What midfielder is suited to partner Bruno in the double pivot?

The Boy said:
He's a very accomplished all rounder. He can play (and does mainly) as a defensive midfielder or as a box to box. He's great at breaking up play and is physically very strong, in fact he's quite like Caicedo in that respect, but where he differs from Caicedo is in his progression of the ball, he's great at breaking the lines and turning defence into attack in split second. He's technically gifted enough to be able to do this both by carrying the ball himself or picking a pass to bypass a midfield.

I think we bought him for about 25 million after he'd made only 5 or 6 starts for Lille, so he was a big gamble and he struggled at first under De Zerbi, but he has really had a break out season this year and the transitional football we play under Hurzeler really suits him. I'm certainly not alone on thinking that a midfield of Baleba and Gomez has the potential to be better than Caicedo and Mac Allister.

On the negative side, he can get caught out by over committing sometimes, but he's only 21 and still learning and improving.

I know I am biased, but I genuinely think he is well on the way to becoming one of the best midfielders in the world.
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He would be my dream big money signing for 2026 if we manage to get into top 5 again with this season.
 
Gabriel Djemba-Bebe said:
Where did you get the 120m figure from? The initial talk was that Al-Hilal were preparing a 100m bid, and then when they submitted the bid in late May, every tier 1 source reported it as 80m.
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Latest reports said that they'd bid around 100m, potentially going even a bit higher. Which is indeed crazy money for a 31 year old
 
Gabriel Djemba-Bebe said:
Where did you get the 120m figure from? The initial talk was that Al-Hilal were preparing a 100m bid, and then when they submitted the bid in late May, every tier 1 source reported it as 80m.
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I totally agree with this. The figures were bullshit. Even the 700K wages. It was likely around 80 mill and 400-500k a week. That's why it was rejected
 
Escobar said:
When the season starts in Saudi he will turn 31. And 100-120m was mentioned plenty times. But yeah, keep derailing the conversation further...
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The issue with this "we should have cashed in on Bruno" is there was never an offer on the table for United to accept.

Its all hypothetical.
 
Escobar said:
When the season starts in Saudi he will turn 31. And 100-120m was mentioned plenty times. But yeah, keep derailing the conversation further...
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There was no bid that was remotely close to 120m received, and the Saudi season starts in August when Bruno is still 30. If you don't want me to 'derail' the thread then stop inflating figures to suit your argument.
 
romufc said:
The issue with this "we should have cashed in on Bruno" is there was never an offer on the table for United to accept.

Its all hypothetical.
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Because Bruno obviously rejected it. In case he would have accepted their proposal, he would have been sold
 
Are we linked with any CMs? If Mbeumo falls through and we end up with Gyokeres, who’s going to play CM? Or maybe we go chase another RAM?

We need more threads! The permutations are limitless!
 
windycityfan said:
Are we linked with any CMs? If Mbeumo falls through and we end up with Gyokeres, who’s going to play CM? Or maybe we go chase another RAM?

We need more threads! The permutations are limitless!
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Still Ederson stuff from Romano is only credible link
 
Seems to be a few stories linking us with Douglas Luiz. Could be good is money is right.
 
Monger said:
Seems to be a few stories linking us with Douglas Luiz. Could be good is money is right.
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Should only be considered as a loan + option IMO given his struggles last year with form and fitness. Juve certainly wouldn't extend the courtesy of a permanent bid if the shoe were on the other foot...
 
DannyCAFC said:
Should only be considered as a loan + option IMO given his struggles last year with form and fitness. Juve certainly wouldn't extend the courtesy of a permanent bid if the shoe were on the other foot...
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Yeah would like to see us at least explore idea, gut feeling is chances ended when DOF left Juve
 
Escobar said:
Latest reports said that they'd bid around 100m, potentially going even a bit higher. Which is indeed crazy money for a 31 year old
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If I remember they were reported thinking about 100m but it didn't happen.
 
Not sure what we can do with so many No-10's like Mount, Mainoo, Cunha, Bruno, Mbeumo, Zirkzee and Amad.

I know some of them can play as 8 but I am really worried about playing Bruno OR Mainoo in the centre because we may land in same old situation of not having enough control in the midfield.

I really wish we bring in balance by recruiting 2 quality CM's or at least one box-2-box CM for now, having said that I am all in for Mbeumo.

In the grand scheme of things, I think Bruno sale makes more sense now. Wish we could have cashed in and invested on some one like Baleba,Wharton.
 
To get the best out of Bruno, we need a midfield partner who brings balance - someone who retains possession better, but also brings tidy, composed passing and improved progressive play, especially compared to what Ugarte and Mainoo currently offer. On top of that, this player must be defensively solid, strong in duels (both aerially and on the ground), and add much needed physicality to the midfield. Essentially, we’re looking for someone who can operate as a stabilizer in the center of the pitch to give Bruno the freedom to roam and impact the game further forward.

I realize this might be a bit of a hot take - and perhaps an underwhelming name to most - but within that specific role, I’d suggest Boubakary Soumaré from Leicester. While he hasn’t lived up to the “Kanté replacement” tag in a dire Leicester side, I still think he’s a good player with qualities that could complement Bruno well. He’s composed on the ball, physically capable (faster, bigger and stronger) and could thrive in a better team IMO - much like Sander Berge has since moving from Sheffield United to Fulham (mentioning him since we were linked last summer).

Soumaré wouldn’t be a priority signing by any means, but with funds already committed to Cunha, Mbuemo, a striker, and hopefully also a goalkeeper – we could be forced to buy smartly in the “bargain basement”, and I genuinely believe we could do far worse than Soumare. With just a year left on his contract - and considering Leicester loaned him out to Sevilla the last time they got relegated to the Championship - it’s likely they’ll be looking for a sale.
 
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Anyone caught the eye at Club World Cup
Bobby_2024 said:
Not sure what we can do with so many No-10's like Mount, Mainoo, Cunha, Bruno, Mbeumo, Zirkzee and Amad.

I know some of them can play as 8 but I am really worried about playing Bruno OR Mainoo in the centre because we may land in same old situation of not having enough control in the midfield.

I really wish we bring in balance by recruiting 2 quality CM's or at least one box-2-box CM for now, having said that I am all in for Mbeumo.

In the grand scheme of things, I think Bruno sale makes more sense now. Wish we could have cashed in and invested on some one like Baleba,Wharton.
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Yeah I could understand not selling if we had the £100m from winning Europa, however we don't so can't do anything this summer in terms of midfield rebuild
 
DannyCAFC said:
Should only be considered as a loan + option IMO given his struggles last year with form and fitness. Juve certainly wouldn't extend the courtesy of a permanent bid if the shoe were on the other foot...
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They have more players than they are using on the midfield. He was benched last night in their 5-0 trashing of some Emirati side at the CWC… Clearly behind Thuram & Locatelli in the pecking order. And also behind Mckennie. Koopmeiners seems to be used higher up. Pretty sure they’d want to get rid of Luiz at current book value, whatever that is…
 
Pintu said:
They have more players than they are using on the midfield. He was benched last night in their 5-0 trashing of some Emirati side at the CWC… Clearly behind Thuram & Locatelli in the pecking order. And also behind Mckennie. Koopmeiners seems to be used higher up. Pretty sure they’d want to get rid of Luiz at current book value, whatever that is…
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So would you take him?
 
The way its going, probably none. Also, its hard to see Casemiro and Ugarte being relegated to permanent bench roles.
 
croadyman said:
So would you take him?
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Only if its a loan with option to buy, which I believe is possible. But if we are spending big bucks for midfielder I’d rather go for players who have done it at a bigger club than Aston Villa. A Casemiro like signing, and not a washed up version…

Anyway I still believe we have more urgent positions to fill, and deserving of higher investment.
 
Pintu said:
Only if its a loan with option to buy, which I believe is possible. But if we are spending big bucks for midfielder I’d rather go for players who have done it at a bigger club than Aston Villa. A Casemiro like signing, and not a washed up version…

Anyway I still believe we have more urgent positions to fill, and deserving of higher investment.
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Has it not worked at Juve? He was brilliant for Villa.
 
USREDEVIL said:
Bruno deep seems like a bad idea, but i'm not a top manager. More a random dude on a forum from the United States of all places.
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Don't think most people do, would be really interesting to see if it works. If we mostly play deep and rely on quick transition in attack, that's the only way I can imagine it working.
 
AdNani said:
Has it not worked at Juve? He was brilliant for Villa.
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He started all his 35 games for Villa last year... Only started 3 League games for Juventus this year, but the 5 subs is helping though, he did come in 19 times in the league.

I remember watching some of their big games. They defeated Inter and City with a midfield 3 of Locatelli-Thuram-Koopmeiners / Mckennie-Thuram-Koopmeiners... He is clearly behind these 4.

The should be looking to get rid of him, I wouldn't mind a loan to be fair. He might be just more suited to the PL.
 
Maybe Cunha and possibly Mbuemo taking some of that attacking responsibility of Bruno's shoulders will allow him transition to that role better. I have little faith though because i just cant trust Bruno to pump the breaks as he always feels like he can do more to influence the game and that will mean him drifting out of position and trying to get into the box. If Amorim cant get that across to him then he's better of playing as 10 to which now he has even greater competition.

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Hit It said:
Maybe Cunha and possibly Mbuemo taking some of that attacking responsibility of Bruno's shoulders will allow him transition to that role better. I have little faith though because i just cant trust Bruno to pump the breaks as he always feels like he can do more to influence the game and that will mean him drifting out of position and trying to get into the box. If Amorim cant get that across to him then he's better of playing as 10 to which now he has even greater competition.

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There's nothing wrong with the more attacking central midfielder having licence to join in in attack and get in and around the box? It's not a Bruno-specific feature? A back three with a single holding midfielder ahead of them is a perfectly acceptable defensive base to maintain in possession. And Fernandes has already demonstrated that he is fully capable of holding his position in midfield when that is what is asked of him.

Bruno shows positional indiscipline when deployed as a no.10, frequently infringing on the central midfielder's space. When played deeper he is perfectly fine.
 
Pintu said:
He started all his 35 games for Villa last year... Only started 3 League games for Juventus this year, but the 5 subs is helping though, he did come in 19 times in the league.

I remember watching some of their big games. They defeated Inter and City with a midfield 3 of Locatelli-Thuram-Koopmeiners / Mckennie-Thuram-Koopmeiners... He is clearly behind these 4.

The should be looking to get rid of him, I wouldn't mind a loan to be fair. He might be just more suited to the PL.
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Would they be interested in a loan deal, mind you most clubs seem to be for our unwanted players so maybe it's worth us making them an offer.
 
sherrinford said:
There's nothing wrong with the more attacking central midfielder having licence to join in in attack and get in and around the box? It's not a Bruno-specific feature? A back three with a single holding midfielder ahead of them is a perfectly acceptable defensive base to maintain in possession. And Fernandes has already demonstrated that he is fully capable of holding his position in midfield when that is what is asked of him.

Bruno shows positional indiscipline when deployed as a no.10, frequently infringing on the central midfielder's space. When played deeper he is perfectly fine.
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It should be a strong enough base but do you think the defence and that holding midfielder are composed enough to carry the ball out of defence without fear independently? I saw United get stung multiple times last year when they tried and its something I'm hoping they improve upon next year without injuries to disrupt them. I also don't mind Bruno attacking but its alot of energy to get back if we loose it and alot of space in midfield is vacated behind him. Sometime its worth he risk and other times its fatal. I would much prefer we use his vision, passing, ball retention to the fullest in deeper positions because that helps us in both ends of the pitch.
 
We need to play a 2 man diamond.

CDM
RWB-Bruno-LWB
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We played most of the season

RWB - CM - CM - LWB
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It's a small difference but playing in a diamond makes us more compact and centrally gives us a sitting CDM and a more creative CM. The CDM can connect with the CB's from dropping deep in to the CB's line and receive the ball safer than the CB's trying to find a midfielder higher up. It's why we looked better with Casemiro than Ugarte.

We need someone to sit down and stays purely centrally. This is why Ugarte struggles because he wants to go in to the tackle rather than sitting deep and controlling his central area & gets scared against the pressing.

Ideally we would go for a deep lying playmaker who can receive the ball and play the ball under pressure like Wharton, Jashari or Stiller. I've even wanted to see Mainoo given a chance as a CDM because I think his defensive ability/positioning, beating the press, dribbling is underrated & primarily needs to focus on his progressive passing.

However, I expect Amorim to either play with one complete destroyer or with 2 box to box type players whilst using Bruno as one of the 2. This is because he loves his defensive players even within an already defensive system.
 
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I see we were loosely linked (truly awful Dean Jones) with a loan move for Palhinha. The general consensus on here seems to be he's too limited on the ball.
 
Hit It said:
It should be a strong enough base but do you think the defence and that holding midfielder are composed enough to carry the ball out of defence without fear independently? I saw United get stung multiple times last year when they tried and its something I'm hoping they improve upon next year without injuries to disrupt them. I also don't mind Bruno attacking but its alot of energy to get back if we loose it and alot of space in midfield is vacated behind him. Sometime its worth he risk and other times its fatal. I would much prefer we use his vision, passing, ball retention to the fullest in deeper positions because that helps us in both ends of the pitch.
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Positionally, a staggering in midfield is very much commonplace and is desirable pretty much all the time. There has been occasions where Bruno has deliberately stationed himself in line with the attacking midfielders in possession from a nominal starting position as part of a double pivot, but rarely, and generally when operating as part of a two he played in close proximity to his midfield partner, relatively deep.

Fernandes has also played as the deeper player in a midfield pair, as well as in both the holding and left-sided roles on the occasions Amorim has altered the team shape and used a midfield three and a front two. He has shown that he has the discipline to hold his position in midfield as well as the energy to get up and down the pitch all game.

I would also like us to use Bruno deeper to make full use of his playmaking, but for me that means the onus is on his midfield partner to position themselves higher and involve themselves more in attack to give Fernandes the space to operate.
 
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