Who decided to sign Van De Beek?

Sandikan

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I think hes one of those players who every week people reckon hes best in a different position until he plays there and is mediocre so hes best in another position. Its probably the same people who were all for signing him. We've all become invested in at least one player in the past who ultimitely wasnt good enough. We were all doing the same thing with Kagawa.
Yeah let's hope it's not the end of United career Rooney thing.
Better in the position he's not in, needs legs round him, needs better quality round him etc.

We've had that a bit with Pogba too.
 

MU655

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Just because he hasn't been very good doesn't mean Solskjaer didn't want him.
 

Scholsey2004

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Yeah let's hope it's not the end of United career Rooney thing.
Better in the position he's not in, needs legs round him, needs better quality round him etc.

We've had that a bit with Pogba too.
Yeah, exactly. At least with Rooney and Pogba there are quantifiable examples of good form at this level. With van de Beek its more like believing in unicorns.
 

Sandikan

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Yeah, exactly. At least with Rooney and Pogba there are quantifiable examples of good form at this level. With van de Beek its more like believing in unicorns.
He just looks like the sort of player who'd fit Pep's intricate keep ball style.
Not our get it forward quickly, pacey breaks stuff.
 

roseguy64

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It’s an opinion, hence the ‘to me’. It’s an opinion based on the signing of Vdb, who is completely the wrong fit for us. The only explanation is that Ole took advice from scouts regarding Vdb and went ahead with the deal without watching Vdb. A fair assessment would be that in this instance Ole didn’t pay attention to detail.
What? So Ole has gone to scout players before and researched on the players but for VDB he didn't do any of that and just went off the scouts? FFS.
 

Scholsey2004

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who do you think Pep is taking for his team , Donnie or McPassion?
Well McTominay is definitely better than van de Beek if thats what youre getting at. Neither of them is technically good enough for Guardiola's tastes though I shouldnt have thought.
 

clarkydaz

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Well McTominay is definitely better than van de Beek if thats what youre getting at. Neither of them is technically good enough for Guardiola's tastes though I shouldnt have thought.
He is in the team because he is tall, physical and a youth product. Ive seen people on here saying they were seeing a potential Yaya Toure and top 3 or 4 in the league. Madness
 

VP89

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Well McTominay is definitely better than van de Beek if thats what youre getting at. Neither of them is technically good enough for Guardiola's tastes though I shouldnt have thought.
Funnily enough, McTominay has been given lots of chances to play back into form despite having a the same or more shit performances. VDB, not so much.

Two different player with different skill-sets though, so it's not really comparable.
 

Scholsey2004

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Funnily enough, McTominay has been given lots of chances to play back into form despite having a the same or more shit performances. VDB, not so much.

Two different player with different skill-sets though, so it's not really comparable.
It definitely is different. McTominay has proved himself at premier league level, van de Beek hasnt at all.
 

Scholsey2004

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He is in the team because he is tall, physical and a youth product. Ive seen people on here saying they were seeing a potential Yaya Toure and top 3 or 4 in the league. Madness
Well obviously thats not realistic. Hes a really good athlete but hes never going to be the kind of midfielder who can put his foot on the ball and control the game. Neither is he likely to be scoring and assisting a lot.
 

VP89

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It definitely is different. McTominay has proved himself at premier league level, van de Beek hasnt at all.
Well that's not true completely re. VDB. He had a couple good performances, but he's been given games in drips and drabs which makes it terribly hard for consistency. McTominay on the other hand has had a lot more flex.

I'm not saying that's why VDB had a poor season by the way, but it's more than likely a contributing factor.
 

Rightnr

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Well McTominay is definitely better than van de Beek if thats what youre getting at. Neither of them is technically good enough for Guardiola's tastes though I shouldnt have thought.
This has to be a joke. Some people on here are absolutely delusional. McTominay won't get in a bottom of the table PL team if he wasn't a Man Utd youth prospect.
 

VP89

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Well McTominay is definitely better than van de Beek if thats what youre getting at. Neither of them is technically good enough for Guardiola's tastes though I shouldnt have thought.
VDB's technical qualities are actually quite strong. It's the physical element of his game that he needs to work on. More aggressiveness, showing for the ball more, generally "getting stuck in" if you will. But he's gone through an academy built on systematic pressing, he operates very well in tight areas and can pop-up in great pockets in the final third. We saw this in an Ajax shirt very often, sometimes in big games too. That's why Real were interested, and why Ole was too. They aren't mugs, he's clearly got a lot of talent and is still young.
 

GBBQ

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Okay you know best. Ole reviewed the research for all the other players we've signed but for this one he just didn't choose to.
It’s laughable that other posters will literally make up their own narrative to suit their view point. VDB himself says Ole had been watching him since Ole was managing Molde. Also he spoke of his strengths and convinced him to come to United.

VDB hasn’t worked so far. He might never work but for some to think he was foisted upon Ole is really naive. He was a relatively low risk hit that we should recoup most of the fee on or else he comes good in his second season (starting your career in an England on lockdown can’t be easy)

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.man...-news/solskjaer-told-van-de-beek-18871580.amp
 

VivaRonaldo85

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I’m assuming some at the club thought Pogba was leaving last summer so we needed another creative style midfielder. They also couldn’t have banked on Bruno bring so influential and never missing a game. I would normally say he needs his second season so we can fairly assess him but I just don’t see where he fits in unless Pogba leaves this summer. We need a world class ball playing DM rather than what VDB offers. All very odd and being £40 million lighter isn’t to be sniffed at by any club.
 

Leroy The Red

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Okay you know best. Ole reviewed the research for all the other players we've signed but for this one he just didn't choose to.
Unlike every other transfer this was out of the blue and appeared more of a panic buy. There tends to be less attention to detail with those and more reliance on advice...

It’s laughable that other posters will literally make up their own narrative to suit their view point. VDB himself says Ole had been watching him since Ole was managing Molde. Also he spoke of his strengths and convinced him to come to United.

VDB hasn’t worked so far. He might never work but for some to think he was foisted upon Ole is really naive. He was a relatively low risk hit that we should recoup most of the fee on or else he comes good in his second season (starting your career in an England on lockdown can’t be easy)

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.man...-news/solskjaer-told-van-de-beek-18871580.amp
Who’s making up a narrative
You do realise it’s not that black and white right?
im not doubting Ole knew van De Beek or hadn’t seen him play but to suggest he was watching him closely whilst he was manager of Molde is laughable. Why the feck would a manager of a Norwegian team be closely watching an Ajax player. As if that’s where they do their business.

The thing is if you truly believe Ole extensively scouted van de beek and yet still chose to sign him you’re basically saying Ole is an idiot. Because the guy does not fit in at all with ho

The logical reasoning behind the transfer is that as stated this was a slight panic buy after failing to bring in other targets. It was easy to get over line with no politics and shit. Ole would have taken the advice of his scouts etc and given the deal the go ahead.
Ole isn’t going to come out and say “I haven’t seen him that closely and signed him on the whim”. That would be dumb.

We’ve spent the best part of seven years conducting transfers like a bunch of amateurs. Why’s is it so hard to believe this transfer followed the same suit?
 

forevrared

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Seems fairly obvious his signing was the club hedging it’s bets on Pogba leaving.

When Pogba stayed and (somewhat) found his form, the opportunities for Donny were the biggest casualty.
 

Ferguson’s Hairdryer

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Who decided to sign Cavani ? When we signed him last summer the uproar was that it was a Glazer/Woodward signing because they didn’t want to spend... now he’s worked out that theory has died down...

I think the manager, as with managers at City and Liverpool, has several targets a plan a, b, c etc. Some are his own players, others are those recommended by the scouting network but ultimately he has to agree.

Last year it was probably agreed that they couldn’t sign Sancho as £120m was way too high, so they decided to strengthen the depth of the CM, as Pogba future was uncertain and Bruno getting injured would leave us extremely weak.
 

Scholsey2004

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This has to be a joke. Some people on here are absolutely delusional. McTominay won't get in a bottom of the table PL team if he wasn't a Man Utd youth prospect.
If van de Beek was as good as McTominay do you not think that by now hed be getting games ahead of him? McTominay isnt likely to win any European player of the year awards but hes an absolute country mile better than van de Beek as anyone can see. The basic fact is that van de Beek plays in the low profile games and hes still crap in them whereas McTominay always plays in the big games.
 

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Not sure it matters who signed him, he's clearly a capable player. Solskjaer is a better manager than i gave him credit for but i'm still far from high on him and i think his lack of don't know if you'd call it courage or conviction in placing faith in players outside of a core of 13-14 in number is still a very weak point of his arsenal.

Is it because he doesn't back himself to make judgment calls and fears being labeled "wrong" if it's anything other than a win or is it because there's an element of the tail wagging the dog where certain players are concerned?

Whatever it is it leads to certain player being ran into the ground and others being cut adrift and then on their rare outings understandably struggling to make an impact.

A better (in my opinion) manager, more sure of themselves, would have found many more opportunities to integrate the likes of van de Beek and Diallo as well as utilise players like James, Mata, Tuanzebe more often.

It was a serious weakness of Lampard that it was a case of complete results oriented where it was win = do the same again and a loss = change something. Just a lack of conviction or in simpler terms balls.
 

Adnan

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What? So Ole has gone to scout players before and researched on the players but for VDB he didn't do any of that and just went off the scouts? FFS.
Agreed. Also don't forget that Solskjaer has his own personal scout (Simon Wells) who he sends to watch prospective targets according to wide spread reports.
 

amolbhatia50k

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He probably deserves a second season, and has barely had any sort of run. It's all coming in for 10mins or the odd league cup game or when the big players are rotated and it's a mish mash line up.

Therefore, he tends to look a safe player, passing 5 yards either back to whoever gave him it, or sideways.

I'm not sure we're the right style of play for him anyway though, and I really can't see where he can regularly get in the team.

He doesn't strike me as being able to play in the 2 behind Bruno at all.
Really depends on the talent Ole sees on the training pitch. If he's showing as little quality as we've seen in the first team in terms of speed of thought, technical quality etc we should grow a pair and sell him as soon as possible. To be the best you have to be ruthless. Of course if Ole is seeing a proper player who just isn't able to to do right now on the big stage then by all means give him time.

But I'm skeptical. As I'm not seeing the individual ability there. Only so much you can rely on the team doing the business for you /system dependency. At United generally you need to have that individual ability, especially in a tough league like the PL.
 

Statue of Limitations

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It is still possible he has a bright future here, I wouldn't give up on him just yet.
Needs a solid run in the squad, would certainly play him.
 

GBBQ

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Why the feck would a manager of a Norwegian team be closely watching an Ajax player. As if that’s where they do their business.
It explains it in the interview, Ajax played Molde in the Europa League, VDB scored against them when he was 19 years old. Very plausible that he stood out to Ole even then and he kept tabs on him in case he was ever more than a Molde manager. Its not like VDB was an unknown quantity playing in the Uruguayan second division, he was part of a really impressive young Ajax team and was lined up to join Madrid.

Why’s is it so hard to believe this transfer followed the same suit?
I think Ole has in general been consistent with his transfer business, has signed players with a certain profile that he wants. As I said, VDB may have been a punt, maybe a back up in case Pogba agitated for a move. Who knows. But I think all signs point to the fact Ole knew him and approved his signing so ti may be a signing that comes good or just a bad judgement call by Ole (even SAF made those mistakes).
 

Bastian

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So is he going to be happy staying if he's not promised an actual role next season? I thought he'd have been getting games in the 2nd half of the season, but surely he can't be OK with things as they are?
 

MadMike

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So is he going to be happy staying if he's not promised an actual role next season? I thought he'd have been getting games in the 2nd half of the season, but surely he can't be OK with things as they are?
I think this summer, after the Euros, Pogba either signs on or he gets sold because otherwise he walks for free next summer.

That might dictate VDB's future. If Pogba extends I don't see how VDB has a place in the squad. He's behind Fred and McTominay for the CM spots and unlikely to leapfrog them, because he's not combative enough to play in the double pivot. We might be signing another CM/DM too. He's behind Bruno and Pogba for AM, which is his more natural position from his Ajax days, and nowhere near either of them in quality. The few minutes he currently gets might as well go to Amad or Mejbri while he gets regular football elsewhere, he's not a youngster.

If Pogba leaves and we don't intend to sign a like-for-like replacement (say Grealish) because we prioritise other positions then he could get enough minutes as Bruno's replacement at #10 or an alternative to McTominay at #8.
 

Bastian

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I think this summer, after the Euros, Pogba either signs on or he gets sold because otherwise he walks for free next summer.

That might dictate VDB's future. If Pogba extends I don't see how VDB has a place in the squad. He's behind Fred and McTominay for the CM spots and unlikely to leapfrog them, because he's not combative enough to play in the double pivot. We might be signing another CM/DM too. He's behind Bruno and Pogba for AM, which is his more natural position from his Ajax days, and nowhere near either of them in quality. The few minutes he currently gets might as well go to Amad or Mejbri while he gets regular football elsewhere, he's not a youngster.

If Pogba leaves and we don't intend to sign a like-for-like replacement (say Grealish) because we prioritise other positions then he could get enough minutes as Bruno's replacement at #10 or an alternative to McTominay at #8.
Yeah, I don't see Ole having enough belief in him just because Pogba leaves. And they're, as you mentioned, different sorts of players. Ole hasn't really shown any indication that he's changing how he sets up.
 

tomaldinho1

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He is in the team because he is tall, physical and a youth product. Ive seen people on here saying they were seeing a potential Yaya Toure and top 3 or 4 in the league. Madness
McT could definitely be a shitter version of Yaya Toure - that’d still be a very good player.

Personally I think VdB is a better overall player than both McT and Fred but only if we were playing a possession based system. I’m our system he’s ok still but it’s so evident it doesn’t suit him
 

MadMike

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Yeah, I don't see Ole having enough belief in him just because Pogba leaves. And they're, as you mentioned, different sorts of players. Ole hasn't really shown any indication that he's changing how he sets up.
He'd still be a bench player if Pogba leaves, he'll just get more minutes if that happens as we deal with injuries, suspensions etc.
 

Bastian

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He'd still be a bench player if Pogba leaves, he'll just get more minutes if that happens as we deal with injuries, suspensions etc.
Yeah, if we sell Pogba we either replace him or Ole does the audacious and super unexpected thing of hyping Mejbri up as much as Tunisia. Which of course won't happen.

Unless Ole wants to completely change how we operate in midfield, I really think VDB should salvage his career.
 

RedDevil@84

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I believe he was signed because Pogba circus was going on and we needed a backup plan. But it turns out, VdB can play only in a specific system, and maybe a specific formation only.
So looks like he can't even get his place if Pogba leaves.
 

MadMike

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Yeah, if we sell Pogba we either replace him or Ole does the audacious and super unexpected thing of hyping Mejbri up as much as Tunisia. Which of course won't happen.

Unless Ole wants to completely change how we operate in midfield, I really think VDB should salvage his career.
I don't think it's clear cut that we would replace Pogba like for like. Pogba played a lot as a LW after coming back, with Bruno having taken the AMC/#10 spot from him. Ole might go for Sancho and a DM rather than opt for a #10/#8 to replace Pogba, because Pogba does cause a bit of a headache selection-wise and we don't need that much competition for the creative midfielder spot.

Although on the bolded, from VDB's point I would totally agree.

I believe he was signed because Pogba circus was going on and we needed a backup plan. But it turns out, VdB can play only in a specific system, and maybe a specific formation only.
So looks like he can't even get his place if Pogba leaves.
And what was Bruno then?