So to prove the point that Labour was stuck in the past and didn’t prepare, you quote from the 80s. The point here was of course just to blame the right of the party.
Westminster Politics 2024-2029
- Thread starter Pexbo
- Start date
Who else would you blame?
Each of the two (preciously) main parties are a coalition of ideologies that need to be brought together. It’s clearly important to bring those together with shared goals and a vision.
Labour didn’t have that, and even campaigned to that extent. Clearly the biggest failure is at the top, and thinking that the race was simply about being elected, and sidelining governing.
You're not describing Labour post Starmer and Mcwotsits cull.
The right won the internal battle. They own this mess completely.
Not really, it is typical Labour reactions to gaining power, even when they expected it.
In fairness Blair and Brown came close to 'being prepared' after the years under Maggie Thatcher, and when John Major tried to hold the Tories together.
Perhaps only Harold Wilson was 'ready'.... if not exactly 'prepared', because he knew his 'majority' was slim very slim!
Labour's 'wide church' membership; predominately 'left-leaning' in terms of its troops, but some 'old fashioned right' members as well in the PLP, always tend to 'kick one another on the shins, under the table, whilst in opposition, but soon as they got into power internecine warfare erupts.
McSweeney, seems to have persuaded Starmer to try 'the iron fist... in the iron glove' to compel obedience from MP's, but as he now admits they simply didn't know how much the world had changed.
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An iron fist to make changes is one thing, an iron fist to not do much at all is another. The devil makes work for idle hands as they say.
It seems Labour went for a mix of 1997 (ming vase across a polished floor etc) and 2010 (keep blaming your predecessors for how bad things are). Completely missing the point that circumstances are very different to 1997 (the economy was in good shape then while more radical action around progressive taxation is required now) and 2010 (the UK had only endured a couple of bad years by then, not 16 years). Burnham will at least do the messaging a lot better than Starmer and Reeves; we’ll have to wait and see whether he can or is willing to do the more difficult bit of transformative change. Either way, he’s Labour’s last chance, possibly the country’s last chance of saving itself from the Far Right and certainly my generation’s last chance to redeem itself in politics after producing the likes of Liz Truss.
Indeed.
Very true.... however, the 'iron fist... in the velvet glove' , which will probably be Andy Burnham's approach to motivating the Starmer 'die-hards' to see it his way, might just work.......... but, nah didn't think so!
Wonder what the chances of John Healey returning, possibly as Secretary of State for Defence... after all Andy does owe him.... something?
Pubs allowed to stay open until 5am for England Mexico match
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1kyr8747m9o
But in a U-turn later on Thursday, Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer
a U-turn later on Thursday, Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer
U-turn Sir Keir Starmer
@ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg
He ended as he lived.
I do love a Starmer u turn! Might as well wait until the morning transport kicks in, rather than the night bus.
England is going to be productive on Monday!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvg53d9p18vo
A rare bit of sanity.
How on earth can any judge not give custodial sentences to rapists? These scumbags should be in jail for at least a decade, but at least this is a start.
I don’t know whether it’s the judge, and their complete misjudgement or the interpretation of the law that’s at fault?
I think the restraining order was also limited previously?
At least it’s been rectified reasonably quickly.
A rare bit of sanity.
How on earth can any judge not give custodial sentences to rapists? These scumbags should be in jail for at least a decade, but at least this is a start.
I don’t know whether it’s the judge, and their complete misjudgement or the interpretation of the law that’s at fault?
I think the restraining order was also limited previously?
At least it’s been rectified reasonably quickly.
There is a statutory route of appeal for 'unduly lenient sentences' (I think under the Criminal Justice Act 1988).
Here is a Parliamentary Question which lays out the raw data:
From 1 January 2019 to 21 February 2025, 781 sentences were referred to the Court of Appeal by the Law Officers under the Unduly Lenient Sentence scheme.
The number of referrals by Law Officers to the Court of Appeal each year since 2019 is as follows:
| 2019 | 93 |
| 2020 | 97 |
| 2021 | 155 |
| 2022 | 139 |
| 2023 | 139 |
| 2024 | 146 |
| 2025 | 12 to date |
This data is available publicly using the Outcome of ULS Referrals Data Tool - Outcome of unduly lenient sentence referrals - GOV.UK(opens in a new tab).
https://questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-questions/detail/2025-02-25/33594/
https://www.sentencingacademy.org.u.../Key-Facts_Unduly-Lenient-Sentence-Scheme.pdf
To be fair, pretty much the only person in the country who didn't think the previous sentence was a joke was the judge involved. It'd have been a travesty had that not been overturned and some jail time given.
Indeed. I didn’t realise there was a sentencing thread, so probably the wrong place to put this, in any case.
Right-leaning Telegraph is putting out reports that Hollie Ridley, Labour's General Secretary ( Starmer friend) who recently tended her resignation, was forced out by 'toxic briefings' against her by friends of Burnham and she was being threatened of worse to come if she didn't go.
This has apparently struck fear in the hearts of top Labour women who are apparently thinking 'jobs for the boys' will be Andy's stock in trade in terms of selection of senior ministers. The 'boys' incidentally are thought to be among those who Andy served with in Brown's brief Premiership.
Of course, this could all be 'mischief making' by the Telegraph, who we know will not have Andy Burnham as top of their Christmas card list; but will it still result in an outpouring of defensive.... "oh no Andy is such a sweetie'" from Labour's female top-notchers?
Sounds like right-wing mischief making but if so then if we thought Starmer got a pounding, then Andy could be in for much worse, reach for the 'tin hats' Andy.
This has apparently struck fear in the hearts of top Labour women who are apparently thinking 'jobs for the boys' will be Andy's stock in trade in terms of selection of senior ministers. The 'boys' incidentally are thought to be among those who Andy served with in Brown's brief Premiership.
Of course, this could all be 'mischief making' by the Telegraph, who we know will not have Andy Burnham as top of their Christmas card list; but will it still result in an outpouring of defensive.... "oh no Andy is such a sweetie'" from Labour's female top-notchers?
Sounds like right-wing mischief making but if so then if we thought Starmer got a pounding, then Andy could be in for much worse, reach for the 'tin hats' Andy.
Because the other option for government is Reform. Especially where I live the only options are Labour or Reform. The lesser of two weevils.
You’ve raised a point that many don’t seem to get, as a voter, you will not agree with everything a political party stands for, far from it.
The right leaning rag called Torygraph is full of sh1te.
If the Telegraph is "right leaning" then the Tower of Pisa is straight.
It could be that the Telegraph has chosen this moment to start caring about equality in the workplace.
Hopefully Burnham gives the Telegraph and the rest of the right-wing press two finger's and acknowledges they are going to be his enemy from the get go. Dismiss and ridicule them for what they are. Instead of taking the cowardly approach Starmer did trying to appease them, whilst they kick and spit on him.
Appreciate this is from a couple of weeks ago, but on reflection do you now think you misjudged Starmer?
All of that plus commissioning Leveson Part 2, as well as ordering an inquiry into foreign (Russian) interference into our domestic matters including the 2016 referendum. You know, just for fun
Not misjudged, in the sense he wasn't on the right track. I do think he was both serious and correct in trying to play the long game; in effect making certain key constitutional changes before attempting to reposition 'the dial'. This was especially true given both the current economic and world situation.
However I do think his lack of political nous did for him in trusting all the advice he received from various quarters. He clearly didn't realise as PM everybody wanted a 'piece of him' even his advisors...perhaps especially his advisors; especially when there is now a clear admission " they were not ready" for power.
I think history will concluded Starner PM was something of an 'innocent abroad' and he paid the price.
Doubt Burnham will make same mistakes, he is a smooth political operator, but also doubt he will make the key long-term changes in moving the dial for working people that Starmer envisaged.
Hopefully you're very slowly coming round to the idea that he was and always has been an empty suit. A useful idiot for the remnants of the Blairites (his advisors) that can't fathom why their idea of politics and governance doesn't work anymore and is incredibly unpopular. Stuck in their ways trying to recreate a vibe that has not existed for 20+ years.
There was no long term plan. Starmer had no personal vision outside of what he was presented with. Which is why he couldn't even muster up the capability to champion the few achievements his government made. I doubt he's even aware of them unless it's written down for him in a speech.
He may as well have been AI generated.
Surely 'AI generated' is indeed where we are heading with our future political leadership models.
Perhaps Starmer should be considered as an early prototype that didn't quite work out!
Got em again! No matter how many times terrorist Sue tries this terrorist bit The Labour Party will be there to use the full force of the law against her. 14 years in prison, send her down.
Farage vs Binface!!!
I’m ready!
I’m ready!
If I was the government I would schedule the election for the end of the summer. Make Nige campaign for two full months.
If Farage wins will the investigation into his dodgy dealings continue?
If he loses can they still investigate retrospectively?
Would love bin face representing us in parliament.
Yes.If Farage wins will the investigation into his dodgy dealings continue?
If he loses can they still investigate retrospectively?
Would love bin face representing us in parliament.
Yes, but no sanctions can be applied as he won't be an MP.
I agree, although he would have to wear a tie...
Bin face beating Farage would be sweet. Albeit highly unlikely.
But it's hardly Farage vs the Establishment is it
New theory that farage doesn't actually want to lead reform into government and is actively doing this shite so he can quit whilst still claim to be fighting against the establishment.
The guy would genuinely be great.
Please Clacton.
Robert Jenrick hosting on LBC at 10am. Let's get the popcorn.
Why does Forage get to wear his frog mask?A national disgrace.
It's not as unlikely as you might think, if it's just these 2, based on the GE results, if all non-Reform voters cast their vote for Binface then there's enough to beat himBin face beating Farage would be sweet. Albeit highly unlikely.
But it's hardly Farage vs the Establishment is it