Why are the Glazers/Woody running the club so badly?

[Web of Bissaka]

They don't know how to run a sports club well.
And likely they just don't care.

What affection do they have to this club? nothing.
What do they know about football? nothing.
What ambition do they have from this club? money.

The least they can do is hire people who can run a football club, not some clueless-in-football employee who is failing for uhh 6 to 7 years now and counting, and that someone also seems to only favor good reputations and financial profits. And seriously put a proper structure in place eg. proper department specialized in football. Problem is, none of them know so far how to make that proper structure, possibly they're also afraid of the shift of power i.e. afraid of losing more power in the club hierarchy, so not much control over the finances and profits. I mean political "pressure" happen internally in the "game" of power.

So far they're treating it as a commercialized club with good reputations to consider, not a football club.

Football is just the means to get money, not the goal. The goal is money, not the means for best football.

Judging from their reluctance to change the whole power structure so far.
If they officially elect a DoF in the future, won't surprise me to see it's given to a yes-man.

EDIT:
Tbf, they do support financially. But to what degree.. who knows.

That said, if they hit a jackpot -- hired a juggernaut competitive visionary football manager, that can easily hide their incompetent weaknesses. Small chance of happening though but hey, who knows. Another Busby and Ferguson, and I'm sure when Busby and Fergie were hired, no one expect them to reach the amazing heights which they did.

 

[reelworld]

Yes. He got those appointment wrong. But without a hindsight he imho has chose the best option according to the situation at the time.

Woodward think they're the best option because he doesn't know about football. He went for the biggest names not the most suitable for United.

 

[Pearl of Wisdom]

They really don’t care as long as they make money from us.
As for Ed. I can’t believe a single United supporter can think he’s done/doing a good job. Look at where we were, look at where we are now, and look at where our rivals are now. All on him. And of course the blood sucking leeches who own us

Im a newb so my posting restrictions are high currently, but here are two links that maybe of interest from forbes showing Tampa Bay running at 9% debt ratio and 18% debt ratio for MUFC.

https://www.forbes.com/teams/tampa-bay-buccaneers/#7539a3fd35d1
https://www.forbes.com/teams/manchester-united/#49acc01313f9

They are redeveloping the stadium with the introduction of 76 beers. "get them pissed andthey wont care how shit the team is performing"
My point is they are investing in Tampa Bay which gives them much less revenue than MUFC. They are not going anywhere soon and I think we need to face the facts rather than get depressed. A 3-5 year rebuild is required, but do they really want that level of investment?

Edit forgot to post this other link, very interesting interactive webpage:
https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/Man Utd/manchester-united/stock-price-history

 

[Josep Dowling]

I think the truth is none of the Glazers have a clue what they are doing. Their wealth was inherited, not earnt. Because of this they have left Woodward in charge of the club.

He goes into meetings, gives them a cheque for £20m in dividends each year and boasting about record revenues and record twitter followers and that keeps them happy and they don’t ask many questions.

The truth is has our lack of success dented their profits? We still generate ridiculous amounts of money. Maybe some fans need to realise the only way they will listen is to stop spending your hard earned cash with these guys until they sort out the executive level. The common denominator since Fergie retired is Woodward and the incompetent mate of his that negotiates contracts. Both should be gone or at the very least moved away from footballing matters.

 

[Catt]

You really are a huge fan of his aren’t you? Maybe you should go support Ed. Why not start a forum called Ed Cafe and quit trying to argue the unarguable with Man Utd fans.

Talk about overreaction.

 

[diarm]

I got a bit carried away writing a stupidly long post in another thread which got locked while I was writing it but I reckon it'll fit well in here:

I've just seen a team with Origi and Shaqiri in their front 3 smash Barcelona 4-0. So yeah I think it does.

But you take that same Liverpool side without Van Dijk, Allison, Keita and Fabinho and its not making any final or even top 2.r

Liverpool are succeeding because their owners, board, scouts, recruiters, academy, coaches and yes, their manager are all reading from the same page.

Klopp is a class manager and managed to get Liverpool to a decent level before this season despite the weaknesses in his squad. But Jose is a class manager and got us to 2nd last season. The difference being that Liverpool is a club in sync from top to bottom and they went out in the summer, identified the areas they needed to fix and brought in the very best solutions they could aquire.

I'm not saying Jose should have been given free reign to sign who he wanted. We don't know Klopp was the man behind all the signings Liverpool made last year and in my personal opinion, the values of Jose Mourinho are not and should never be in sync with those of Manchester United.

I'm just pointing to the total disarray at all levels of our club. We have a Chief Executive with a banking background signing players because of their image, even if they aren't needed and will take funds from the vital areas which need fixing. We have a head coach publicly requesting older signings (against our traditional values) and then the club publicly refusing to sign off on his requests. We have had scouts and technical directors walking out on the club because they felt their voices weren't being listened to. I could rant on for another hour here about our farce of a wage structure and the lack of accountability for anyone bar the manager of the current few months.

When I picture the successfully run clubs of the moment, Barca, Bayern, City and Liverpool (PSG and Real Madrid are a different beast but Manchester will never be Paris or Madrid so those models aren't going to work here), I picture weekly or monthly meetings where a senior executive, the Director of Football, the Head Coach, the Academy Director, The Head of Recruitment and the Head Scout sit around a table and discuss the current state of affairs, currents areas needing to be address and potential solutions.

These meetings are structured around a small number of focused, clearly defined and agreed upon pillars. The club has identified and set in place the values and style upon which they want to proceed. Is this a club which plays with physicality and a strong aerial presence or do we prefer a quicker tempo and more technical quality? Are we more defensive and counter or possession and patient attack focused? Do we focus more on proven class and experience or young talent and promise?

Everyone at that table should have a voice. Obviously the Head Coach is best placed to identify the current issues but that doesn't necessarily mean he's best suited to identifying potential solutions. He might identify a player during a match or have some fellas he's keeping an eye on but the majority of his time should be spent on preparing, motivating and focusing his own side. It's not an efficient use of his time to be spending hours a week scouting and judging prospects.

The well run clubs have scouts to do that. They can prepare information and videos for managers, directors of football and recruiters. If other people in the room don't trust the scouts for this then get rid of them a recruit better scouts.

The Director of Football has a voice as to whether this signing will match the core values of the club. Does this player match the age profile we are looking for? Does he have the work rate we are looking for? Does he have the required technical ability or the physical presence?

The Academy Director needs to be heard, in case there is a prospect worth investing time into instead of splashing huge cash right away, perhaps better value could be found in a temporary solution until that kid is ready.

The recruitment and financial team need a voice. Is it a feasible target? How much will it cost? How much will that leave us for other areas of concern.

The very last voice to be heard in these meetings should be the senior executive. I accept that an owner or CEO might like a high profile signing for business reasons and there is nothing wrong with them voicing that desire.

But if they have hired coaches, footballing directors, recruiters, accountants and scouts, they simply have to trust and respect them. Everyone in that room should believe that the person in charge of their department is better at their specific job than anyone else in the room. If the senior executive thinks he knows more about identifying players than the coach or the scouts then you are on a hiding to nothing.

When I picture such meetings at United (if they even happen), I picture a battle of egos between Woodward and head coaches like Van Gaal or Jose while the scouts or academy director are marginalised and their work disrespected. I can't see how there can be any cohesive strategy or core pillars which focus and tie the decision making process together.

I'm not sure even Sir Alex in his pomp could succeed in this current setup at United. Under Fergie, Edwards and Gill there always seemed to be a respect that doesn't feel like it exists under Woodward. Scouts were trusted to be scouts, the manager was trusted to be the manager and the senior executive knew his place was to trust and support the people he had recruited to look after the football club.

 

[Rory 7]

Talk about overreaction.

It’s called sarcasm. It’s the lowest form of wit.

 

[calodo2003]

I wouldn’t be surprised if it was Woodward’s attitude that was the major force for the club’s derailment. He strikes me as someone who was not good at all in athletics growing up. He may see his current position as the ability to make up for his athletic ineptitude growing up. He may have had some success at FM which just feeds his narcissism & he won’t typically take suggestions that are not in line with his thoughts. Case in point:

https://www.foxsportsasia.com/footb...oodward-refused-to-sign-barcelona-bound-star/

I may not be correct, but the reason for our demise has to be something in the order of such an absurd magnitude.

 

[wolvored]

BOARD OF DIRECTORS

• Avram Glazer – Executive Co-Chairman and Director
  
  
• Joel Glazer – Executive Co-Chairman and Director
  
  
• Edward Woodward – Executive Vice Chairman and Director
  
  
• Richard Arnold – Group Managing Director and Director
  
  
• Cliff Baty – Chief Financial Officer
  
  
• Kevin Glazer – Director
  
  
• Bryan Glazer – Director
  
  
• Darcie Glazer Kassewitz – Director
  
  
• Edward Glazer – Director
  
  
• Robert Leitão – Independent Director
  
  
• Man Utd Sawhney – Independent Director
  
  
• John Hooks – Independent Director
  
  
  
  Taken from https://ir.manutd.com/corporate-governance/board-of-directors.aspx
  
  I’m aware Avram has passed so aware this is outdated.

Just googled Avram doesn't say he's dead on wiki

 

[Physiocrat]

I think the truth is none of the Glazers have a clue what they are doing. Their wealth was inherited, not earnt. Because of this they have left Woodward in charge of the club.

I fear this is the case

 

[Skills]

I got a bit carried away writing a stupidly long post in another thread which got locked while I was writing it but I reckon it'll fit well in here:



But you take that same Liverpool side without Van Dijk, Allison, Keita and Fabinho and its not making any final or even top 2.r

Erm?

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Unpopular opinion:
The majority of our demise was caused by managers and their bad signings. Glazers/Woody provided PLENTY of transfer funds.

Unpopular or not, it's clearly true.

However, what you can lay on the owners 100% is the absence of any long-term strategy. Individual managers have all been given plenty of money, but there has been no overarching plan for replacing A with B (and C - we're on to D now), which among other things has meant that the new guy has taken over largely unsuitable squads every time.

The "model" only works if you happen to recruit a brilliant manager who's in it for the long haul. Fergie Mk2, if you will.

 

[Skills]

Unpopular opinion:
The majority of our demise was caused by managers and their bad signings. Glazers/Woody provided PLENTY of transfer funds.

Is correct.

 

[Infra-red]

It's only been badly run from a football and from a fan perspective. The Glazers couldn't care less about football or about the fans.

2005 Revenue: £221m
2018 Revenue: £590m

2005 purchase price: £790m (of which £540m was debt)
2019 reported value: £4bn

The Glazers and Woodward will be absolutely delighted with how they're runnings things.

 

[Rory 7]

Jesus wept. It’s not just about transfer funds. When will people realise this. It’s the clubs’ lack of long term strategy or vision. And the knee jerk short term approach to the footballing side of things that is at the root cause of our decline. If anything spend spend spend policy for the last five years is part of the problem. All of this boils down to one thing - corporate culture. The buck stops at board level now.

 

[Vedder]

Glazer - “I'm not some kind of land baron trying to milk his cash cow. It's just ....’

Ed - “Don't worry, you'll get your milk.”

 

[Rory 7]

It's only been badly run from a football and from a fan perspective. The Glazers couldn't care less about football or about the fans.

2005 Revenue: £221m
2018 Revenue: £590m

2005 purchase price: £790m (of which £540m was debt)
2019 reported value: £4bn

The Glazers and Woodward will be absolutely delighted with how they're runnings things.

A bit like Lehman Brothers.

 

[Sky1981]

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/ed-woodward-your-views-on-him-now-part-3.395922/

 

[Damien]

Just googled Avram doesn't say he's dead on wiki

@Andy_Cole is probably thinking of their father, Malcolm.

 

[Rory 7]

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/ed-woodward-your-views-on-him-now-part-3.395922/

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/so-...-blame-game-topic.394878/page-8#post-16282139

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Unpopular or not, it's clearly true.

However, what you can lay on the owners 100% is the absence of any long-term strategy. Individual managers have all been given plenty of money, but there has been no overarching plan for replacing A with B (and C - we're on to D now), which among other things has meant that the new guy has taken over largely unsuitable squads every time.

The "model" only works if you happen to recruit a brilliant manager who's in it for the long haul. Fergie Mk2, if you will.

Not true.

The club works if you recruit successive managers with similar styles that require similar types of players. A clear strategy.

It's not rocket science that lurching from possesion based LVG to anti-possesion, counter attack Jose requires totally different squads and coaching.

 

[Rory 7]

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/ed-woodward-your-views-on-him-now-part-3.395922/

Or if you want to read posters comments on lack of strategy look no further than here: https://www.redcafe.net/threads/why...rry-i-dont-follow.441077/page-9#post-22990878.

I think you are missing the point about Woody/Glazers. This is not a blame game or continuing vicious circle of witch hunting. I happen to disagree with the way managers have been treated at United over the last 6 years. I'm pretty fed up with fans and media and players hounding managers out. I feel we are being run with no long term vision, by a CEO who is knee-jerk in every decision. Under Moyes I was convinced he would be sacked immediately on failure to hit top four, the same happened with LVG and essentially with Jose when it was obvious he was going to miss top four. Why? Because Woody and the Glazers have written top-four finish as a minimum into managers contracts time after time. Ole probably escapes with a fool's pardon because Woody knows he can't jerk his knee again so soon after the knee-jerk permanent appointment.

IF there was any evidence that Woody/Glazer regime had a long term plan and vision for the football club I'd get behind them but there is none. They are short term fixated venture capitalists milking the club dry. And they have been from day one. Investment in the club infrastructure has more or less stalled. Investment in playing staff and wages is essentially Divestment of funds accrued with new TV and sponsorship deals. None of this is a football focused culture that was present under the great years of SAF. By any measure these owners have been terrible for us as a sporting institution. How you can't see that is beyond me.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Is correct.

Give me strength.

See my above post.

 

[wolvored]

When you look at it from a neutral point of view, taking the fan cap off.
Utd had a buyout of the club in 2005. They the Glazers decided to max out all the profits they could. Like in any other business, you want it to pay out as much as possible. You dont run a business and plow all the profits back in. Fergie was regularly winning without needing a lot of funds. They hired the man who helped the buyout as the new CEO once Fergie and Gill left. So before 2013 Woody hadnt a say on transfer spend.
Now we speculate who brought in Moyes. Some say it was Fergie alone, but no one knows really. We can only go on Moyes version. For some reason there was an almighty cock up on getting players in with Moyes in charge, but once again was that Moyes or Woody? When it was obvious Moyes was out of his depth we had to find the best manager out there that was available.
VG was leading Holland to WC semis, was a title and champions league winner. It was a no brainer. He was backed to the hilt money wise. Did he suggest which players come in or Woody? You can deduce the players we went for were VG buys.
When that was going tits up, we brought in Mourinho. Apparently the 2nd best manager in the world, a man who also had won titles and champions leagues, more than VG. He was backed to the hilt. The players bought you can deduce were Mourinho players. He had us 2nd and whether there were rumblings of him moving on, or whatever, he had his contract extended, which no one moaned about on here. Something happened last summer as a couple of players came in, but Mourinho started slagging the club off in the pre season. The atmosphere grew toxic and sacking was the best thing to do, which once again no one moaned about.
Woody then brought in Ole to steady the ship which he did greatly. Everyone clamoured for him to get the job, which was then followed up.
From a neutral perspective Woody has followed the path any CEO might have followed. He might be niave or pig headed thinking he only has to finance the manager. He could have got another possession based manager in after VG, but look, theres Mourinho, 2nd best manager all ready to sign up.
Maybe this DOF is going to happen and hes interviewing loads so he doesnt get the wrong bloke in again. Maybe hes having a whisper in his ear to get as many ex Utd in as they 'know the club'. Avram Glazer has been quoted in the press he is going to be more hands on, so perhaps hes behind this 'Utd way'. Who knows?

 

[Samid]

Just googled Avram doesn't say he's dead on wiki

He's dead to us.

 

[Jim Beam]

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/ed-woodward-your-views-on-him-now-part-3.395922/

It's year 2019.

 

[Hawks2008]

Incompetence + No ambition.

 

[red4ever 79]

Incompetence + No ambition.

Nailed on. /Thread

 

[red4ever 79]

Is Ed's full name Edward Woodward as in the same as the Equalizer guy? That explains it then. He has been sent to us undercover by Liverpool to destroy the club from the inside. That explains everything now why Young and Jones got new contracts.

 

[Hammondo]

They are running it just for money, the commercial side of it.

That's why we keep buying big named and/or flashy players, Pogba, Falcao, Sanchez, Zlatan, Schweinsteiger, Angel Di Maria among others.

This matched with the fact we don't have a football style or footballing DNA to the club just means we are throwing money at the available big name, player or manager.

We have missed out on so much that teams like Barce, bayern, real etc have done for a long time, build a proper footballing structure to the club.

 

[Siddharth]

Just look at our fullback situation and it will confirm utterly incompetent people are running the club. Sad situation.

 

[djembatheking]

They are doing a fantastic job , making more and more money every year so why change .

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Not true.

The club works if you recruit successive managers with similar styles that require similar types of players. A clear strategy.

It's not rocket science that lurching from possesion based LVG to anti-possesion, counter attack Jose requires totally different squads and coaching.

Eh?

Isn't that exactly what I said?

 

[11101]

They're businessmen and we are a business, and we have been the biggest in the world at what we do for some years. Remove the currency effect of Brexit and we still are. The fans and the owners are after different things, in their eyes we have been doing well.

Now our growth is stalling but i think the family are looking to sell so aren't prepared to make major investments. When Malcolm Glazer was involved things were fine, for both us and Tampa. When he started to hand control over to his kids is when things went awry, and particularly so since his death. Seems they're just not that good at running things.

 

[Jezpeza]

Ive said it a thousand times on this forum but no one listens - the Glazers invested in this club as a ‘sports franchise’. Its an american thing, Ramped up sponsorship on the with 750 million adidas deals and matchday bleach sponsors whilst making the minimum investment to keep the team competitive enough to remain in the UCL. Sorry if anyone thinks any different. Simply put, the investment needed to get us to title contenders is more than the extra prizemoney so they dont want to win anything.
They just care about the financial gain. After last years low financial outlay versus our revenues we could spend 4or 5 hundred million. But we wont. We are on here talking skriniar and sancho. Woodies sat with the glazers talking alderweireld and gueye and whatever baragin bin buys they can reel in and the least they can spend to get us to scrape top 4 is. Look what Randy Lerner did to Villa. Look what Gillet and Hicks did to Liverpool

 

[Robbo's Shoulder]

Because they know nothing at all about football and how it works.

 

[TRUERED89]

Just like Jose, Ed can't win.

Extend contract = giving in
Not Extending contract = letting good players leave to save penny
Hiring top manager = Instant success
Hiring Ex Legend = Cheap option yes men
Buying youngster = United is being leeched by the glazer
Buying Top star = We have no vision
Employing a patience phylosophy builder = boring, we want action
Employing a strict disciplinarian = Toxic, the players needs arms around their shoulder, how dare he
Employing a United Legend = He's not experienced enough
Finding sponsor = Ed is too money minded, he's not a football man
Listening to a fooball man (SAF) = What the feck is he thinking hiring Moyes

For me the sign of absurd finger pointing is when he does the opposite and still be blamed for both.

You have some good points here, but what solution would you advise? I'd say stop the mercenary signings and focus on the best players in England/PL.

 

[jderbyshire]

It really is about time Woodward or the Glazers appear in some sort of video interview and answer some questions and apologise and make some assurances to the fans about the future of the club.

They are hiding in the shadows too much - they need to take some responsibility.

Edwards, Kenyon and Gill used to be more open and transparent. Not briefing their side of the story to journos like slippery Ed.

God he looks like such a psychopath.

 

[calodo2003]

Interesting article, apologies if posted before...

https://lazyfansports.com/woodward-what-happened-to-the-director-of-football

 

[Andy_Cole]

Yes I am thinking of Malcolm!!!