How can you not rate Zidane? He literally ticks most boxes that would be important as a United coach. And don't come with the "he only managed one team" argument - so did Pep, so did Fergie....For some reason I don't rate Zidane and think this would be a disaster.
I don't think it's as complicated as you make it sound. Brendan Rodgers has implemented his style on Leicester fairly smoothly. Any manager who wants them to play football that is fluid, focused on ball retention and a solid press, will easily be able to do that. Same with Bielsa at Leeds. Potters is showing the same as Brighton now. I'm not saying we need to have something like a Barcelona way that we follow for the next 80 years, but I believe as a football club, we have never truly modernised and infact have made managerial selections that have ensured that we actively ignore the major tactical shifts that have occured in the game over the last 10-15 years. So we need a teacher type manager who can finally rid us of our tactical issues and get the team playing some slick progressive football, finally. That will bear fruit in the years to come. The next manager after that doesn't have to play the exact same way but ideally shouldn't be taking over a team that plays a shit version of 90's football in 2023/2024.Imo for that you'd need a whole change of the club structure and top hiearachy, especially youth structure. Managers come and go and they bring along with them their own style, their own philosophy. Without the above it's simply impossible to maintain a certain fixed style/system if the next manager comes with a completely different style and is allowed to implement his.
You look at clubs like Ajax, Bayern, Barcelona and you'd see their whole structure including youth development is set up to serve for a certain style. We don't have that and I don't think we ever will.
Why couldn't Zidane (or any other coach) not do that? I anyway believe that a system throughout the club is a myth and overrated - you don't really see it at any other top club except maybe Barca and Ajax.Good read
I would still prefer someone can bring in a progressive attacking system that can be instilled to bare fruit for years to come. But you know with Zidane given he has such big accomplishments.
My whole point is would you be so sure that Leicester or Leeds will play a similar football if their next manager is with a different mindset? Or is it possible for them to hire a manager with a different mindset once Rodgers and Bielsa leave?I don't think it's as complicated as you make it sound. Brendon Rodgers has implemented his style on Leicester fairly smoothly. Any manager who wants them to play football that is fluid, focused on ball retention and a solid press, will easily be able to do that. Same with Bielsa at Leeds. Potters is showing the same as Brighton now. I'm not saying we need to have something like a Barcelona way that we follow for the next 80 years, but I believe as a football club, we have never truly modernised and we have made managerial selections that have actively ignored tactical changes that have occured in the game over the last 10-15 years (and been shit tbf). So we need a teacher who can finally rid us of our tactical issues and get the team playing some slick progressive football, finally. That will bear fruit in the years to come. The next manager after that doesn't have to play the exact same way but ideally shouldn't be taking over a team that plays a shit version of 90's football in 2023/2024.
I'm interested by that one because Zidane was rumoured to be the one dictating France tactics in 2006 and his staff at Madrid wasn't made of particularly heralded individuals, some of them being absolute nobodies. I have seen people make that point several times on the caf but don't really understand where it comes from.Zidane is obviously a better manager than Solskjaer and may well do well here.
However, there is reason to think he isn't the perfect fit too. He unquestionably isn't the coaching-orientated manager I'd prefer, instead leaving a lot of the actual details to his coaches to implement and taking a more "adaptable" rather than system-orientated approach. And (true or not) there was an undercurrent of "switch play and hope for the best" and "relying on individual talent" snarkiness during his time at Madrid and complaints that his team weren't as well-drilled and hyper-organised as those other more system orientated ones. Which a lot of people will dismiss as coming from internet armchair tacticians but then then those internet armchair tacticians called the Solskjaer problems correctly a long time ago too.
Now it may be that would work for us. After all, it obviously worked for Madrid and Zidane isn't remotely comparable to someone like Ole as a manager, so happening to also be releatively hands off doesn't mean he's not very good. But with every manager carrying some level of risk, I'd prefer these weren't the areas where we took that risk.
Whoever we hire next, I would prefer them to be from that more coaching and system orientated mold. And I would be happier taking the risk on them not having won as many major trophies as of yet.
Not saying he'd be a bad appointment, but he would also be the appointment that someone who doesn't know much about football would make, being the most high-profile option. In doesn't take much football insight to argue "he's Zidane and he won a lot of Champions Leagues". And I have little trust in our board to hire him for any reasons deeper or better thought out than that.
I follow Madrid's IG, during Zidan's time, when they shared short clips of the training drills, especially shooting drills, it would be Zidane laying off the ball for the players, also there some clips of attacking drills where Zidane is actually involved and is inside the training pitch.I'm interested by that one because Zidane was rumoured to be the one dictating France tactics in 2006 and his staff at Madrid wasn't made of particularly heralded individuals, some of them being absolute nobodies. I have seen people make that point several times on the caf but don't really understand where it comes from.
Yeah he seemed as involved as Pep, neither lead the training sessions in theory for Zidane it's Bettoni, similarly to SAF having Meulensteen or Pep having Torrent years ago. They all focused on observing and interacting with individual or smaller group of players. Now maybe Zidane does nothing tactically behind closed doors but there isn't much to support that idea.I follow Madrid's IG, during Zidan's time, when they shared short clips of the training drills, especially shooting drills, it would be Zidane laying off the ball for the players, also there some clips of attacking drills where Zidane is actually involved and is inside the training pitch.
Whether the manager is hands-on type or the type that delegates to others doesn't matter, ultimately what matters is what happens on the pitch in terms of performances and results, and Zidane has proven himself and won plenty of trophies as a manager/head coachYeah he seemed as involved as Pep, neither lead the training sessions in theory for Zidane it's Bettoni, similarly to SAF having Meulensteen or Pep having Torrent years ago. They all focused on observing and interacting with individual or smaller group of players. Now maybe Zidane does nothing tactically behind closed doors but there isn't much to support that idea.
Great post.Zidane won 3 CLs in a row and 8 other trophies and you lot dismiss it all as fluke? feck's sake, if you know nothing about what you are posting then don't bother posting your stupid opinion. He won the league with RM in 2019/20 despite Ronaldo leaving, Hazard perma-crocked, Bale playing golf, Asensio became a shadow of himself, Jovic flopping hard, Ramos being their second top scorer with only 2 players hitting double digits on goals scored, and Messi scoring 25 goals while assisting 21.
People thinks that he is tactically awful simply because he doesn't have any philosophies. That is completely wrong because he believes in being pragmatic instead of sticking to one set philosophy and passage of play. He always adjusts his teams according to his opposition, and will not hesitate to abuse any weakness of his opponents despite it pissing the purists off. His "cross and ishallah" tactics is used often when teams are parked too deep against RM and he had prime Ronaldo and a forward-roaming Ramos in his team. Teams with a set philosophy will never do this, but Zidane knows the strength of his players and always tinker his tactics to them.
And what's with the fecking obsession with all these philosophies anyway. SAF had never stick to a single playstyle his whole career and he is the greatest manager in the world. SAF is known for adapting to his opponents and play to the strength of his players, and Zidane is exactly that, yet this forum thinks Ole is a better manager than Zidane? You lot are fecking hysterical and delusional.
I totally agree, the results with Zidane have been a well trained team and a coaching staff that is able to alter games through tactical changes. I can understand that people don't like the pragmatic nature of Zidane but I don't understand the claims that he is tactically limited.Whether the manager is hands-on type or the type that delegates to others doesn't matter, ultimately what matters is what happens on the pitch in terms of performances and results, and Zidane has proven himself and won plenty of trophies as a manager/head coach
Plenty of Real Madrid fans criticized everything and everyone at some point, including Ronaldo, Ramos, Raul, Casillas, Benzema or Del Bosque.Plenty of Madrid fans criticised his get it wide and cross it in approach.
Especially considering that he took over a RM team that were doing really badlyZZs record at RM is mightily impressive. Yes, he had a good squad but he showed a lot of adaptability during his tenure.
I doubt many managers could do worse than Ole but the fact ZZ has a style that has been proven at the highest level must resonate in the players. Taking tactical advice from Ole, Carrick and MacKenna must be quite uninspiring considering they’ve won nothing in management. Nothing.
Expect more rumours regarding ZZ in the coming weeks.
So he's just another Moyes vs. Fulham?Plenty of Madrid fans criticised his get it wide and cross it in approach.
I'm in the "let's get a tactician in here" group because, at this moment, our players look fecking clueless. We got world class stars in and turned them into championship players.Zidane won 3 CLs in a row and 8 other trophies and you lot dismiss it all as fluke? feck's sake, if you know nothing about what you are posting then don't bother posting your stupid opinion. He won the league with RM in 2019/20 despite Ronaldo leaving, Hazard perma-crocked, Bale playing golf, Asensio became a shadow of himself, Jovic flopping hard, Ramos being their second top scorer with only 2 players hitting double digits on goals scored, and Messi scoring 25 goals while assisting 21.
People thinks that he is tactically awful simply because he doesn't have any philosophies. That is completely wrong because he believes in being pragmatic instead of sticking to one set philosophy and passage of play. He always adjusts his teams according to his opposition, and will not hesitate to abuse any weakness of his opponents despite it pissing the purists off. His "cross and ishallah" tactics is used often when teams are parked too deep against RM and he had prime Ronaldo and a forward-roaming Ramos in his team. Teams with a set philosophy will never do this, but Zidane knows the strength of his players and always tinker his tactics to them.
And what's with the fecking obsession with all these philosophies anyway. SAF had never stick to a single playstyle his whole career and he is the greatest manager in the world. SAF is known for adapting to his opponents and play to the strength of his players, and Zidane is exactly that, yet this forum thinks Ole is a better manager than Zidane? You lot are fecking hysterical and delusional.
They're amongst the worst set of fans there is, they criticize everything.Plenty of Madrid fans criticised his get it wide and cross it in approach.
A manager like Zidane accepting to be treated like a supbar manager would be surprising.Would he be open to coming on an interim basis till the end of the season? And then we can decide. That'd be a dream scenario for me, but highly unlikely.
But possible if he has his eyes set on another job already (like the frech national team after the world cup?)A manager like Zidane accepting to be treated like a supbar manager would be surprising.
No he didn'tHow can you not rate Zidane? He literally ticks most boxes that would be important as a United coach. And don't come with the "he only managed one team" argument - so did Pep, so did Fergie....
What Zidane has done at RM has been incredible, there is no doubt about that. If he can replicate that at another team, how knows, but he has proven twice that can be a bloody great manager with tons of further potential. And, he's without a job
If that's the case he isn't taking any job and will just enjoy his family like every other manager in the same situation does.But possible if he has his eyes set on another job already (like the frech national team after the world cup?)
I'm basing my general opinion of how Zidane operates off various pieces I've read about his time at Madrid over the years.I'm interested by that one because Zidane was rumoured to be the one dictating France tactics in 2006 and his staff at Madrid wasn't made of particularly heralded individuals, some of them being absolute nobodies. I have seen people make that point several times on the caf but don't really understand where it comes from.
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As for his coaching staff, my impression based on the commentary around his time at Madrid was that gave more authority to staff like Pintus (who was his coach at Juve) than Lopotegui did and who then instilled a more fitness-focused regime at the club, though tbf I could be wrong in terms of how much he delegated the day to day management of training sessions.For Zidane, the easiest way to improve a team is to bring out the best in his players, not create an intricate tactical system that'll look to dominate an encounter. This is rooted in a central truth that Zidane has internalised since his days as a galactico: in the history of football, the team with the most talented players often wins. It is about the individual.
Meanwhile, the Pep Guardiola revolution has supporters talking formations, repeated patterns of play, group pressing, or novel ways of playing out from the back. But in his early career as coach thus far, the man who has most influenced Zinedine Zidane is Guardiola's opposite, Carlo Ancelotti.
It is not only that the two shared a touchline, but more importantly when they did, since it came right when Zidane was just starting out. When making the transition from superstar player to coach, the first thing Zizou picked up on was the Italian's man management, his greatest skill.
So in this sense, the French boss is not following the dominant trend in modern coaching, and frustrating many who expect a symphony not a collection of solos.
Bielsa is doing perfectly fine motivating his players and he doesn't have half the stature that Zidane has in football. Even otherwise, other than the English lads, the rest can either speak to him in French or Spanish.Does he speak English? If we're looking for a manager that can motivate and manage players individually and as a team, that's pretty important.
