Why is everyone so certain that DDG will be a starter under ETH?

Carl

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I would argue we have essential needs in every area of the pitch including goalkeeping and it doesn't matter much which ones we'll get to first.
Of course it matters. As it stands our midfielders going into next season are McTominay, Fred and VDB (arguable) Our forwards are Rashford, Sancho, Ronaldo and Elanga.

We could have the best goalkeeper in the world but if we only have 3 midfielders and 4 forwards we're fecked. Not to mention that most of those 7 players aren't good enough anyway.
 

Idxomer

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Of course it matters. As it stands our midfielders going into next season are McTominay, Fred and VDB (arguable) Our forwards are Rashford, Sancho, Ronaldo and Elanga.

We could have the best goalkeeper in the world but if we only have 3 midfielders and 4 forwards we're fecked. Not to mention that most of those 7 players aren't good enough anyway.
Yeah you're right, I just really hate seeing him in goal these days and doing the bare minimum required from him as a keeper.

At this point, I would take Henderson being average at everything over him.
 

Adnan

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It's easy to why the Brighton keeper is considered better by Luis Enrique.
 

Idxomer

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It's easy to why the Brighton keeper is considered better by Luis Enrique.
Or anyone who watched them both the last two years.

They should start tapping him up from now if there's any long-term plan at this club.
 

CloneMC16

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Does anyone even argue this point outside of a tiny few? It's obvious we do, it's just we have many far greater needs.
A lot of people argue that De Gea is world class and isn't a problem. Probably not as much on this forum, but I see it a lot on Twitter.

Sanchez's distribution is the reason why they scored their third. De Gea would never make that pass in a million years. He also came quite far out to grab a cross from a corner in the 2nd half that De Gea never would. It takes so much pressure off of the defence.
 

Adnan

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Or anyone who watched them both the last two years.

They should start tapping him up from now if there's any long-term plan at this club.
We know he lacks quite a bit when it comes to distribution but also being a non-entity when it comes to commanding his area is unacceptable imo.

Watching the Brighton keeper create a goal and command his area was sad to see from a United perspective.
 

Longshanks

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The second goal just after half time that really killed is, the one where he just watches the ball roll all the way through his six yard box and the also allows trossard all the time and space in the world to pick out a pass all from the comfort of his line to then get beaten at his near post just kind of sums him up for me.

Biggest fraud at the club should be the first player ETH gets rid of or at least removes from the first team.
 

Lux Thunder

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Been here a few days before the Brighton game suggesting Robert Sanchez as a potential replacement for De Gea and a goalkeeper who I think ETH would like.

Not pretending to be smart as*, but I'm a big fan of this player and although I know that we have more urgent positions to solve in this transfer window but many posters here would be surprised how a change of goalkeeping position can have a big impact on the whole squad.

Press resistance and not having players who are capable of controlling possession under pressure is one of the biggest problems this United squad has and adding a goalkeeper who has composure, vision and is comfortable with the ball will secure one more option to break the opposition first line and progress ball because breaking press do not depend on player press resistance solely but also depend on how many options does he have in certain situations. Having no pace upfront is also an issue because you can't pin the opposition backline back and the whole team suffers from the high press, but at least with the goalkeeper of Sanchez's quality, you secure a numerical advantage in the first third.

More too, he is very good at claiming crosses and commanding his area, so our center backs would not be under such pressure to deal with those crosses and I'm sure he will improve our set-piece record.
 

Alfie092

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I hope we at least sign a budget GK (£10m-£20m) who is young and has good ball playing abilities (obviously shot stopping abilities is needed too). Someone who is happy to play backup and play in the odd cup games while given the chance to grow and eventually given the opportunity to become number 1.
 

Idxomer

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Been here a few days before the Brighton game suggesting Robert Sanchez as a potential replacement for De Gea and a goalkeeper who I think ETH would like.

Not pretending to be smart as*, but I'm a big fan of this player and although I know that we have more urgent positions to solve in this transfer window but many posters here would be surprised how a change of goalkeeping position can have a big impact on the whole squad.

Press resistance and not having players who are capable of controlling possession under pressure is one of the biggest problems this United squad has and adding a goalkeeper who has composure, vision and is comfortable with the ball will secure one more option to break the opposition first line and progress ball because breaking press do not depend on player press resistance solely but also depend on how many options does he have in certain situations. Having no pace upfront is also an issue because you can't pin the opposition backline back and the whole team suffers from the high press, but at least with the goalkeeper of Sanchez's quality, you secure a numerical advantage in the first third.

More too, he is very good at claiming crosses and commanding his area, so our center backs would not be under such pressure to deal with those crosses and I'm sure he will improve our set-piece record.
Agreed.

I suggested the same months ago and again if those new guys at the club actually have a plan for this team, they'll start tapping him up from now.
 

Lux Thunder

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I hope we at least sign a budget GK (£10m-£20m) who is young and has good ball playing abilities (obviously shot stopping abilities is needed too). Someone who is happy to play backup and play in the odd cup games while given the chance to grow and eventually given the opportunity to become number 1.
Add £10m more and we would have a potentially long-term world-class goalkeeper in Robert Sanchez, who only can improve under ETH. He should be attainable for around £30m.
 

sullydnl

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Been here a few days before the Brighton game suggesting Robert Sanchez as a potential replacement for De Gea and a goalkeeper who I think ETH would like.

Not pretending to be smart as*, but I'm a big fan of this player and although I know that we have more urgent positions to solve in this transfer window but many posters here would be surprised how a change of goalkeeping position can have a big impact on the whole squad.

Press resistance and not having players who are capable of controlling possession under pressure is one of the biggest problems this United squad has and adding a goalkeeper who has composure, vision and is comfortable with the ball will secure one more option to break the opposition first line and progress ball because breaking press do not depend on player press resistance solely but also depend on how many options does he have in certain situations. Having no pace upfront is also an issue because you can't pin the opposition backline back and the whole team suffers from the high press, but at least with the goalkeeper of Sanchez's quality, you secure a numerical advantage in the first third.

More too, he is very good at claiming crosses and commanding his area, so our center backs would not be under such pressure to deal with those crosses and I'm sure he will improve our set-piece record.
Aye, I rate Sanchez too. Would be very happy to see us opt for him if/when De Gea's time is up.
 

Gator Nate

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A lot of people argue that De Gea is world class and isn't a problem. Probably not as much on this forum, but I see it a lot on Twitter.

Sanchez's distribution is the reason why they scored their third. De Gea would never make that pass in a million years. He also came quite far out to grab a cross from a corner in the 2nd half that De Gea never would. It takes so much pressure off of the defence.
Those are the reasons I prefer Henderson. But I do worry about Henderson's attitude now.
 

Ralph1386

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I say DDG will be a starter at least in ETH’s first season.
 

Idxomer

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One of the funny/depressing stats about him is that there are 20 keepers in the league who has claimed more crosses and done more sweeping actions than him.
 

Lee565

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Most likely and the whole team will suffer because of it.
This, and yet he will escape criticism from TV pundits like neville and keane who are stuck in the past with their views on football and why they are such abysmal managers.

We would be fools not to shift de gea this summer whilst his stock as good as it will ever be from now on with time not on his side and on over inflated wages that can be put to better use.
 

ShinjiNinja26

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This, and yet he will escape criticism from TV pundits like neville and keane who are stuck in the past with their views on football and why they are such abysmal managers.

We would be fools not to shift de gea this summer whilst his stock as good as it will ever be from now on with time not on his side and on over inflated wages that can be put to better use.
Keane has criticised De Gea on numerous occasions. I remember him even saying he’d be swinging punches at De Gea if he was his teammate.
 

Lee565

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Keane has criticised De Gea on numerous occasions. I remember him even saying he’d be swinging punches at De Gea if he was his teammate.
Wasn't that when he kept making errors though in the previous couple of seasons?
 

ShinjiNinja26

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Wasn't that when he kept making errors though in the previous couple of seasons?
Yes and he’s largely escaped criticism this season because he’s been our best player alongside Ronaldo. He’s far from perfect and I do think we need to upgrade to a modern style keeper eventually. The thing is there’s so many problems in the team that require urgent attention that goalkeeper is probably the lowest priority at the moment. I’m pretty sure ETH will persevere with DDG for next season at least despite his ball playing limitations.
 

flappyjay

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Yes and he’s largely escaped criticism this season because he’s been our best player alongside Ronaldo. He’s far from perfect and I do think we need to upgrade to a modern style keeper eventually. The thing is there’s so many problems in the team that require urgent attention that goalkeeper is probably the lowest priority at the moment. I’m pretty sure ETH will persevere with DDG for next season at least despite his ball playing limitations.
Thats how I see it too and then let his contract expire next summer.
 

Lee565

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How the hell do we ever catch up with liverpool and man City when we have him holding us back playing a modern style of football
 

flappyjay

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How the hell do we ever catch up with liverpool and man City when we have him holding us back playing a modern style of football
Because our non ball playing midfielders are holding us back more than de Gea at playing a modern style. What's the point in having Allison if he has to pass to mctominay.
 

sullydnl

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How the hell do we ever catch up with liverpool and man City when we have him holding us back playing a modern style of football
We don't.

But then neither City nor Liverpool's rebuilds started with Ederson and Alisson coming in either. There are a lot of things holding us back atm. It's just a question of which are Year 1 or Year 2 problems.
 

Lee565

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Because our non ball playing midfielders are holding us back more than de Gea at playing a modern style. What's the point in having Allison if he has to pass to mctominay.
It shouldn't be one or the other though, upgrade both the midfield and gk and our defense will look a whole lot better of not being so exposed by these two areas.
 

Lee565

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We don't.

But then neither City nor Liverpool's rebuilds started with Ederson and Alisson coming in either. There are a lot of things holding us back atm. It's just a question of which are Year 1 or Year 2 problems.
But pep did shelve joe hart straight away in favour of a ball playing gk that helped pep lay down the foundations of how he wanted to play within his first season
 

Bebestation

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Better goalkeeper = higher line defence = a midfield that is higher up


Build a team from the back to the front, not from front to the back.
 

Lewnited

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He's just a much smaller problem than the rest of our team if I'm being totally honest.

If I'm ten Hag, I'm taking far bigger issue with things like the entirety of our back line and their refusal to push up when the team beyond them go to engage higher up the pitch. Or maybe our midfielders' and attackers' inability to drop in and create a spare man in the build up even when it's glaringly obvious we need it.

Those for me are massive issues which once addressed will go a long way towards progressing how we play. We need to bring in players that recognise these things if the current crop aren't up to it. Not to mention we're very light in midfield going in to this season. I just don't think the net benefit of replacing De Gea at this stage is big enough to think about.
 

JB7

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We don't.

But then neither City nor Liverpool's rebuilds started with Ederson and Alisson coming in either. There are a lot of things holding us back atm. It's just a question of which are Year 1 or Year 2 problems.
You say that as if Guardiola and Klopp didn't both sign new goalkeepers in their first summers at the clubs. The fact they later replaced them is irrelevant, it shows they were unhappy with the style of goalkeeper already at the club and it was a priority to immediately rectify the issue.
 

JB7

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He's just a much smaller problem than the rest of our team if I'm being totally honest.

If I'm ten Hag, I'm taking far bigger issue with things like the entirety of our back line and their refusal to push up when the team beyond them go to engage higher up the pitch.
They can't push up because the goalkeeper behind them doesn't leave his line. They had no issue playing considerably higher in front of both Henderson and Romero but you cannot push up in front of De Gea because you are constantly leaving a wide open space for attackers to freely run into. I don't really see how this is difficult to grasp.
 

flappyjay

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But pep did shelve joe hart straight away in favour of a ball playing gk that helped pep lay down the foundations of how he wanted to play within his first season
It did help that he already had technically competent players like David Silva, De Bruyne, Fernandinho in his midfield. City didn't have as many technically incompetent players as we have.
 

Lewnited

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They can't push up because the goalkeeper behind them doesn't leave his line. They had no issue playing considerably higher in front of both Henderson and Romero but you cannot push up in front of De Gea because you are constantly leaving a wide open space for attackers to freely run into. I don't really see how this is difficult to grasp.
Disagree. For me it looks like we have a bunch of defenders that have no idea when to push up, nor when to drop. Which is exactly why we get stupid goals like the opening one against Liverpool only a few weeks ago.

If at any point the coaching setup really wanted De Gea to be more proactive in his approach and adopt a starting position a few yards up the pitch you would have seen it months ago, as it's a relatively simple instruction to grasp. Instead, we've heard nothing but praise for him.

The obvious deduction from that is that he's never actually been asked to start any higher up the pitch and thus we don't know if he can do it or not. What we do know is that our defence is collectively horrible at organising themselves both on and off the ball and we have no individual quality in midfield.
 

sullydnl

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But pep did shelve joe hart straight away in favour of a ball playing gk that helped pep lay down the foundations of how he wanted to play within his first season
He did but then Pep was also taking over a team that had just finished 4th, had had his preferred DOF in place for 4 years and already contained players like KDB, Sterling, Fernandinho, Aguero, Silva, Kompany, Zabaleta, Clichy, Yaya Toure, etc.

Give him our squad instead and suddenly goalkeeper might not seem quite as pressing among his list of fires to put out.
 

JB7

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Disagree. For me it looks like we have a bunch of defenders that have no idea when to push up, nor when to drop. Which is exactly why we get stupid goals like the opening one against Liverpool only a few weeks ago.

If at any point the coaching setup really wanted De Gea to be more proactive in his approach and adopt a starting position a few yards up the pitch you would have seen it months ago, as it's a relatively simple instruction to grasp. Instead, we've heard nothing but praise for him.

The obvious deduction from that is that he's never actually been asked to start any higher up the pitch and thus we don't know if he can do it or not. What we do know is that our defence is collectively horrible at organising themselves both on and off the ball and we have no individual quality in midfield.
They are relatively poor at organising themselves, true. However in the interests of fairness most defences have a goalkeeper behind them doing a lot of the basic organising for them because he's the one who has the best view of what's happening on the pitch, whereas our defence has a mute behind them.

And we do know he can't do it. We've seen him try to do it and it goes against all his instincts, so he dithers and ends up either coming at ridiculous times or dropping back to his goal. As I said, do you think it's coincidence that the defence just happened to play comfortably higher in front of Henderson and in front of Romero over the past few seasons? Last season De Gea swept behind the defenders on average 0.35 times per game (0.22 this season), yet with the same defenders in front of him Henderson's stat was 1.12 times per game. Is it any wonder the defenders were able to play the higher line in front of him? The defenders know they cannot push up with De Gea behind them.

If you want a good laugh, Allisson has swept up behind his defenders more this season (53) than De Gea's last 5 seasons put together (51).
 

Lewnited

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They are relatively poor at organising themselves, true. However in the interests of fairness most defences have a goalkeeper behind them doing a lot of the basic organising for them because he's the one who has the best view of what's happening on the pitch, whereas our defence has a mute behind them.

And we do know he can't do it. We've seen him try to do it and it goes against all his instincts, so he dithers and ends up either coming at ridiculous times or dropping back to his goal. As I said, do you think it's coincidence that the defence just happened to play comfortably higher in front of Henderson and in front of Romero over the past few seasons? Last season De Gea swept behind the defenders on average 0.35 times per game (0.22 this season), yet with the same defenders in front of him Henderson's stat was 1.12 times per game. Is it any wonder the defenders were able to play the higher line in front of him? The defenders know they cannot push up with De Gea behind them.

If you want a good laugh, Allisson has swept up behind his defenders more this season (53) than De Gea's last 5 seasons put together (51).
To clarify, I'm not saying De Gea is a good sweeper, I'm simply saying I don't think we've seen any evidence that he's been told to even start a little higher up the pitch. With that, it remains remains to be seen whether he can be aggressive enough in his engagment once the instruction is there (though like you I think he'll be found wanting).

Regardless, I still think the enormous gap we leave inbetween defence and midfield is more indicative of the organisation of our defenders more than anything. We're not seeing defenders that constantly stay back to prevent a ball over the top. They do actually try to engage high up the pitch sometimes. They just do it at stupid times and are miles too slow to do so.

If ten Hag decides that a new keeper is a priority for him then I'm more than happy with that, I just don't see a replacement being an immediate priority for him. I will say though I don't think there's a keeper in the world that could have prevented some of the idiocy we've seen from our defenders this season.