Women/girl's Academy teams

[jojojo]

As much as I’d like to pin it all of Skinner, if any of our loanees were ready to be part of our squad, you’d think they would have attracted interest from other WSL clubs in the summer. But instead they’re all playing in WSL2. To me, that seems to indicate that the gap between academy and senior football is too big right now, and the question for the club is how to bridge that gap.

Since we’ve reformed the women’s team, the only player from our academy to get more than a handful of minutes in any significant game is Safia. I think she’s the only player from the team who won the youth double a few years ago that’s still at the club (a few are on loan). And she was heavily criticised for her performances, especially after the Wolfsburg game.

There are a couple of factors reducing the odds of an approach from a WSL1 team. One is that we don't invite it! We (along with their agents) try to put them where they're guaranteed minutes and we effectively vet the coach/environment they're going to. Clinton was different, she'd already played numerous times for Everton before coming to us. She still had to gon on loan to Bristol and Spurs and become a full England player before she played a WSL match for us

The other thing is that if you're a WSL1 team with an Academy and a transfer budget you're better off trying to invest time/effort in your own players. Or even simply waiting until they are available as free agents.

But it's our record compared to the rest of WSL that's striking. We've given approximately 40 minutes of WSL match time in the last four years to teens, that's one of the worst records in the League and a lot less than City, Arsenal and Chelsea for example.

We can complain about lack of investment but part of the sales pitch for Skinner was that he was supposed to be someone who developed talent.

 

[Maestro14]

There are a couple of factors reducing the odds of an approach from a WSL1 team. One is that we don't invite it! We (along with their agents) try to put them where they're guaranteed minutes and we effectively vet the coach/environment they're going to. Clinton was different, she'd already played numerous times for Everton before coming to us. She still had to gon on loan to Bristol and Spurs and become a full England player before she played a WSL match for us

The other thing is that if you're a WSL1 team with an Academy and a transfer budget you're better off trying to invest time/effort in your own players. Or even simply waiting until they are available as free agents.

But it's our record compared to the rest of WSL that's striking. We've given approximately 40 minutes of WSL match time in the last four years to teens, that's one of the worst records in the League and a lot less than City, Arsenal and Chelsea for example.

We can complain about lack of investment but part of the sales pitch for Skinner was that he was supposed to be someone who developed talent.

Yeah, and it's incredibly frustrating as a United fan to see a complete lack of representation from our academy in our squad. Our men's team is built on the success of our youth, and giving them opportunities. And then you look at our women's team and it's the total opposite, despite having a very successful academy at multiple levels of girls football. Sounds like that's maybe down to a lack of opportunities, but I also wonder what is being done by the club to prepare our youngsters for football at senior level. I have no idea what the solution is personally, but it seems like too big of an issue within the club to blame it all on the manager, who's main priority is getting results with a much smaller budget than the other teams we're competing against.

 

[jojojo]

I have no idea what the solution is personally, but it seems like too big of an issue within the club to blame it all on the manager, who's main priority is getting results with a much smaller budget than the other teams we're competing against.

You might be right, but my instincts say different. I think if you've got a thin squad and a small budget you have to know more about your youth players.

I've grown up on a tradition of risk taking by United men's team managers. Not all the teens had Wayne Rooney's profile or his career, some of them were more like Federico Macheda. Rashford didn't even have many reserve team matches behind him when he first played. It's not just forwards either, though of course I remember them best.

I don't blame Marc Skinner for being risk averse. I just don't think it's a desirable characteristic in a United manager, particularly in a United manager with a limited squad. Worse still, I don't think they'd get a second glance if we had a stronger squad, it wouldn't even occur to him to use them if he could avoid it.

 

[Grande]

I agree it’s not really good enough to be worst in class giving time to academy players. In a club were even managers setting numerous records for being best in class end up being criticized for being risk averse (Solskjær, Ten Hag too, tbf), it is perhaps more risky than risk averse to go down that route.

I think it’s correct that the gap is huge, and I think it’s a point that United’s squad needs a lot of margins going our way to be able to both play CL and squeeze into the top three at the same time. Skinner has improved in rotating in general, and I’m not sure everyone would agree if we lost three points because of fielding a youth with every game a must-win in terms of top three.

Still, I for one would rather risk points searching for the next Ella Toone than to risk them by letting too many players play two games a week. It’s an extra point for me as well that the ‘academy’ was in a sense here first, through the Foundation, and that part of the drive in opening the first team for women was giving them a path forward at United instead of forcing them out to City and Liverpool - as with Zelem, Toone, Ramsey etc. Man Utd Women was built on the back of the young girls in more ways than one, also because the first team who went straight up from second division had an important core of young’uns in it.

 

[Ekeke]

3 of our Academy played for the U23s

Simpson & Barry scored

Begs the question with our thin squad - should they have gone on loan?

They did both score but both were crosses. Simpson's was a freekick that bounced in a dangerous area nobody got a touch and the goalkeeper was unprepared and unable to save it. Barry's goal she made a run down the right wing and was found then tried to cross the ball and it flew into the top corner.

Simpson is doing great on loan. FotMob has her as Southampton's highest rated player this season, shes shown multiple times that shes a dangerous crosser. Shes only 20 and is getting valuable experience and hopefully next season she can be a good option to save Sandberg's legs at times, although we still have Rolfo to cover the position and if needed George although personally I dont rate her at leftback and think of her more as a CB.

Barry is a tall striker who can run but shes not starting much on loan (6 times subbed on, 1 start albeit on the right wing and 1 goal so far in the WSL. Shes had 2 starts in the cup as well without scoring) and only has a few goals in her career so far. Unfortunately she doesnt really look like shes about to become a reliable goalscorer and a good option up front. Its good that she got a start and a goal recently even if its from the right wing because if she isnt scoring enough maybe she can change positions. Her goal against Newcastle was from about 5 yards after a corner had been headed a few times and kept alive. She was on the spot to head it in. I'm not convinced shes going to be good enough to be one of our options although shes physically what you'd want from a striker, shes tall and has a bit of mobility, the goal she did score she was able to head home... Its just not happening often enough even at WSL 2 level.

And Emma Watson who is on loan at Palace and being picked in a 2 up front for them is scoring and assisting more. She got 2 in her last game for Palace in the cup and she got an assist in her last WSL 2 game before that.

 

[Rood]

They did both score but both were crosses. Simpson's was a freekick that bounced in a dangerous area nobody got a touch and the goalkeeper was unprepared and unable to save it. Barry's goal she made a run down the right wing and was found then tried to cross the ball and it flew into the top corner.

Simpson is doing great on loan. FotMob has her as Southampton's highest rated player this season, shes shown multiple times that shes a dangerous crosser. Shes only 20 and is getting valuable experience and hopefully next season she can be a good option to save Sandberg's legs at times, although we still have Rolfo to cover the position and if needed George although personally I dont rate her at leftback and think of her more as a CB.

Barry is a tall striker who can run but shes not starting much on loan (6 times subbed on, 1 start albeit on the right wing and 1 goal so far in the WSL. Shes had 2 starts in the cup as well without scoring) and only has a few goals in her career so far. Unfortunately she doesnt really look like shes about to become a reliable goalscorer and a good option up front. Its good that she got a start and a goal recently even if its from the right wing because if she isnt scoring enough maybe she can change positions. Her goal against Newcastle was from about 5 yards after a corner had been headed a few times and kept alive. She was on the spot to head it in. I'm not convinced shes going to be good enough to be one of our options although shes physically what you'd want from a striker, shes tall and has a bit of mobility, the goal she did score she was able to head home... Its just not happening often enough even at WSL 2 level.

And Emma Watson who is on loan at Palace and being picked in a 2 up front for them is scoring and assisting more. She got 2 in her last game for Palace in the cup and she got an assist in her last WSL 2 game before that.

Cheers for the updates - I suppose we are actually quite well stocked upfront as even Rachel Williams doesn't get much game time

Strength & depth in defensive areas is the main need - any details on Evie Rabjohn who also played for U23s?

I know Emma Watson was very highly rated before her serious injury - hopefully she can get back on track

 

[Ekeke]

Cheers for the updates - I suppose we are actually quite well stocked upfront as even Rachel Williams doesn't get much game time

Strength & depth in defensive areas is the main need - any details on Evie Rabjohn who also played for U23s?

I know Emma Watson was very highly rated before her serious injury - hopefully she can get back on track

Rabjohn has 3 league cup matches and 3x WSL2 matches but only 1 of them was a start where she was replaced at half time, a 30 minute sub on and a 7 min sub on. Fotmob's ratings suggest she isnt doing that well but shes still only 20. It doesnt seem like shes going to be an option in the short term

Lucy Newell is also out on loan and she has had 2x 90 min games in the cup, 1 90 min game, 1 game where she was subbed at half time and 1 sub appearance for 21 mins. Fotmob's ratings again suggest shes not doing well but shes 19 so she has a year on Rabjohn and hopefully she can push on. Again she's probably at WSL2 level for the next few years out on loan

I think for either of them to get much of a chance at CB while we have several options with George back from injury and Turner to come, they'd need to be really strong in the WSL2 and that isnt the case so far. Perhaps they could also be options at rightback - one of Rabjohn's subs she came on for the leftback so its probably an option. In that regard we have Riviere and Bizet seems to be thought of as rightback cover now and then maybe Rabjohn or Newell might be considered extra cover. Other than that it doesnt seem like they'd be playing more than cup games next season. And if we wanted more defensive options perhaps we'd sign someone.

But leftback I think we should certainly see Simpson given a chance next season when Sandberg needs a rest.