Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?

  • Sack Ole & appoint new coach ASAP

  • Keep Ole & back him to finish rebuild


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Keanes Magic Hat

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In both transfer windows he's brought in players that have improved team and squad. He took us from being useless at the end of Mourinho to a team that work hard, then could beat top teams on counter and then slowly evolved towards a team that can keep the ball better and break teams down.

Still work to do and more to prove but I'm delighted with the progress we have made in a season and a half
 
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Matriac

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Yes saw those lot who seemed a bit too happy at our missing out on top 4 and can't imagine everyone who didnt and still don't believe in Ole was rooting for us to fail. Was referring to that guy who screenshotted the dissenting opinions in the poll like today was meant to make them/us feel bad
I think the screenshot was just meant as a bit of banter. The calling for bans etc. were jokes in the moment of glee from today.
I appreciate other opinions on here. I'm glad the one most extreme person got banned the other day, but other than that I would be posting a lot less on here if I didn't have anyone to argue with! :lol:

If anything the screenshot was just in case someone would later claim they had voted in support of Ole all along. :rolleyes:

There's been a few in here saying that Ole proved em wrong, and for now deserves further support, and I applaud them for that.
 

Zen86

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So you pointed out that Ole has won more trophies than Poch but you weren't using it as evidence that Ole may be a better choice than Poch? Why bother saying it then when we were comparing them?

That is what you were implying, it just didn't make any sense and I explained why it's silly so don't pretend that's not what you meant just because you realised it's daft.
Who’s pretending? It was pointing out your shit argument that Poch was somehow more qualified than Ole.
 

sammsky1

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Thread has taken a turn for the worse with some truly childish behaviour. Many people who don't think he's right didn't start rooting for us to lose matches, yet some are treating it like they've won an opinion battle.
I'd still take an upgrade in the summer, if that opinion offends then you're doing this internet forum thing wrong. You'll never get a 100% of people to agree with you on anything
So you like to express your opinion, but cant take it when others ridicule your opinion for being wrong? Is that it?
You are also welcome to wish for whatever you like. But thankfully you are no way close to the decision making at Manchester United.
Your 'opinion' has been proven to be plainly wrong. You were wrong. Take that gracefully instead of whinging and you might even learn something.
In reality, all you have achieved is making yourself get upset, not allowed yourself to fully enjoy the whole point of supporting a football club, and set yourself up for a totally unachievable outcome into the future.
Perhaps you should ask yourself why you are following this team.
 

Greck

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So you like to express your opinion, but cant take it when others ridicule your opinion for being wrong? Is that it?
You are also welcome to wish for whatever you like. But thankfully you are no way close to the decision making at Manchester United.
So in reality, all you have achieved is making yourself get upset, not allowed yourself to fully enjoy the whole point of supporting a football club, and set yourself up for a totally unachievable outcome into the future.
Perhaps you should ask yourself why you are following this team.
Yeesh I see the problem here, Good thing you're here to provide guidance to the rest of us lost sheep. Anyway for the most part no one seems emotionally charged but you. You also realise there's no being "proven wrong" here. Proven wrong about what?
 

MrSingh2002

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Good Post.

Are you gonna close it though?
Unfortunately it doesn't give me an option to delete it. I've selected the Poll to close by tomorrow. Hopefully the mods pick these comments up and delete the thread for now.

Time for a "Will Ed Woodward back Ole in the transfer window" thread and poll instead!
 

MrSingh2002

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You two won't be out of place in modern-day China's censorship apparatus. Freedom of speech is the point of discussion forums. This kind of shite (from both sides) is exactly what stops fruitful discussions.
Love that post. This is a forum. Some people forget that you can have opposing views.
 

Tyrion

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Who’s pretending? It was pointing out your shit argument that Poch was somehow more qualified than Ole.
So were you arguing that Poch having not won any trophies makes him less qualified or not? Because you can't seem to make up your mind.
 

Tyrion

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In reality, all you have achieved is making yourself get upset, not allowed yourself to fully enjoy the whole point of supporting a football club, and set yourself up for a totally unachievable outcome into the future.
Do you understand that you can have doubts about the manager and still "fully enjoy" the team?

Perhaps you should ask yourself why you are following this team.
Why should they?
 

Faetheshire86

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At the start of the season, based on our squad, I was expecting us to be battling for 5th-6th place. Given the prospect of next season in the Europa, I was pretty disinterested in results and cared more about looking at positives for the future. Were individual players progressing? Were we giving young players a chance? How was Ole handling the media? With a few exceptions, I've been really impressed.

Given that the results have started to follow suit, I'm not really sure what more could be expected from Ole? Challenging City? Liverpool? From where we were at the end of last season / start of this season, I don't think there's very many managers, if any, who could have achieved that.

As a fan, do I believe this should be the end product? Absolutely not. If we are still here in 2-3 years time, then someone will have to answer for it. But every story needs a beginning. Maybe Ole won't be the man to conclude it, but he's earned the opportunity to try.
 

Flexdegea

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Implement attacking football? Check
Reinvigorate the squad? Check
Change the culture of the club? Check
Promote youth? Check
Sign quality players? Check
Sell the deadwood? Check

His first full season by the way chaps. First full season. Let's give the guy some respect.


This and this :lol: :lol: again
 

Zen86

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So were you arguing that Poch having not won any trophies makes him less qualified or not? Because you can't seem to make up your mind.
You seem to be struggling to understand, but that’s ok. To summarise, you suggested Poch had more qualifications than Ole, I questioned what these greater qualifications were, because they certainly aren’t trophies.

As for your question above on whether Poch having not won any trophies makes him less qualified for the job, considering the Manchester United job is to target silverware... f*** yes it does. Understand?
 

Tyrion

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You seem to be struggling to understand, but that’s ok. To summarise, you suggested Poch had more qualifications than Ole, I questioned what these greater qualifications were, because they certainly aren’t trophies.

As for your question above on whether Poch having not won any trophies makes him less qualified for the job, considering the Manchester United job is to target silverware... f*** yes it does. Understand?
Less qualified than who?
 

glazed

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I still don't think we can achieve anything big with either Ole or the Glazers in charge. But OGS has certainly earned the right to prove otherwise, because he qualified for the Champions League. Any manager who does that while attempting some decently entertaining football is entitled to our support.
 

Tyrion

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I still don't think we can achieve anything big with either Ole or the Glazers in charge. But OGS has certainly earned the right to prove otherwise, because he qualified for the Champions League. Any manager who does that while attempting some decently entertaining football is entitled to our support.
I'm not sure about the Glazers. We won plenty with them. Woodward is more relevant to our onfield success imo than them as I dont think they care at all (which I'm fine with).
 

glazed

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I'm not sure about the Glazers. We won plenty with them. Woodward is more relevant to our onfield success imo than them as I dont think they care at all (which I'm fine with).
An argument for another day.
 

Reditus

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I think some humble pie should now be eaten. I looked through a lot of posts in this thread. And many of you have now been proved flat out wrong .

Ole has been our best appointment in the post Ferguson era. He has cleared out deadwood and overpaid players who were never right for the club. Right now I see the club in it’s best position since 2013 and with investment can actually challenge....but there is a but, I’m still not sure Ole will be the man to get us there. I am not sure if he can go that next level.

It’s a strange situation as he clearly deserves the chance for at least another 1-2 seasons. But he is doing such a good job in developing players and with vastly improved recruitment I still see it as setting up the next manager with a massive club in a great position to go to much bigger things.
 

van Persie

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I think some humble pie should now be eaten. I looked through a lot of posts in this thread. And many of you have now been proved flat out wrong .

Ole has been our best appointment in the post Ferguson era. He has cleared out deadwood and overpaid players who were never right for the club. Right now I see the club in it’s best position since 2013 and with investment can actually challenge....but there is a but, I’m still not sure Ole will be the man to get us there. I am not sure if he can go that next level.

It’s a strange situation as he clearly deserves the chance for at least another 1-2 seasons. But he is doing such a good job in developing players and with vastly improved recruitment I still see it as setting up the next manager with a massive club in a great position to go to much bigger things.
Exactly.
 

GDaly95

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The signs have always been there. Bringing through youth, increased work rate, positive attitude, better recruitment.

I've tolerated the knee-jerk reactions on this forum since joining, but honestly the disrespect leveled at Ole over the past few months has been an absolute disgrace.

If you didn't think he was the man for the job, fine, once you were respectful about it. But he's been called all names under the sun on here by so many people.

Some seem to forget how much he's done for us, as a player and a manager.

I'm not sure if this forum has a huge faction of overly-privileged teens who don't remember who Ole is or what he's done, I can't even wrap my head around it but its been awful. I really hope the mood changes from here on out whatever happens.

In any case, whatever anyone has thought in the past, he is undoubtedly the man to bring us forward. And its no longer subjective. He's the man for the job, at least for the foreseeable future.

Quick link to a tribute of Ole I enjoy cos sure why not:

 

always_hoping

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Worth remembering Uniteds record against top six was excellent in the league this season :

V Liverpool drew/lost
V City: Won/Won
V Chelsea: Won/Won
V Leicester Won/Won
V Spurs: Won/Drew

23 points out of a possible from 30.
 

Red Company

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I don’t think this thread should be closed or blocked.

This thread, while offering some noteworthy debates and arguments in and against support for Ole, has also been eye opening.

I am glad that the disrespectful posters were able to show themselves in their true colours and hence why a handful got banned as well.

This thread will be key to keep a check on Ole’s progress going forward. Specially next season when he will have to be judged way more factually and harshly if he’s given substantial funds this coming window to upgrade the squad further.

Myself, being one of those who want Ole to stick around for the near future, truly enjoyed the feedback from some posters who tried to respectfully and factually debate that he’s not the right manager for us. And I want to continue these debates with context from our past debates in this thread.

Hence my vote is not to close this thread.
 

Lj82

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No. I don't think Ole haters want the best for the club. Rather, they just want to be right.
The foolishly took a negative position early on, and have since just doubled down through hubris and arrogance.
They'd rather the club go backwards than admit they were wrong.
Agree. And this thread has shown up many of them
 

Lj82

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I was Ole out until the restart. We came back with energy and played well. His style of play needs squad depth though and unless we invest in players who can actually win us games from the bench I worry we'll run out of steam. He's certainly earned another season regardless of how the Europa league goes.
This transfer window is going to be crucial for that.
 

Red Company

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My vote has remained Ole out... not because I want him out right now... ( he's earned any benefit of the doubt for now by achieving Champions League) but because I'm still not convinced he's a brilliant coach and I can't be arsed to change it.

Everything changed when Bruno joined the team... I've always had faith in the young strikers... so their performance is what I expected.
I attribute the success to finally playing midfielders who could provide them with service.
If we didn't have Fernandes, would things have changed? I think it would have been pretty poor.

I do give him credit for playing Greenwood over Lingard though
I also give him credit for improving the overall morale of the team.

If Ole was the main driving force behind the identification and selection of Bruno... then that would be a huge point in his favor.
If Ole is able to keep Pogba... that would be another big one.
If he is able to retool the defense (cut losses on Maguire and teach Wan-Bissaka how to play the ball a little more effectively) that might be another one.

I'm very happy with the season and if I can see continued growth, then I will reevaluate accordingly.

But in the same way I wouldn't call Frank Vogel a genius coach for winning with LeBron James and Anthony Davis... I can't really be convinced about Ole until I see him coach his way to true contention for Premier League title or a Champions League victory

66 points seems like underperforming for this team. I think they are better than that.

But Ole seems like a bright guy... so maybe he will find his way.

For now he's earned his right to operate without an axe hanging over his head. I hope he can take us to the next level.
Referring to the bolded parts;

1) I’m curious to know what you make of managers like Pep, Klopp, Zidane? Also of managers like Poch? Because according to you, a manager is only great if his coaching abilities can shine without a galactic squad. None of the first three managers I pointed out, managed to win anything until they had a full squad full of talented individuals. Then comes Poch, who for all his coaching prowess, failed to win a single trophy. And then his downfall was so abnormal that being champions league finalists, he somehow managed to feck it all up in a matter of months and get sacked before December. End of the day, you need to have a squad decent enough to comprehend and implement your tactical demands and expectations.

2) 66 points you say. I can’t seem to understand how you think this squad was projected to score more points with the injuries we had this season, the lack of personnel available. Literally need a miracle like Bruno in January to get to where we are now. It’s not Ole’s fault that all the incompetent players we had available couldn’t seem to get in any goals/assists. I mean even if Poch had to come and manager Lingard/Pereira/Mata/James & co., I’m not sure he’d fair any better. Pep came to city with a squad full of winners and yet some of them made tremendous blunders in his first season. Same with Klopp. Only Henderson is left from the squad he inherited. The point is, if Ole had gotten 66 points with our squad being justifiably good enough to get to 75/80 then I’d say okay fair enough. But technically we could’ve reached 70/75 even with this current squad if it wasn’t for DDGs blunders. Or Bruno being signed in Jan instead of when the season started like we all cried for. But these factors had nothing to do with Ole.
In all respect, I think you’re just making our squad seem a lot more than they are and you really need to be practical and realistic when you start making statements like that.

To conclude, coaches don’t become ‘brilliant’ over night. Pep would’ve never become brilliant if he didn’t have an amazing squad and good infrastructure around him. That is where he got his footing from and that is why he was trusted with the job. Everyone knows Ole is yet to prove his brilliance but he too, has a good infrastructure around him, and the clubs support. For me, he’s already done much better from an overall perspective than what LvG or Mou managed to do. There is only so much a manager can do.

This is why many of us want to give him another season when we can fairly judge him. Same way Pep or Klopp didn’t get judged in their first season(s) while their project was incomplete.

But having said that, I did appreciate the humbleness in your post where you have left yourself open to changing your perspective if things continue to Improve. Even though it didn’t sound like that when you began your post saying he’s not a brilliant coach and can’t be arsed to change your thinking. Perhaps you first need to stop contradicting yourself to be able to see the bigger picture.
 

Lj82

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At the start of the season, based on our squad, I was expecting us to be battling for 5th-6th place. Given the prospect of next season in the Europa, I was pretty disinterested in results and cared more about looking at positives for the future. Were individual players progressing? Were we giving young players a chance? How was Ole handling the media? With a few exceptions, I've been really impressed.

Given that the results have started to follow suit, I'm not really sure what more could be expected from Ole? Challenging City? Liverpool? From where we were at the end of last season / start of this season, I don't think there's very many managers, if any, who could have achieved that.

As a fan, do I believe this should be the end product? Absolutely not. If we are still here in 2-3 years time, then someone will have to answer for it. But every story needs a beginning. Maybe Ole won't be the man to conclude it, but he's earned the opportunity to try.
Well said.
It's fair to have doubts. There is also no guarantee in football. My view on Ole is that he may or may not be the one who win us the league, but I'm confident the club will be stronger and in a better position to do so than when he took over.

Edit: not just the team, but the entire club.
 

Flexdegea

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Referring to the bolded parts;

1) I’m curious to know what you make of managers like Pep, Klopp, Zidane? Also of managers like Poch? Because according to you, a manager is only great if his coaching abilities can shine without a galactic squad. None of the first three managers I pointed out, managed to win anything until they had a full squad full of talented individuals. Then comes Poch, who for all his coaching prowess, failed to win a single trophy. And then his downfall was so abnormal that being champions league finalists, he somehow managed to feck it all up in a matter of months and get sacked before December. End of the day, you need to have a squad decent enough to comprehend and implement your tactical demands and expectations.

2) 66 points you say. I can’t seem to understand how you think this squad was projected to score more points with the injuries we had this season, the lack of personnel available. Literally need a miracle like Bruno in January to get to where we are now. It’s not Ole’s fault that all the incompetent players we had available couldn’t seem to get in any goals/assists. I mean even if Poch had to come and manager Lingard/Pereira/Mata/James & co., I’m not sure he’d fair any better. Pep came to city with a squad full of winners and yet some of them made tremendous blunders in his first season. Same with Klopp. Only Henderson is left from the squad he inherited. The point is, if Ole had gotten 66 points with our squad being justifiably good enough to get to 75/80 then I’d say okay fair enough. But technically we could’ve reached 70/75 even with this current squad if it wasn’t for DDGs blunders. Or Bruno being signed in Jan instead of when the season started like we all cried for. But these factors had nothing to do with Ole.
In all respect, I think you’re just making our squad seem a lot more than they are and you really need to be practical and realistic when you start making statements like that.

To conclude, coaches don’t become ‘brilliant’ over night. Pep would’ve never become brilliant if he didn’t have an amazing squad and good infrastructure around him. That is where he got his footing from and that is why he was trusted with the job. Everyone knows Ole is yet to prove his brilliance but he too, has a good infrastructure around him, and the clubs support. For me, he’s already done much better from an overall perspective than what LvG or Mou managed to do. There is only so much a manager can do.

This is why many of us want to give him another season when we can fairly judge him. Same way Pep or Klopp didn’t get judged in their first season(s) while their project was incomplete.

But having said that, I did appreciate the humbleness in your post where you have left yourself open to changing your perspective if things continue to Improve. Even though it didn’t sound like that when you began your post saying he’s not a brilliant coach and can’t be arsed to change your thinking. Perhaps you first need to stop contradicting yourself to be able to see the bigger picture.
Ole out has currently matched the mightly Poch best season at spurs,



And has more trophies in his CV
 

Water Melon

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Getting CL next season was a must and Ole achieved it. Well done. Let us hope with more backing this time around he continues to progress. If he does not, start looking for an alternative. Managers just like players should be judged on their performances throughout the season. One thing I am sure of is that nobody can claim that Ole has not been backed by the Board. Next season, with more investment the Board will expect more improvement.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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I still don't think we can achieve anything big with either Ole or the Glazers in charge. But OGS has certainly earned the right to prove otherwise, because he qualified for the Champions League. Any manager who does that while attempting some decently entertaining football is entitled to our support.
Well, after all it's on him. It was exactly as he planned it. ;)
 

Strelok

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Worth remembering Uniteds record against top six was excellent in the league this season :

V Liverpool drew/lost
V City: Won/Won
V Chelsea: Won/Won
V Leicester Won/Won
V Spurs: Won/Drew

23 points out of a possible from 30.
If you take into account he has done this with Lingard, Pereira it's even more amazing. Bruno only played one match against Citeh.
 

roonster09

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If you take into account he has done this with Lingard, Pereira it's even more amazing. Bruno only played one match against Citeh.
Bruno played against City, Chelsea, Spurs, Leicester.

Brilliant record, something we should build on.
 

Strelok

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Bruno played against City, Chelsea, Spurs, Leicester.

Brilliant record, something we should build on.
Ah yeah my bad I forgot to count the matches after the break. And forgot that Bruno has played against Chelsea.

Prior to Bruno's arrival, I still remember Ole won or at least drew with the top 6 with Lingard. He only lost against Liverpool away when forced to play Pereira.
 

wolvored

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No he didn't.
  • Ole f*cked out a tonne of dead wood last summer
  • Ole invested his time and efforts into young players including YTS like Greenwood and Williams. Showed faith in Martial and Rashford to lead our line instead of Lukaku and Sanchez!
  • Turned us from an ageing, boring, defensive team lacking fitness and an attitude that stunk to a young, attack minded team that can retain possession and counter attack
  • 7 Clean sheets to 13
  • Goals conceded down from 54 to 36
  • Vastly improved our injury record from last season
  • Vastly improved our overall fitness
  • Arguably improved all players across the squad, can't think of a player that has regressed
  • Bruno is a revelation
  • Just the 88 goal involvements from our front 3 (60 in the league)
  • Still the Europa to play in
That's just some of the reasons he should of kept his job even if he didn't make top 4...but he did.
Well said. If he gets another 2/3 in with Fernandes star quality we could close the Premier gap significantly next season.
 

wolvored

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One person posted, (and he/she might be right) that no quality posters wanted Ole out.

I think that's partly behind my reason... as well as what I just said that I think polls are almost meaningless if you can go back and forth. Not that you shouldn't be able to change your mind... but most will just follow the crowd as the season progresses so what's the point of calling people out.

For me it's more nuanced than that. I hate Twitter cancel culture that forces you into conformity with the majority or you are treated like a pariah... even though as a liberal, I usually fall into agreement with the majority. I respect all opinions as long as one is not trolling.

I felt like the team was adrift until we signed Bruno... and without both Bruno and Paul, I don't think we can compete for the title next season.

I get that all top teams have players like that... but it was horrible to watch the games every week until he came.

For me, Ole would need to adapt to something like losing Bruno to injury for me to want to change my vote. Didn't Pep still win when they lost DeBruyne?

As I said, I now have hope for better from him, but I'm still not quite convinced.

Do I have confidence that the team would be able to overcome the loss of Bruno to injury, and/or Pogba if he decides to leave? Not really.
If we sign another 2/3 with the same mental attribues as Fernandes, then if Bruno did get an injury we could probably cope. You mentioned Pep and DeBruyne. He coped because he had a team of game changers, not just one. If we signed Sancho and Grealish, for example, we could cope with Bruno missing.
 

rollingstoned1

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Sack Ole Brigade (captured for posterity)

@MrSingh2002 please threadmark!

who's who of reactionary village idiots who are now using straw men to backtrack and try to justify claims like 'ole iz fraud lel, he pe teacher'. they want to pretend that outright abuse was somehow cautious skepticism.
 

Gehrman

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Ole out has currently matched the mightly Poch best season at spurs,



And has more trophies in his CV
Poch best league season at spurs was 2017 where they finished 2nd with 86 points. Best european season last season where they made the CL final.
 
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