Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap

[Brownie85]

You may be right, nobody knows. But if you believe that then just carry on in blissful knowledge that all is well.

I don't know for sure as you don't, but there's nothing to suggest otherwise. Where's the reputable sources confirming any changes? I don't think any of them would even give a crap about the Ronaldo news if it meant them getting clicks and traffic for some juicy transfer news.

So you're basically taking Laporta as gospel truth and that the deal is dead and we're holding off on a brief because of Ronaldo? Yep makes sense. Let's just announce some unknown guy to soften the blow first before announcing our main target is off. Am sure that'll make everyone happy

 

[WPMUFC]

Exactly as I've been saying.

Tonight's comments are exactly what you expect your club president to say. Fans would be furious if he was to roll over and admit he's going. They want to appear to be strong and doing all they can to keep their best players. They know the truth is much different

Laporta has just set up the media narrative that if Barca sell him its because FDJ wouldn't take a big enough pay cut. Politics 101.

 

[WPMUFC]

I don't know for sure as you don't, but there's nothing to suggest otherwise. Where's the reputable sources confirming any changes? I don't think any of them would even give a crap about the Ronaldo news if it meant them getting clicks and traffic for some juicy transfer news.

So you're basically taking Laporta as gospel truth and that the deal is dead and we're holding off on a brief because of Ronaldo? Yep makes sense. Let's just announce some unknown guy to soften the blow first before announcing our main target is off. Am sure that'll make everyone happy

according to the doomers, Laporta's words are gospel, but his negotiation of a fixed fee can be thrown aside and dismissed.

 

[pocco]

Exactly as I've been saying.

Tonight's comments are exactly what you expect your club president to say. Fans would be furious if he was to roll over and admit he's going. They want to appear to be strong and doing all they can to keep their best players. They know the truth is much different

Their fans know their financial predicament. It's common knowledge, not just exclusive info for RedCafe posters. So if we know the script, they're not going to fool anybody with these sort of media tricks.

Seems pretty pointless.

 

[Brownie85]

Laporta has just set up the media narrative that if Barca sell him its because FDJ wouldn't take a big enough pay cut. Politics 101.

Yup means Laporta comes out of this smelling of roses and de Jong is painted as this money hungry arsehole who wouldn't take a pay cut to stay at the club he loves.

They'll pretty much paint his as a mercenary who didn't respect Barca or their fans

 

[pocco]

Laporta has just set up the media narrative that if Barca sell him its because FDJ wouldn't take a big enough pay cut. Politics 101.

And when FdJ says Barca never discussed a pay cut, it blows up in their face anyway.

In fact, don't be surprised if there's stories from his agent that he'll reduce his wages to stay, killing this hand you think Barca are trying to play.

 

[Berbaclass]

Their fans know their financial predicament. It's common knowledge, not just exclusive info for RedCafe posters. So if we know the script, they're not going to fool anybody with these sort of media tricks.

Seems pretty pointless.

It's a blatant attempt at shifting the blame onto Bartomeu and Tebas. Saying "I will do everything in my power" to keep him there.

 

[Brownie85]

Their fans know their financial predicament. It's common knowledge, not just exclusive info for RedCafe posters. So if we know the script, they're not going to fool anybody with these sort of media tricks.

Seems pretty pointless.

Yep they do, but it doesn't mean that he's going to roll over and admit defeat does it? Come reelection time he'll be able to say he did everything possible to keep Barcas best players but things outside of his control forced his hand.

 

[pocco]

A paycut isn't enough. They need him out.

We don't know that.

 

[Berbaclass]

We don't know that.

Yes we do. They currently can't register new players as they are spending too much on salary.

 

[Brownie85]

And when FdJ says Barca never discussed a pay cut, it blows up in their face anyway.

In fact, don't be surprised if there's stories from his agent that he'll reduce his wages to stay, killing this hand you think Barca are trying to play.

How much of a paycut does he have to take though.

People saying a pay cut isn't enough though... how are Barca going to reduce their wage bill enough to keep FdJ, sign Raphinha, renew Dembele and register 2 more players?

 

[pocco]

I don't know for sure as you don't, but there's nothing to suggest otherwise. Where's the reputable sources confirming any changes? I don't think any of them would even give a crap about the Ronaldo news if it meant them getting clicks and traffic for some juicy transfer news.

So you're basically taking Laporta as gospel truth and that the deal is dead and we're holding off on a brief because of Ronaldo? Yep makes sense. Let's just announce some unknown guy to soften the blow first before announcing our main target is off. Am sure that'll make everyone happy

As I said, announce Malacia and another (eg Martinez or whoever) or stories of other potential signings to get excitement back. Whichever they think works best or is feasible (if there's another target close to being signed).

And I don't think the FdJ news is much bigger, if at all, than Ronaldo wanting to leave us after a year. This will be mentioned for years to come when talking about how badly run we've been. FdJ will be forgotten by the next transfer window.

 

[WPMUFC]

And when FdJ says Barca never discussed a pay cut, it blows up in their face anyway.

all they have to do is create the doubt and get local reporters to present their side of the story. That's politics 101. How much journalist time is actually going to be spent on asking FDJ how much of pay cut was he going to take? If the deal goes through are you expecting the MUTV interviewer to ask him about barca wage cuts?

I really don't understand how you see Laporta agree a fixed fee with us over the course of a month and then him openly lying in public and seeming take him as an honest actor when he's nothing more than a weasel.

 

[fallengt]

fecking great. We're going full circle again.
6 years and we still can't have a midfield

 

[NewGlory]

being a United fan is a rollercoaster for sure.

hear! hear!

 

[Berbaclass]

As I said, announce Malacia and another (eg Martinez or whoever) or stories of other potential signings to get excitement back. Whichever they think works best or is feasible (if there's another target close to being signed).

And I don't think the FdJ news is much bigger, if at all, than Ronaldo wanting to leave us after a year. This will be mentioned for years to come when talking about how badly run we've been. FdJ will be forgotten by the best transfer window.

You're kidding yourself if you think that this is anywhere near the size of the Ronaldo story.

 

[Aeryis]

fecking great. We're going full circle again.
6 years and we still can't have a midfield

It's beautiful, isn't it? More than 6 years since we've had a consistent competent midfield. Says it all about our management, both the Glazers/Woodward and our coaches. Ole literally went through 3 summer transfer windows and never really sought to improve the centre midfield.

 

[Red_toad]

I'm afraid it feels like we've been mugged off... Not saying it's definitely dead but the fact that it's dragged on sooooo long and always being 'done this week' suggests maybe Barca were just trying to cut his pay. I hope I'm wrong

They’ve just agreed a deal for Raphinha with money they do not have, so they Have very little option.

 

[Brownie85]

As I said, announce Malacia and another (eg Martinez or whoever) or stories of other potential signings to get excitement back. Whichever they think works best or is feasible (if there's another target close to being signed).

And I don't think the FdJ news is much bigger, if at all, then Ronaldo wanting to leave us after a year. This will be mentioned for years to come when talking about how badly run we've been. FdJ will be forgotten by the best transfer window.

Do you truly see the signing of Malacia as exciting? I can guarantee that most people will be like who the feck is he? Signing defenders when our midfield is a shambles won't cause excitement, it'll cause depression and lots of it!

It was expected that Ronaldo would ask to leave when we failed to qualify for the CL. Still United say he's not for sale and people call BS and he's gone regardless. Barca say they won't sell de Jong after negotiating a fee and people lose their crap and believe its all over.

Makes no sense.

 

[Berbaclass]

They’ve just agreed a deal for Raphinha with money they do not have, so they Have very little option.

As far as I know, I could be wrong here but to comply with the La Liga FFP rules to sign Raphinha for €60 million for example they would need to show revenue of €60 million. Where do you think that is coming from as the second economic lever is not ready yet...

 

[pocco]

How much of a paycut does he have to take though.

People saying a pay cut isn't enough though... how are Barca going to reduce their wage bill enough to keep FdJ, sign Raphinha, renew Dembele and register 2 more players?

They've managed to do it with these other players. If they truly wanted to keep FdJ then they could have let another go and reduced his wage, or whatever works to balance the wage bill. They're all on crazy wages there. They can't be in too much shit if they still want to spend £100m and add the wages of Raphinha and Lewandowski. They could have let Dembele go. They could have done a lot of stuff, but they haven't. All I'm saying is perhaps they don't need to sell FdJ either.

 

[Bondi77]

Better off closing this thread and just open one up for Frenkie in the Performance thread if he signs for us.

 

[Brownie85]

They've managed to do it with these other players. If they truly wanted to keep FdJ then they could have let another go and reduced his wage, or whatever works to balance the wage bill. They're all on crazy wages there. They can't be in too much shit if they still want to spend £100m and add the wages of Raphinha and Lewandowski. They could have let Dembele go. They could have done a lot of stuff, but they haven't. All I'm saying is perhaps they don't need to sell FdJ either.

They've still got to renew Sergi Roberto too, another case of Laporta lies as I posted earlier on.

They want to add players, with money they don't have. They've also got Christensen and Kessie to announce and register. Unless they've come into new found billions, I just don't see how they can do it.

 

[pocco]

Do you truly see the signing of Malacia as exciting? I can guarantee that most people will be like who the feck is he? Signing defenders when our midfield is a shambles won't cause excitement, it'll cause depression and lots of it!

It was expected that Ronaldo would ask to leave when we failed to qualify for the CL. Still United say he's not for sale and people call BS and he's gone regardless. Barca say they won't sell de Jong after negotiating a fee and people lose their crap and believe its all over.

Makes no sense.

It depends, I was giving an example. We may have Malacia and another player close to signing. The more likely option is we'd hear about us trying to sign João Felix and another midfielder (for example), even if it's not true, and that would reduce the impact of the FdJ news. Kind of like when we used to release a statement after a failed signing that we were assessing candidates for the DoF position. Same principle. We've done this shit for years.

 

[pocco]

They've still got to renew Sergi Roberto too, another case of Laporta lies as I posted earlier on.

They want to add players, with money they don't have. They've also got Christensen and Kessie to announce and register. Unless they've come into new found billions, I just don't see how they can do it.

Hasn't he said they'll be announced early next week? Just how well do you understand the finances of Barcelona and their other upcoming "levers"? Genuine question. Because it's probably not as black and white as made out with the lending capabilities of some of these football clubs.

 

[WPMUFC]

Just remember everyone, whatever Laporta says is gospel and he can never lie.

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[Brownie85]

It depends, I was giving an example. We may have Malacia and another player close to signing. The more likely option is we'd hear about us trying to sign João Felix and another midfielder, even if it's not true, and that would reduce the impact of the FdJ news. Kind of like when we used to release a statement after a failed signing that we were assessing candidates for the DoF position. Same principle. We've done this shit for years.

Completely agree with the fact that we've done this shit for years, but if the FdJ deal falls though after agreeing a fee etc, and possibly losing Ronaldo too, it'll take something special to get the fans back on side again.

Still, to me, the silence from all the usual sources speaks volumes. If things have gone tits up, I'm sure one of them would know about it. Hell, these twitter journos thrive on getting stories out first! Romero basically said he's been told info that he can't release yet and couldn't wait to get it out there.

 

[pocco]

Yes we do. They currently can't register new players as they are spending too much on salary.

Currently as of when? Because they're registering these players next week apparently, whilst chasing two big money signings.

 

[Brownie85]

Hasn't he said they'll be announced early next week? Just how well do you understand the finances of Barcelona and their other upcoming "levers"? Genuine question. Because it's probably not as black and white as made out with the lending capabilities of some of these football clubs.

Aside from them selling off some of their TV rights for quite a bit of cash, I'm not too familiar. I just know that they're in a bit of a crap situation with amazingly bad debts.

 

[OpenIntrovert]

Most of you guys seem to be only interested in the transfers only because the rival clubs are buying a lot of players. Buying players does not mean that we will compete. Ultimately it depends on how the manager keeps the players motivated and adapts the players into his tactics. There were transfer windows where SAF had 1 or 2 signings as compared to the other clubs, and he still won titles.

Pipe down or else, take a breather from the forum until the season starts. You guys are too engrossed over the transfers.

 

[Berbaclass]

Currently as of when? Because they're registering these players next week apparently, whilst chasing two big money signings.

Currently as in now. They are the only La Liga club with a negative salary limit meaning they absolutely have to move players on or negotiate big wage cuts.

Here is an example of how it works.

For example, Robert Lewandowski has reportedly agreed to a €16m gross salary per season in a three-year contract with Barcelona. If Bayern Munich let him leave for a fee of around €40m, the amortization quota would be fixed at around €13.33m.

In that specific scenario, Barcelona would need to build up €30m in fair play for his transfer. The 49% sale of BLM for €320m would guarantee €106m in salary margin, more than enough to register him and the other signings that have already been completed.

A last resort can be the sale of important players. Selling footballers can also give the team a positive balance but to a lesser extent. Frenkie de Jong has been met with much media speculation recently.

Using the reported figures, say Manchester United signed him for €80m, and his current wage sat at €16m gross per season.

By subtracting the pending €40m amortization in his contract from the transfer fee, as well as adding the positive balance gained from offloading his wage, Barça could net €56m from his sale. And as per the 1/3rd rule, around €19m in fair play space could be generated.

 

[pocco]

Completely agree with the fact that we've done this shit for years, but if the FdJ deal falls though after agreeing a fee etc, and possibly losing Ronaldo too, it'll take something special to get the fans back on side again.

Still, to me, the silence from all the usual sources speaks volumes. If things have gone tits up, I'm sure one of them would know about it. Hell, these twitter journos thrive on getting stories out first! Romero basically said he's been told info that he can't release yet and couldn't wait to get it out there.

Maybe. But what I will argue here is that they've all gone in 100% saying he will join, so they might be taking their time to see what happens before they say they were wrong. But even Romero has kind of back tracked a little by emphasizing that we've not agreed anything with FdJ and have no agreement with him, nor full agreement with Barca. So he's left the door open for his eventual excuses if it doesn't happen.

 

[WPMUFC]

Maybe. But what I will argue here is that they've all gone in 100% saying he will join, so they might be taking their time to see what happens before they say they were wrong. But even Romero has kind of back tracked a little by emphasizing that we've not agreed anything with FdJ and have no agreement with him, nor full agreement with Barca. So he's left the door open for his eventual excuses if it doesn't happen.

In what reality would Simon Stone and the BBC care about a deal falling apart? The deal falling through is a massive news day for them

 

[Berbaclass]

In what reality would Simon Stone and the BBC care about a deal falling apart? The deal falling through is a massive news day for them

Exactly British press would climb all over themselves to report negative news on United. United don't pick and choose when it happens

 

[pocco]

Currently as in now. They are the only La Liga club with a negative salary limit meaning they absolutely have to move players on or negotiate big wage cuts.

Here is an example of how it works.

And their next round of finance won't change this? The only way they can make signings is to sell players? Because I've read quotes from Laporte saying he's going to agree a few of these finance deals that will clear debt, part wages and free up money for transfers. The Spanish journalists have said the same, no mention of having to sell de Jong.

 

[Brownie85]

Exactly British press would climb all over themselves to report negative news on United. United don't pick and choose when it happens

Has any of the British press actually jumped on the comments, aside from those like the MEN etc? You'd think if it was a sure thing and thar Barca were adamant he was staying they'd be all over it. I'm pretty sure they won't look at the Ronaldo news and think "aaaah it's OK, we'll give United fans a night off, they've suffered enough today".

 

[WPMUFC]

Exactly British press would climb all over themselves to report negative news on United. United don't pick and choose when it happens

doesn't have to even be united related. If credible well know journos go big on any transfer stories for big players and then the clubs break negotiations that is a HUGE media day.

 

[Berbaclass]

And their next round of finance won't change this? The only way they can make signings is to sell players? Because I've read quotes from Laporte saying he's going to agree a few of these finance deals that will clear debt, part wages and free up money for transfers. The Spanish journalists have said the same, no mention of having to sell de Jong.

It's still unknown when these deals will be agreed/finalized.

Short-term to sign players they need to move players on.

Frenkie is most appealing as he gives them a big fee + big wage removed. It's absolutely no coincidence Laporta comes out with such bullish comments after they have stabilized the club in the short term. Due to the intricacies of how the wage bill works their negotiating position with United has been strengthened (first lever-activated) and they are now trying to get as much as they possibly can out of us as it all counts.

 

[Berbaclass]

Has any of the British press actually jumped on the comments, aside from those like the MEN etc? You'd think if it was a sure thing and thar Barca were adamant he was staying they'd be all over it. I'm pretty sure they won't look at the Ronaldo news and think "aaaah it's OK, we'll give United fans a night off, they've suffered enough today".

No one worth taking any notice of.

 

[pocco]

In what reality would Simon Stone and the BBC care about a deal falling apart? The deal falling through is a massive news day for them

They need confirmation from somebody involved first. Simon Stone isn't the best example though because he seems in cahoots with the club and seems to tread carefully on most topics.