What exactly is the 'real' problem?

Discussion in 'Football Forum' started by LazyRed-Ninja, Aug 28, 2018.

  1. Aug 28, 2018

    LazyRed-Ninja LazyGrammar-Ninja

    Aug 14, 2014
    Reading a novel in the class of '92
    Not neccesary to write an essay here, the title is quite self explanatory. When the team plays poorly the result is logically poor (Brigton), but when the team plays good (first half especially against Spurs) the result is still poor. Is it quality alone? Fans have been criticizing the board referring to a 'structural' problem, a gap between the business side and the actual football 'know how'. The money is here, the structure is here, yet five years after the last title, the club has not made a convincing title charge whatsoever. The obvious thing that can be mentioned are;

    1. Not enough quality
    2. No 'identity'
    3. Manager
    4. Gap between board and the manager

    Feel free to add yours.
  2. Aug 28, 2018

    deafepl New Member

    May 19, 2017
    I guess the coaching could make difference to our players like Poch, Kloop and Pep can get best out of them and play their better football but for sure, we need a huge investment for our defence whilst rest of our midfield and attack is okay.
  3. Aug 28, 2018

    SER19 Full Member

    Apr 15, 2008
    The culture of the club is rotten. Ferguson used to speak about the significance of the ceo to the tea ladies. Nobody at united seems to be pulling in the same direction. We change players and managers and have the exact same issues. The leadership of the club lacks focus, engages in unneccesary pr battles, seems to change approach every few months. The players, for 5 years have lacked motivation regardless of who they are or who our manager is. When theres always somebody to blame theres no accountability.

    We need to accept years on the periphery rather than a disjointed grab at getting right back to the top. Woodward should be absolved completely of any role to do with football. He is so out of his depth its untrue. The priorities should be realistic and achievable and build from there. Start with exciting football.
  4. Aug 28, 2018

    Red Digger Full Member

    Mar 25, 2014
    It’s all about making money now. The football is only the side show. Our past success will keep the Glazers in profit until they move on.
  5. Aug 28, 2018

    Sweet Square Full Member

    Jun 6, 2013
    Ruler Of The Supermarket
    Both the owners and us lot have no idea what we want. After Moyles the club went the way of building a team for the future with Van Gaal and when that plan went to shit, the owners(And also us lot because we where all fecking moaning about no trophies)decided to completely u-turn and become a bad remake of the galacticos.

    Although you know it's literally only august so.......
  6. Aug 28, 2018

    crossy1686 Full Member

    Jun 5, 2010
    Stockholm, Sweden
    I posted this before, but this is my take on it:

  7. Aug 28, 2018

    Sterling Archer Full Member

    Jun 30, 2016
    Have you tried turning it off and then on again?

    Club needs a hard reset.
  8. Aug 28, 2018

    An Irish Red New Member

    Sep 25, 2009
    Ros Earcáin/Tuaim/an Baile Meánach
    Our attack is nowhere near okay. We have multiple average forwards (Rashford, Lingard and Mata) and a main striker with serious question marks surrounding him as well.

    It's not good enough for a club of our size.
  9. Aug 28, 2018

    groovyalbert Full Member

    Feb 14, 2013
    Nobody shares the same priorities at the club right now. Of course, they all want us to win and be succcessful, but they don’t share the same vision on how to achieve this. There is no cohesion, there is no project in mind. We are a corporate shell of a club, reliant on individual big name managers and players to keep us afloat.

    Players have been isolated by the manager, who has been isolated by the board, who have isolated themselves from the club. It’s a trickle down effect from the running of the club, to the atmosphere around the facilities, to the performances on the pitch. The only thing that seems to make us a club is our name, and the fans who spend hard earned money to watch us play.

    So what exactly is the problem? I hate to say it, but you’d get a much shorter answer if you were to ask what is right.

    I have no idea if, when or how this gets fixed. Jose will leave, but the process will repeat itself as it did with LVG. Maybe we have to fall from financial grace a bit - get to a point where we aren’t so financially attractive to the owners. Maybe then we can start to build a team in the manner of Spurs, Liverpool or City. You know, the right way. Where whether you’re spending loads or developing youth, you have a clear footballing vision and ethos that spreads throughout the running of the club, which looks to the future for success. That’s what we need.
  10. Aug 28, 2018

    Pink Moon Full Member

    Aug 20, 2009
    Manager and players aren't up to it. It isn't 2005 any more. Mourinho and his brand of football are outdated.

    Guys like Lukaku just aren't good enough for a team like United if you wanna be winning CL's and PL's. Look at his chance tonight and ask yourself if that was Aguero, Salah or Kane if it's a goal. Likewise his chances v Brighton and Leicester. That's the difference.

    The recruitment policy at the club seems awful. Fred for 50(?) million is shambolic. I know it might only be 3 games into his United career but the same goes for guys like Keita and Jorginho but you can at least see their quality.

    DDG is the only player with genuine world class quality. Pogba has all the tools and all the ability in the world but honestly is too far up himself to ever realise his potential. His bit tonight where he eventually passed it straight out sums him up. Had chances to lay the ball off or clear it but instead wants to mess around with his foot on the ball and show how skilful and strong he is, gets pressed, panics and just surrenders possession. Outside of those two I'm struggling to think of a real top class player at the club. Shaw is pretty good but the rest of the defence aren't up to much. Sanchez and Mata once upon a time but both are done.
  11. Aug 28, 2018

    Klopper76 "Did you see Fabinho against Red Star & Cardiff?"

    Dec 15, 2015
    You’ve had a severe identity crisis post Ferguson which has led to a scatter-gun transfer policy under three very different managers.

    I don’t believe that Mourinho hand picked all of the players you’ve signed since he’s been there, and I think the same thing’s happened under Moyes (Mata) and LVG (Di Maria/Falcao) too. I think that Mourinho and Pogba are a perfect example of this. Mourinho didn’t want him but now he’s stuck with an £89 million midfielder that he has to play, because if he doesn’t everyone’s coming at him from all angles. It shouldn’t take two years to get the best out of a midfielder. It’s a compatibility issue. Pogba doesn’t fit into what Mourinho wants from a midfielder. He’s in a similar situation with Sanchez. I don’t think Mourinho knocked on Woodward’s door and said “get me Sanchez”. If he’d actually got the players that he wanted he probably wouldn’t be as pissed off about the last window.

    Mourinho would love a team full of Matic’s who’re solid, work hard and follow instructions but he’s had expensive ‘star players’ thrown at him by a board that wants to sell shirts.

    Under Ferguson you had one direction: his. Anyone who didn’t want to go in that direction was shown the door. Since he retired you’ve been a club with a board pulling in one direction and the manager pulling in the other trying to develop their footballing philosophy, with Woodward struggling to balance it all in the middle.

    Once you find an identity and get everyone pulling in one direction, it’ll be much easier to build something. A director of football working under a manager like Zidane focussing on developing a fixed style of play that everyone at the club buys into, that’s what you need in my opinion.
  12. Aug 28, 2018

    TheReligion Abusive

    Nov 22, 2006
    Good post. Interesting opinions and not really that far fetched to believe.
  13. Aug 28, 2018

    RedIke Full Member

    Oct 3, 2012
    Milwaukee, Wisconsin, America
    I honestly just think it's two losses in a row and nothing more.

    One game they played like shit and rightfully got embarrassed. Nothing more, in to the next one.

    The next one came, they played much better, and got punished for errors.

    The only way out, is to keep working and play the next game. We'll see how next Sunday goes.
  14. Aug 28, 2018

    Sarni nice guy, unassuming, objective United fan.

    Jan 21, 2004
    Nothing is good enough at the moment to be completely honest. The squad isn’t as good as what United should aim for, the manager is underperforming, the board is a total mess and seem to be working without a long term vision. We have not dealt with Fergie’s departure at all.
  15. Aug 28, 2018

    Frank Grimes Full Member

    Aug 1, 2014
    Newbies 15/16 FPL Champion.
    Whether Mourinho goes or not we need to get rid of the bad apples. I'm mainly talking about Martial and Pogba here, players with bad attitude are cancerous and bring down the whole group.
  16. Aug 28, 2018

    Klopper76 "Did you see Fabinho against Red Star & Cardiff?"

    Dec 15, 2015
    I should’ve added that I don’t think Mourinho wants to work with a director of football which is why I said someone like Zidane. Also I’ve got nothing against signing star players, but they should be stars the manager wants and can build a team around. I think Mourinho would’ve worked wonders with someone like Bale.
  17. Aug 28, 2018

    Holocene New Member

    Dec 15, 2013
    Good post. Certainly agree with Pogba not being a Mourinho player. But I do think he wanted Sanchez.
  18. Aug 28, 2018

    The_Midfielder Full Member

    Apr 12, 2006
    Bad recruitment .. coach to players .. no philosophy.. outdated coaches ... Spurs, citys, liverpool's , Chelsea's entire backline are better than our defense .. so hence we will be 5th..
    Spurs backup fullbacks are better than our 1st 11 fullbacks..
  19. Aug 28, 2018

    Striker10 "Ronaldo and trophies > Manchester United football

    Sep 21, 2004
    The problem is the ownership of the club. When Chelsea had success and city...yes you bring in new players and it's easy when you have a carefree attitude. We have too many average players. We've become complaicent. Our mentality is fragile. We're sloppy. We lack focus. We needed players.....it's as simple as that. We know the market is broken. Clubs have gotten more and more greedy. We're indecisive because of the prices in the market. If they are looking for value? They should sell now. Because they bought rightly or wrongly, into a successful model and while Ed can do deals....they don't have the money to replicate what Sir Alex did. So we're in a situation where you have a proven manager with a squad who don't appear to believe in themselves and don't have the bottle to fight. I'm not talking about tonight. I'm talking about Brighton. Tonight, wasn't our night. We are not aggressive enough. We're sloppy. There are so many things. What Jose needs to do? Is sell A NUMBER of players...and bring in QUALITY....4/5 QUALITY players...We're short and the energy isn't in the squad because they know at best they're fighting for second place......that's because of the owners and maybe the scouting. We just seem slow doing anything. We're indecisive. We need new owners. Else we risk losing De Gea certainly (and others potentially) but a lot will stay - because they're not top top quality.....and they're on a decent wage. Joses biggest problem is that he don't have a lot of time and will not be allowed to do the job required.
  20. Aug 28, 2018

    Ekeke Full Member

    Aug 1, 2006
    Hope, We Lose
    Today the problem was being less clinical than our opponents. Happens to every team sometimes, happened under Sir Alex at times too. Having said that he liked to try and fix that by having 4 strikers on the pitch by the end of the match.
  21. Aug 28, 2018

    ForestRGoinUp New Member

    Aug 15, 2018
    I see this as being key to everything. Fans must finally accept that it’s going to take time. It has to take time if we’re going to build anything sustainable and long term again.

    The longer fans refuse to accept it, the more likely we are to churn out manager after manager. I suppose it’s one thing if we accept that reality and another thing entirely for the know nothing owners to accept it. The champions league money seems to be at the top of their priorities every season.
  22. Aug 28, 2018

    tjb Full Member

    Sep 6, 2013
    For me the major problems at the club are as follows:

    1. Our fans have never truly gotten behind Mourinho from day 1, they are too influenced by the style of play. This has made it so easy for the media to attack the club at every turn, and has created the toxic environment we currently have. In addition, Mourinho attacking the board and preseason constantly, and Woodward not supporting Mourinho has led to this.

    2. The recruitment of players at the club post ferguson and pre mourinho was horrible. We have been unable to sell some of these players, while still being reliant on some of the squad players in Fergie's era. This has meant that despite the talent of some of our players (with DDG being the only good and consistent one bought pre Mourinho), the rest are dragging us down in quality, making us unbalanced. Certain positions are championship level, while others are world class.

    3. The defensive unit at the club deserves a very special mention on the recruitment and maintainance front. Injury prone players that lack the quality of other competitors in the top 6 not named arsenal. At least the arsenal centre backs can get the ball out of the back four, ours cannot. It forces our midfield to come deep in big games, and whenever theyre exposed, theyre lack of quality shows itself.

    A director of football who knows the direction the club want in style and quality of play will improve us significantly. Unfortunately we will have to part with Mourinho as the relationships between him and several key figures at the club is too strained for any future, in addition, the fans are not supportive and may never be supportive of his approach in certain scenarios, while the board are too conservative to dismiss the media circus around him. So we will also need a manager who can work with a director of football and the board, while producing attacking tactics and having the will to work with the club in the long term.....as this is ultimately the clubs goal.

    In addition, we need to address the weakness at the club eventually with this new recruitment approach. But most importantly, we need to keep the bad apples in the squad ( Pogba and Martial) on probation. The new manager should be given the option to keep or sell these two players, depending on formation and suitability.
  23. Aug 28, 2018

    Coach V New Member

    Aug 22, 2018
    The current state of United is due to four reasons: Board, Players, Mourinho, Past Success. The order of failure for me would be

    1. Board (Ed Woodward)

    The biggest mistake Ed made this season is not to back the manager fully in the transfer window. In my other post I have explained the hypothetical United team, if Mourinho was backed in the transfer window. On paper its a 1000 times better than the current one (without a grain of exaggeration). Also, not buying CBs is atrocious. This has nothing to do with backing/not-backing Mourinho. United can never be a top team under any manager with the current CBs. United desperately need new CBs. Mourinho CB target Toby proved his class today and the other target Maguire is a massive improvement over the Smalling/Jones/Lindelof/Rojo quartet. So for a billion dollar revenue team like United, rejecting quality CB by haggling over price and age is criminal. This is the main reason why United are poor this season. A defensive united Mourinho team shipping 3 goals in 2 consecutive games is purely because of bad CBs.

    2. Players

    The current United squad must be one of the worst United squad as far as I can remember. Its a Mourinho miracle they made it to 2nd last season (mainly due to the cagey underdog mindset and the much maligned safety first defensive-nick-goal tactics that helped them reach there). There are 4 types of players in this squad:

    Titus Bramble Type - Smalling, Rojo, Jones, Lindelof, Felliani
    Balotelli Type - Pogba, Martial
    Sturridge-Wilshere Type - Bailly, Matic, Shaw
    Mata Type (aged/fading) - Young, Valencia, Mata, Matic

    De Gea is the only world class player in the squad (Matic at times)
    Rashford, Lingard future potentials
    Lukaku - Non-clinical striker
    Bailly, Sanchez and Fred - Yet to be firing.

    This squad is never going to come out bursting. On top of this most players were either injured or returned late from world cup and had few to zero pre-season.

    3. Mourinho

    Mourinho plays a dour football style which is completely anti-united way. Fans are never going to get value for money when it comes to entertainment, a poor run of results is always going to get an overreaction from the already non-entertained dissatisfied fans.

    His toxic agitating nature is not working with both the players and board. Though his demands from both player performance and lack of transfer backing from the board are legitimate, he could have dealt with it in a non-combative classy way and enhanced the dressing room environment.

    Also his public criticism of key united players is not working due to the abundant snow-flake noueve riche immature 19 year old baby players in the United squad, aka Pogba, Martial. Overall, his management of both board and players could be way different.

    He has literally baited all the media headlines with his poor press handling and big ego, inviting unwarranted pressure that keeps mounting with poor results

    4. Past Success

    Manchester United is a big victim of its past success. The United commercial machine is built on fans endlessly pampered with rich entertaining and continuous success under the Great Sir Alex. As a result, both the fans and the board keep oscillating between success and style - both of which is built into the "United Way", Majority of the fans have mistaken it only to be style and not success. A United team that doesn't win will be as much scorned upon as a United team that doesn't play well. United lost that battle when City nabbed Pep. So until they identify the next Pep, a manager who can do both Style and Success - the true United Way, the undue pressure and impatient fan expectations will keep pushing the board in making irrational managerial choices, conflicting between delivering style/ immediate success.

    These are the true reasons of United's current predicament
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2018
  24. Aug 28, 2018

    Subho611 Full Member

    Jul 26, 2013
    The issue is simple. There is NO long term strategy here. There isn't a single person at the club who is tasked with thinking well into the future and putting the pieces in place to make that happen.

    Post Ferguson, we have become a reactive machinery - swooping at everything that comes our way. There isn't a definitely decision making policy that is used against potential opportunities to determine whether or not these opportunities will get us in the direction that we want to go in the long term.

    Instead what we have are a few people in power making decisions based on what matters most to their role in the club. Woodward wants to maximize shareholder value in the short to medium term while our manager wants expensive toys for immediate glory, while discounting the effects on the long term health.

    The players are caught in between this dysfunctional way of running the club. Most of them have never tasted success, or have done so in other clubs or in a bygone era. Quite a few of them are only here because no one is going to pay them more.

    We need a committee in place to put together a long term vision, and make short-term decisions based on that vision. Also, a clear out of the team is required.
  25. Aug 28, 2018

    Fosu-Mens Full Member

    Apr 11, 2016
    Muppet station for next season.
    If the objective of the corporation that is Manchester United is to make money and we make a ton of money/increase in value, then there are no problems.
    Factors for success(make money): Please read and try to find anything football related. Winning trophies, playing attacking football or entertaining fans.
  26. Aug 28, 2018

    meamth Full Member

    Jun 3, 2017
    I see some of you beginning to criticize Fred. He got some ability the lad, but today by 70th minute he ran out of gas.

    Back to the topic, I guess we lacked pre season and things doesn't click at the moment.
  27. Aug 28, 2018

    Red_toad Full Member

    Oct 23, 2010
    No one knows the real problems, aside those running the club. I'm sure certain issues are being addressed, but as with our preparing a bid style every summer, it'll take time.
    Nice to see the team playing well for 30 odd minutes, very refreshing, shame to result is causing a meltdown...
  28. Aug 28, 2018

    ash_86 Full Member

    Sep 4, 2013
    A+ post
  29. Aug 28, 2018

    Himannv Full Member

    Dec 11, 2017
    I know we lost, but I'm actually much happier with the team's performance last night than the farce that we witnessed against Brighton. We were definitely the better team in the first half and just need a bit more stability at the back. Also, Lukaku needs to start taking those straightforward chances.

    I also felt we did put in the effort but there were too many players who were featuring for the first time this season or still trying to get used to the speed of things and I think that was obvious to see in the second half. I'd wait a bit more before suggesting a complete overhaul of everything. The team could still get it right between now and Christmas and suggesting that we fire the manager three games into the season is ridiculous.

    Anyone can see that the CB signing was an important one and we really shouldn't have missed out on it. It's down to Ed to put things right in that department now, but that's something we'll have to wait until January or the next Summer to address.
  30. Aug 28, 2018

    steffyr2 Full Member

    Feb 6, 2005
    From reading redcafe, it's not even apparent that our fans are our fans!

    I agree with your other comments. One to add, #4 -- conspiracy!

    We don't have any senior players who know what Utd should be like. They were fired, and I'm starting the think that they were fired because they were more powerful than could be tolerated. If Utd keeps buying younger players, and keeps changing managers, well then all power will reside with the board.

    They'll buy showy has-beens and youngsters, bring in the next manager for a year or 2. It will be exciting, always a new chance to succeed around the corner. Nothing like the old Utd, though.
  31. Aug 28, 2018

    MuFc_1992 Full Member

    Apr 25, 2014
    I think it's the lack of identity as well as players being unmotivated. Last season we finished second and got criticized and it was clear before the season began that we werent going to better that. I think that really demotivated the players. I know people are gonna say that they make shitload of money so they should do their jobs but I honestly don't see how money alone would motivate them when they already have enough to live a life of luxury. I find it ridiculous when people say he's paid so and so so he should be performing better. Also, I believe that mourhino usually has meltdown because players after a few season players lose motivation to play his system which I assume is boring as hell and requires intense focus without the ball.
  32. Aug 28, 2018

    tjb Full Member

    Sep 6, 2013
    I agree, and I am hoping guys like Lukaku and Matic step into that role this year, as they seem to be mature. I'm honestly tired of the primadonnas we currently have, its one thing if they are producing every week, but ours seem to have merit based off of nothing. Rashford, Martial for example have not had a consistently good season at utd, but somehow are almost treated like star players....Then you get the squad players who show no passion or energy like players like ji sung park or fletcher or even wes brown or oshea used to show. This is the reason I appreciate herrera fellaini and lingard, despite them not be starting level players, they will always fight for the club and not hide in difficult situations, this is how all our squad players should be and how they generally were under Fergie. Our defence lacks any players willing to take responsibility, particularly on the ball, this is why we have so many backward passes, and even De Gea doesnt have leadership capabilities for the squad.
    On the manager aspect, this is why we need to get a steady hand in the director of football for transfer strategies, we have the money, the name, the reputation, and even some decent players. If we can hire a director of football or some sort of technical director that can implement the directives of the clubs vision from the board ( as I feel they have good intentions but the inability to execute efficiently enough), in addition to a manager who can satisfy both board and fan demands( not completely as that is not possible, but at least to a satisfactory degree), then I feel that we will be well placed for years, as our board don't seem to be as reactive as other clubs ( both Moyes and Van Gaal should have been sacked about 4 months prior to their releases).
  33. Aug 28, 2018

    Reyoji-Utd Full Member

    May 11, 2014
    i think we lost all the aura of a great footballing club when Ferguson finally retired. What's worse was that David Gill left at the same time. The Club lost two footballing figure heads. Ferguson alone can earn us points because we just know that somehow he'd do something and we'd win the game. The players are with him, fight for him, for the club, know how to grind out results week in week out, year in year out, leadership all over the pitch.

    When you ask what is the real problem is, it's because everyone involve not working toward the same GOAL, on the same boat, fighting for the same thing - Winning.

    Looking the past five years after Ferguson retired, we can see that the clubs has no more footballing foundations, no medium or longer plan. The board is happy as long as United makes more pricey sponsorships and doesn't really care about the performances or results as long as we stay at top 4. We can see this with LVG, that when Mourinho available, he's sacked without even given notice in person. Woodward now are trying to do the same by relaying any blame to the manager again. The board makes it clear that they only interest in making money when they make sure everyone knows that they only sign young star names to help with sponsorships.

    The manager has his own flaw as well be it his football style or his management of his players. We know what we get when we hire Mourinho that if you want to win something with him, you have to continue to pay big amount of money to bring players that he wants/can use to play his football. We can see that he's trying something that wasn't his style this year with Carrick and Mackenna but i think it's too late now because the players that he has won't be helping him or the club. Ferguson was able to evolve because he's already has years of success, foundations, players/leaderships. He only needed to tweak a few staffs, players to change his style to evolve with the footballing world or aspiration (CL). Mourinho can't because he's still trying to win the PL and by the looks of it, he's not that backed by the board if choices has to be made between him or players. United has become just another corporate football club these past years and it's a final nail on the coffin when we saw that the board was/is siding with players over manager.

    Then, we have the players that some have the talents in the world to be world class but couldn't because of mentality or has too much over their head. This is a team game but if when anything bad happen the stick ends only with the manager then i'm afraid the players won't care much about the consequences of their performances. Players nowadays have too much power and coincide with Mourinho only been here a few years, they know that the board might back them rather than the manager when push come to shove because they are considered pricey assets by United than the manager. Players nowadays seems to care more about their brand when they haven't even make a big impact on their clubs yet. This exacerbates because fans seems to care more for particular players than the entire good being of club. We can see here that some don't even care about the balance of team or results as long as their favorite players play/signed.

    What we need to do now is keep working hard to win, win at all cost, everyone helping each other out, fight for each other. But i'm afraid this won't happen as the board already mess up with the transfer, Mourinho already mess up with his changing of footballing style at the wrong period, players are just...sigh.

    All in all, the United that most of us love, attached to, the mystique, the history seems to be gone/lost. We had those even when Glazer bought us because we still has SAF. Now, those sentiments/emotions are gone. I feel really indifferent toward United especially this year or at least that's what i keep telling myself. But somehow i can't keep my urge of keeping track of what United doing, then, only to realize again and again that it's not very much the same United that makes me mesmerize and fall in love with anymore.
  34. Aug 28, 2018

    njred HALA MADRID!

    Nov 3, 2001
    Looks like the so called”rot” has set in at your club. There just doesn’t seem to be any leadership on the pitch. Sometimes a group of players just don’t mesh and this seems to be a classic example of it. Your old Mgr would have sorted it out in my opinion and Jose would too if he was in it for the long haul. But he’s not is he?
    The problem is worse when you consider the individual quality and price of the players that just don’t seem to play well together especially at the moment. I think you are a Good mgr away from being a top top team again. I’d have to say it’s on the coach and I see it getting worse before getting better. You’re not going to be playing any top sides for a while but that might not be a blessing. If you slip up against one of these so called lesser teams in the coming weeks your season could just fall apart. Kinda on a knifes edge right now.
  35. Aug 28, 2018

    elmo Can never have too many Eevees

    Jul 14, 2008
    AKA: Slapanut Goat Smuggla
    Football isn’t the focus at the club anymore and it shows in our players.

    I’ll rather see the club do a total reset and get in players who actually want to play for the club rather than just getting players who fit the commercialised approach that Woodward is selling to our sponsors.

    feck the spoilt brats that need motivation to play well, they’re playing for Manchester United and are paid fecking well for it. How much more motivation do hey bloody need.
  36. Aug 28, 2018

    Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber Thus says Kemo

    Jul 13, 2002
    Founder of IhateMakeleles.org and Gourcufffanboysa
    1. Little investment in the defence under the new manager.

    2. No investment in the right flank.

    3. Undermining the current manager publically
  37. Aug 28, 2018

    tenpoless Full Member

    Oct 20, 2014
    *Teleports behind you*
    1. A few players are looking to leave the club, causing negativity among players
    2. Mourinho has earned himself a title of "negative manager" and when the club doesn't win anything the fans and mainly the media turn against him, causing more negativity around the club
    3. Half arsed backing by the board, you either fully support a manager and get the players He wants or not at all and replace the manager
    4. Our club has no clear structure, We're amateurs in this regard. The first evidence was the club's handling of Sir Alex replacement. It's been going downhill since SAF left the club

    Out of all the things above, I fear number 4 the most because it is the root cause of the shite We've been having for the last 5-6 years.
  38. Aug 28, 2018

    ErranMorad New Member

    Jul 30, 2018
    Here, there, everywhere...
    There are tons of problem with the ambition and football structure at this club. But the immediate problem is none other than Jose.
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2018
  39. Aug 28, 2018

    ShadesOfTomato New Member

    Feb 24, 2012
    From an external point of view, I'd say the issue can be condensed to a lack of clear strategic direction within the club since Ferguson and Gill left. You have the resources to compete with the best clubs in the world, but they're consistently misused. Recruitment is scattergun and there are much more misses than hits. The play style under three different managers has been completely disjointed and there seems to be no common theme in recruitment at managerial level either.

    Additionally, there probably needs to be an acceptance from your fan base that things will most likely never return to peak Ferguson levels of dominance. Competition in the league is now far greater; resources are more evenly distributed. Many will have grown up with that version of Manchester United and so will expect a title challenge every season at minimum. That's not realistic and lean periods are to be expected.

    Hiring Moyes and Van Gaal were pretty inexplicable decisions which left you with a lack of identity, and a mish mashed squad. Mourinho has never been the man to come into a situation like that and strategically rebuild a side from the roots up.

    I'd say the next move is extremely important and if I supported Man Utd, I'd want an internal conversation as to the strategic direction of the club. This would encompass but not be exclusive to recruitment, play style, youth development. As a consequence of that the club should be looking at a manager whom can fit into and implement this direction. Essentially - you should be looking to snap out of this cycle of quick fixes and signing the big names with huge expectations. I think overall club strategy is arguably more important than the manager - as it will be a constant even after a manager leaves.

    Many on here seem to be calling for Zidane, but there's a risk he'd be a continuation of previous practice. You can't dismiss his 3 CLs as Madrid manager, but the circumstances were fairly exceptional and his own signings barely made an impact in his time there. The challenge would be completely different at Man Utd.

    If I was a Manchester Utd fan I'd be wanting to hire someone who fits into the mould outlined above. Somebody with an idea and direction for the club in the long term, whom can work in tandem with a board whom are committed to implementing his strategy.
  40. Aug 28, 2018

    kouroux 45k posts to finally achieve this tagline

    Apr 25, 2007
    Djibouti (La terre des braves)
    Based on what do you say this ? If it's about him not being a typical Mourinho signing, yeah well maybe but it doesn't mean he didn't want him. It doesn't compute to me that a manager as arrogant as him would have no say on any transfer. It makes absolutely no sense.
    Otherwise why isn't he backed up by the board if they thought he had no say in some of the players brought in ?

    There is none like that. Managers for the long haul at the highest, do not exist anymore.