Yes in part agree, the last 2 games showing the fight and desire is great and what is needed but the performance against Sheffield for example was unacceptable.It's the manner of how we get there. If we plod along and get beaten by teams that we should be beating -- then there has to be serious questions asked. I don't think there is a United fan out there who'd bemoan us finishing 5th, 6th if it was a close race and we played well. What we've seen at Bournemouth, Newcastle, Sheffield, Villa at home, Palace at home, Rochdale, should not be tolerated.
Do I have to @ReddBalls? I mean even if you want to ignore past pedigree and just go off stats alone, in Klopp’s first full season at Liverpool he was 2nd at this stage after 16 matches with 34 points.Could you please elaborate?
He still ended up 4th. I'd say it's interesting to compare their results as the inherited the same problems in comparable clubs. They are both hugely influenced by SAF and have some of the principles. I'm not in any way suggesting Ole is a better manager than Klopp, but I find it interesting to compare how he holds up against him results and progress wise. I struggle to see why you are opposed to his because they have different pedigree.Do I have to @ReddBalls? I mean even if you want to ignore past pedigree and just go off stats alone, in Klopp’s first full season at Liverpool he was 2nd at this stage after 16 matches with 34 points.
What am I opposed to aside from comparing Ole to Klopp? I mean, are you ok if we start comparing James to Messi?He still ended up 4th. I'd say it's interesting to compare their results as the inherited the same problems in comparable clubs. They are both hugely influenced by SAF and have some of the principles. I'm not in any way suggesting Ole is a better manager than Klopp, but I find it interesting to compare how he holds up against him results and progress wise. I struggle to see why you are opposed to his because they have different pedigree.
My memory isn't the greatest so I can't remember many asking for top 4 or the sack. I will be happy with a top 6 finish as long as there is clear progress. We did show fight and it's great to see that the players are playing for their manager.Yes in part agree, the last 2 games showing the fight and desire is great and what is needed but the performance against Sheffield for example was unacceptable.
I think you’re wrong re fans and acceptance of 6th. Lots have said that Ole should be sacked if we don’t make 4th, which is setting things up to fail
One season out of top four is accepting mediocrity? Do you mean that?Accepting mediocrity?
Very good post, there are positives for sure and negatives too but what you said is true. Ole has show that he has good tactical knowledge going by his record vs big 6, we have very good young players who should improve with more experience and finally we are having fully fit team having run of games (still Pogba is missing).I don't get the negativity from some of you lot.
I would suggest that behind the scenes he is doing well and the outlook for Utd is bright.
- Ole has shown his tactical nous against every top 6 team he's come up against. He's quite flexible tactically switching his points of attack depending on who he is up against. Exploiting Liverpool's full backs beautifully as an example.
- He has managed something no other post SAF manager has managed which is to go through a truly shit period, but keep the dressing room on side and begin to look like he has turned it around. Moyes, LvG and Mou all lost the players support, he hasn't.
- You have a young core of excellent players who will only improve
- He rebuilt the defence, which is without doubt better than last seasons even in letting Smalling go could be seen as a mistake.
- Yes you've had poor games against lower teams, but these are fine margins and confidence is now running through your squad, you only need to upgrade your number 10 position to add a bit more creativity and I think that would make a huge change, Pogba as many have suggested.
- He has dealt with a huge run of injuries and your still 5th with players coming back.
Our fanzine is called "And Smith must score" probably one of the most famous and disappointing bits of commentary in our history. However many times I watch it Smith never scores ..... but he should!Unless he starts winning against the teams that defend in numbers and counter attack us, he will be a one trick pony.
So far he has not been able to get his tactics right in those situations.
When we played Brighton in the FA Cup final, they did the same thing to us. Robinson and Smith would attack us with pace and we managed to survive because Smith messed up the easiest of the chances to win the cup.
In the replay Ron changed it around and didn't give the opportunity to do it. We won 4-0.
Yes this is a forward step but until we can play like this game after game I would not change my mind in that he is good enough for United.
Not sure why I'm picturing everyone in the boardroom wearing a Mandalorian helmet nodding and telling Ole " This is the way". Maybe Ed Woodward's Adult Disneyland is getting to me.I don't get the negativity from some of you lot.
I would suggest that behind the scenes he is doing well and the outlook for Utd is bright.
- Ole has shown his tactical nous against every top 6 team he's come up against. He's quite flexible tactically switching his points of attack depending on who he is up against. Exploiting Liverpool's full backs beautifully as an example.
- He has managed something no other post SAF manager has managed which is to go through a truly shit period, but keep the dressing room on side and begin to look like he has turned it around. Moyes, LvG and Mou all lost the players support, he hasn't.
- You have a young core of excellent players who will only improve
- He rebuilt the defence, which is without doubt better than last seasons even in letting Smalling go could be seen as a mistake.
- Yes you've had poor games against lower teams, but these are fine margins and confidence is now running through your squad, you only need to upgrade your number 10 position to add a bit more creativity and I think that would make a huge change, Pogba as many have suggested.
- He has dealt with a huge run of injuries and your still 5th with players coming back.
5. We're trailing by 5 pts. And in Jan? We're not signing anyone in particular unless you believe in fairy tales. We focus with this team, and we sort it out until the end of the season.Same here. Were 6 points behind Chelsea at this point and with more than half of season still to play, I think anything than a serious challenge for a top 4 spot from here on, would be a massive failure. No excuses about players, or lack there of.. talks of long term plans... etc etc. We've seen that this team is capable of, we've seen that this team is playing for the manager. We've got the squad here to challenge Chelsea's and Tottenham's. We have to spend in January and if we don't, I don't want to see Ole giving it the aul' company man routine -- he already stated he was happy with the squad once this year, whilst it was clear we needed 3-4 replacments. I appreciate its difficult to do business in January but at the same time we can sign players now if we like, they just cannot be registered until then. Also, I get that clubs don't want to part with players midseason but again, we've left yourselves in this precarious position, we shouldn't expect an easy negotiation and a free pass. I mean, of course clubs will want more money, like what did you expect? Have them gift wrap them for us as a late Christmas present? Doesn't happen. Anyway, as I said no excuses we need to perform strongly over next month and if we do then we have to challenge for top 4 and in Europa League, League Cup, FA Cup. If we don't then Ole's position will have to be evaluated, just like any other manager. He has bought another month for me, and heck I thought that was impossible only a week ago. Hopefully, I'll be eating humble pie next month, and I'll do it gladly but I please no more false dawns.
Agree.Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Was going through my twitter TL and I agree with the tweet above. I still have major concerns if we can sustain our form. We have 9 fixtures that we should be winning in all honesty. I expect minimal to be points dropped over the next month. Anything other than that, and qualification to League Cup semi would be a total failure and would be a strong indictment of how Ole is only getting results against teams who are willing to play football against us, rather than him being a manager who gets the better of Mourinho, Pep etc. However, do well in those 9 fixtures and I think he should oversee January. The end of those 9 fixtures coincide with the start of January window. I think if Ole does well, over the next month, he should be given the January window to bolster our squad, and subsequently see out the season to try to get top 4 or win the Europa League or/and League Cup.
Why? Apparently we know how to play against top teams who are not afraid, so on the contrary, in the CL, we will be flying since he can challenge or beat all the Pep, Sarri, Klopp, Tuchel, etc...It's not different than what I said originally because I didn't say what you seem to think I did, you're welcome to go read my post again if you need clarity, just wipe your glasses first!
I don't see the point in comparisons, it's setting expectations crazy high for Ole. I doubt anyone truly believes he'll have us as CL finalists next year or winning it the year after, or setting PL points totals. Klopp was already a proven, great manager before he went to Liverpool, Ole has shown no signs yet that he can reach that sort of greatness. Personally I'll be impressed if we make top four with him next season, let alone this one. I'd be baffled if he got anywhere close to doing what Klopp has done with Liverpool because I'm 99.999% sure there's no chance it'll happen. It's a fairytale scenario to try compare him to a manager like Klopp which is why it's so pointless to do it.
Because it's clear that's the only way we can get results, teams in the UCL will respond accordingly then.Why? Apparently we know how to play against top teams who are not afraid, so on the contrary, in the CL, we will be flying since he can challenge or beat all the Pep, Sarri, Klopp, Tuchel, etc...
Klopp took over in Oct and did 8th at 60 pts. After that, he did 4th at 76 pts, 4th at 75 pts, 2nd at 97 pts, and now this season.
Ole took over in Dec and did 6th with 66 pts. Now it's his 2nd year. If he does 4th at 76 pts, he's on par with Klopp in results.
Since their football is very similar, though Ole seems to be more into our own 2008 team rather than Klopp's version of Liverpool, we should have no complain about that.
In fact, I think if it clicks again, we will be far better than 4th because the mental work he's trying to pass to the players seems to be of a much higher level than whatever Klopp did during his seasons being 4th.
And for the story about the EL or CL, well let's just see how it plays out then.
Had to wait a long time to post this ..right pal? And if by style you mean counterattacking....yes you know I have seen football before.just wondering if you saw the style on Wednesday and today pal?
There is literally plenty of money and we don’t need to reduce the debt.5. We're trailing by 5 pts. And in Jan? We're not signing anyone in particular unless you believe in fairy tales. We focus with this team, and we sort it out until the end of the season.
And before you talk about spending money. There is not enough money, right now. We need to win the league and go to the semis of the C1 to have a chance to reduce the debt, so stop with the craziness of asking for money and let's support Ole.
no even if we fail against those teams it doesnt make us game raisers. Fact is we cant break down teams but any team that gives space to run into will get punished. is there a team with a quicker attacking trio that ours in the league? without Sane city only have sterling, liverpool mane and salah but firminho isnt quick whilst chelsea have willian and pulisic.Agree.
I think we are just game raisers (partly cuz we find it easier to play on the counter with our pace)
Ultimately if we don't beat Everton /Newcastle /Burnley... It will just prove the point. We are just game raisers.
In Klopps' first full season, he had them in 2nd place with 34 points at this same stage. Please, stop with the Klopp comparison. Their improvements were night and day in those 18 months.After 37 league games in charge at Liverpool, Klopp had managed 64 points. After 37 league games in charge for us, Ole has managed 64 points.
That being said, Liverpool started their first full season under Klopp like a house on fire, and had clearly improved from the season before, while we've struggled more. I think the reasons for our struggles are obvious (shipping soft goals, and a lack of depth and creativity in midfield and attack), and I think (or at least hope) that when these issues are sorted, we'll raise our game significantly.
I've said this before, but vs Palace, Wolves and Soton we really were robbed. Really deserved 9 points and ended up with 2. Vs Sheffield and Villa we might not deserve 6 points, but we threw away a lead none the less. 15 points lost here, ended up with 4. If we had been a bit more focused and clinical in those games and had a bit more luck we would be sitting at 35 points now, which would be ahead of CityI don't get the negativity from some of you lot.
I would suggest that behind the scenes he is doing well and the outlook for Utd is bright.
- Ole has shown his tactical nous against every top 6 team he's come up against. He's quite flexible tactically switching his points of attack depending on who he is up against. Exploiting Liverpool's full backs beautifully as an example.
- He has managed something no other post SAF manager has managed which is to go through a truly shit period, but keep the dressing room on side and begin to look like he has turned it around. Moyes, LvG and Mou all lost the players support, he hasn't.
- You have a young core of excellent players who will only improve
- He rebuilt the defence, which is without doubt better than last seasons even in letting Smalling go could be seen as a mistake.
- Yes you've had poor games against lower teams, but these are fine margins and confidence is now running through your squad, you only need to upgrade your number 10 position to add a bit more creativity and I think that would make a huge change, Pogba as many have suggested.
- He has dealt with a huge run of injuries and your still 5th with players coming back.
Aye, this ”after 37 league games” drivel needs to stop, as do the Klopp comparisons.In Klopps' first full season, he had them in 2nd place with 34 points at this same stage. Please, stop with the Klopp comparison. Their improvements were night and day in those 18 months.
I dont think a week or so is a long time, no.Had to wait a long time to post this ..right pal? And if by style you mean counterattacking....yes you know I have seen football before.
what if we kept and backed moyes? You cant blindly back any unproven manager (not talking about ole)Still in the Etihad had to post this
. We rocked the Etihad today the boys where unreal . That's for every one of the clowns on here crying everyday to get our manager sacked . Back your team back your manager and give him time to build his own team .
MANCHESTER IS RED !!!!
I'm fairly sure I said something to that effect somewhere in there. It was a long post, though, so it's understandable that you might have missed it.In Klopps' first full season, he had them in 2nd place with 34 points at this same stage. Please, stop with the Klopp comparison. Their improvements were night and day in those 18 months.
Why don't you compare him to Moyes then? Results even more comparable.But his results with Liverpool were not. They're comparable.
Strange comment. Comparison or contrast?Why don't you compare him to Moyes then? Results even more comparable.
By the standards of internet forums, especially this one, it's an eternity. However to give you the benefit of doubt, i will see whether you make all replies exactly one week later!!!I dont think a week or so is a long time, no.
It's logical as well. We actually have a good squad, it's ridiculously expensive and lots of players have generally under-performed but individually we have talent everywhere so this style Ole is developing which seems very much about aggressively countering in every instance, super direct football and then dropping off when the team inevitably begins to tire (which makes getting the first goal paramount) works best against any possession heavy attacking team. Look at our wins this season - Chelsea, Norwich, Brighton, Leicester, City all fall comfortably into that category. Spurs are the only one who don't but I still don't really understand what Mourinho was trying to do starting 4 really attacking players away at OT. We also played well against Liverpool at OT even though we didn't win - if a team throws players forwards we will always be in with a shot because we have a top keeper, a very expensive back four and are relatively good at soaking up pressure, hence our GA stats.Agree.
I think we are just game raisers (partly cuz we find it easier to play on the counter with our pace)
Ultimately if we don't beat Everton /Newcastle /Burnley... It will just prove the point. We are just game raisers.
Yep. In the past 5 years we have always given the big 6 a lot of grief. Jose and LVG routinely dispatched them. It's the consistency against the smaller teams that we stumble. The next draw/defeat to a bottom half side is always just around the cornerTweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Was going through my twitter TL and I agree with the tweet above. I still have major concerns if we can sustain our form. We have 9 fixtures that we should be winning in all honesty. I expect minimal to be points dropped over the next month. Anything other than that, and qualification to League Cup semi would be a total failure and would be a strong indictment of how Ole is only getting results against teams who are willing to play football against us, rather than him being a manager who gets the better of Mourinho, Pep etc. However, do well in those 9 fixtures and I think he should oversee January. The end of those 9 fixtures coincide with the start of January window. I think if Ole does well, over the next month, he should be given the January window to bolster our squad, and subsequently see out the season to try to get top 4 or win the Europa League or/and League Cup.
