Not sure about that, he's off the back of poor year of league results with Spurs, Working along side Woodward is a much harder task than Levy who at least has some football sense. Out of the fire and into the frying pan it could be, the pressure to succeed is far greater at United than Spurs and the media attention on United is 24/7.
Would no money spent in January indicate Poch in the summer?
- Thread starter TheReligion
- Start date
It would indicated we are foched in summer.
Dunno whats worse, them not wanting to spend money because potential Poch incoming, which means we repeating same mistake, giving money to fit manager ideas instead of clubs. Or thinking that those clowns have any football related plan.
True, but it assumes that the players we (the club) identify as the right ones will actually turn out to be the right ones.
No, because if they had Poch lined up they'd also know if he approves of any of the committee targets.
Wishful thinking I'm afriad. Failing Ole falling to a 20% win-rate, we're stuck with him until xmas 2020 I reckon
Wishful thinking I'm afriad. Failing Ole falling to a 20% win-rate, we're stuck with him until xmas 2020 I reckon
As Revaulx says @Pexbo. Pretty much everyone here and around Europe thought Depay was destined for the top and "right for us", didn't Liverpool's amazing system want him? Luke Shaw was also "right for us", Bundesliga POTY Mikhi was, Schneiderlin was lauded on these boards and by pundits. I'm sure there are others too.
Safe to say, plenty of our shittest buys have been the ones who were going to be right for us.
I really hope you’re right!
No.
I've no idea if we are interested in Maddison or Grealish and to be honest it's pointless comparing their merits because we have no idea who the club view as first and second choice signings. The point is that Bruno clearly isn't and that's why we are not throwing money at him.
Right and my point is, when we've gone to so much effort to cut the fat off the squad and got ourselves into a position where we can rebuild it properly with quality signings, why the hell would we want to undo all that and settle for whatever players might be useful? It's literally the last thing I want us to do right now. I want every single player we sign to be a huge upgrade on anything we have and to be automatically first choice for the medium to long term.
We've already got squad players, they're currently playing for the first team far too often.
Which shows just how shite we are as scouts on here.
Mkhitaryan is an absolute prime example. Pumping out crazy numbers in the Bundesliga and can't replicate it in the Premier League and he's gone within 3 years. I have no doubt Bruno will be the same.
It clearly indicates that there is going to be a good harvest in 2020 and that Trump will be re-elected.
Seriously, this is no indication of Poch joining in the summer. It does however create the basis for that narrative if we find that he is manager in the summer. There will be people in this forum stating, and perhaps even the club briefing, that this was an intentional decision to save funds.
All of these ideas, rumours, etc and be written down and walked through. You can even assign probabilities to each of the possible choices/decisions along the way and come up with detailed models for how things play out. These don't factor in key unknowns: what's actually in Ed's head, what's happening in the boardroom, what our results are, what the players are actually thinking, etc.
If this is anything like a major corporation, which is what Manchester United is, since it's no longer the Manchester United Football Club we once had, then the following is happening:
The only thing that can change is perception. If Ole's results on the field start becoming connected with poor financial performance, or other negative impacts on the corporation, then it'll be time for the board to change. Fan perception of the situation is only a small part of that, and corporations have built-in systems to ignore the general public. Just look at the behaviours of other corporations and you can get an idea of how much corporations care.
I wish things were different, but I also wish that other fans had some clue about the inner workings. That's going to be the only way to make Ed uncomfortable and eventually unseat the Glazers.
Seriously, this is no indication of Poch joining in the summer. It does however create the basis for that narrative if we find that he is manager in the summer. There will be people in this forum stating, and perhaps even the club briefing, that this was an intentional decision to save funds.
All of these ideas, rumours, etc and be written down and walked through. You can even assign probabilities to each of the possible choices/decisions along the way and come up with detailed models for how things play out. These don't factor in key unknowns: what's actually in Ed's head, what's happening in the boardroom, what our results are, what the players are actually thinking, etc.
If this is anything like a major corporation, which is what Manchester United is, since it's no longer the Manchester United Football Club we once had, then the following is happening:
- The board will be reviewing multiple options. Included will be multiple versions of Ole staying in charge (versions outlined by Ole and variations based on what board members think) and there will be multiple replacement options discussed. We have to imagine that Poch is going to be option number one, but they'll have other options included for context.
- Ed and team are talking to Poch's representatives to get a feel for how a deal would go. They want to know what things he wants and what is flexible, if we somehow get better results under Ole this season then they'll also want to know if he'll start to renege.
- Multiple transfer discussions will be ongoing directly and through proxies. The people having the real discussions will maintain confidence, but other parties looking to get leverage will selectively break confidence and leak details to the press.
- Ed and Ole will have computer models showing what happens when results go certain ways, forecasts of injuries, how the return of certain players will work out, etc. These models work similarly to those used by doctors. We don't want to believe it, but these models can perform analyses which are as good as, or better than doctors. The same applies to football decisions. It's very likely that the models predict any over the odds signing being a financial loss which eats into summer budget with insignificant performance given the price. Buying Fernandes wouldn't get us more points than some other change that is possibly out-of-sight to the public being made.
The only thing that can change is perception. If Ole's results on the field start becoming connected with poor financial performance, or other negative impacts on the corporation, then it'll be time for the board to change. Fan perception of the situation is only a small part of that, and corporations have built-in systems to ignore the general public. Just look at the behaviours of other corporations and you can get an idea of how much corporations care.
I wish things were different, but I also wish that other fans had some clue about the inner workings. That's going to be the only way to make Ed uncomfortable and eventually unseat the Glazers.
This is exactly the shit that got United into trouble in the first place. Identify, recruit, and sign players based on talent according to how you're going to play football. That's not based on a manager or according to one player's strengths.
Players will come and go, as will managers. That is why you build a proper structure that is able to cope with ins and outs. It's okay when people move on, but it's not okay when you're not able to replace them adequately and it all falls to shit.
If the manager is any good, they'll be able to work with quality. United don't have any where near the quality or depth required. Complete shambles top to bottom.
Players will come and go, as will managers. That is why you build a proper structure that is able to cope with ins and outs. It's okay when people move on, but it's not okay when you're not able to replace them adequately and it all falls to shit.
If the manager is any good, they'll be able to work with quality. United don't have any where near the quality or depth required. Complete shambles top to bottom.
I think it just means as fans we are clutching at straws or any little bit of light at the end of this rather gloomy tunnel for the club, fact remains even if Poch did arrive, we still have the same average(below) squad, Moyes,LVG,Jose & then Ole, on the victims list, what makes you think Poch will fair any better.
You only need to look at the bucs, they have had similar problems as United, a mangerial revolving door, and low and behold who owns them? yes that's right the Glazers, we can change the manager a 100 times, we are still stuck with the problem, thats at boardroom level.
You only need to look at the bucs, they have had similar problems as United, a mangerial revolving door, and low and behold who owns them? yes that's right the Glazers, we can change the manager a 100 times, we are still stuck with the problem, thats at boardroom level.
I think that some fans believe, and the club certainly wants us to believe, that everything has now changed and the bad old way of doing signings is gone for good. We have been told that statistical analysis and some sort of United DNA detector are now in operation to ensure that the right players really are just that.
You took me to task the other day when I facetiously drew attention to the number of recruitment people the club employ with Head or Chief in their job title. Harry Maguire for a world record fee doesn’t give me a great deal of confidence that the new system they’re supposedly working to is all that.
Indicates a bit less than that.
Incase you've been sleeping the United forum has been completely tedious and idiotic for quite sometime. You need to get with the program.
This would cost United around £16m + whatever the costs of compensating Ole and his staff for contract termination … which would all be subtracted from your summer budget.
I've made this observation a couple of times so I agree with this narrative. And your point about a DoF is spot on. Woodward is such a frustrating cocknose.
I don't think it would be too much of an issue given the money we make. It cost you a bomb to get rid of Poch and hire Mourinho (world record compensation from what I recall).
That said I feel Poch only wants a new job in the summer.
No chance.
Signing no one in January with the squad we presently have just shows how incompetent this board is.
Signing no one in January with the squad we presently have just shows how incompetent this board is.
One word, yes. They know this year is a lost cause and are hanging onto whatever revenue they can.
They will not spend £100 million on players that a new Manager will look bat and go, nah mate not for me. At least in that they have learned.
Ole's press conference today was an embarrassment. I am sticking with what I have been doing even though it is not working.
They will not spend £100 million on players that a new Manager will look bat and go, nah mate not for me. At least in that they have learned.
Ole's press conference today was an embarrassment. I am sticking with what I have been doing even though it is not working.
Can you imagine if we started banning feckers for banging on about things til they became tedious?
Zero new threads in the United forum
I get the whole "let's wait till our dream targets are available" to an extent, but surely even Ed must realise we're a Martial injury away from a relegation battle at this point...
Depay would have been overall quite poor but scored a good (not great) number of goals for a left winger if we'd been a normal club playing 4-3-3 with decent players everywhere.
Shaw is the weird one. His body has just sort of not been right maybe, but he has the talent.
Mkhitaryan, it does seem like Dortmund tend to get a lot out of their players and maybe he lost a step of pace earlier than we thought (430 games when he joined us is a fair few for a speedy attacker) and also he had obvious confidence/settling issues and was particularly hurt by the club being a mess.
Schneiderlin you could see game 1 the other players did not trust with the ball in tight spaces and I think it's fair to say Pochettino got the best out of him.
The scouts should have known about Schneiderlin, the attackers I think would have done better if we weren't a mess overall and had a normal consistent system, and Shaw I believe has his own medical illness like Lou Gehrig did or possibly a demon type thing?
Writing off a season when the other top 4 challengers are shite makes terrible business sense. Another season out of the champions league is a disaster.
City were buying players who could perform under Pep prior to his arrival. Would there be a reason why United couldn’t do this?
For me we’re not spending money as clubs and agents are taking the pish with regard to fees.
I think it could be the case. However that's pretty stupid. We still have a chance for CL qualifications + with a squad that is so thin we're risking of playing players despite with injuries/fatigue which could translate in career threatening injuries. I believe that if Ole is doomed then the club should just tell him so. He's a legend and he deserves to make plans for his future. Meanwhile, let get the Poch deal done (even if its in the summer ) + let him and Ole coordinate with one another regarding signings. There will be players available that both managers would rate.
Yeah. People act like we can have the pick of any manager we want, but why would Poch come here if hes got other offers on the table? We are quickly becoming a graveyard for managers careers so you would have to be a masochist and/or slightly mental to chose us over pretty much anyone else
Poch who? Spice girls girl?
Poch to United is definitely not happening. At least for now. We need to create some kind of stable environment for a manager to work for a couple of years in order to show it. It's just pointless to change managers every couple of months. Y'all jump on OGS like he is on the pitch. We just don't have quality in midfield and proper wingers to compensate for the inability of our fullbacks to go forward.
Because we don't have a DoF and city have a good recruitment structure in place? The same happened when we'd decided to get rid of Jose. The purse strings closed. I believe the club is scared of signing another batch of players that the new gaffer won't fancy.
The reason we are not spending money is because under LVG and Mourinho we spent millions and got absolutely nothing in return.
The club needs a rebuild but we have to realise United can’t spend £200m every single summer, it’s just not realistic. Mourinho in particular spent way too much money and it was a disaster for the club.
Even the last two summers we spent £70m last year and £150m this years. It’s not exactly nothing. £220m spent on reinforcement but where is that value? Honestly the club needs a new strategy and start targeting cheaper options. Inter Milan have done very well in just one season by decent transfer strategy.
And now every player we targets the selling club and agents rub their hands and doubled the asking price. Woodward’s in a very difficult position to a degree because of this, though in my view they should just move on to other targets rather than focusing on 1 or 2 players. There are plenty of players out there. My gripe with the club right now is the likes of Eriksen are available and we do nothing. Won’t get Haaland because we think we are above contract clauses that means we may lose him in the future. We would be in a much better position with Haaland now if they just accepted that clause. And when he does leave buy another player. It’s not exactly difficult.
The club needs a rebuild but we have to realise United can’t spend £200m every single summer, it’s just not realistic. Mourinho in particular spent way too much money and it was a disaster for the club.
Even the last two summers we spent £70m last year and £150m this years. It’s not exactly nothing. £220m spent on reinforcement but where is that value? Honestly the club needs a new strategy and start targeting cheaper options. Inter Milan have done very well in just one season by decent transfer strategy.
And now every player we targets the selling club and agents rub their hands and doubled the asking price. Woodward’s in a very difficult position to a degree because of this, though in my view they should just move on to other targets rather than focusing on 1 or 2 players. There are plenty of players out there. My gripe with the club right now is the likes of Eriksen are available and we do nothing. Won’t get Haaland because we think we are above contract clauses that means we may lose him in the future. We would be in a much better position with Haaland now if they just accepted that clause. And when he does leave buy another player. It’s not exactly difficult.
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I think much like when we didn't back Jose, Ole not getting any money spent is a sign that he's on his way and someone, probably Poch will take over in the summer.
I could pick several players that would fit into a Poch team. Are you telling me that I’m more qualified than anyone at United to spot a player? As the bar must be very low if that’s the case.
I refuse to believe our scouts aren’t able to identify a player who’d suit a certain manager.
You buy players with a balanced set of abilities. No major weaknesses in their game. Regardless of who you bring in as a coach, they would be able to perform.
Sadly, we buy specialist, suited to one type of football, or only able to perform in specific situations.
My issue with the idea of us sticking to our summer targets, I can imagine them being unrealistic ones like Sancho, and when he doesn't come, then what? We sign no one again?
I'm just speculating but closing off the money when we've already decided it's time for a manager to go is what we've done in the past so it seems logical, given we are yet to appoint a DoF, we are doing the same again. If United aren't set on Ole past the end of the season (and there's already reports they are looking to get rid along with supposed talks with Poch) then it seems counterproductive to give him free reign to spend what he wants on his players. If the hold up on Bruno is because Joel Glazer stepped in and said we'd not pay the asking price it could well be we aren't happy to spend what we believe is over the odds on a player Ole wants.
But Bruno is also a player Poch reportedly wanted too. Which adds another layer. It's not like he'd just be an Ole player, he fits in with what Poch wants too.
Yeah this is true. Again I'm only speculating. Spurs wouldn't pay the full amount either so perhaps Poch has said if you can get him for xx amount great if not don't bother?
It just seems all a bit coincidental with what's coming out of the club at the moment. I personally, irrespective of this theory, am of the opinion Ole would go in the summer anyway. Don't think the club will want to miss out on Poch as it seems they've had their heart set on him for sometime.
Means nothing with the manager. It can mean two things that Ed fails to deliver or Ed succeeds to avoid overpaying. If we add extra 5m to the bid and Sporting still reject our offer, then I won’t call it Ed fails to deliver.
That's the problem with United. Get the players the manager wants instead of the club itself signing players because they are world class or can become world class.
Elite clubs like Madrid, Bayern and Barcelona gets the best players, the manager can try his best to get the most out of them.
Act like a proper elite club.
Elite clubs like Madrid, Bayern and Barcelona gets the best players, the manager can try his best to get the most out of them.
Act like a proper elite club.