Will Ole get another PL job after this?

[JebelSherif]

2nd last season was impressive but people would probably look at the wider picture of no title challenge or trophy if it was a big club. A struggling club would look at his role with Cardiff.

Overall I think his experience with Cardiff and the fact that he has spent nearly 500 million here would be a bit of a red flag and set alarm bells ringing. The away record here is impressive, although it's kind of offset by the home record (and Covid maybe?) and the third place finish two seasons ago was pretty fortunate considering the points tally and our absolutely abysmal start before signing Bruno.

Actually it wasn't. I read such an interesting thing on the net earlier, as is mentioned in another thread, there was this in-depth article in the Guardian today:

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...e-ball-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-baffled-spectator

But hidden amongst the readers comments, is this brilliant analysis which proves that Ole has technically over-achieved because of the strange times we have been living through. I hope 'Dubhghaill' won't mind me pasting it on to the cafe, it is worth a look - the writer doesn't really labour the point, so I will: if you are playing well 70,000 fans helps, if you are not it can add pressure and your players struggle. Man Utd. have benefitted from the empty grounds, OGS has benefitted from the empty grounds....

"In a sense, OGS has overachieved as United manager, though.

Let me explain:

Since becoming permanent Manager at Old Trafford, Ole's taken charge of 95 leagues games. He's won 46 of them (drawn 27, lost 22). That's a mediocre win record of 48%ish.

Yet he's managed to finish 3rd and 2nd in his two full seasons in charge, which is quite literally unprecedented in the 38 game Premier League era (26 seasons and counting), so Ole can rightfully claim he has managed something no other manager in all that time has...

He finished 3rd in 19-20 with 66 points. Only once (Late Evans era Liverpool, 97-98, with 65 points) has a team finished as high with so little accumulation. In fact, only four teams have finished inside the top 4 in that time with fewer points (Villa 95-96 with 63, the aforementioned Liverpool team two seasons later, Liverpool again in Houllier's last season, 03-04, with 60, and Everton the following season with 61).

He also finished second last season with 74 points. This is the fifth lowest points total to finish so high in those 26 seasons, "bettered" only by Newcastle in 96-97 (68) and Arsenal in 99-00 (73), 00-01 (70) and again in 15-16 (71). In fact, Ole managed to finish second in the league last season with a points total that is less than the median for a top 4 finish in that 26 year period (only 40 of 106 teams have finished in any of those positions with lower points totals).

All of which is a very dry and stat heavy way of saying: OGS didn't just get mediocre this last month, He has been since he took charge. He's also been very fortunate in what that mediocrity has been good enough for outsized rewards (and no little misplaced acclaim and good PR as a result)...And he's spent around €500m in that time on transfers and signing on fees alone.

Man United do spin and PR better than anyone. And that happenstance has aided Ole and his team to achieve league finishes their records don't "deserve" in a historical context, so much so that he's been not only shielded from criticism over his tactics or coaching up to now, but actively lauded as a "game changer" or "breath of fresh air" etc for United is testament to that. This week a rescue act from an aging Superstar against a team struggling domestically was being touted as a great leap forward. Today we get Ole digging up his discarded 5-3-2 and hoping it works. It doesn't.

He's just not good enough. And his team aren't much better"

 

[Irwin99]

Actually it wasn't. I read such an interesting thing on the net earlier, as is mentioned in another thread, there was this in-depth article in the Guardian today:

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...e-ball-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-baffled-spectator

But hidden amongst the readers comments, is this brilliant analysis which proves that Ole has technically over-achieved because of the strange times we have been living through. I hope 'Dubhghaill' won't mind me pasting it on to the cafe, it is worth a look - the writer doesn't really labour the point, so I will: if you are playing well 70,000 fans helps, if you are not it can add pressure and your players struggle. Man Utd. have benefitted from the empty grounds, OGS has benefitted from the empty grounds....

"In a sense, OGS has overachieved as United manager, though.

Let me explain:

Since becoming permanent Manager at Old Trafford, Ole's taken charge of 95 leagues games. He's won 46 of them (drawn 27, lost 22). That's a mediocre win record of 48%ish.

Yet he's managed to finish 3rd and 2nd in his two full seasons in charge, which is quite literally unprecedented in the 38 game Premier League era (26 seasons and counting), so Ole can rightfully claim he has managed something no other manager in all that time has...

He finished 3rd in 19-20 with 66 points. Only once (Late Evans era Liverpool, 97-98, with 65 points) has a team finished as high with so little accumulation. In fact, only four teams have finished inside the top 4 in that time with fewer points (Villa 95-96 with 63, the aforementioned Liverpool team two seasons later, Liverpool again in Houllier's last season, 03-04, with 60, and Everton the following season with 61).

He also finished second last season with 74 points. This is the fifth lowest points total to finish so high in those 26 seasons, "bettered" only by Newcastle in 96-97 (68) and Arsenal in 99-00 (73), 00-01 (70) and again in 15-16 (71). In fact, Ole managed to finish second in the league last season with a points total that is less than the median for a top 4 finish in that 26 year period (only 40 of 106 teams have finished in any of those positions with lower points totals).

All of which is a very dry and stat heavy way of saying: OGS didn't just get mediocre this last month, He has been since he took charge. He's also been very fortunate in what that mediocrity has been good enough for outsized rewards (and no little misplaced acclaim and good PR as a result)...And he's spent around €500m in that time on transfers and signing on fees alone.

Man United do spin and PR better than anyone. And that happenstance has aided Ole and his team to achieve league finishes their records don't "deserve" in a historical context, so much so that he's been not only shielded from criticism over his tactics or coaching up to now, but actively lauded as a "game changer" or "breath of fresh air" etc for United is testament to that. This week a rescue act from an aging Superstar against a team struggling domestically was being touted as a great leap forward. Today we get Ole digging up his discarded 5-3-2 and hoping it works. It doesn't.

He's just not good enough. And his team aren't much better"

Actually I have to admit I was trying to be more balanced in saying it was impressive but I agree largely with the person you quoted. I think 74 points isn''t bad but it shouldn't be seen as impressive for United and the least said about 66 points the better (Jose finished his first season in 6th place with 69 points). Also, let's be honest there's no way we finish second last season if Liverpool don't collapse with their entire centre back line being out for months. A lot of people were convincing themselves that we went through something similar in 09-10 season but that wasn't true.

It has been a very weird and strange time during our recent history and I hope we learn from it and move on.

 

[sunama]

Their owner Vincent Tan said he resisted advice to sack him after the relegation. He said that he gave him the chance to prove himself in the Championship because he believed in him, and even spent a fair bit too. They signed 10 more players that summer, to add to 7 signed in January.

But he was even worse there, and they were plummeting down the Championship also, (17th by September, 8 pts after 7 games), so he had no choice but to sack him.

Damn. Ole was terrible.
He relies on signing top calibre players to win matches off their own ability, as opposed to using tactics to win.

 

[Varane around town]

I can see Solskjaer getting a gig at say Norwhich at Southampton at some point.

I don't think he's a clown manager. I think the Solskjaer reign has 4 chapters. The caretaker, his first full season, his second full season and this season (the end) and I'd argue that 3 out of those 4 chapters are happy stories. Not perfect but good enough.

 

[Wilt]

Where ever he goes, i just hope he takes G Nev with him.

 

[Will Singh]

You wouldn’t think so and I did vote no BUT with he’s cheerleaders ie ex team mates anything is possible. You only have to look at Moyes and how he got a decent job again…!

 

[sunama]

I can see Solskjaer getting a gig at say Norwhich at Southampton at some point.

We'll have to agree to disagree.
Just as no club would be foolish enough to sign Phil Jones (except for us), no club would be foolish enough to sign the worst manager currently in the EPL (except for us).

 

[Edy2]

Not a chance.

 

[sunama]

You wouldn’t think so and I did vote no BUT with he’s cheerleaders ie ex team mates anything is possible. You only have to look at Moyes and how he got a decent job again…!

Moyes was highly regarded before he joined MUFC, because he kept Everton in the top 6 for a while.
Ole does not have that track record. Ole's track record is getting Cardiff relegated, then spending big in the Championship and falling to 17th place (I think it was), before getting fired.

 

[golden_blunder]

Their owner Vincent Tan said he resisted advice to sack him after the relegation. He said that he gave him the chance to prove himself in the Championship because he believed in him, and even spent a fair bit too. They signed 10 more players that summer, to add to 7 signed in January.

But he was even worse there, and they were plummeting down the Championship also, (17th by September, 8 pts after 7 games), so he had no choice but to sack him.

So he’s gone from chopping and changing his team to hardly any rotation. Interesting

 

[tenpoless]

Where ever he goes, i just hope he takes G Nev with him.

G Nev? no chance. When he was born he already criticized the doctor for supporting Chelsea and suggested ways to improve the club.

 

[Jackal981]

He fared better than Moyes who had no issues waltzing into jobs after United

See Moyes after United stint. He struggled to get a job and need to go somewhere as low as Sunderland. Ole will be worse. Moyes had his Everton days to show that he is not totally clueless. Same cant be said with Ole.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

I don't think he will want one. He looks utterly broken, he doesn't need the cash, especially when he gets his 7 million quid sacking bonus. This will finish him as a manager.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

Damaged goods. ‘Ole’s at the Wheel’ ringing out after every opposition goal won’t bode well with fans that have no emotional ties to him.

He might get a chance at a fallen giant in Germany but I reckon once he’s no longer under the veil of United PR he’ll be hard to employ based on his credentials.

 

[Majima]

So he’s gone from chopping and changing his team to hardly any rotation. Interesting

It's very strange. One of the single biggest frustrations I've had, is the way he plays the same team regardless of form, whilst never giving a single chance to his reserve players.

If you don't attempt to change something that's clearly not working, how can you ever expect to find any solutions? Not to mention how disastrous for team morale that policy is when you're not winning. It doesn't make any sense.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

"In a sense, OGS has overachieved as United manager, though.

Let me explain:

Since becoming permanent Manager at Old Trafford, Ole's taken charge of 95 leagues games. He's won 46 of them (drawn 27, lost 22). That's a mediocre win record of 48%ish.

Yet he's managed to finish 3rd and 2nd in his two full seasons in charge, which is quite literally unprecedented in the 38 game Premier League era (26 seasons and counting), so Ole can rightfully claim he has managed something no other manager in all that time has...

He finished 3rd in 19-20 with 66 points. Only once (Late Evans era Liverpool, 97-98, with 65 points) has a team finished as high with so little accumulation. In fact, only four teams have finished inside the top 4 in that time with fewer points (Villa 95-96 with 63, the aforementioned Liverpool team two seasons later, Liverpool again in Houllier's last season, 03-04, with 60, and Everton the following season with 61).

He also finished second last season with 74 points. This is the fifth lowest points total to finish so high in those 26 seasons, "bettered" only by Newcastle in 96-97 (68) and Arsenal in 99-00 (73), 00-01 (70) and again in 15-16 (71). In fact, Ole managed to finish second in the league last season with a points total that is less than the median for a top 4 finish in that 26 year period (only 40 of 106 teams have finished in any of those positions with lower points totals).

All of which is a very dry and stat heavy way of saying: OGS didn't just get mediocre this last month, He has been since he took charge. He's also been very fortunate in what that mediocrity has been good enough for outsized rewards (and no little misplaced acclaim and good PR as a result)...And he's spent around €500m in that time on transfers and signing on fees alone.

Man United do spin and PR better than anyone. And that happenstance has aided Ole and his team to achieve league finishes their records don't "deserve" in a historical context, so much so that he's been not only shielded from criticism over his tactics or coaching up to now, but actively lauded as a "game changer" or "breath of fresh air" etc for United is testament to that. This week a rescue act from an aging Superstar against a team struggling domestically was being touted as a great leap forward. Today we get Ole digging up his discarded 5-3-2 and hoping it works. It doesn't.

He's just not good enough. And his team aren't much better"

We’re only a matter of weeks removed from a very vocal contingent of this forum that we’re telling you how his 2nd place was ‘progress’ no matter how reasoned the discussion.

It shouldn’t have taken people this long to see the truth, that’s a brilliant post.

 

[Jackal981]

Damaged goods. ‘Ole’s at the Wheel’ ringing out after every opposition goal won’t bode well with fans that have no emotional ties to him.

He might get a chance at a fallen giant in Germany but I reckon once he’s no longer under the veil of United PR he’ll be hard to employ based on his credentials.

Let’s say, you are an owner of a mid-low table club in top 5 league. Would you agree if your CEO decides to appoint Ole as the club manager ? He got so long here simply because he is a former player with all this dna bollox

 

[JebelSherif]

At the end of the day, 99% of us on here would swap places with him in a heartbeat (even if he was just a manager, without 1999 and all that from his past). Because when he goes he will get at least £7 million as a payoff - which is basically a lotto win on a triple rollover & then he can still earn a decent wage watching footy and talking about it, on TV!

 

[Dominos]

I don't rate the work he's done here in the slightest to be honest. He's met the absolute bare minimum target of finishing top 4 to his credit, whilst failing to get out of CL groups, failing to win a trophy, failing to get the team performing to a high level, failing to get anywhere near a league title. We've sort of just limped our way through the last 3 years playing mostly terrible disjointed football, scraping enough wins to just keep us in or around top 4. All whilst spending bucket loads on players. Why any premier league team would look at that and think "that's our guy" I've no idea.

And the mediocre results he has gotten are somewhat flattering, our points totals have been poor and our rivals failings have masked that, we've overperformed xPTS which demonstrates results have been better than the performances on the pitch.

So, then you go back to what he's done outside of United. His last achievement in football was 2012 in Norway.. Disastrous spell at Cardiff.. I'm not convinced he's even a decent PL level coach, he's just a guy who got United top 4 a couple of times whilst almost getting sacked multiple times for dreadful performances.

 

[Majima]

Actually it wasn't. I read such an interesting thing on the net earlier, as is mentioned in another thread, there was this in-depth article in the Guardian today:

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...e-ball-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-baffled-spectator

But hidden amongst the readers comments, is this brilliant analysis which proves that Ole has technically over-achieved because of the strange times we have been living through. I hope 'Dubhghaill' won't mind me pasting it on to the cafe, it is worth a look - the writer doesn't really labour the point, so I will: if you are playing well 70,000 fans helps, if you are not it can add pressure and your players struggle. Man Utd. have benefitted from the empty grounds, OGS has benefitted from the empty grounds....

"In a sense, OGS has overachieved as United manager, though.

Let me explain:

Since becoming permanent Manager at Old Trafford, Ole's taken charge of 95 leagues games. He's won 46 of them (drawn 27, lost 22). That's a mediocre win record of 48%ish.

Yet he's managed to finish 3rd and 2nd in his two full seasons in charge, which is quite literally unprecedented in the 38 game Premier League era (26 seasons and counting), so Ole can rightfully claim he has managed something no other manager in all that time has...

He finished 3rd in 19-20 with 66 points. Only once (Late Evans era Liverpool, 97-98, with 65 points) has a team finished as high with so little accumulation. In fact, only four teams have finished inside the top 4 in that time with fewer points (Villa 95-96 with 63, the aforementioned Liverpool team two seasons later, Liverpool again in Houllier's last season, 03-04, with 60, and Everton the following season with 61).

He also finished second last season with 74 points. This is the fifth lowest points total to finish so high in those 26 seasons, "bettered" only by Newcastle in 96-97 (68) and Arsenal in 99-00 (73), 00-01 (70) and again in 15-16 (71). In fact, Ole managed to finish second in the league last season with a points total that is less than the median for a top 4 finish in that 26 year period (only 40 of 106 teams have finished in any of those positions with lower points totals).

All of which is a very dry and stat heavy way of saying: OGS didn't just get mediocre this last month, He has been since he took charge. He's also been very fortunate in what that mediocrity has been good enough for outsized rewards (and no little misplaced acclaim and good PR as a result)...And he's spent around €500m in that time on transfers and signing on fees alone.

Man United do spin and PR better than anyone. And that happenstance has aided Ole and his team to achieve league finishes their records don't "deserve" in a historical context, so much so that he's been not only shielded from criticism over his tactics or coaching up to now, but actively lauded as a "game changer" or "breath of fresh air" etc for United is testament to that. This week a rescue act from an aging Superstar against a team struggling domestically was being touted as a great leap forward. Today we get Ole digging up his discarded 5-3-2 and hoping it works. It doesn't.

He's just not good enough. And his team aren't much better"

Excellent post.

To also add, Jose's first season in the league here (16/17) is universally regarded as a failure right?

He finished 6th on 69 pts, which is higher than Ole managed when he came 3rd on 66 pts, which was heralded.

In fact Arsenal finished 5th on 75 pts that season (16/17), which is higher than Ole managed when he came 2nd last season (74 pts).

 

[Infra-red]

Norwegian national side and then retirement.

 

[Kostov]

Yeah he will, being a pitch man at City probably.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

Excellent post.

To also add, Jose's first season in the league here (16/17) is universally regarded as a failure right?

He finished 6th on 69 pts, which is higher than Ole managed when he came 3rd on 66 pts, which was heralded.

In fact Arsenal finished 5th on 75 pts that season, which is higher than Ole managed when he came 2nd last season (74 pts).

I felt that the Ole Inners were doing him a disservice by simply relying on league finishes as ‘progress’.

I didn’t think it would be this bad but under OgS we were never going to challenge for the league so the likelihood we were going to regress in league finish for me was very high, the whole ‘we finished 3rd then 2nd’ was a bubble that was always going to burst.

 

[Marcus]

He ia so crap Norwich wouldn't hire him.

 

[tenpoless]

If he didn't spend that much money I reckon clubs will have him as an option. But looking at the amount he spent and the results so far... surely other clubs will think twice. "If he had that much money to spend and his team looked clueless, what about ours?"

 

[tenpoless]

2nd last season was impressive but people would probably look at the wider picture of no title challenge or trophy if it was a big club. A struggling club would look at his role with Cardiff.

When you look at the points and the way we played and the over reliance on Bruno ever since he joined us, no it's not that impressive. Just like this season, when other rivals start performing we're left behind.

 

[smi11ie]

Only if the guy wearing the "Fred the Red" suit retires.

 

[Sky1981]

No team would touch him with a barge pole, even Molde would not touch him. He demands big wage yet offers little. He's no better than young inexperienced manager but with modern vision.

Relegation battler : Prefers old safe hands
Midtable : They can attract high calibre managers like Conte, Ranieri, and even if they need ex players they have many more to choose from
Top team : won't touch him with a barge pole
Any other manager : Unproven
Ole : Proven shite

 

[Sky1981]

I'm not sure, really. I think he's a decent manager. That's it - decent. He's a man who's obviously way out of his depth here, but could he do it further down the table? The thing is, how far would you have to go down the table and say "yeah, he's just as good as this guy if not better. He could get this job" I guess it's hard to judge.

I know this is often repeated, but it's true at the end of the day. We have some incredibly talented individuals who can get you out of the shit. That's not to say Ole deserves no credit for what he's done, but you have to take that into consideration. Because i don't see a manager here who's getting the absolute best out of these individuals, so when you drop down to teams who haven't got these talented individuals to depend on, and where a holistic approach is more important (i.e., playing as a unit), i don't think he has it in him.

Perhaps as a caretaker, short term type of deal where the team he's coming into is on the floor in terms of mood and confidence, maybe. But anything longer i don't see it in the Premier League.

He's nothing but decent, he's infact awful. Sure 2nd and all that, but he obtained that with 300M spending and a United Squad with things to prove. The more he meddles the worse we become.

And why? It's not like there's shortage of candidate. Managers like him are dime dozen. He's hardly SAF

 

[Sviken]

I don't think Gary would have him at Salford. He's either going back to Norway (and apparently he's not all that welcome there now since he's been shit even there) or one of the leagues outside the top 5 or 6. I don't see his kind of "football" being embraced by any club in the top leagues. You either want regressive managers that can still deliver results and play a particular system (aka Dyche or Pullis) or you want progressive managers who want to pass the ball around, dominate teams, play attractive football (like Potter or Frank). Ole is neither.

 

[Sky1981]

He'll get pundit job, out of cruelty, they love the folks to take a stab at him and become the household living joke.

 

[Rex Banner]

No chance. He's not good enough for any team with aspirations of finishing in the top half and I don't see why any club in the bottom half would want him considering his record with Cardiff.
Personally think he'd just be happy to go back to Norway after all this is over.

 

[SlothIsLove]

A chequebook manager but without trophies? I doubt that any PL clubs would want that.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

I don't think any PL club is crazy enough to appoint him except us. One can dream, I hope either City or Liverpool appoint him and it's popcorn time for us.

 

[passtheball]

Where do you stand on this?

personal opinion is that he will at some stage.
Solid win %, the 3rd top manager for getting PL points in his tenure and the away record to his name.

obviously there are things against him too

So choose your side and let’s keep this for record

With big * to both achievements.

1. He has had a very good squad throughout his tenure (Jose finished 2nd and on 81 points [something Ole has never reached] merely months before he was fired).
2. Away record was achieved in the absence of fans. Away games are tough mostly because of them.

Not to completely dismiss Ole's limited achievements, but even they come with qualifiers.

He won't get another PL job if clubs have any sense / don't suffer from United's unique romanticism and stupidity.

 

[a_devil_inside]

Not straight away but at some point can see him managing another Premier League team, maybe even start off a league lower.

 

[Judge Red]

Norwich need a new manager. Do you think they’d consider Ole? Of course not. He would be a downgrade from Farke.

 

[R'hllor]

Might be wrong but have a feeling that outside United, no owner/dof is rating him in PL.

 

[Lee565]

I would question whether he is even better than Eddie Howe who is at the bottom side

 

[Idxomer]

I would question whether he is even better than Eddie Howe who is at the bottom side

Howe is miles better.