( I assumed it was)
Xabi Alonso | Next Ex-Chelsea Man Ager?
- Thread starter horsechoker
- Start date
-
In the latest edition of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) discuss the absolute VAR shambles that lead to us losing the Manchester Derby.
But is it all on the VAR room? How much blame can be placed on Carrick and the players?
They also preview the 2 matches before the International Break and update on the struggles at MUWomen.
- Status
It was a different squad, a very different squad tbh.
Courtois, Lunin, Rudiger, Carvajal, Militao, Alaba, Mendy, Fran Garcia(
), Valverde, Tchouameni, Camavinga, Ceballos, Guler, Brahim, Rodrygo, Bellingham and Vinicius were all on the team that won the CL 18 months agoMissing the point though: any clear out of underperforming players shouldn't be lead by, or done on behalf of, a particular manager
You should never clear out a squad because of a manager. But that doesn't mean that the squad shouldn't be cleared out. The question is where they're heading and it shows more and more that this squad is unbalanced and lacks the mentality that characterized Real Madrid teams in the past.
Btw, at least Fran Garcia, Carreras, Militao, Alaba, Mendy, Carvajal, Trent and Camavinga will be unavailable vs Alaves.
Rudiger is almost discarded and Mbappe is very doubtful.
I guess there will be a lineup including Courtois, Huijsen, Asencio, Valverde, Tchouameni, Ceballos, Bellingham, Vinicius, Rodrygo and Gonzalo. Alonso will have to lineup players from the academy, otherwise I don't know how he can manage this extremely difficult situation.
Rudiger is almost discarded and Mbappe is very doubtful.
I guess there will be a lineup including Courtois, Huijsen, Asencio, Valverde, Tchouameni, Ceballos, Bellingham, Vinicius, Rodrygo and Gonzalo. Alonso will have to lineup players from the academy, otherwise I don't know how he can manage this extremely difficult situation.
Forget Alonso. Real should use this as a pretext to ruthlessly crush the over the top player power at the club by making an example of a small group of their top players. It'll benefit them in the long run, even if this season is a writeoff, as every other player sees them as the destination to strive for anyway. When you're where they are, you don't need to accommodate outspoken underperforming players at all unles they've shown a Messi/Ronaldo consistency for some seasons.
How in the world is this season a write off? They are four points behind Barca and are still playing champions league. Everything is still within reach.
Wish we had this kind of ownership
I'd be surprised if Klopp was interested. He's got a cushy gig advising young German trainers like Leipzig's Ole Werner or Daniel Farke at Leeds on how to beat teams like Dortmund or Liverpool... Also, he can't speak Spanish so he can't rizz the players and media in Spain. If he ever joins La Liga, Barca is more likely since La Masia produces young players who suit a collective Gegenpressing system. They are more patient, Flick had shaky results earlier this seasom but his job was never in jeopardy.
Like @mctrials23 and @Raul Madrid said, it's not simply an issue of hard work if you saw the City game, they played at an unsustainably high intensity in the first 25 min (Klopp used to also do this
What I meant by Xabi needs time is he needs more time and experience before he's a CL contender, but the expectations at Madrid are crazy thus fans will be disappointed if they don't reach a CL final in the next 1-2 years. Currently Madrid lost to an out-of-form Liverpool and couldn't beat City at home, plus as I stated earlier his best CL run culminated in a 5-0 loss to Kompany's Bayern in the RO16. Thus there's a risk that even if Real Madrid allow Xabi to ship out the rabble rousers and buy all the hardworking, hard-running Bayer players and staff he desires, they still may not reach a CL final. This is fine for Arteta at Arsenal, i.e. Arsenal's board trusts and invests in his vision even if Arteta doesn't win anything for a few years and never wins the CL, Arsenal fans and execs will still be delighted if they managed to win another PL after 20 years. But at Real Madrid the expectations are higher so winning La Liga only is a failure, they want a coach who can guide them to win CLs. Hence Xabi needs to convince RM's hierarchy and players that he's capable of guiding them to a CL final but I'm not sure he's got the requisite experience needed yet and I doubt Real Madrid have the patience to wait 3-5 years while learns on the job.
Xabi got fast-tracked to a top job only because of his status as a star player for Spain, Bayern, RM, Liverpool but IMO he isn't ready to handle Madrid's expectations of CL success. Not everyone is Guardiola. Both Klopp and Tuchel were still at Mainz in their 4th year of coaching senior teams and Klopp still had a lot to learn at Dortmund especially in the CL, he once was sent off in a disastrous game in Napoli and watched the rest of the game with their janitor
careful what you wish for.
You must win every match or = fired
I'd be surprised if Klopp was interested. He's got a cushy gig advising young German trainers like Leipzig's Ole Werner or Daniel Farke at Leeds on how to beat teams like Dortmund or Liverpool... Also, he can't speak Spanish so he can't rizz the players and media in Spain. If he ever joins La Liga, Barca is more likely since La Masia produces young players who suit a collective Gegenpressing system. They are more patient, Flick had shaky results earlier this seasom but his job was never in jeopardy.
Like @mctrials23 and @Raul Madrid said, it's not simply an issue of hard work if you saw the City game, they played at an unsustainably high intensity in the first 25 min (Klopp used to also do thisBlitzkriegin his early days but realised the downsides later on) and outpressed City who were there for the taking but Rüdiger & Courtois, senior players who are usually reliable, made 2 silly errors that directly led to City goals.
What I meant by Xabi needs time is he needs more time and experience before he's a CL contender, but the expectations at Madrid are crazy thus fans will be disappointed if they don't reach a CL final in the next 1-2 years. Currently Madrid lost to an out-of-form Liverpool and couldn't beat City at home, plus as I stated earlier his best CL run culminated in a 5-0 loss to Kompany's Bayern in the RO16. Thus there's a risk that even if Real Madrid allow Xabi to ship out the rabble rousers and buy all the hardworking, hard-running Bayer players and staff he desires, they still may not reach a CL final. This is fine for Arteta at Arsenal, i.e. Arsenal's board trusts and invests in his vision even if Arteta doesn't win anything for a few years and never wins the CL, Arsenal fans and execs will still be delighted if they managed to win another PL after 20 years. But at Real Madrid the expectations are higher so winning La Liga only is a failure, they want a coach who can guide them to win CLs. Hence Xabi needs to convince RM's hierarchy and players that he's capable of guiding them to a CL final but I'm not sure he's got the requisite experience needed yet and I doubt Real Madrid have the patience to wait 3-5 years while learns on the job.
Xabi got fast-tracked to a top job only because of his status as a star player for Spain, Bayern, RM, Liverpool but IMO he isn't ready to handle Madrid's expectations of CL success. Not everyone is Guardiola. Both Klopp and Tuchel were still at Mainz in their 4th year of coaching senior teams and Klopp still had a lot to learn at Dortmund especially in the CL, he once was sent off in a disastrous game in Napoli and watched the rest of the game with their janitor
Its not about whether klopp is interested or not but having a manager of Klopp's quality would command respect from players instantly.
If Real Madrid B lose their next game, Xabi Alonso will be fired
Are you being funny?
Benitez was similar to klopp in many ways, but wasn't able to do well enough. Klopp is considered a better man manager though.
We definitely shouldn't be making any definitive decisions in december
Why? Doesn't it look incredibly stupid? Obviously this isn't what they actually plan.
I was meaning if it becomes a write off after making an example of some of the players. tbh I was half-joking anyway, I just enjoy the chaos.
Fan owned club voting its president and board in place sounds stupid to you?
Yes, very. Why would you think the fans have a clue?
So, I'm guessing their plan is to fire him then?
Why would you think the Glazers or Ratcliffe have a clue? The difference is if they prove to be clueless, Madrid can kick them out, and their reign won't last more than 4 years at most anyways
They’ve always done this and their trophy cabinet doesn’t look ”incredibly stupid”, quite the opposite.
They don’t feck around with mistakes like United do, they realise their managerial mistakes instead and quickly remedy them.
Whilst we continue to give managers years and wait for them to turn into the next Messiah, Madrid keep acting like a giant club, demand results and win the big trophies.
Last edited:
Yes Liverpool for example is very well known for it.
They have football experts advising them, they don't just make decisions, football fans are clueless.
It's on the club leadership, lets be honest. If you have a squad of "vibes" players, and then bring in a coach notorious for being very demanding on work rate etc., whose entire philosophy is built on players performing very specific roles and working in a very specific manner, then you can't be surprised if it takes a while to work. To function properly under Alonso Madrid need a complete change of their work culture, which is just a very lengthy and difficult process. If they are committed to it, then it will bear fruit eventually, probably. But I am absolutely certain that Madrid isn't a club that thinks about "eventually" or "probably". They want "immediately" and "definitely". The approach is completely alien to their entire organisational philosophy.
United, by contrast, are sticking to the "eventually" and "probably" model because they are trying to build an identity. Tactically, this has been a real flop - and I am pretty convinced that Amorim isn't the right manager to bring success on the pitch, but from what I have seen he has brought significant improvements in how players train, how they approach preparation, and their mentality. That will "eventually" hold us in very good stead, when we get in a manager who has a better approach to tactics and game management. Probably.
United, by contrast, are sticking to the "eventually" and "probably" model because they are trying to build an identity. Tactically, this has been a real flop - and I am pretty convinced that Amorim isn't the right manager to bring success on the pitch, but from what I have seen he has brought significant improvements in how players train, how they approach preparation, and their mentality. That will "eventually" hold us in very good stead, when we get in a manager who has a better approach to tactics and game management. Probably.
Say what?
Liverpool did the United thing and it took them 25 years for their Messiah to turn up man
Reminds me of Lockstock...
"...In fact, you're gonna have to work very hard to stay in a job, Xabi. Now do you understand everything I've said? Because if you don't, I'll sack ya."
who do you think makes decisions at real madrid
If you're already in that frame if mind just sack him now what's the point in carrying on
Not sure why people think Klopp is the answer. His past success has not come with big ego superstars, it has come with low key players that he turned into stars.
Experts, not fans.who do you think makes decisions at real madrid
It was sarcasm.Say what?
Liverpool did the United thing and it took them 25 years for their Messiah to turn up man
Exactly. So explain how an ownership system that holds those experts and the people who hired them accountable to the actual fans instead of a billionaire is bad?
Klopp would be brilliant anywhere, he’s the best manager in the World for me.
Why would you hold people accountable to the clueless? It's why they don't.
Unless the post 2000s globalization and consolidation of cash has permanently entrenched the elite of football with the same 4 clubs on route to win in europe in perpetuity which unfortunately may be a real possibility there eventually will be a period where a European cup every other will be considered far from guaranteed and long dry spells in europe will take shape perhaps even akin to how their post 60s to 97 drought looked like and in that scenario will they continue their hyper aggressive all or or nothing approach with managers? Surely it wouldn't be sustainable.
I see many people are doing their analysis based on a game vs City but what has brought Alonso to this situation are his games vs Liverpool, Elche, Rayo, Girona and Celta, all of them concentrated in period starting on 4th November, so basically one month. Apart from the bad results, the vibes the team has given off have been rather bad. A mix of lack of effort, ideas and quality mixed with rumours of mutiny of his players that I don't remember seeing in this club. I mean, it felt even worse than the worst Ancelotti's team last season.
And this is coming from someone who really likes Xabi as a person, player and coach in Germany and that would love to see him succeed here. However, I am very pessimistic at this point in time.
And this is coming from someone who really likes Xabi as a person, player and coach in Germany and that would love to see him succeed here. However, I am very pessimistic at this point in time.
- Status