You are speaking sense mate. This period reminds me of when people on this forum told me mourinho played incredibly attacking football and that lvgs Holland team were thrilling.
Would you give the job to Allegri right now?
- Thread starter Nikelesh Reddy
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Well I would hope that isn't the only criteria when picking our next coach. "Must do better than the last guy". Hopefully we'll also look at stuff like:
- Does he even speak English?
- Does his preferred style of play match the club's? (Attacking football)
- Cv
- Ambition
Well then that rules out Allegri and rightly so
I’m sorry. Which bit rules him out?
Now that's just pure speculation. We don't know what Allegri might bring to the table just yet. What we do know, however, is that Ole is out of his depth and we have seen close to zero improvement in our play,and that Allegri has loads more experience and pedigree at the highest level of football, trophy-wise and managing star players. Worth a shot as a replacement manager, don't you think?
That's your opinion mate. Don't be trying to shove it down other peoples throat. I love this club and It's not proved yet FOR ME that Ole is the wrong man for the job. He needs a chance, we are REBUILDING.ffs
Pure speculation? Have you watched any Allegri team play? He's not exactly known for entertaining football. Literally the only thing he has going for him is experience. Appointing him would be embarrassingly shortsighted.
- Most European can speak/understand English, it's not like He's Japanese
- His tactical ability is one of his strengths, so maybe?
- His CV is better than our current manager
- He doesn't seem like the type who will only collect paychecks after paychecks
He's literally said he speaks English poorly only a week ago. Your other points are hardly exclusive to Allegri.
Allegri is 5 and a half years older than Ole. Hardly a dinosaur.
Any manager can learn English. It's not a sophisticated language to learn, Conte and Sarri had no problem with that and Allegri pretty much checks every other criteria you mentioned bar the offensive style which I don't have any problem with.
And Allegri is far from being a dinosaur.
It's not just about his age. His style of play and tactics are old school
He admits his English isn't good enough. His football is horrible to watch .His CV is winning a one team league with a side mostly built by Conte and he wants to join a team in the bottom half with a history for handing out huge contracts to Managers
He has a lot of recent success with those old school tactics though.
It would be clear improvement on what tactics and coaching we currently have in the club.
I know that it's Italy but his teams, including Milan have averaged more than 70 goals per season and usually 40+ GD, with CL success on top of it.
He sets up defensively in CL that's true, but his teams are well organized and proven to be successful.
Is he the right type we should be looking at? I'm not sure.
Is he the type to stabilize the club - maybe so. Would certainly be an improvement.
Also you have to ask yourself - do we have the resources to try and play like Klopp/Pep or the high press style that seems to be everyone's cup of tea at the moment or we should play to our strengths which at the moments are counter attacking football with a solid defensive base.
So he’s learning English. His football isn’t amazing but currently better than the football we watch. His CV is winning the Italian league with 2 different club sides.
So what top class manager do we get if we don’t offer him good wages to take up the challenge? More Solskjaer level managers?
I hope not I am tired of these defensive managers. Even Juventus fans were fed up with his style by the time he left as would still do the same against the cannon fodder. We really should have went for Howe. He isn't the best in the business but we would be playing good football and probably be somewhere in the top six.
I still think Ten Hag is the best choice if Ole goes.
Ten Hag, Nagelsmann, Rose - all very progressive and up and coming managers that we should look at as long term option.
it's a reply to your bullet points and you said it yourself that "Hopefully we'll also look at stuff like..." which I assumed you wanted to apply those criteria to every candidates. So of course They aren't exclusive. Which means those criteria are nothing special, They're general. But even if you apply those to Allegri, He's still better than Ole. That is unless We take into consideration the rebuilding process We've been in since Ole took over - mainly transfer strategy and players preference. The last thing you want is a new manager to come in and sell four players again.Almost every manager can speak english, They of course have ambition, Most have better CVs than Ole. What's your point exactly?
You lot are generally right with not wanting Allegri in that Utd needs a coach more than a men manager these days.
Out of those 3, Rose would be my choice. Spelling the other two would become old very fast.
It's not an opinion that you're clutching at examples from 14 years ago. That's literally what you're doing, typing in capitals doesn't change that.
Pogba
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Hes basically Mourinho but less of a dick head. Appointing someone to play that sort of football is the wrong choice.
And him winning Italian cups and the league over there is like a Bayern or PSG manager doing it. It's not really all that impressive because it's the bare minimum for any manager to do it because of the massive discrepancy between them and the rest.
After ploving through loads of different managers with different styles. Why not stick to one and actually build a team instead of changing manager all the time and players.
Allergri won with Juventus in Italy, feck even Michael Owen would win as a manager there.
Allergri won with Juventus in Italy, feck even Michael Owen would win as a manager there.
By Examples you mean bringing in Evra and Vidic in January 14 years ago. Don't be so stupid man, There is players out there if we really want to pay the money. I'm not clutching at anything. Grow a pair will you.
It's a reply, but in response to playing style you come up with tactical ability which are two very different things. You also keep saying "better than Ole" while that has nothing to do with it. You say most managers (but not Allegri) can speak English at the required level. Correct. Many have better Cv's than Ole. Also true. You're making my point for me, which is that there are a lot of other managers out there who are a better fit than Allegri. They check all the boxes instead of most. I hope we don't make the mistake of just hiring the guy with the biggest prize closet again.
Almost every manager can speak english, They of course have ambition, Most have better CVs than Ole. What's your point exactly?
In a way he was successful. Depends on your perspective. At Milan he started off well and things gradually got worse. At Juve he did the bare minimum of what was expected of him. He won the league every season in a 1 team league. Internationally he was tasked with delivering the CL but he never delivered. Not even close.
He has a lot of recent success with those old school tactics though.
It would be clear improvement on what tactics and coaching we currently have in the club.
I know that it's Italy but his teams, including Milan have averaged more than 70 goals per season and usually 40+ GD, with CL success on top of it.
He sets up defensively in CL that's true, but his teams are well organized and proven to be successful.
Is he the right type we should be looking at? I'm not sure.
Is he the type to stabilize the club - maybe so. Would certainly be an improvement.
Also you have to ask yourself - do we have the resources to try and play like Klopp/Pep or the high press style that seems to be everyone's cup of tea at the moment or we should play to our strengths which at the moments are counter attacking football with a solid defensive base.
As I've been saying, Allegri may well be an improvement (at least tactically) but there's a lot of coaches out there who would be a better fit.
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Would Michael Owen take them to two CL finals too? Why didn't Conte do it before Allegri took over from him? How many chances are there for Juventus to even consider looking towards Solskjaer's direction for their future manager? Even with the Serie A in their pocket as you claim.
Nevermind the fact that for three consecutive seasons between 2016 and 2018 Napoli and Roma pushed the title challenge to over 90 points. Nevermind that in his four first seasons Juventus did the double. Nevermind that he's actually a manager who has worked his way up from Italy's third division instead of having good jobs landing in his lap because of his ex-club legend status.
I don't mind people thinking he's the wrong fit for United. Personally, if Poch leaves Spurs next May, i'm more than willing to wait for him. I don't have any issues with the fans who believe that Solskjaer will come good in the foreseeable future either. But this belittlement of other people's achievements to big up our manager isn't just absurd. It's damn pathetic. Just say you don't want him at United and that you'd prefer to watch us, even in our current predicament, because you believe in Ole and Ed's grand masterplan for the future and be done with it.
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Hardly a first choice for me I'd take Naglesmann / Poch primarily but it's without doubt he would make better use of this team than anything under Solskjaer. I don't think people really acknowledge how horrid of a manager Ole is, 90% of the managers in the premier league would be an improvement over our current coaching staff / management.
Allegri to his credit has also nurtured some talent Dybala / Pogba (at the time) young unproven talented players during his tenure who turned into world class performers. He provided a slight foundation for Bentacur / Moise Kean perhaps not playing the latter enough in his last season. How much would the likes of Rashford, Martial, Greenwood, Gomes and Garner benefit if they were coached by a reputable manager.
Allegri to his credit has also nurtured some talent Dybala / Pogba (at the time) young unproven talented players during his tenure who turned into world class performers. He provided a slight foundation for Bentacur / Moise Kean perhaps not playing the latter enough in his last season. How much would the likes of Rashford, Martial, Greenwood, Gomes and Garner benefit if they were coached by a reputable manager.
Yes i do not want Allegri as our manager. I do not like his style.We could just as well have kept LVG then. So since i do not like Allegri`s style i am happy with the way we play now?
The state of the squad is because of the GLazer`s and Ed not having a clue about football.
You wrote about sticking with the manager we have. What makes you think Solskjaer will suddenly change his tune when Ed's incompetence strikes again next summer? The way i see it, we'll sell Pogba for nearly 100 million pounds, we'll sign someone like Longstaff and then spend all summer trying to get Sancho and ultimately failing. And then Solskjaer will put on his smiley face and say that he's happy with the squad because he won't want to lose his dream job. Is this the way forward? Why not give another proven manager (not necessarily Allegri) the chance to bring in his own players?Yes i do not want Allegri as our manager. I do not like his style.We could just as well have kept LVG then. So since i do not like Allegri`s style i am happy with the way we play now?
The state of the squad is because of the GLazer`s and Ed not having a clue about football.
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His English isn't bad to normal standards, especially since these interviews are fairly old and we can assume that he had improved his English since then.
However I understand why he thinks his English isn't good enough. Allegri loves having a good relationship with his players. He builds his tactics bottom up, so he needs to be able to communicate with his players.
Conte didn't built Juventus team, Paratici and Marotta did. Conte simply criticised that team with his "you can't eat at a restaurant of 100 euros with 10 euros jab" following a series of early CL exits from Juventus. Allegri took that same team and came a game away from winning the treble.
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Two finals is not even close?
Yes, he is italian and his teams usually played from the back, but we need some structure and we need it right now. With Olé we have nothing to build on - its mostly chaos with some nice football actions but thats not enough and never will be. Maybe if our players would be on level with Man City guys, it might work in some way, but not with those players like Lingard, Fred, Mctominay and co.
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Is it Solskjaer`s fault that the squad is mismanaged the last 7 years? He bought 3 good players wich improved us, but the squad needs more. Glazer`s have not spend enough and Matt Judge and Ed Woodward uses 6 months to negotiate one deal for a player.
Solskjaer and Phelan have a plan to buy players they want whgo fit the style of play, not panic buy like many other years. And look how those buys turned out.
Im so fecking sick of people blaming the manager when we clearly have bigger issues like the owners and Ed/Matt Judge who are bleeding the club dry. We still have debt! Old Trafford stadium is falling apart! We do not have a DoF! because of the Glazers and all you think is "Lets get another manager".
Things gradually got worse because Milan were losing key players every years without replacing them.
It's Solskjaer's fault that his team is currently in 14th place with 2 wins after 10 league games. This is a new low for United no matter how you want to spin it. Even his most ardent supporters were talking about a minimum of a top-six finish after a good pre-season in the summer. No one predicted that we would be in the state we find ourselves now but somehow the people who want him to stay try to convince everybody else that there is nothing to worry about and that we're a few signings and a couple of seasons away from challenging for the big prizes.
Of course, people will blame the manager, any manager, who has failed to come up with a plan to win matches when United are expected to enjoy the lion's share of possession and open up low-block, compact defences. They complained when Moyes couldn't do it, when LvG had his players exchanging short passes in our own half and when Mourinho was finishing 20 points behind City while getting humiliated by Sevilla too. Why should they not complain when Solskjaer is failing for nearly a year in the same manner?
So, you're saying that we shouldn't be looking into another manager because the stadium needs refurbishing? That's a new one as far as excuses come.
I spelled it out to you several times that the squad is fecked because of bad and under investing from the Glazer`s. What manager in the world could win anything with this unbalanced squad.Huge holes in the squad but hey a new manager will make those holes disappear!
Lets agree to disagree. You just ignore what i am saying anyway.
Yes, Allegri will come in and fill all the holes straight away, forget that Woodward is still doing the deals.
2 midfielders, LB, RW, CF, all in 1 window.
2 midfielders, LB, RW, CF, all in 1 window.
I'm not ignoring what you have to say and i'm not suggesting that any other manager would have us challenging with this squad. But yes, i believe that Allegri wouldn't have this squad just above the relegation zone. It's idiotic to even consider that when managers with much less expensive squads, much less talented squads, managers who can't afford to splash 80 million quid on a single centre-half can produce better performances and better results than Solskjaer. Their teams are currently sitting above us on the PL table.
The other thing you're not getting is that by protecting Solskjaer at all costs you're actually supporting Woodward's vision and his most crucial decision as CEO which is to keep Ole no matter how low we slide on the PL table. But that's a discussion for another thread.
We have already derailed this thread which is about Allegri. I'll admit that my initial post came out as a bit of a rant because it was the result of reading cumulative posts waving away what Allegri has achieved throughout his career. I shouldn't have quoted only you and if what i wrote seemed a bit aggressive, then i apologize. Back to my point, i wish people would just say that they're happy with Ole in charge and that persisting with one of our own and the United way will pay its dividends in the end. I don't agree with it but i respect it as an opinion and i will be more than happy to be proven wrong. But writing off four doubles, six Serie A titles and two CL finals while our manager has a fisherman's league and a qualification from a Europa league group to show for is a bit too much.