Who decided to sign Van De Beek?

Josep Dowling

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The question has to be asked. Do we think Ole wanted him?

The signing never made any sense. Trying to negotiate a deal for Sancho, saying we can’t afford to pay the full price. Then we blow €40m on a midfielder we simply didn’t need. And it’s shown this season. He’s barely played because we have Pogba and Bruno already. Now we have a player that looks a fraction of the quality he should be. He has looked poor in the games recently but he’s not playing in his natural position which is CAM.

I suspect we will sell him at a massive loss and he will end up being a decent player for another club. Yet another poor decision by us in the transfer window. Why not sign players in positions we actually need?
 

amolbhatia50k

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Great question. Needs answering.

Probably Ole. At United the boss gives the go ahead. Appalling signing tbh
 

FrankDrebin

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Just involve him in a potential Sancho deal. Beek would fit in well at BVB.
 

Robboadam31

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I feel like he was signed as a backup to Fernandes, but we’re too over reliant on him to drop him.
 

amolbhatia50k

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Just involve him in a potential Sancho deal. Beek would fit in well at BVB.
Not a bad point. He'd suit the Bundesliga s empty spaces well. Would Dortmund have a need for him though?
 

FrankDrebin

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Not a bad point. He'd suit the Bundesliga s empty spaces well. Would Dortmund have a need for him though?
I hear they were willing to move Brandt on in the last window, not sure if its still the case.

Still, on the face of it, it sounds like a good deal.
 

DWelbz19

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My theory on this around October last year:
I think he was signed mostly because fan uproar was at the highest; we hadn’t signed a single player and the league was about 3-4 weeks away, and Ajax were extremely easy to work with — player wanted the move, Ajax had a fee in mind, both clubs have a good relationship with each other.

Whether he was an “Ole player” or not, eh. I’m sure he was on the list and I doubt Ole was going to say ‘nah, not him’ when it looked very possible to do the deal.
 

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I think we had earmarked him in case Pogba left, signed him because he was cheaper than Grealish and Ajax weren’t going all Dortmund on us, then found out Sancho in/Pogba out wasn’t going to happen. I think the Sancho deal hinged on Pogba freeing up some funds.
 

amolbhatia50k

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I hear they were willing to move Brandt on in the last window, not sure if its still the case.

Still, on the face of it, it sounds like a good deal.
Would be too good to be true. Heck I'd just take 15 million off the Sancho deal. That's how bad has has been .
 

devilish

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I don't think it's ole signing else he would have played him. The club has a tendency not to back managers after their 2nd-3rd season. I believe it's a jon Murtough signing. Woodward's pet was months from being made DOF and VDB is in line to the value signing/top name balance the Glazers like to make.
 

amolbhatia50k

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I don't think it's ole signing else he would have played him. The club has a tendency not to back managers after their 2nd-3rd season. I believe it's a jon Murtough signing. Woodward's pet was months from being made DOF and VDB is in line to the value signing/top name balance the Glazers like to make.
Then Fred wasn't a Mourinho signing? It's so convenient to palm bad signings off to others and keep the good ones.
 

Pexbo

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I actually think more blame needs to be placed at the players feet. If you watch how he played for Ajax, we haven’t seen a glimpse of that yet. Players take time to adjust and maybe we should afford him the same courtesy but every single time he has played he’s just been a bit cowardly. Rather than working extra hard to find space and make himself available he goes into hiding. I don’t know if you can put this on the scouts when it’s the opposite of how he played at Ajax.
 

amolbhatia50k

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I actually think more blame needs to be placed at the players feet. If you watch how he played for Ajax, we haven’t seen a glimpse of that yet. Players take time to adjust and maybe we should afford him the same courtesy but every single time he has played he’s just been a bit cowardly. Rather than working extra hard to find space and make himself available he goes into hiding. I don’t know if you can put this on the scouts when it’s the opposite of how he played at Ajax.
That's exactly it and why I feel he's a big worry. And when he gets into a "contest" I'm convinced the opponent will be braver and stronger than him. These are basics. He isn't a 16 year old from the youth team FFS. At least fight for your right to be on the pitch.
 

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He's very much a system player and our system is completely different to what he is used to. I think his best for us came when he played next to Bruno/Mata, who have the same-ish understanding of space and movement, but the main thing is that he's not good enough to change our system to fit his needs. It's a shame. He would've looked much better for City, for example, although he probably wouldn't start for them to be fair.

When he just came in you could see that the promise is there, it's just that he was on a completely different wavelength to the entire team — always initiating very direct one-twos, playing at a much higher tempo, which resulted in us losing the ball most of the time. Then he got benched (and rightly so), lost all of his form, fitness and mojo and haven't got it back. It's actually a quite similar story to Lingard, who share a lot of van de Beek's attributes — we've seen how good he can be when the whole play revolves around him, but he's not good enough to displace Bruno, so he has no future here.

I really thought that it was a nice signing for this price, assuming that we've had a place reserved for him... but turns out we didn't. The Pogba-replacement theory makes sense, in which case he was majorly fecked over by the Frenchman staying — but seeing the way van de Beek plays today I'm having doubts that he'd fit in seamlessly even in a team without Paul (especially since Pogba was missing for a while at the beginning/middle of the season).
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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I still think he was the cheaper option instead of Grealish. Now I know that makes no sense when comparing the two players but I feel Ole wanted Grealish to play on that left side and cover for Bruno at number 10. The board/committee clearly didn’t feel that Grealish was worth £80 million (he was) so VDB would have been considered another option on that list. I’m sure ole would have given it the go ahead and thought he could use him as cover for Bruno while playing the occasional game on the flanks. Its clear from his lack of game time that he isn’t the player Ole expected him to be. In hindsight we would have been better just paying up the extra money and getting Grealish anyway as we have likely wasted half of that on a far lesser (and completely different) player.
 

DWelbz19

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I actually think more blame needs to be placed at the players feet. If you watch how he played for Ajax, we haven’t seen a glimpse of that yet. Players take time to adjust and maybe we should afford him the same courtesy but every single time he has played he’s just been a bit cowardly. Rather than working extra hard to find space and make himself available he goes into hiding. I don’t know if you can put this on the scouts when it’s the opposite of how he played at Ajax.
He’s been shite, no denying that, but the player fundamentally is just one who doesn’t fit. He’s playing exactly how he did at Ajax. He was a midfielder who was at his best without the ball, relying on better players (De Jong; Ziyech) to do the creative lifting for him. He’s not one who can pass; can screen a defence; or will tackle and intercept like crazy.

It would be like being angry at Fernandes for not being able to play slow possession play; or that Rashford can’t play as a no.9 target man.

He should be moved on, and fault lay at his desk as his general performances have been underwhelming, but the biggest fault lay with the scouting team and whoever approved this signing.
 

Dan_F

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It’s just another example of us signing a player without having a clue what qualities we’re looking for. A back up for Bruno at 10 was necessary, but we’ve signed someone who has an opposite skill set.

People try to counter this by claiming he’s a Pogba replacement, but Ole doesn’t even want Pogba in central midfield and he’s never shown a willingness to put VDB there.

I just hope that Ole has figured out exactly what he wants from his midfield pair, because getting that signing right (and what he does with Pogba) will define his time at United. I honestly believe it’s that important.
 

That'sHernandez

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He was signed to add strength and depth to the squad and to enable us to play a different type of football . Players hitting the ground running and immediately slotting in like Bruno did is extremely rare.
 

bsCallout

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Then Fred wasn't a Mourinho signing? It's so convenient to palm bad signings off to others and keep the good ones.
Wasn't that McKennas 'scouting'? Likely taken up again to John Murtough. Managers are probably put in a position where it is X or nobody and no manager is going to want to go into the season without some potential extras. Pretty sure that was pretty much how LVG described it too.
 

devilish

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Then Fred wasn't a Mourinho signing? It's so convenient to palm bad signings off to others and keep the good ones.
I believe so. Both did pretty much what managers do when saddled with players they didn't want. They barely ever played them. Also they barely knew the positions these players play. Mou thought he needed a better defence to play Fred (whose defensive minded). Ole thinks that VDB is a no 10 when in reality he can play b2b very well

That's the typical feck off message managers use in such circumstances

Mou wanted slap head and he got Fred, Ole wanted Graelish and he got VDB, Moyes wanted Fabregas and he ended with Fellaini
 
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DWelbz19

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Managers are probably put in a position where it is X or nobody and no manager is going to want to go into the season without some potential extras. Pretty sure that was pretty much how LVG described it too.
Very much. These players will obviously be on the ‘list’ for a manager - as nobody is stupid enough to think he’ll get his first or second option every time. If you’re told as a manager “we can’t get player X or Y you wanted, but player Z is very much attainable. We scouted him a few times - he’s alright, ain’t he?” You’re hardly going to say no.

Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t. Allegedly Dias was behind Koulibaly and Kounde for City in their targets. Klopp wanted Brandt over Salah etc.
 

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Ole wants two no 6s. He will be getting a young one back from Forest ( Garner), but needs another more experienced one ( at least a notch up from McFred.). Will take at least £50m to buy him; which is why he will take Varane for £40m if he can to fill the CB role required, leaving possibly enough for the no6 and Sancho if he can get money for Lingard.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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Ole. If he was playing well he would be called an Ole signing. Its been said several times that the manager has the last word on who to sign so why shouldn't we believe it is Ole that wanted him? He doesn't play because he hasn't been good his position which is also occupied by our best player and we hardly have any match that has nothing or very little at stake. And the reason he hasn't been good is because he is not the type of AM that suits us.

It was a bad buy because he doesn't suit our system and he's not the first. Awb shouldn't have been the first name on the RB list if we wanted our full backs to push up. Telles shouldn't have been considered as be tends to underlap. Maguire is too slow for a high line. We signed a left winger from the championship and played him as our right winger in his first season (we could have just signed a right winger from the championship). We've seen how these players weaknesses sometimes distort the system we are playing, VdB is just the first for it to happen so often

I do think he would come good but as an 8 not a 10
 

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Not every signing works out. Veron, top tier footballer in Italy, couldn't cut it in England. It's not just United, it's all clubs. No doubt he has time on his side should he want to become a regular. Technically he is a very very good player and can play a number of positions, just not worked out for him upto now.
 

Bebestation

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Just need to be patient until pre season then all answers be answered.

if he gets more game time then it’s olés player if not then the board bought him instead of grealish hence why vdb gets used at lw completely randomly
 

devilish

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He was signed to add strength and depth to the squad and to enable us to play a different type of football . Players hitting the ground running and immediately slotting in like Bruno did is extremely rare.
That's true. There again very few players are able to settle down with 4 minutes game play here and there. In my opinion the writing is pretty much on the wall. The manager didn't want him
 

Bebestation

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Amad is young but he hasn’t exactly started either has he and RW is a place we needed a player in.

Maybe Ole has a way of working things. Who knows.
 

devilish

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Ole. If he was playing well he would be called an Ole signing. Its been said several times that the manager has the last word on who to sign so why shouldn't we believe it is Ole that wanted him? He doesn't play because he hasn't been good his position which is also occupied by our best player and we hardly have any match that has nothing or very little at stake. And the reason he hasn't been good is because he is not the type of AM that suits us.

It was a bad buy because he doesn't suit our system and he's not the first. Awb shouldn't have been the first name on the RB list if we wanted our full backs to push up. Telles shouldn't have been considered as be tends to underlap. Maguire is too slow for a high line. We signed a left winger from the championship and played him as our right winger in his first season (we could have just signed a right winger from the championship). We've seen how these players weaknesses sometimes distort the system we are playing, VdB is just the first for it to happen so often

I do think he would come good but as an 8 not a 10
If he was Ole signing them the manager would insist on him. That's what managers do with the most expensive signing of the season. Ole can't even be bothered to make it work. Hence why I believe it's not his signing
 

devilish

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Amad is young but he hasn’t exactly started either has he and RW is a place we needed a player in.

Maybe Ole has a way of working things. Who knows.
He’s not ole's signing either. If it was for him he would have signed sancho. United were screaming for a top quality RW. We ended up with 2 kids instead one of which had just been loaned.
 
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Lash

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Not every signing works out. Veron, top tier footballer in Italy, couldn't cut it in England. It's not just United, it's all clubs. No doubt he has time on his side should he want to become a regular. Technically he is a very very good player and can play a number of positions, just not worked out for him upto now.
Exactly. Just because he's not broke through this season, it's not curtains on his United career either.
 

tomaldinho1

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Ole. This shouldn’t even be a thread - we’re not like Chelsea.
Transfer committee give go ahead and then Ole signs it off. No need for speculation when we have all the facts.

I think he’s a good player - he doesn’t suit our style but, then again, I don’t think we’ll win any of the major trophies with our current style.
 

devilish

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Ole. This shouldn’t even be a thread - we’re not like Chelsea.
Transfer committee give go ahead and then Ole signs it off. No need for speculation when we have all the facts.

I think he’s a good player - he doesn’t suit our style but, then again, I don’t think we’ll win any of the major trophies with our current style.
If you believe the official line then you also believe that the Glazers are passionate about this club
 

Bubz27

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All the credible talk is that Ole has a veto on transfers. So it's on Ole.
 

devilish

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All the credible talk is that Ole has a veto on transfers. So it's on Ole.
What if Ole was told that it's either VDB or nothing? Is that veto worth anything?
 

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Exactly. Just because he's not broke through this season, it's not curtains on his United career either.
I agree.

He's still relatively young in that he only turned 24.

Plenty of players needed a season to bed in and get up to speed when coming to a new country and a stronger league.

I'm not sure what all the fuss is about.
 

sullydnl

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I'm sure the manager wanted him insofar as he okayed the signing.

However, I'm thinking back to LVG's complaints that we often ended up signing his fourth or fifth choice for given positions.

At the moment my thought would be that this was the case here. Solskjaer wanted him in that he was on the list of potential targets and he eventually okayed the signing, but he may have made that call knowing he had missed out on players he preferred and VDB was increasingly the most viable option. Okaying a signing doesn't mean you're overly enamoured with it.
 

Bubz27

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What if Ole was told that it's either VDB or nothing? Is that veto worth anything?
Signing a player for the sake of signing a player is not a good way to go about business. Jose signing Fred was similar iirc. He didn't want him but was told it's him or no one.
 

Mark Pawelek

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What if Ole was told that it's either VDB or nothing? Is that veto worth anything?
Yes. If a manager accepts a player this season then it means transfers in that position are off for next season. So if you buy Fred this season, you can't buy, say: Ndidi, next transfer window because the wages, for one, won't be available.
 

Godfather

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Every summer we talk about how we won't spend for the sake of it. Yet signings like that are the definition of exactly that.