Sad you think that's a bad thing
Would you be okay with state or state-backed ownership?
- Thread starter sullydnl
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Sad you think that's a bad thing
Sport is literally about winning.
There is not a single sport where the aim is to finish 4th. Not one.
So, yes, we want our club to win trophies and beat every team in the country and Europe.
That's a sad way to view sport. It's a professional athletes goal for sure, but surely fans can just support their team and hope for a good game. The two Champions League group games against Barca in 99 that finished 3-3 were fantastic and there was no winner in either game.
I'd say some of the biggest things football is lacking right now is sportsmanship, fair play and freedom/imagination and pumping even more money into the game isn't going to solve those problems.
The problem is that people use sports clubs or sporting icons/athletes to 'represent' them. To idolise them is to associate yourself with their stardust, popularity, 'winning' or success -- or moral compass in this case. They are your external identifiers.
If you recognise this then you dont take it as seriously or personally as you should. Or in this case some moral compass representation of yourself. To ignore or deny this is just delusional behaviour.
It's a sport -- and really a business nowadays. Nothing more, nothing less. It changed when it became big bucks and when the PL was formed.
Everything else is just your own personal interpretation/representation or fantasy of it.
Personally state ownership doesn't bother me because it wasn't stopped in 2008,therefore I haven't any issue with us being run in that way
Just a reminder that there is no state or sovereign wealth fund bidding to buy Manchester United
I really want Sheikh Jassim to win this bid. Since he's entered into the process, I've wanted him to win.
Having said all that, even I know it will be state backed.
A position that someone can disagree with yet still respect. Refreshing in the current climate and I applaud your honesty.
You might assume it is and it's certainly possible, but no one knows it for sure
Everybody looks the other way for City and acts like they are doing what they are doing on equal footing with everyone else. Everyone looked the other way for PSG. Everyone looked the other way for Chelsea. Everyone is looking the other way for Newcastle. They're even overjoyed for Newcastle. Everyone likes to act like they truly care about justice and rights but when the competition gets going the football media and fans have shown that they truly do not give a toss and if that is the case then we need to get ourselves some deep pockets or we will be left in the dust and nobody will care whether we are ethical or not.
That link is more apt for those who think it's definitely a state bid even though there is no proof of this
Would so fans want it yes ?
Will it happen , No ?
The Glazers just want some form of revenge and stitching us up with SJR and Two Goblins for another decade is their way of saying F…..You United, we’ve done it for nearly two decades let’s make it three!
Will it happen , No ?
The Glazers just want some form of revenge and stitching us up with SJR and Two Goblins for another decade is their way of saying F…..You United, we’ve done it for nearly two decades let’s make it three!
If he is state-back then why all the stress over Ratcliffe bring back the G-Bros? Surely a state-backed bid wont lose?
Personally, I think he is a hybrid model of various consortium investors plus some state. Otherwise, 'they' wouldn't have let the bidding process get this far. He has some business model/case in his pitch.
Thanks.
But if anyone knows the ins and outs of a country like Qatar, we all know nothing will be purchased without the states blessing...especially at the figures of £5bn+.
There will be many faces to the Nine-Two Foundation. However, money will come from the state.
I'm comfortable with this. We know it happens elsewhere. However, we just need not cheat.
I'm a 100% ok with Qatar owning us...I wish it would just hurry up!
I don't understand how that works. Both the owners and players are intractably linked to the club. Systematic abuses of thousands of people on a national scale is easy to forget about because they aren't in a pair of shorts kicking the ball around?
My poor suffer soul. I empathised!
When united was owned by the butchers (I am a vegetarian) I hated united, the players and the manager! I wasn't happy either when the coolmore mafia owned united either -- all that inhumane flogging of their horses during training and races.
The glazers were the most vegetarian friendly/animal humane of the lot. So yay to the glazers!
Err.. righto.
Post the PSG owner’s links and statements, there’s no deniability of Jassim’s bid being a state-backed one. Without doing whataboutery with Ratcliffe or Glazers, are most of you okay with a) Having our name popped up every time Qatar does something shady and b) Literally being in the same boat with City and Newcastle.
We basically lose any ground on being able to question City, Chelsea or Newcastle on being oil, artificial or plastic clubs. Just because we want an owner who will spend like Fifa’s Career Mode.
It’s blowing my mind how fans are okay with this.
We basically lose any ground on being able to question City, Chelsea or Newcastle on being oil, artificial or plastic clubs. Just because we want an owner who will spend like Fifa’s Career Mode.
It’s blowing my mind how fans are okay with this.
The difference is we wouldn’t need to financially cheat to do well like City have, we have enough revenue coming in from legitimate sources. Not having to pay huge interest payments and dividends would be good. Where new investment would be valuable is in modernising Old Trafford and Carrington.
The main problem is if United become state owned it will somehow be worse than City or Newcastle doing the same.
Wouldn‘t need to cook books to be successful but you can be sure that all other fans would be calling us cheats.
Its bad enough as it is with Scousers still claiming Howard Webb runs the whole league for the benefit of United
They'll justify it by saying we're just spending the money we should have been able to all along.
City's win felt so hollow last night and I know deep down I'd feel the same way about United's success if we went about winning it in the same way.
If United get like a Saudi buy out, anyone still on board will have to either accept city's treble as legit or not celebrate United's own achievements post takeover...
What a dilemma
What a dilemma
It's not comparable at all mate, we wouldn't have to cheat by cooking the books and faking sponsors.If United get like a Saudi buy out, anyone still on board will have to either accept city's treble as legit or not celebrate United's own achievements post takeover...
What a dilemma
All we want is owners that invest all the money we make back into the club and employ the right people to run it. The issue is the Glazers have saddled the club which such an astronomical debt that only a sugar daddy type of owner can really do this.
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The idea that a football team should be owned by any national government is wrong in principle and far too open to corruption. In the case of the oil-state owners, extended ruling families divert national wealth into sports-washing projects without the consent of their citizens, while in most cases those citizens are denied basic civic rights in a way that we would never accept. Some fans are prepared to turn a blind eye to that on the basis that it's OK so long as it's legal under our own laws, and it would put their club at a disadvantage if other clubs are doing it.
If we had decent regulation of the game by the governing bodies it wouldn't be allowed, but those bodies are themselves as corrupt as the states concerned, and money talks.
I hope Utd don't go down this route.
If we had decent regulation of the game by the governing bodies it wouldn't be allowed, but those bodies are themselves as corrupt as the states concerned, and money talks.
I hope Utd don't go down this route.
We don’t need to cook the books, we make more than enough as a global brand to put that money back into the club. Ed Woodward was right when he said we don’t need to be successful on the pitch to be successful off it. That money can be invested by employing the right people to invest it for us which we have been lacking for many a year. City had to spend cause they’re not a global brand and a long way off it but they employ the right people to do it.If United get like a Saudi buy out, anyone still on board will have to either accept city's treble as legit or not celebrate United's own achievements post takeover...
What a dilemma
If you think we’re getting bought by a state own fund and unlike any other team owned by a gulf state we would be the first one to be crystal clear on our sponsorship deals, first one not to cook the books and the only one not to become hollow following the blood money takeover, I admire your optimism, but also find it delusional. You’ve seen it with your own eyes, how does the oil money success taste. How can you even wish this upon your own club.
With the way things are at the moment .. city are going to overtake us, it’s only a matter of time. They’re fast catching us up and they could continue to dominate for years to come. Throw Newcastle into the mix and suddenly you just want whoever is going to bring structure and invest the best in Manchester United. It’s about protecting our history as much as it is winning in the here and now. We are also different because we do have such a rich history, we’re not Wigan that won the lottery ticket or a team that almost got relegated last season. We are already massive so we’re not buying trophies, we’re simply bringing ourselves back in line with where we SHOULD be. If glazers were great owners, this wouldn’t be happening as we were so far ahead in the first place. City should have never of been allowed to overtake us the way they have on all fronts. But atleast they’re not from Qatar, right?
I can't stress enough how little this matters to me in the year 2023 and beyond. Truly there are few things I can say bother me less than not being able to question city or chelsea
And how about the other points in my post? None of those bother you?
I'm not going to suddenly become a fan of Qatar or try to justify what happens there if they take us over. I have explained this before. I can isolate the football stuff to the football and leave it at that. If our name gets mentioned when something dodgy happens from them...oh well? Doesn't bother me. That's an issue for the governments of the world to sort out.
My scope when it comes to being a United fan has narrowed to just enjoying the football that I see out on the field from us.
I'm not just talking about the cheating. Before any of that was bought up, people were saying none of their success means anything because they just bought the trophies with their two squads and also all the blood money stuff.
If United follow suit then it's the same thing.
I don't mind city winning and United not as long as United don't sell out to blood money etc.
This basically.
Some things are bigger than football and trophies.
I suppose that’s the most common approach from the City fans when they hear about the 100+ charges, under the table payments and so on. Whatever the accusations or despite the proofs, you can always just focus only on the football on the pitch.
If anything, city's win last night makes me despise sportswashing even more. I am happy for the club to not win anything rather than join the club. Our history will become smeared with shit if we joined the club and a few trophies won't take it away.
Yes indeed. I am perfectly happy and content to focus on the stuff on the pitch.
Objection to the morality of the owners is valid, but when it comes to the cheating aspect this is factually incorrect way of understanding the situation then.
No, let’s sit still for another 10 years.
Let City win another Treble or 3.
Let City win another Treble or 3.