What gives: Potential legacy team disbanding at the first opportunity? (Bayern)

[Offside]

There’s surely only so many unopposed Bundesliga titles you could be arsed winning.

 

[432JuanMata]

There’s surely only so many unopposed Bundesliga titles you could be arsed winning.

I agree with this but if they win on Sunday surely Thiago and Alaba have to stick around and see can they back it up next season.

 

[Offside]

I agree with this but if they win on Sunday surely Thiago and Alaba have to stick around and see can they back it up next season.

I’d think the opposite. As I say there’s only so many unopposed German titles you can win so the burning desire will have been the Champions League. Once that is won you couldn’t blame them for wanting a new challenge.

 

[OutlawGER]

Like any top club. But whens the last time Bayern had a truly elite player like Ronaldo/Messi/Mbappe that the biggest clubs just had to have. If they did they'd prolly lose him to Madrid /Barca.

Robben and Ribery. Now Lewandowski. The latter two were heavily linked to Real, but both stayed at the club in the end.


And i am not even mentioning elite german nationals (and legends) such as Lahm, Schweini and Neuer.

The last elite player they couldn't hold was Ballack. And that was a different time, where german football was at its worst.

 

[strongwalker]

Like any top club. But whens the last time Bayern had a truly elite player like Ronaldo/Messi/Mbappe that the biggest clubs just had to have. If they did they'd prolly lose him to Madrid /Barca.

Bayern had and has a fair share of world class players, only they're not hyped beyond belief. For me, I'm okay with that.

 

[edcunited1878]

Thiago and Alaba have contributed over the years to making Bayern the force that they are and it can be argued they are underpaid, thus looking to get their paid day now, especially when you consider their age. They want to feel valued monetarily and being played as much as possible. Thiago isn't a bang on starter due to Kimmich and Goretzka. Alaba is filling in at CB, but he's played at LB and central midfield. Regardless, Alaba is a top player and he's just a damn good footballer who can play multiple positions like Kimmich (who is currently filling in for Pavard at RB).

 

[Suedesi]

Anyone else find it strange that players are looking to leave a Bayern side who look like they could go on to be the next force in Europe? Obviously the final has yet to be played, and they mightn't even win the first, but supposing they do and at that point both Thiago and Alaba make good on their stances and up and leave, when's the last time something like that happened? Two top quality starters just upping and leaving of their own accord before the organic end to their team's potential period of dominance? I suppose Ronaldo's one of the examples of a player ruining what could have been upping and leaving after a single European Cup win.

How do you Bayern fans feel about this? How much do you lose in terms of your first xi if these two do go?

Alaba will stay

Thiago is not likely to be a starter going forward if he stays. Winning the CL gives him the chance to leave on a high. Bayern are not too fussed about him leaving - in fact €30m seems pretty reasonably low fee.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Robben and Ribery. Now Lewandowski. The latter two were heavily linked to Real, but both stayed at the club in the end.


And i am not even mentioning elite german nationals (and legends) such as Lahm, Schweini and Neuer.

The last elite player they couldn't hold was Ballack. And that was a different time, where german football was at its worst.

These are the same as great players we've had who all stayed. The point is that when if have proper Balon Dor talents like Ronaldo or Mbappe you would lose them too. People are pretending that this is some dig towards Bayern when in truth the point is clear that you're like the other big clubs. That in certain circumstances you'd lose the very very best to Madrid and co.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

It's actually unlike most top clubs - Kroos left because they refused his contract demands, it wasn't like what we deal with at United, Spurs, Liverpool, Chelsea etc with Ronaldo, Bale, Coutinho, Suarez, Courtois type transfers where the player has always wanted to play for a specific club. I also doubt they'd ever be anywhere near huge transfers because their model is too good; they win something domestic every year, usually do well in the CL and then take the best talents in the Bundesliga, usually by unsettling them and getting them to run down contracts, and it's worked a treat for them. I'd also argue they have the best striker in the world, the best LWB in the world, arguably best keeper and then Gnabry, Kimmich, Sane (coming in), Mueller are all top players so whilst none of them are Messi/CR7 they are elite players.

I do get that the league itself for someone like Thiago might not be the most exciting, he's won it every season since he's been there and most players seem to want to be in the PL, LL, or even Serie A above the Bundesliga or L1.

The only player we sold who we really didn't want to sell was Ronaldo. And they've not had a player like that. The likes of Kroos and Thiago are comparable to plenty of players we had who never left. Let's control ourselves here. Liverpool aren't a top club. Well they haven't been for 3 decades at least. They've been more Dortmund than United/Bayern in that time so it's only fair that they'd lose their best in that time. And they win something every year domestically because the Bundesliga doesn't have the same level of competition the PL does.

 

[Cheimoon]

These are the same as great players we've had who all stayed. The point is that when if have proper Balon Dor talents like Ronaldo or Mbappe you would lose them too. People are pretending that this is some dig towards Bayern when in truth the point is clear that you're like the other big clubs. That in certain circumstances you'd lose the very very best to Madrid and co.

Robben was on that level and never went anywhere. Other than that, extremely few players are on the level you seem to be talking about, so you're talking about a sample size that's so small, that it's pretty much meaningless. And even among those, Ronaldo moved before he was in the GOAT discussion, Messi never moved, Mbappé is fine at PSG (which isn't Real Madrid or Barcelona), and Neymar actually left one of your top-top clubs to join PSG. I just really don't see the narrative you're trying to argue for.

 

[Myrecks]

New challenge / more money.
Also - unrelated to their decisions - this “dominating Europe / being the next force in Europe” almost never works out. The only dominant force where people thought they would be dominating Europe and it kind of turned out like this was Barca (if you include their 2015 win you can say they won 3 cups in 7 years).
The more dominant / successful force which actually won 4 cups in 5 seasons wasn’t tipped to this kind of glory at all when they won their first of this series in 2013/14.
Performances and results in Europe always vary from season to season and it’s no surprise that apart from RM no other club has managed to defend the CL in the current (pre COVID) format

Bayern Múnich made the final en 2010, 2012, 2013, and now again in 2020. Those 3 years they went to the final and only won one, you can say they dominated Europe. When you have that success in the European cup you can’t say they didn’t dominate.

 

[Blackwidow]

I do not see Alaba leaving. But he always makes contract extensions difficult. He will not be able to build up an environment elsewhere with his family and friends clan like he has it in Munich. And right now all the signs say that he stays.

Thiago - I am not so sure it is just about him or a decision he made because of his wife and his family. We thought that he might somewhen want to go back to Barcelona - but I guess he does not want to go back to the shambles the club and its lead is right now. His wife build up various deep friendships with mostly spanish families in Munich and every year they get destroyed because the families are leaving. Funnily about all are now near Manchester/Liverpool...
Look at the last 15 seconds of that video - that was after the Cup win a months ago...

 

[Raees]

New challenge / more money.
Also - unrelated to their decisions - this “dominating Europe / being the next force in Europe” almost never works out. The only dominant force where people thought they would be dominating Europe and it kind of turned out like this was Barca (if you include their 2015 win you can say they won 3 cups in 7 years).
The more dominant / successful force which actually won 4 cups in 5 seasons wasn’t tipped to this kind of glory at all when they won their first of this series in 2013/14.
Performances and results in Europe always vary from season to season and it’s no surprise that apart from RM no other club has managed to defend the CL in the current (pre COVID) format

Good post. Agree with this - there’s no guarantees in football and yes Liverpool had a blip but they’re as good as Bayern IMO so not a bad move for Thiago.

 

[OutlawGER]

Bayern Múnich made the final en 2010, 2012, 2013, and now again in 2020. Those 3 years they went to the final and only won one, you can say they dominated Europe. When you have that success in the European cup you can’t say they didn’t dominate.

And after that they also reached 3 semis in a row. Up to this day, and this will definitely not change this season, they have almost only lost to the future CL winner. The only exception since 2011 was the undeserved loss to Atletico. Not to forget the last 2 losses to Real. In 2017 they got robbed by the ref (google it if you want) and in 2018 it was somehow harder to lose than to win, but they still managed to get knocked out. But unfortunately history will not remember those kind of details.

 

[Zehner]

And after that they also reached 3 semis in a row. Up to this day, and this will definitely not change this season, they have almost only lost to the future CL winner. The only exception since 2011 was the undeserved loss to Atletico. Not to forget the last 2 losses to Real. In 2017 they got robbed by the ref (google it if you want) and in 2018 it was somehow harder to lose than to win, but they still managed to get knocked out.

You're referring to that match against Real, after which Rummenigge complained publicly? Still not buying that.

 

[OutlawGER]

You're referring to that match against Real, after which Rummenigge complained publicly? Still not buying that.

I watched it live and i never had a doubt to this day, that the ref of this game was bought.

this video doesn't even cover all the fouls of Casemiro, it was a scandal that he was not sent off.

 

[youmeletsfly]

Nobody is disbanding at the "first opportunity".
Also, no team is disbanded by two players leaving.
Those two players are rumored to leave by the way.

For feck sackes stop with these "The Sun" threads.

 

[Zehner]

I watched it live and i never had a doubt to this day, that the ref of this game was bought.

Yeah, there was quite an outrage right after it so I re-watched the extended highlights multiple times and remember that I couldn't agree at all but can't really recall the exact reasons. I remember that Vidal should already have been sent off before all the shady stuff even began. Would have to watch it again but pretty sure all that outrage ignored that there were also some incredible decisions that favoured Bayern.

 

[harms]

It's highly unlikely that Alaba will leave in the end and, as people have said, it's understandable that Thiago, who has no ties with Germany, wants to try something else when he's still at the top. Playing in PL is a great experience, he's going to get a lot of money to do it and he doesn't really risk anything – and if he'll win CL this season, there's nothing else to achieve at Bayern for him.

 

[Ekeke]

They always pick the best players from their league. This is kind of what we used to do, but can’t anymore because of too much competition.

They always tend to have a core of German players, and add quality on top.

You say we cant but Liverpool did

 

[LoneStar]

You say we cant but Liverpool did

Liverpool have the best English players?

 

[laughtersassassin]

People are forgetting Bayern want both to stay and have offered both contracts. So it's different from usual

 

[iHicksy]

I think if you're not a German then a two to three seasons winning the league at a canter becomes very very dull. I mean, you're literally guaranteed to win the league. I imagine that that can become a little tiresome and some players who are more competitive want a challenge after a while.

 

[Ekeke]

Liverpool have the best English players?

They assembled a top team from signing premier league players like Bayern sign bundasliga players

 

[LoneStar]

They assembled a top team from signing premier league players like Bayern sign bundasliga players

Yup, and picked up some gems like their fullbacks for very low fees. Unfortunately, we only seem to go for the obvious talents.

 

[tomaldinho1]

The only player we sold who we really didn't want to sell was Ronaldo. And they've not had a player like that. The likes of Kroos and Thiago are comparable to plenty of players we had who never left. Let's control ourselves here. Liverpool aren't a top club. Well they haven't been for 3 decades at least. They've been more Dortmund than United/Bayern in that time so it's only fair that they'd lose their best in that time. And they win something every year domestically because the Bundesliga doesn't have the same level of competition the PL does.

Ronaldo is an outlier though - it's not like there's one of those at every top team, he's an absolute one off. Lewa is probably the best example because he is, in my mind at least, easily the best out and out striker in world football and there was a time it was rumoured he wanted Real and Bayern quashed that. You can also say Sane is an elite level prospect and they managed to unsettle him from the richest club in the PL (admittedly it is a hollow club but still).

I acknowledged the league quality already, as said that definitely could be a factor for players wanting to try the PL or La Liga or even Serie A.

 

[#07]

Anyone else find it strange that players are looking to leave a Bayern side who look like they could go on to be the next force in Europe? Obviously the final has yet to be played, and they mightn't even win the first, but supposing they do and at that point both Thiago and Alaba make good on their stances and up and leave, when's the last time something like that happened? Two top quality starters just upping and leaving of their own accord before the organic end to their team's potential period of dominance? I suppose Ronaldo's one of the examples of a player ruining what could have been upping and leaving after a single European Cup win.

How do you Bayern fans feel about this? How much do you lose in terms of your first xi if these two do go?

No, not really.

While it is important to keep the nucleus of your side its also important never to stand still. If you retain the core of your best team too long it can be difficult to refresh it. Look at the 30+ year olds that make up the core of Barcelona.

Bayern is one of those sides that never stands still. It is constantly refreshing. That's why only seven years since winning the Treble Bayern is on the verge of a repeat.

Bayern could definitely get a few more good years out of Thiago and Alaba but by letting go older players, who are 50/50 on staying and looking for bigger wages, then replacing them well they can prepare for the next cycle.

 

[Fortitude]

Leaving on a high: makes sense.

Leaving as your team has a serious chance of winning it again: really rare.