I’m not talking about any of the others, aside from Scholes who does a bit of punditry the rest are doing their own thing as you say. Scholes as scathing as he is, will still show his colours occasionally and jump in and stand up for the club if a pundit from a former rival gets a bit over zealous in their attacks on United. You still get to see that fire he has in his belly for United. I haven’t seen that in Neville for years and years and I suspect for the reasons I listed. Salford have his interest on an emotional level, he’s conditioned himself into a more neutral mindset for professional reasons and probably found it somewhat easier because of the way we are run these days.
Why are pundits so bad? Especially ex United players
- Thread starter Ramshock
- Start date
Yep, I think that, too. Also the broadcasters probably coach them to do exactly that.
The analysis of games by pundits is strangely similar - even for different sports. Seems like with the right motivation and proper attitude you can always win the game...
Yeah it’s all the same I turn off after full time so only really get halftime analysis which is enough, but I do find the RTE or Virgin (Irish TV) go into more detail on how the game is won or lost.
Sky and BT could really take a page out of their book, Souness for example goes into far more detail and is a really good pundit when on Irish TV but on a World Wide Broadcaster he is so dumbed down it’s unbelievable.
Think he said he couldn’t believe it when he was encouraged to say what he thinks because he doesn’t get the chance to on different channels.
Because fans know so much, and obviously more than ex pros these days
For me, and for many other non United fans, Rio will always be ridiculed because of this:
This is the pundits version of Gerrads never forgetful slip against Chelsea. It will tarnish his pundit career probably forever
He's a fanboy which is pleasing to United when things go well. Apart from that I probably think Neville is the best of the United bunch. He is critical and usually for a good reason. I don't like it when pundits say what the majority want to hear. I find him the most interesting of the bunch to listen to. HAs a great voice/accent for the job too.
That was every united fan after that game
Ex Liverpool players are the worst pundits.
Souness with his racial stereotype agenda, his football is too soft it used to be a tough mans game agenda, Mcmanaman with his Liverpool bias, Carragher spitting at children,
Souness with his racial stereotype agenda, his football is too soft it used to be a tough mans game agenda, Mcmanaman with his Liverpool bias, Carragher spitting at children,
He is atrocious.
Aye. There will be different metrics used to assess a studio such as fame (a lot of people will simply turn off if they see somebody they don't recognise), personality (the enthusiasm of a Rio, Wright or Savage), controversy (Sky always want one pundit stirring things up), eloquence (relaxed speakers put the viewer at ease) and analysis (spoonfed in most cases so not a priority for most shows).
So while there are a few duds out there purely on the basis of fame or for saying stupid stuff, a lot of current ex-pros actually meet a few of those criteria. We have to bear in mind that the folk on this forum are probably not that representative of the wider football-watching public. In general we probably want more knowledgeable analysis, but you can see how the likes of Match of the Day and Sky Sports try to cover all bases to appeal to a wider viewership.
United pundits play-up to the online negativity surrounding the club. Evra in particular is just trying to go viral on a LUHG Twitter account. Neville also tries desperately not to be biased.
Evra's massive insta rant actually touched upon this. He mentioned how SAF would give a player like Giggs much more detailed tactical instructions than someone like Scholes. Seems like Scholesy was actually a pretty simple player. Knew his role and didn't really need to understand the intricacies of it all
Some pundits dumb down for a certain audience while others are just dumb.
I have a bit of a thing for people diminishing other fans' love/support for their respective clubs so I'll agree to disagree, interesting thought though.
Darren Fletcher is a great pundit. He's spot on all the time.
Scholes comes across as someone who just instinctively knows the game. People who are 'naturals' in any field tend to be uniquely bad teachers/explainers. It's not that they don't understand what they're doing, they've just never had to think abstractly about it, they've never needed to have it explained to them because they just 'get it' and they don't really see why others find it difficult.
Some of them are not good students of the game, it seens - compounded by the fact that most are poor communicators too. Great players don't necessarily make great managers or coaches - sometimes they are fixated on their positions within the field and lack the strategic thinking (Relying on world class instincts) to explain game plans and tactics (Even if their mind and body can react to such situations on the pitch).
There was one show where they analysed his Forest goals, and he said all he did was blindly run forward. There was also a goal where he chipped the keeper from twenty yards, which he claimed to be a simple finish as the keeper lost his bearings. No you prick, you were a stunning, world class player loved by all United fansHe has to credit himself more tbf.
About pundits though, him, Neville and Rio are my favourites. I don’t see Neville insinuating problems and second-guessing Ole like the OP is strangely mentioning.
strangely...watch some recent punditryI hate to hear Neville in a United game. He tries to be so unbiased that he becomes biased against us. Starts calling simple fouls on opposition as stonewall penalty and fouls on us as too soft to be called. It is almost nonsensical.
Somebody at Sky loves Jamie Redknapp. Stealing a living.
If we were winning trophies they’d all be great pundits .
To be honest, they have such limited time due to adverts everything has to be dumbed down. It's also our fault as United fans because if the producers see Evra's rant and Keane's soundbites generating the most interest they will understandably ask for more of the same.
What is strange is how Scholes, probably my favourite United player of all time, is by far my least favourite pundit - I genuinely think he's awful. It's probably because the stuff we might find interesting to him should be obvious or has always been natural to him so he's never had to explain it but he's one who needs to get off the 'proper United [insert player position]' bandwagon pronto.
GNev is still the best for non United games - with United he's so scared of being seen as biased he just calls anything not clear cut the other way.
What is strange is how Scholes, probably my favourite United player of all time, is by far my least favourite pundit - I genuinely think he's awful. It's probably because the stuff we might find interesting to him should be obvious or has always been natural to him so he's never had to explain it but he's one who needs to get off the 'proper United [insert player position]' bandwagon pronto.
GNev is still the best for non United games - with United he's so scared of being seen as biased he just calls anything not clear cut the other way.
Don’t know what people expect. Too much by the sounds of it. Or for every pundit to echo exactly what they think. People are way too invested in what pundits say.
Neville is a bit different because he’s clearly trying to make a career out of it.
They’re all scathing of United though because we’ve been shite.
Neville is a bit different because he’s clearly trying to make a career out of it.
They’re all scathing of United though because we’ve been shite.
Because they tread a fine line of trying to suppress emotion and yet trying to be analytical, while being PC and also having to sound interesting.
They're also expected to know everything, when they don't, but because they're ex-players, pressure is placed on them to provide the best analysis.
I still enjoy listening and watching some of them though. Ian Wright, when he has a justified go at the officials and VAR, Keane for entertainment.
And in fairness, I'd rather have them on who get it right 25% of the time, than a couple journalists who are 50 thousand times worse and usually just end up trying to spin a story.
They're also expected to know everything, when they don't, but because they're ex-players, pressure is placed on them to provide the best analysis.
I still enjoy listening and watching some of them though. Ian Wright, when he has a justified go at the officials and VAR, Keane for entertainment.
And in fairness, I'd rather have them on who get it right 25% of the time, than a couple journalists who are 50 thousand times worse and usually just end up trying to spin a story.
I watch every MNF simply to see people like Neville, Carragher, Keane and Evra (he’s not on MNF but I like him). GNev is just analysing in his usual manner. He loves Ole.
Nah, don't think they do so one bit. It comes natural to footballers to be boring and bland after all the stints doing press interviews. Few of them really show a natural side to them.
Another thing is having to do punditry on games you didn't watch. Neville is a lunatic and watches everything. The rest watch maybe half the games and only comment on the highlights, hence cliches. Another reason there are a lot of cliches is because what else are you going to say? We've seen these positives and negatives in football matches before.
Everyone can instantly watch every goal online immediately after it's been scored. The MNF format is so old and boring. The reason why people watch it is because there's literally nothing else and people like football too much. Football production is stale and conservative in its approach and it's the same everywhere. Culturally things might be done a bit differently but they've been done differently the same way for a long time.
Steve McLaren was doing some co-commentating on the United/Chelsea game at the weekend and it was nice to hear someone who not only knows United, but also understands football.
Whenever i watch a clip from Motd or other english punditry and tv shows i always get astonished on how low the standards are in England. Every pundit in every show give the same lazy answers to every questions. Sometimes you get the sense that they’re saying all this vanilla stuff just so people at home can understand and not get bored.
It's more or less prime time TV. While many of us wouldn't mind, it's not hard to see why dispensing Bielsa style tactical lectures to the general public isn't commonplace. Most of the fans I meet day to day, at work and so on, really couldn't give a sh*t about tactics. It's a good game or it's not. No one ever watched Top of the Pops for music theory seminars.
If it wasn't forTo be honest, most of the pundits are ex-'Pool players and they are all the bottom of the pits!
Neville x2, Rio, Keane, Evra, Fletcher, Scholes, Owen, Hargreaves, Dublin, Higginbotham and probably others I can't recall United would hardly have anyone to fight the good fight.
So unfair
You're so right my friend - so very unfair.If it wasn't for
Neville x2, Rio, Keane, Evra, Fletcher, Scholes, Owen, Hargreaves, Dublin, Higginbotham and probably others I can't recall United would hardly have anyone to fight the good fight.
So unfair
Yeah you’re right. But i feel it’s sometimes a huge disservice to some players who get slagged of by these ”experts” when in reality the tactic the team employ can make them do a certain thing on the pitch which can look questionable to the average supporter.
I've come around to Hargreaves a lot. His first few years were awful, he was so inarticulate, he could barely string a sentence together. He's decent now, one of few British pundits who seems to be knowledgeable of football outside of the Premier League.
Higginbotham is good too.
Higginbotham is good too.
This is so terrible I'm really doubting whether they truly watch the game, or watching all other games simultaneously.
Craig Burley you wanker.
Gary Neville’s commentary often makes me feel physically ill.
he’a absolutely atrocious and in my opinion the most biased of all pundits against United which is just embarrassing.
he’a absolutely atrocious and in my opinion the most biased of all pundits against United which is just embarrassing.
I hate how Lianne Sanderson seems to be everywhere at the moment.
Her voice is nails down a blackboard and she derails every conversation to instead talk about “Manchestunited” (always one word) and will use “we” or “us” about fifteen times like it’s fanzone or something. She’s clearly a diversity hire but surely there are other black or mixed race women available who could actually provide some professionalism and insight and don’t sound like Kat Slater.
Her voice is nails down a blackboard and she derails every conversation to instead talk about “Manchestunited” (always one word) and will use “we” or “us” about fifteen times like it’s fanzone or something. She’s clearly a diversity hire but surely there are other black or mixed race women available who could actually provide some professionalism and insight and don’t sound like Kat Slater.
Who was the woman on BT Sport for the Newcastle? She was horrible never stopped talking all through the game yet said nothing of any interest.
Lucy Ward, didn't watch the Newcastle game but she did our game with Fulham and I thought she was decent
The public are constantly underestimated.
TV companies believe that the public do not want or care about detailed analysis, insightful comments or well-thought-out answers. They think that all they need to keep viewers happy is a familiar name who can crack an occasional joke. To an extent, unfortunately, they may be right.
But a lot of us would rather listen to an ex-player give us a window into the mind of a professional footballer than the same overemployed names repeating tired clichés. I like to hope that, slowly, punditry is swinging in that direction- much like management, where the 'old guard' is slowly being phased out. Time will tell.
TV companies believe that the public do not want or care about detailed analysis, insightful comments or well-thought-out answers. They think that all they need to keep viewers happy is a familiar name who can crack an occasional joke. To an extent, unfortunately, they may be right.
But a lot of us would rather listen to an ex-player give us a window into the mind of a professional footballer than the same overemployed names repeating tired clichés. I like to hope that, slowly, punditry is swinging in that direction- much like management, where the 'old guard' is slowly being phased out. Time will tell.
My biggest problem with pundits is when they state their opinion as fact. Especially when it comes to the laws of the game. Pundits should have to take a refs course before they are allowed on TV. They spread their misinformation and the muppets eat it all up...
Maybe the game but she just never seemed to stop talking and seemed to explain everything twice like they need to move up the pitch run up the pitch.
Still better than Gary Neville going "ooooohhhhh "
It’s been refreshing this season to not hear much (any?) of Garry Birtles. He constantly ruined games with his over-opinionated whinging about everything.