Exactly!
..."First is First, second is nowhere!"... as Bill Shankly is quoted by his biographer
Would you be happy with finishing 3rd this season but with more points than last season?
- Thread starter horsechoker
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..."First is First, second is nowhere!"... as Bill Shankly is quoted by his biographer
That's the opposite of "everything is relative".
1st would be great and always the target but 3rd with more points than last season would be progress and as long as Ole was subsequently backed to fine tune the squad then it would be satisfactory
We don't have a world class squad until we win something.
This is the season.
This is the season.
Just to be clear, 77 points = strong season, but 76 points = bottled it?
Sure. But the reason we can is that other top teams are underperforming. So far. We are not yet at a point where we can expect title challenges even if they don't. That's all. But perhaps that was what you meant? I understood you to mean that a title challenge is what we could expect this season generally speaking, not just because the situation is how it happens to be right now. Apologies if I misunderstood you.
Really depends on who are 1 and 2.
If it's City and Pool and we're pretty close, then that's a decent season.
If it's City (way ahead) and Leicester, then it will feel very different, I think.
If it's City and Pool and we're pretty close, then that's a decent season.
If it's City (way ahead) and Leicester, then it will feel very different, I think.
I never expected us to be first in January at the start of the season. Will I be pleased if we finish third? That depends on the season. If we manage to put some wins together and create a bigger gap between 1st and 2nd, and then in March we collapse and drop a ridiculous amount points and finish third? No then I won’t be pleased.
But if City and Liverpool start dominating like they have for the past 3 years, and United is tagging along at the summit but falls behind due to injuries and unlucky games, then it would be a lot more acceptable to finish 3rd in my book.
But if City and Liverpool start dominating like they have for the past 3 years, and United is tagging along at the summit but falls behind due to injuries and unlucky games, then it would be a lot more acceptable to finish 3rd in my book.
Why?
If that happens, it means City and Leicester have done really well, and Liverpool not. What's that got to do with us?OK if you say so, I thought you were saying "everything is relative" i.e. to being No1.That's the opposite of "everything is relative".
As Bill Shankly did.. isn't that why we have runners-up and league placings? "The final table doesn't lie" etc.
Clearly a case of misunderstanding, my apologies.Yeah, a finish north of 75 points would be nice even if it gets us nothing more than CL qualification. If i'm doing the maths properly, it will mean that we will have maintained our current form (12/19 wins in the first half of the season, should all go well tonight) and maybe slightly improved on it. This, subsequently, will be a very good indication that we are close to achieving the much desired consistency in our performances and will set us up nicely for the big push next season (God and Woodward willing...).
I'm closer to eating a humble pie on ole.
After this i think he's save regardless of what happens.
Looking for recipes. Would like to make it grand
After this i think he's save regardless of what happens.
Looking for recipes. Would like to make it grand
Yes, that was what I kinda meant. No worries, I could have spent more effort to explain myself .
I'd like to hope at 5pm on the 1st May we've just beaten or drawn with Liverpool to clinch our 21st Title
We have all to play for, most teams are suffering with injuries & Covid, atm we're Ok, lets power on through and Do It
We have all to play for, most teams are suffering with injuries & Covid, atm we're Ok, lets power on through and Do It
Definitely Maybe
No I want us to win the league and we dont win due to lack of transfer activity this window, I will be absolutely fuming
Because our squad is better than Leicester, but not City or Pool probably.Why?
I'd be happy enough with second or third as long as we finish within 8 points of the winner or thereabouts. We must see visible evidence that the gap between us & City/Liverpool has decreased, and we can achieve that by staying within touching distance of both clubs, especially City who look well up for it this year.
we only have one game against City in the league, we don't play them every week - so look after every other game we play and don't drop stupid points, lets
hope they get bogged down in the CL and stutter in the league dropping points allowing us to march on
hope they get bogged down in the CL and stutter in the league dropping points allowing us to march on
More pts needed, 2nd would be good. But we should give it a try to this damn title at this point.
To answer the OP's question NO
bottom line is if we're good enough we'll be Cham21ons, our fate is in our own hands...don't give away silly points
More so this year as we have some real belief back, aggression and a half decent fit squad
So long as we don't let the Covid situation effect us too much we can do it
Finishing anywhere less than top is losing
bottom line is if we're good enough we'll be Cham21ons, our fate is in our own hands...don't give away silly points
More so this year as we have some real belief back, aggression and a half decent fit squad
So long as we don't let the Covid situation effect us too much we can do it
Finishing anywhere less than top is losing
Pogba agent is pushing for a move so he move unless you want him to leave on free transfer. I think Martial is replacement and so is Fred.
Its means we have not progressed given LCFC were dirt after the restart and limped home to fifth and having spent less than us and losing two of their back 4 over the course of this and last season, where we have depending on who you ask, improved ours at their expense in the shape of Arry and to the tune of 230 plus million over that time, where as they have invested just 66-70 million.Why?
Pogba might be replaceable but he's still amongst our best players as are Fred and Martial. Would be mad to weaken that much for no reason.
I think humble pie eating is a very long way off for even the most ardently against Ole. With the table as it is a couple of defeats could mean the difference between sitting first and sixth. There's a long way to go yet, some people are acting like top four is all but guaranteed. Also a very tough ask to get through in the FA cup and putting a run together in Europa will be really hard without compromising league form.
No. Obviously.
75+ points = The minimum we should be aiming for right now. It'd be pointless trying to categorise exactly what would be good and what would be shit without actually seeing the final table.
Not happy per-se, but acceptable and can even be viewed as progress. For me, we need an 80+ pt season from Ole or I'd be in favor of getting another manager in. I feel he's been given sufficient time + backing to achieve that much.
If we do get 80+ pts and stay in the title race, I'll be optimistic about going for the title next year, esp. if we sign a proper RW and replace Pogba adequately.
If we do get 80+ pts and stay in the title race, I'll be optimistic about going for the title next year, esp. if we sign a proper RW and replace Pogba adequately.
Realistically I would be happy with top 3. Not so much having more points but I’d prefer to have it guaranteed before the final day. We’ve been so up and down post SAF that to have two consecutive champions league qualifications would be sending a good message to potential signings that we’re solid and we’ve a base to improve on.
Not a single team is on track to do 80 points this season... halfway done and all teams are under 40 points. I see no reason why he should be sacked for having under 80 points if no one else has more than 80 points. If it comes to the end of the season and the top 3 teams all go on big win steaks and get 80+ points while we're sitting between 60-75, then it's different though
Put it this way, if we were to finish this season on 70 points, that will be 33 taken from the next 20 matches. That will mean something like a w-d-l record of 10-3-7 or 9-6-5. Or in other words our win% will have to be 50% or less, i.e. we'll have gone through yet another period of bottling it. It would not be good enough, regardless of it being good enough for top four.
The only way that sort of tally would be worthy of keeping Ole in the job is if we also won a cup.
The only way that sort of tally would be worthy of keeping Ole in the job is if we also won a cup.
No I’m never happy not finishing 1st - realistically 3rd would be a good season as i feel that we are still way behind city in quality.
Early days, so far so good but we can improve. Right wing is screaming for a signing.
Early days, so far so good but we can improve. Right wing is screaming for a signing.
Getting more points would be a marignal upgrade from last season given Manchester United is not challenging for title but for a top 4 position only. In the big scheme of things I'd say the team has been regressing since last season, stagnating at best, but it has also benefitted from the pandemic so this season they really need to make significant improvements if you want to challenge for the title soon.
We won't win the league so yes I will be happy with third, hopefully then we sign some real quality unlike last summer and properly challenge next season.
Yeah that's fair, if noone really hits it, I don't think sticking to an absolute points value makes sense. Maybe it should instead be a delta of <6-8 pts away from the champions and comfortably 3rd. That hasn't happened since Fergie left, so that'll be a good indicator as well.
Nail on the head. Begining of the season I wanted 3rd again with a higher points total to be closer to the top. This season has already blew my expectation out the water. I expected to be battling Chelsea, Spurs and Leicester again for top 4 at this point.
??? We're right up there as of now at the very least. Win today and we'll be top.
Again why do you think this? We've been scoring more, getting more points, been much more consistent this season.
Yeah, it looks good now and if you keep up with this it's going to definitely be a progress, but someone was suggesting finishing 3rd with 70 something points. In that scenario I'd say the progress would be marginal but that isn't the case yet so let's hope the team can keep up until the end.
Think many fans are just coming to some dreadful conclusions with their expectations. I've no idea how hardly anyone has mentioned the UCL. The moment we were knocked out the pressure was on for our league form to improve because it's less travelling for the squad placing more directive on domestic competitions. We need either a title charge with a cup or 1st position.
Top four certainly wouldn't be enough to veto Solskjaer but then it will raise questions such as what is the club's directive with him as the manager. Because there's one trajectory with no ambition and it's something similar in the direction that Arsenal have all to well defined, competitive enough to appease the owners financially, however not good enough to have any immediate feasible achievement.
Top four certainly wouldn't be enough to veto Solskjaer but then it will raise questions such as what is the club's directive with him as the manager. Because there's one trajectory with no ambition and it's something similar in the direction that Arsenal have all to well defined, competitive enough to appease the owners financially, however not good enough to have any immediate feasible achievement.
I think we’ve got as good a chance as any to win it, so I don’t think 3rd would make me happy at this stage.
The way I see it, we got to top spot halfway through the season, but there is still a lot of room within the squad to take steps further. We managed to top the league without Martial and Greenwood really joining the party in terms of goals yet. You have to assume that they will also turn up at some point, and that would make us a different animal. Ultimately, there is plenty of potential left in the squad and it isn’t playing to capacity. If we click into gear we should be bang in it.
The way I see it, we got to top spot halfway through the season, but there is still a lot of room within the squad to take steps further. We managed to top the league without Martial and Greenwood really joining the party in terms of goals yet. You have to assume that they will also turn up at some point, and that would make us a different animal. Ultimately, there is plenty of potential left in the squad and it isn’t playing to capacity. If we click into gear we should be bang in it.
Always been a fan of "Be Here Now" personaly
In answer to the OP - yes, definitely.