stays at City. Its the same with Silva, Toure, Aguero.
 
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Hammondo

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Not pace merchants, but athletes. Fernandinho, Rodri, Gundogan aren’t great technically. De Bruyne, Foden, Mahrez are good but not at the Scholes, Pirlo, Xavi, Iniesta, Alonso level. I’d argue Bernardo Silva is probably the closest to that level in terms of relying on pure technical ability. Players who simply make the ball do the work.
I think you are on something mate.
 

Glorio

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Was thinking that watching Bayern last night. I was like woah...another level of ability vs our players.
Bayern, I kinda get considering how they've dominated Europe recently. However, I felt rather embarrased watching Dortmund against City - especially in the first half, all their players seemed completely comfortable receiving the ball under pressure and finding a team mate. After the Sancho debacle, we've ridiculed their form (and "small-time-ness") this year, but I had to sheepishly admit that particularly in midfield they looked technically a lot better than our boys. They were actually a good match for City before City finally decided to bring a striker on.

We actually do quite well against City, but apart from our last match at the Etihad where it didn't seem like we were desperately clinging on, we've never really looked a match technically speaking.

That said, I feel we're more than a match for most of the Premier League. Fred, McTominay, AWB, and James may struggle, but the rest of our players are quite good on the ball. Rashford and Bruno may have some torrid days but I put that down to the club running them into the ground, as they've also shown plenty of times that they can do things most footballers can't.
 

sunama

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Look at how comfortable every single Bayern-player are on the ball. Then look at us with the spine of the team consisting of Fred and McT, with AWB at the right. Those three needs to be replaced, but then again we also need a striker, right-winger and a new CB... It just never ends, we've waisted so much money on crap, it's unbelieveable.
Agreed 100%.
In fact, we don't need to look at Bayern. We can look at lesser teams and they are better technically on the ball.
The difference is that we can beat those better-drilled teams with technically better players - so I guess it's not all doom and gloom. Our team knows how to win, plus we have Bruno who knows how to create killer chances.
Our main problem is that if Bruno is out of form, we are screwed.
 

Isotope

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Not pace merchants, but athletes. Fernandinho, Rodri, Gundogan aren’t great technically. De Bruyne, Foden, Mahrez are good but not at the Scholes, Pirlo, Xavi, Iniesta, Alonso level. I’d argue Bernardo Silva is probably the closest to that level in terms of relying on pure technical ability. Players who simply make the ball do the work.
I'd say KDB is as good as any of those players (bar Iniesta).