[Wednesday at Stoke]

Clear-cut chance conversion - Premier League 2016/17
Player Club Clear-cut chances missed Clear-cut chance conversion %
Ibrahimovic Man Utd 19 26.92
Afobe Bournemouth 12 20
Aguero Man City 10 44.44
Costa Chelsea 10 33.33
Benteke Crystal Palace 9 50

http://www.skysports.com/football/n...ds-finishing-problems-reoccur-against-everton

He's had some good performances, especially the like the one in the league cup final but he also cost us points where another top striker would have done more.

 

[Manny]

I don't understand why he doesn't jump/challenge for high balls into the box.

Set pieces are particularly annoying. Doesn't move, doesn't challenge for the ball and is usually at the back post just looking for scraps and knockdowns.

 

[RedMaestro]

His performance in the Premier League hasn't been good enough. He is the 5th top scorer with by far the most 'big chance' misses in the league.

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/big_chance_missed

Now he is saying that we have to match his level if he will stay, well in the league Zlatan - we are. Stop bottling twice as many clear cut chances as the other top strikers in the league and we will be competing for the title.

Hope this guy leaves soon.

I think people are overly focusing on his conversion rate and forget that his figures for this season is really good for a team that has so many difficulties. If he'd scored on the those 'clear cut chances' then he'd be even better than 'peak-Messi' and why should anyone expect him to be at that level, no matter his age (besides him , but that's his way of performing outside the pitch)?

The problem is the other offensive players and if they'd scored and had better conversion rates (Martial, Rashford and Rooney, top 5 when you look at the worst in the PL) then the PL table would look much brighter from Manchester United's point of view. I have never seen a player score 50+ goals for a team per season when the other players score a total of about 15 goals in a top league. So why do people demand this of Ibrahimovic? I really don't get it.

But I can say this, if a better striker is available for next season, then it's a different question. Then I'd say it's a sensible thing to replace him. But who's this striker that can guarantee as much goals as Ibrahimovic and is willing to come to a club that is in 'limbo'? Not that many top players will 'risk' their careers for such a thing - Manchester United is starting to loose it's 'attraction', the same goes for Mourinho - the only players that would come are those that don't care about titles and will take a risk - there are so many top clubs at the moment so it's hard to attract them if they can't see that the club is starting to be as great as during the 'Sir Alex era'? I can't think of any player that can guarantee as much goals as Ibrahimovic at the moment and is willing to come is it Lukaku? He has a lot more to learn before being ready for the pressure of leading the line for Manchester United - even Ashley Williams got annoyed by Lukaku's play yesterday. Mourinho would tear him to pieces. Belotti is interesting but his price tag is extremely high and I'm not sure that he'll make an impact his first season, since Serie A and PL style of play is very different - sure he seems to fit the PL but still. He'd probably not risk it since there's a World Cup next season, at least how I see it.

But if Lewandowski, Aubameyang or even Suarez (not sure if anyone wants him because of his previous incidents in the PL and him playing for Liverpool, but I'm just stating his ability) would be available and if Ibrahimovic isn't willing to be a back-up for one of them, then I'd thank him for his fantastic contributions and be ok with him leaving. But this is wishful thinking and it's better to strengthen the other positions and when a world class striker is available, hopefully next season, then everything would work easily, just replacing one top striker with another top striker.

So please stop 'blaiming' the players that are actually doing something good (instead of 'nitpicking') and be glad that they are here and will want to stay even next season to help the team. Sure he's made mistakes, had poor games but given the fact that 5-10 other players have underperformed it's strange to be overly critical of his season. Maybe I'm just naive and don't know what the best thing for the club is but these are my views.

 

[RedMaestro]

I don't understand why he doesn't jump/challenge for high balls into the box.

Set pieces are particularly annoying. Doesn't move, doesn't challenge for the ball and is usually at the back post just looking for scraps and knockdowns.

He's not good at that despite his height. He's improved but isn't that good really.

 

[Manny]

He's not good at that despite his height. He's improved but isn't that good really.

Which leads me to my other point, if he doesn't head the ball why not have him at the front post at set pieces instead? There would be more loose balls and knockdowns for him to get on to. When he's at the far post, the ball is usually already contested and won leaving him out of the game or he chases a loose ball out to the wing.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

@RedMaestro

The other players are failing as well no question: Martial, Rashford and Rooney have pathetic conversion rates but it is undeniable that Zlatan has been a far worse finisher than his contemporaries in the PL and that is costing us too.

His contribution wouldn't be a massive issue for me if he wasn't talking to the press saying that United need to match his ambitions. If he only fluffed as many chances as Costa or Kane, instead of twice as many as them, then we would be competing for the title.

 

[Born2Lose]

What the clear cut chances stat and the amount of goals he has actually scored shows is that it's all about him.

19 clear cut chances, if he scored half of those against the right teams we could be right up there near Chelsea.

It's easy to talk about Mata, Rashford et al scoring more goals but when you have such a selfish player upfront it's actually very difficult.

Whithout him we are a mid-table team, with him we can win games and trophy. Simple as that.

Where did we finish last season without him? Typical Zlatan hyperbole.

Oh and I think I remember we wont a trophy last season too...

 

[Von Mistelroum]

Unless he's really fallen in love with the club in this short time, I think he'll leave in the summer. Can't see why he'd want to stay for probably his last season and have to try and drag us through to a top 4 spot when he could go somewhere else and finish on a real high with a league title.

 

[RedMaestro]

@RedMaestro

The other players are failing as well no question: Martial, Rashford and Rooney have pathetic conversion rates but it is undeniable that Zlatan has been a far worse finisher than his contemporaries in the PL and that is costing us too.

His contribution wouldn't be a massive issue for me if he wasn't talking to the press saying that United need to match his ambitions. If he only fluffed as many chances as Costa or Kane then we would be competing for the title.

Yeah, his 'boasting' or what you can call it, is sometimes a bit annoying but it's still good that there are players with a little bit of 'fire' in the club.

But what I was saying is that if he'd have a better conversion rate, like those in the top, wouldn't he be on almost 40 goals in 42 appearances (haven't counted just guessing) now? He'd be almost 'inhuman' with those stats. So instead of focusing on him missing a lot, we should be glad that he creates and his teammates create a lot for him to score this much. It's the way he's always played - he's never been someone with a superb conversion rate. He has an 'unorthodox' style of play and that could be why he sometimes misses. The more you shoot, isn't it likely that you'll miss more? Some are picky with their shots and take the 'safe way' and maybe that's why they have good conversion rates? Maybe he tries too much, I really don't know. I still think it's better that he creates a lot and has a bad conversion rate and still scores 30+ goals per season. Instead of creating very little and having the worlds best conversion rate and scoring 15+ goals per season. But that's just me.

He shouldn't get the blame for missing, every striker does that. Sure the team depends on him to score, but he shouldn't score all the goals. If Mkhitaryan, Rashford, Martial and even Pogba (how many times has he hit the woodwork now, 10?) and Rooney had as many goals as Mata (or close to it) then no one would care about Ibrahimovic's conversion rate, because he has 27 goals in 42 appearances.

But I think we just have different views and both sides will have difficulties 'convincing' the other. I'm just glad that we can do it in a 'civilized' way. Some people get aggressive when they discuss, especially about Ibrahimovic (both sides ).

 

[RedMaestro]

What the clear cut chances stat and the amount of goals he has actually scored shows is that it's all about him.

19 clear cut chances, if he scored half of those against the right teams we could be right up there near Chelsea.

It's easy to talk about Mata, Rashford et al scoring more goals but when you have such a selfish player upfront it's actually very difficult.



Where did we finish last season without him? Typical Zlatan hyperbole.

Oh and I think I remember we wont a trophy last season too...

You're obviously talking about someone else. Because Ibrahimovic isn't selfish. At least not anymore, he was early in his career. He loves to assist, besides, all strikers have to have a bit of selfishness or else they wouldn't have wanted to be a striker.

 

[RedMaestro]

Which leads me to my other point, if he doesn't head the ball why not have him at the front post at set pieces instead? There would be more loose balls and knockdowns for him to get on to. When he's at the far post, the ball is usually already contested and won leaving him out of the game or he chases a loose ball out to the wing.

As I see it, probably because it will be easier to 'use his legs' and he could have a little bit more time to do whatever he wants to do, pass or shot. But I'm not sure. It could also be that he's a very physical and aggressive player and Mourinho might not want him in the center and getting fouled all the time. He already gets a lot of unnecessary fouls which are wrong, mostly because he so much bigger and stronger then his opponents. He usually gets a foul when a player tries to 'bully' him and fails, or they run in to him and fall.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Whithout him we are a mid-table team, with him we can win games and trophy. Simple as that.

but but, we finished 5th and won a trophy without him last season?

 

[M Bison]

Cant dispute his contribution in terms of goals but his wider input isnt great in my view. I'm sick of seeing us with only Lingard in the box when we're attacking and Zlatan strolling around on the edge.

If he goes he goes, may be a blessing in disguise.

 

[Sylar]

That is true, but then he is also our only top level striker. Who knows how high Rashford's ceiling is (I'm not sure it's as high as the early hype) but he certainly isn't yet good enough to be a main goalscorer for a side that wants to challenge for the top 4 or the title

In other words its hard to judge how good Ibrahimovic has been for us, because there isn't any competition in the squad. The number of big changes he has missed is painfully high, despite his excellent goal return.

Oh no doubt, he defo should have taken some of the other good chances hes missed. But then when I think of other strikers weve had in the past, I can remember the likes of Cole, RVP, RVN (lesser extent) missing some glorious chances. But them not being highlighted as we had a plethora of others to help with our goal tallies. It seems to be right now, Zlatan or bust, which is scary.

For chelsea, Costa is their main man, but weve seen Hazard, Pedro etc contribute.
For City, Aguero is their main man, but Sane, Sterling etc have contributed.
Spurs, Kane is their main man, but Alli helps out.

IMO, the other players havent supported Zlatan to make some of his misses a lesser issue.

 

[NinjaZombie]

I'm not sure he'll sign a new contract if we don't finish fourth or win the Europa. You get the feeling he'll be turning his nose up at not playing in the CL for the second successive season.

 

[Dobbs]

Prior to his signing many posters said he was the perfect stop gap, his time here allowing Rashford/Martial to develop and takeover.

When I questioned how this would work, how would those two get game time up front to gain that experience, how would a year be enough time to develop, I was roundly dismissed as a hater.

So coming towards the end of this first year, I'm wondering how you guys feel about that. Is it working out? Have the two lads played enough up front to gain that experience, has a year been long enough etc.

 

[Sandikan]

I'm not sure he'll sign a new contract if we don't finish fourth or win the Europa. You get the feeling he'll be turning his nose up at not playing in the CL for the second successive season.

On his wage, for a club of our standing? I don't think so.

I don't think he'd swap for a lesser club just because they get 6 fixtures in the champions league!

 

[freeurmind]

He moved into the channels well and at time dropped deep to link the play but again missed a clear cut chance with the header. Not sure the club should be looking to retain him for next season tbh. They're betting off bringing someone younger in.

 

[Janson]

but but, we finished 5th and won a trophy without him last season?

We had Martial and Rashford performing, this year they've been shite.

 

[Raw]

We had Martial and Rashford performing, this year they've been shite.

And last season the competitiveness of the league was shite.

 

[clarkydaz]

'i did what I wanted in 3 months. how I feel today I don't know about next year.' hmm

 

[Stacks]

Prior to his signing many posters said he was the perfect stop gap, his time here allowing Rashford/Martial to develop and takeover.

When I questioned how this would work, how would those two get game time up front to gain that experience, how would a year be enough time to develop, I was roundly dismissed as a hater.

So coming towards the end of this first year, I'm wondering how you guys feel about that. Is it working out? Have the two lads played enough up front to gain that experience, has a year been long enough etc.

still a hater

 

[Leftback99]

Prior to his signing many posters said he was the perfect stop gap, his time here allowing Rashford/Martial to develop and takeover.

When I questioned how this would work, how would those two get game time up front to gain that experience, how would a year be enough time to develop, I was roundly dismissed as a hater.

So coming towards the end of this first year, I'm wondering how you guys feel about that. Is it working out? Have the two lads played enough up front to gain that experience, has a year been long enough etc.

Rashford has played too much and hasn't proved that last season was anything more than a purple patch yet. Martial hasn't played enough but it's nothing to do with Zlatan since his best position is left wing/forward.

 

[Dobbs]

Rashford has played too much and hasn't proved that last season was anything more than a purple patch yet. Martial hasn't played enough but it's nothing to do with Zlatan since his best position is left wing/forward.

So the theory about him being a perfect stop gap, has it played out that way in your opinion?

 

[Ixion]

So the theory about him being a perfect stop gap, has it played out that way in your opinion?

If we were relying on Rashford to lead the line this season and get 27 goals which he clearly isn't ready for the pressure and criticism on him would be ridiculous and confidence destroying. You can see how much it's getting to him just now missing chances. So yes its working out fine.

 

[Dobbs]

If we were relying on Rashford to lead the line this season and get 27 goals which he clearly isn't ready for the pressure and criticism on him would be ridiculous and confidence destroying. You can see how much it's getting to him just now missing chances. So yes its working out fine.

That's not what I'm asking. Clearly you shouldn't rely on Rashford this season.

I'm asking do you think Rashford will be ready next season now Ibra has plugged the gap for a year? That was the promise from many posters when Ibra was rumoured to be signing.

 

[Ixion]

That's not what I'm asking. Clearly you shouldn't rely on Rashford this season.

I'm asking do you think Rashford will be ready next season now Ibra has plugged the gap for a year? That was the promise from many posters when Ibra was rumoured to be signing.

Who knows if he'll be ready next season, he's still so young. He will be closer to being ready though. Come back in a year to make this attempt to slag Ibra off.

 

[Leftback99]

So the theory about him being a perfect stop gap, has it played out that way in your opinion?

'Perfect' is a strong word and i'm not sure the whole 'develop to takeover from so and so' thing ever happens, especially in key attacking positions for elite clubs. He's still the best option we had last summer. I'm not convinced Rashford will ever be ready to lead the line for us as our main man.

 

[Dobbs]

Who knows if he'll be ready next season, he's still so young. He will be closer to being ready though. Come back in a year to make this attempt to slag Ibra off.

How can you possibly misconstrue this as a criticism of Ibra. In no way would it be his fault if Martial/Rashford aren't ready to take over.

It's a simple question, do you think Rashford will be ready to lead the line for United next season.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

How can you possibly misconstrue this as a criticism of Ibra. In no way would it be his fault if Martial/Rashford aren't ready to take over.

It's a simple question, do you think Rashford will be ready to lead the line for United next season.

No for me and it's irrelevant to Ibra being here or not.

Rashford isn't good enough to be our main striker at the moment.

 

[Hed Zitin]

He's the only player that scores with any regularity. Can't believe people want him to go.

 

[bucky]

He's the only player that scores with any regularity. Can't believe people want him to go.

I want him to stay, but some people might feel, if we properly replace his goals with 2 other players, we could be better off, similar to moving on from van Nistelrooy.

 

[Giggs86]

I doubt he'd want to stay in this team for another season to be honest..

Rashford leading the line next season... wow..

Can you really blame him if he wouldn't want to stay? The guy is pure class and at his age it's either challenge for trophies or feck off to China/MLS for a final paycheck.

And Mourinho is not that naive to let Rashford lead the line. Ain't going to happen in a million years. If Zlatan leaves Mou will bring in a replacement.

 

[addo]

Dont know why text isnt included.. but apparantly no Premier league player has scored more goals than Zlatan this season in all comps.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Yeah, our number one priority should be to get rid of this guy as he's holding us back.

 

[Man-United]

Quality goal!

But but he missed a few simple passes the first 20 mins so not good enough.

 

[Minimalist]

He was a reasonable free transfer.

 

[Eriku]

Great goal, and what a pass to Shaw on the run shortly after.

We have very few players capable of his inventive passing. Why some people perceive him as being a goals merchant at the cost of general play is beyond me.

 

[Kush]

We'd be fecked without him, people will no doubt slag him off for missing sitters but he's the only player who's been scoring and creating goals for us on a regular basis. To me, it speaks more about the others who are unable to step up when Ibra can't find back of the net. Before we even go down looking for summer signings we need to get this guy signed for next season.

 

[Shark]

It annoys me so much that nobody else has stepped up with Ibra. He really doesn't deserve to do what he's gone and finish fecking 5th. We need to get in more players of his quality in the summer. We've too much average, cowardly dross.