I keep him for now, but I am not convinced he is the guy. I would like us to aim to take Liverpool down. Not seeing that in our current management.
Seem to be happy enough to fight for top 4.
Seem to be happy enough to fight for top 4.
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
- Thread starter MrSingh2002
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Relative to where we were under Mourinho, top 4 would be a good achievement. After that, we need to kick on and aim for the title - we have the young players and finances to be doing it within 3 years IMO.
For me - the great think about Ole is that he's so invested in the long term plan, blooding young players and buying players for the long term that fit well, as opposed to Sanchez/Di Maria. He's not a brilliant coach, but he is at least going about things in the right way and will leave the club in a much, much better position than he joined it. I originally wanted him out, but with players back from injury and Bruno's arrival signalling a sharp upturn in form, I'm excited to see where we go.
I'm really torn on Ole. I think there have to be a lot of allowances made for the fact that, in addition to the fitness issues associated with last season's collapse, we started this season with probably the weakest squad we've had in decades, which is really one thing you can't blame Ole for at all. The lack of creativity in midfield in particular has surely got to be a consideration in our inconsistency this season. But there have been some incredibly flat performances, and I can't help but feel that Ole's attacking approach is quite unsophistocated.
He's certainly not tactically inept. There have been some excellent tactical victories, especially in big sides. But I've always been worried he might not have the genuine tactical insight to build a team with the sophistication in attack to break down defences and win consistently. I'm hoping with the players we have back, he can prove me wrong.
He's certainly not tactically inept. There have been some excellent tactical victories, especially in big sides. But I've always been worried he might not have the genuine tactical insight to build a team with the sophistication in attack to break down defences and win consistently. I'm hoping with the players we have back, he can prove me wrong.
Yay the Ole threads are back!
Interesting. I always feel like the lad were out at the end of last season. They just stop running as much as in the first matches under Ole. And lot of injures.
Thanks.
Its an interesting way to look at it. You could argue that Solskjaer should have found a way to bring fitness up gradually and had the squad last the season with the next season earmarked for the full transition to full fitness and quicker play.
I’m no Mourinho apologist and Solakjaer has had my backing almost the entire time but it seems a bit disingenuous to complain that Mourinho’s methods weren’t good preparation for Solkjaer’s style of play. Mourinho has always been economical with his players energy levels and it usually resulted in a strong finish to the season for him.
This is just not true from what what I remember. Jose’s teams historically start very fast and win a bunch of games upfront, build up a healthy points lead and then limp over the line towards the end when the focus is on other competitions. This was true of all his title wins at Chelsea especially his last one and was also true of our 17/18 season.
Mourinho really left a mark here
It's probably taken a good year or more to clear out the Mourinho effect.
Guys, how's this still up for debate! Ole has excelled in pretty much every area this season except maybe the injury management front, which is largely due to our players adapting to change in play style.
Transfers: Literally each of his 5 signings have great buys, the transfer outs were understandable really and apart from Ander's departure (which has been offset by emergence of Fred as a great player), I don't have any issues there
Style of Play: We're finally having an identifiable style of play which tweaks a bit based on the opposition. One can genuinely see what he is trying and that in itself is more than enough for me. This is unlike Moyes' season, LVG's seasons and Mou's seasons
Results: I'd agree that we've lost a fair few games to opposition we shouldn't be losing to, but all/ most of these losses came when we were missing Pogba, who was our only creative outlet in the 1st half of the season. Additionally, one can argue that our set of players should be beating likes of Watford and Newcastle irrespective of who the manager is. Our record against bigger sides, top tier mangers, is phenomenal which shows that Ole is tactically pretty good.
General Atmosphere: I don't think this point needs expansion really. From doom and gloom under Mou, the club is on the rise. You dont see infighting, sneaky remarks in PCs, blame game going on and you can see the players and manager backing each other.
Transfers: Literally each of his 5 signings have great buys, the transfer outs were understandable really and apart from Ander's departure (which has been offset by emergence of Fred as a great player), I don't have any issues there
Style of Play: We're finally having an identifiable style of play which tweaks a bit based on the opposition. One can genuinely see what he is trying and that in itself is more than enough for me. This is unlike Moyes' season, LVG's seasons and Mou's seasons
Results: I'd agree that we've lost a fair few games to opposition we shouldn't be losing to, but all/ most of these losses came when we were missing Pogba, who was our only creative outlet in the 1st half of the season. Additionally, one can argue that our set of players should be beating likes of Watford and Newcastle irrespective of who the manager is. Our record against bigger sides, top tier mangers, is phenomenal which shows that Ole is tactically pretty good.
General Atmosphere: I don't think this point needs expansion really. From doom and gloom under Mou, the club is on the rise. You dont see infighting, sneaky remarks in PCs, blame game going on and you can see the players and manager backing each other.
It should be up for debate. We had one month before lockdown where we looked quite good, but that is not enough to change people's opinions. There have been quite a lot of awful performances, some of which we were lucky to get a decent result from e.g. dominated by Sheffield United.
People also forget that we did not play very well against Everton, either. One of the last four games played. We started off well, but the second half was pretty abysmal. Even Fernandes was not very good in the second half.
Two of the following games were LASK and Derby; very weak opposition. The Man City win was good, but we still have not shown that we can consistently beat lower teams in the Premier League. After all, that is where most of the points are won.
Solskjaer needs to sort this out first. I don't think there has been enough time in terms of good results to show that he has turned it around.
I mainly agree with the last point. Think we could have done better in all other areas.
Our style is mainly good in the big game on the counter. With Pogba back we will see if this change .
Results are good in the cup, but not in the league. We have still to win anything too although we have two chances left.
This is going to be back in full force soon enough. I can’t wait 
I changed from wait till the end of the season to let him at least finish rebuild. The last 10 games, coinciding with his best buy yet, has seen Utds results change dramatically, including the clean sheets, goals for and against. The improvement of Fred, Shaw and McTomineys overall game. Martials capture of first season form. Rashford getting closer to WC, The emergence of Williams and Greenwood. The fact Ole has hown he can change and work different tactics and formations all this in just over half a season, for me has got me more excited for football than since Fergies time.
Would love to hear some factual feedback from posters who still think Ole isn't the right man for the managerial job.
I think Bruno proved there was a serious lack of creativity in our team.
Also - Pogba's absence during the first half of the season genuinely affected our team performances.
The struggle was certainly not due to Ole's coaching prowess being insufficient as a manager.
I think Bruno proved there was a serious lack of creativity in our team.
Also - Pogba's absence during the first half of the season genuinely affected our team performances.
The struggle was certainly not due to Ole's coaching prowess being insufficient as a manager.
Don't worry, you'll get plenty once we get a bad result. We surely can't win all the matches you know. Just don't worry
Some aspects have been good, but not making top 4 should still have him sacked. I hope we have one final push to claim it with our current squad there're no excuses. Breaking the small teams down has been a real challenge.
It would be diabolical should we not get it, if Man City are banned. It would be quite poor even if they aren't. After January, we have been playing with £200m worth of signings over Chelsea's £0m expenditure.
We should have the advantage there. Also, our whole team is back fit and we also have the easier run-in. In fact, I don't think there are any excuses for him not to get top four. I see it as more of a must now than I did before. At least he had the injury excuse then.
We started playing better recently, but I think people are still getting ahead of themselves.
Burnley - Lost (diabolical performance)
Tranmere - Win (expected)
Brugge - Draw (dreadful performance)
Chelsea - Win (good)
Watford - Win (good)
Brugge - Win (good, but should be an expected win)
Everton - Draw (Decent start, poor second half)
Derby - Win (expected)
Man City - Win (great)
Lask - Win (expected)
We have still not put to bed whether we can consistently beat the lower teams in the Premier League. We have played three in those games and came out with 1 win, 1 draw, and 1 loss.
Some of those others teams are so weak as well: LASK and Tranmere - there shouldn't really be any praise for beating them. Those two are the type of games that only have expected (win), poor (draw), or dreadful (loss). Brugge are not much stronger.
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Looks like many have changed from sack to keep. It's nice to see saner heads are prevailing. Here is my take:
4th or better - give him a contract extension
5th or 6th and playing attractive football - he stays but keep close eye in the fall and evaluate in December
5th or 6th and no obvious improvement in style - let him go
7th or worse - let him go
The tricky one will be 5th and some good football but not consistent. Other factors like injuries, poor losses, cup results etc will have to come in to play.
4th or better - give him a contract extension
5th or 6th and playing attractive football - he stays but keep close eye in the fall and evaluate in December
5th or 6th and no obvious improvement in style - let him go
7th or worse - let him go
The tricky one will be 5th and some good football but not consistent. Other factors like injuries, poor losses, cup results etc will have to come in to play.
'This is going to be back in full force soon enough. I can’t wait
Why do you want us to fail? Or hope we smash teams and people think Ole is the right man?
What about the EL and the FA Cup? Mourinho got to stay with 6th and no improvements in style winning the EL.
Thread would be back in full force soon. As it stands there's no excuse not to make top 4. We have a better squad than Sheffield Tottenham Chelsea and even Leceister. We have the easiest fixtures with just 3 points behind and a higher goal difference.
So before the season kick-starts again I would say keep Ole granted he keeps progressing. He's spent quite a lot money on transfers and added to the squad. And when youve spent almost 200m on a team then that demands progress. Progress in style of play...progress in results.....progress in league position. I judge Ole based on the progress he has made. Are we breaking down lowblocks now after spending 45m on Bruno and Pogba back from injury? With our squad back better and stronger than it was pre corona are we getting better results than before? Our squad this season also being better than last are we going to finish higher than the 6th position we finished last time?
It's all about the progress he makes and all through this season there has been reasonable excuses why he hasn't made this progress - Injuries, lack of creativity etc. Right now though those excuses are out the window.
So before the season kick-starts again I would say keep Ole granted he keeps progressing. He's spent quite a lot money on transfers and added to the squad. And when youve spent almost 200m on a team then that demands progress. Progress in style of play...progress in results.....progress in league position. I judge Ole based on the progress he has made. Are we breaking down lowblocks now after spending 45m on Bruno and Pogba back from injury? With our squad back better and stronger than it was pre corona are we getting better results than before? Our squad this season also being better than last are we going to finish higher than the 6th position we finished last time?
It's all about the progress he makes and all through this season there has been reasonable excuses why he hasn't made this progress - Injuries, lack of creativity etc. Right now though those excuses are out the window.
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I think what is most important is whether the team is showing signs of playing consistently good football, which hasn't been the case until relatively recently. If that continues until the end of the season then there is every reason to keep him. However, if we revert to our pre-Fernandes form, dire football and wildly inconsistent results, then big questions will have to be asked.
I’m a big Ole fan but I agree with some of the more recent posts here. With the squad we now have available, if everyone can stay fit then we really do have to expect a 3rd/4th place finish. The expectations are rightly being raised again with everyone back so I think it’s time for Ole to show that he has the ability to kick the squad into the next gear ahead of next season.
I’m excited, I think Ole will still prove many people wrong and we will finish with a real bang. Wouldn’t be surprised to see a return to his caretaker form.
I’m excited, I think Ole will still prove many people wrong and we will finish with a real bang. Wouldn’t be surprised to see a return to his caretaker form.
No more excuses for Ole. If we cannot finish in the top 4 with a fully fit squad 9 games to go then we really have to think if he is the man for the job.
I want him to do well but at the end of the day results matter. We cannot keep talking about rebuild and he has had alot of money to spend with little improvement.
He has done well in getting a decent squad together but it means nothing if he cannot get them to win football matches. On paper now, this is one of the strongest squads around.
I want him to do well but at the end of the day results matter. We cannot keep talking about rebuild and he has had alot of money to spend with little improvement.
He has done well in getting a decent squad together but it means nothing if he cannot get them to win football matches. On paper now, this is one of the strongest squads around.
While I do agree with the recent posts, there is by no means a sure thing that the team will carry on the way they played before the lockdown, and that might not be down to the manager, but the fact that the players haven't played football for three months and the circumstances. But then again, it's the managers job to make the best out of the situation. There should be signs of progress towards the summer.
I except at least a cup, and top 4 is a realistic target.
I except at least a cup, and top 4 is a realistic target.
Agree, not coaching, but rather it's more to do with his 1) player management of "certain players", and moreso his 2) tactical decisions in insisting with 4231 formation, to have #10 role but no consistent reliable player for that. We struggled the first half of this season because of those stubbornness.
I mean, this is dependant on teams above us dropping points and us not dropping points, it's not like we're all on level points going into the restart. We will have to win the bulk of our games and hope we don't get too many of these soft muscle injuries that lots of players in Germany seem to be picking up after the break.
And that stubborness led to Bruno Fernandes hitting the ground running because the team was already set up and drilled to play to his (os a similar kind of players) strengths.
It's going to be a problem once again if Bruno is out injured. We don't have similar kind of players.
Surely tactical adaptability depending on what players are available is a necessary skill a manager should have. Else, we'll have another long drought of losing points again it's embarrassing.. unless you don't mind going through those again.
Yes, we are not going in on level points but our run in is probably the easiest. Chelsea have City and Liverpool both to play, you would expect them to lose some points. If we beat Spurs and SU we can put some day light between ourselves and them, if we lose we could end up being 8th in the table.
It is pointless coming up with excuses now, every team is in the same boat.
Would it necessarily? Any team would suffer without a key player, but right now, Pogba can play that role if Bruno is injured. Even without Bruno the team won games against Spurs, City et. al. Pereira were playing the 10 role in the 4-1 against Newcastle.
There are two schools of thought regarding tactics. Adapting to circumstances or sticking to a system. Neither are wrong, as history shows.
Erm, you do realise he has played different formations?
3-5-2
4-2-3-1
4-1-2-1-2 narrow
You can play any formation, without a creative midfielder we will struggle in any formation.
I fully expect us to finish in the top 4 to be honest, but I don't think Ole should be judged on the finishing position this season as it's been a bit mental and it's taken the introduction of Bruno to steady the ship and get things looking positive again. I'd like to see him have a crack at next season with another transfer window where he's backed to bring in the players he wants. If we're floundering in 8th next season halfway through the campaign then there are no more excuses and nowhere to hide.
You're joking with this
1) Which players?
2) I think that was due to the fact that our midfield wasn’t geared or good enough to play other formations? Specially without Pogba and McT (who was out for quite some time as well). But which other formations would you have preferred?
In my opinion, due to the lack of quality available in midfield and up front for most parts of this season, it would’ve been a risk to try other formations in general.
Why would I be? Why would you sack someone who's halfway through building a team just so someone else can come in and inherit a half-built squad? Let him finish the job and then we can judge him fairly on the team he's put together.
We've not played football in months. Not ready for this argument
I think it is that you said floundering 8th. I think after another summer window, he shouldn't even be floundering around 5th. If he is struggling in that position after probably another £100m expenditure, he would have to go. That would mean there has been zero improvements on this season.
Yeah, I would agree with that also. 8th was probably a bit extreme as an example. That obviously depends on whether or not there are 3 or 5 points between 8th and 3rd also.
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