SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

11101

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I feel stupid even contemplating asking this question, but has anyone considered stockpiling non-perishables?

Reading a few (perhaps sensationalist) stories of supermarkets being stripped in Italy as panic sets in. What worries me is just how quickly this could escalate if it reached pandemic levels.

I'd feel like a bit of a numpty, but do wonder it's worth going to the supermarket and spending a few hundred quid on stuff should quarantine set in in the UK!
We have made sure we have a few days worth of basics in the house. I live in Lombardy albeit not near a quarantined area. I keep seeing images of empty shelves but all the local supermarkets I have actually been to are fine.

The one thing i would consider buying is disinfectants/hand sanitiser. You can't find that anywhere in Northern Italy now.
 

Bosws87

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I feel stupid even contemplating asking this question, but has anyone considered stockpiling non-perishables?

Reading a few (perhaps sensationalist) stories of supermarkets being stripped in Italy as panic sets in. What worries me is just how quickly this could escalate if it reached pandemic levels.

I'd feel like a bit of a numpty, but do wonder it's worth going to the supermarket and spending a few hundred quid on stuff should quarantine set in in the UK!
Theres 7 billion people in the world and 100,000ish cases of a virus, take a step back
 

Penna

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We have made sure we have a few days worth of basics in the house. I live in Lombardy albeit not near a quarantined area. I keep seeing images of empty shelves but all the local supermarkets I have actually been to are fine.

The one thing i would consider buying is disinfectants/hand sanitiser. You can't find that anywhere in Northern Italy now.
Gel hand-cleanser is sold out in the village, but I've just (literally 10 minutes ago) got some online from Amazon.it. However, washing your hands is just as good - the gel is useful when you're outside, I suppose.
 

horsechoker

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From the guardian

Italian authorities are investigating the skyrocketing online prices for hygienic masks and sanitising gels after the coronavirus outbreak in northern Italy, according to two senior magistrates.

“We have decided to open an investigation after media reports of the insane prices fetched up by these products on online sales websites in the last two days,” Milan deputy chief prosecutor Tiziana Siciliano told Reuters.

The biggest outbreak in Europe has hit Italy, with more than 260 cases and seven deaths reported, most in the north of the country.

Many pharmacists have run out of hygienic masks and hand sanitizers, with people going online to buy them. “The price of masks online has risen from one cent to 10 euros each and a one litre bottle of disinfectant that last week was on sale for 7 euros, was up to 39 euros yesterday,” Siciliano said.

As the emergency has spread, police have also issued warnings that criminals posing as health inspectors have been using false identity papers to try to gain access to people’s houses to steal money or other valuables.
A special place in hell for the price gougers and thieves
 

Classical Mechanic

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Gel hand-cleanser is sold out in the village, but I've just (literally 10 minutes ago) got some online from Amazon.it. However, washing your hands is just as good - the gel is useful when you're outside, I suppose.
Pretty sure that washing your hands with warm soapy water is better than any gel.
 

senorgregster

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Pretty sure that washing your hands with warm soapy water is better than any gel.
Yep. If you can wash, wash. Washing hits bugs in two ways, removal and inactivation by detergent (minimal with latter as it's time/temp dependent). It wouldn't be the worst idea to use a gel afterwards for more inactivation. And of course if you don't have access to hot water and soap then gels are a must.
 

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Guys what's the situation in Austria and Germany. Safe to travel there ? I need to visit the two countries in the next couple.of weeks.
Couple of cases in Germany about a month ago through a company that had business dealings in China. All recovered I think, most of them probably bored themselves to death at an isolated hospital wing. Haven't heard anything since, German citizens from the Wuhan region were flown back and quarantined, dunno if they still are.
I guess it'll creep through Austria via south tyrol and reach Germany as well but don't think that should stop you from travelling, just wash your hands and avoid touching your face.

This thing must not reach Lagos.
Not an expert but I think it's too hot for the virus to spread.
 

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Tons of kids have just returned to UK after ski trips to Italy and all hell is breaking loose. My work colleagues daughter's school has been grabbing teachers and kids out of classes today and looks like all going to be sent home - of course they have already been in work/school for a day so god knows what this will lead to.
 

11101

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Tons of kids have just returned to UK after ski trips to Italy and all hell is breaking loose. My work colleagues daughter's school has been grabbing teachers and kids out of classes today and looks like all going to be sent home - of course they have already been in work/school for a day so god knows what this will lead to.
I saw that on the news. A ski trip to Bormio and now loads of kids have flu symptoms - although that province only has 1 case and it's not in Bormio.
 

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On the hand washing thing, I've read here about washing hands with warm water being effective. As far as I know, temperature isn't really a factor, and it's as much about making sure you've lathered your hands and rinsed them off properly.

If nothing else, hopefully a scare like this serves as a wake up call for people to actually start washing their hands. Too many disgusting pigs out there who've created some warped reasons in their heads to avoid doing so.
 

Adamsk7

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Yeah I think it’s the running of the water and of course the soap. I’m sure heat does help but it’s not the main contributor.
 

senorgregster

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The reason washing works is because it removes the bugs whether it be virus, bacteria or fungus. Soap helps dislodge. If used long enough soap can also kill/inactivate certain bugs but it takes extended periods. Heat improves the kill.

I would gel after washing. And be careful on touching taps etc after washing.
 

Di Maria's angel

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Tons of kids have just returned to UK after ski trips to Italy and all hell is breaking loose. My work colleagues daughter's school has been grabbing teachers and kids out of classes today and looks like all going to be sent home - of course they have already been in work/school for a day so god knows what this will lead to.
Can't people just read the news?
 

Fener1907

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The reason washing works is because it removes the bugs whether it be virus, bacteria or fungus. Soap helps dislodge. If used long enough soap can also kill/inactivate certain bugs but it takes extended periods. Heat improves the kill.

I would gel after washing. And be careful on touching taps etc after washing.
Out of curiosity, where do you get this information from? I haven't read anything to support this and, if anything, it seems that using heat (at least temperatures that could be considered 'hot' because warm water certainly doesn't do anything further) can be an irritant to the hands.
 

Buster15

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Yeah I think it’s the running of the water and of course the soap. I’m sure heat does help but it’s not the main contributor.
I doubt that heat will help as it would need to be boiling to have any affect.

Totally agree that handwashing is vital.
 

izec

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I think people wash their hands too quickly, take your time, especially away from home. I always make sure to use enough soap and take my time with rubbing it in.
 

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Why would they? Unlike the rest of Europe they've been scanning people coming in for weeks and its not exactly helped has it...

Italy has had the strongest controls in the EU since the beginning.
Because for example I go there weekly from Luxembourg, and provided I contacted someone in Lombardy who already has the virus, I should not be allowed to travel back and potentially spread the virus, this was last friday actually, no checks on departure...
 

11101

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Because for example I go there weekly from Luxembourg, and provided I contacted someone in Lombardy who already has the virus, I should not be allowed to travel back and potentially spread the virus, this was last friday actually, no checks on departure...
It's Luxembourg you want to be asking those questions to...
 

Di Maria's angel

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Yeah of course but it's a pretty big call not letting your daughter go to school for 14 days - in reality most people would send them in and hope nothing happens. May not be smart but that is what people do.
Just read a school in Doncaster has quarantined students who've returned from Northern Italy.
 

Adamsk7

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Yeah of course but it's a pretty big call not letting your daughter go to school for 14 days - in reality most people would send them in and hope nothing happens. May not be smart but that is what people do.
Also they’d need to quarantine themselves too for being in contact with said student
 

Grib

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Just read a school in Doncaster has quarantined students who've returned from Northern Italy.
8 and counting

3 in NI, excellent as if maybe not been able to go to Tenerife in a few weeks wasn't bad enough, some ejits who go on school skiing trips might have brought some Italian covid back
 

senorgregster

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Out of curiosity, where do you get this information from? I haven't read anything to support this and, if anything, it seems that using heat (at least temperatures that could be considered 'hot' because warm water certainly doesn't do anything further) can be an irritant to the hands.
For clarity, I'm not recommended washing in hot water. I'm recommending using multiple methods each with a different mechanism (wash - removal; gel - kill/inactivation).

Various detergents are used in the pathogen inactivation industry. It's been a while but the general idea is detergent selection is important (I would have to dig up if there is vast difference from bug to bug), time in detergent is a huge factor (days better than seconds obviously), and even moderate temperatures (low enough to not harm products) can be used to improve or speed up kills depending on the need. Also not advocating people hop in cold baths but using ice may also be helpful for kill - it's actually how we help detergents break apart mammalian cells. The idea behind temperature manipulation is to destabilise membranes (cold - tighten/crack; hot - increase movement) then the detergents intercalate and finish them off. For viruses, they'd need to be enveloped like this one is.
 

Fener1907

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For clarity, I'm not recommended washing in hot water. I'm recommending using multiple methods each with a different mechanism (wash - removal; gel - kill/inactivation).

Various detergents are used in the pathogen inactivation industry. It's been a while but the general idea is detergent selection is important (I would have to dig up if there is vast difference from bug to bug), time in detergent is a huge factor (days better than seconds obviously), and even moderate temperatures (low enough to not harm products) can be used to improve or speed up kills depending on the need. Also not advocating people hop in cold baths but using ice may also be helpful for kill - it's actually how we help detergents break apart mammalian cells. The idea behind temperature manipulation is to destabilise membranes (cold - tighten/crack; hot - increase movement) then the detergents intercalate and finish them off. For viruses, they'd need to be enveloped like this one is.
Since many aren't at all familiar with the technical details behind hand washing - and the message to a populace needing to be as concise and simple as possible to ensure its effectiveness - is there a consensus about how to effectively eliminate the current virus through hand washing?

Again, genuinely curious. My knowledge of handing washing is rudimentary at best, although apparently still better than a significant percentage of the population that omits it altogether. I once had an argument in which somebody defended their stance by claiming that hand washing didn't make sense since their dick was cleaner than their hands. Still flabbergasts me to this day.