Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach | Thread locked during matches

[DON’T PANIC ™]

I think he’s a breath of fresh air and am hopeful for the future but………

Why is he over complicating things? Play the new LWB on the left. Stop moving centre backs side to side in the middle of games. Stop playing Dalot, he’s sh1t.
Pick your best 11 in their best position for your system and stick with them. Replace the weakest in the summer, keep the players that have demonstrated they have learned their role. Should be easy really.

 

[always_hoping]

Did you see when Southampton tore us up and should’ve been 3-0 up at half time at OT? How about that rancid match at Fulham where we win off a one in a million deflection from outside the box? The win in Europe against HSBC, well they’re about the level of a mid table Championship club. Sure he’s done it in Portugal but this is the big leagues. Every team, even relegation fodder, are strong, physical and athletic with a plan. I’ve been thinking about this whole ‘this season is a write off narrative’ but if nothing else he needs to show something to the higher ups where they trust him with a rebuild. It’s utterly pathetic and for me it’s 50/50, he could go on to become our saviour but I wouldn’t be surprised in the slightest if he turns out to be another false hope.

I was in attendance for the Southampton game. 1st half United played poor and made Southampton look decent but it was still just a few Onana routine saves and conceded with OG. Garnacho, Anthony missed sitters before turning things around.
Better side 2nd half as were tonight ended up winning.

No question about luck tonight as if VAR in operation that winner is disallowed then again who knows how the game would have panned out in Extra time?

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Yeah agree. I thought the whole idea of appointing a director of football (do we actually have one now that Ashworth has been binned?), was that he directed the formation that the team would play, and identify the players required. If we sign players for Amorim's 3-5-2 or whatever it is, and then he gets the bullet in the autumn, it would effectively mean we have to appoint another manager who plays the same system, or rip it up and start again wasting another 2 seasons. This to me is the reason why Ashworth didn't want Amorim and why Liverpool shyed away from him after some initial interest.

I think you're bang on, especially regarding Ashworth.

If it turns out that Ashworth was the smart one in the room and the users pushed him out I'm going to cry.

Thankfully an offside goal - which never happens to any other club in cup matches without VAR, obviously - helped us out tonight, so he's got a stay of execution for another week few hours.

 

[Withnail]

Primarily on the team selection. Do you think it was a coincidence that we brought on someone with legs to stretch Leicester, moved Amad to RWB, swapped our wide CBs around to the correct positions and then suddenly the players weren’t meek and cowardly?

Arguably, we had no less than 7 players playing out of their best positions in the first half. The players are always going to play better if the team is set up correctly.

Not really no. While I agree there were strange choices, there was no excuse for it imo. Players could have turned and driven forward many times but took the safe option and passed it backwards instead.

It's a habit now especially at home. They start games very slowly and conservatively. At one point the thought crossed my mind that it was maybe some kind of ill-advised game plan but the manager had complained about it and Maguire also said it needed to improve in the post match interview.

 

[Stig]

He has said he will never change it and has been very adamant about that. He will absolutely look weak if he does

But he's also said that he does change. Said it in a post match interview. I guess it comes down to the interpretations he's making of change.

 

[Flying_Heckfish]

It's all about next season. We've clearly written this one off. No CL via league, no real aspiration to win a cup.

But it can't all be "jam tomorrow"... right now he needs to avoid this current season being a complete shit show. That first half today was absolutely as boring and listless as the nadir of the LvG era.

We have to see progress, or at the very least we have to be entertained. Give us just a little excitement now, show some of your creativity and ingenuity, so that we can all believe what you're selling.

 

[Brand Nubian]

No matter circumstances, this is a great win and a relief for Amorim. He´s needed it, the pressure was mounting.

 

[Ronaldo's ego]

I was in attendance for the Southampton game. 1st half United played poor and made Southampton look decent but it was still just a few Onana routine saves and conceded with OG. Garnacho, Anthony missed sitters before turning things around.
Better side 2nd half as were tonight ended up winning.

No question about luck tonight as if VAR in operation that winner is disallowed then again who knows how the game would have panned out in Extra time?

We can speculate until the cows come home, which is the purpose of such forums but like with most things, time will tell.

 

[Stig]

He's absolutely fuming tonight. post match, and in the press conference. Hopefully it's chanelled into something good, he was visibly holding back pure anger I felt.

But he's the one to blame here.

Wrong players in the wrong positions playing the wrong system with no effort and no enthusiasm.

He's got to fact up to the fact that he needs to change.

 

[Vault Dweller]

The Dorgu sub was apparently pre planned, I'm fine with that

Not the sub. The playing opposite sides.

 

[Wing Attack Plan R]

We are whistling past the graveyard with these performances.

 

[pocco]

But he's the one to blame here.

Wrong players in the wrong positions playing the wrong system with no effort and no enthusiasm.

He's got to fact up to the fact that he needs to change.

Apparently he was stubborn at Sporting too, but in the end things turned out well. We’ll just have to hope they do here too. Some of his decisions frustrate me even though I’m fully behind him. The stats show that we are better with a winger in one of the wing back positions, so he needs to move to that and be more proactive. Also Leicester’s wingers were pinning our WBs back in the first half meaning we had 5 defending vs 3 and were outnumbered elsewhere. This wasn’t something he did at sporting and I hope he stops allowing it here too. We need to be more aggressive in our setup.

 

[Squeaky_Bum_Time]

Not sure if you’re agreeing with me or not but I thought he did improve second half. He was woeful in the 1st

I’m agreeing with you

 

[sglowrider]

This seasons a right off the moment they spent all that money in the summer and then sacked ETH, ten weeks later.

Amorim gets a free hit this season. Otherwise we might as well accuse INEOS of setting him up for failure - especially after what they did in the winter transfer window.

 

[LDUred]

He's got a tendency to reinvent the wheel alright.

Just play Dorgu on the left, and Dalot or whoever on the right. It doesn't make any sense to unnecessarily play natural left and right footers out of position. If both the WBs and WFs are inverted the ball just comes inside all the time.

He does need to be flexible with his system. That first goal came from having numbers in the box. You can sacrifice one of those centre backs at home and play another striker.

Admittedly, going away from home, bolstering the defence makes sense, but in the PL, you need to be more aggressive, particularly against a low block, and you need to overload more in attack.

 

[Dominos]

Behave!

6 wins in 8 now

It's really weird when you put it like that because it still feels like we're on a dreadful run of form.

Late winners against terrible sides in Southampton, Leicester and Rangers in poor performances. Late deflected win against Fulham in what was a dreadful performance. A penalty shootout win. Routine win FCSB in what might be our only acceptable performances. Two dreadful defeats.

 

[alexthelion]

You bunch of fannies! If you haven't got the stomach for some tough times, just say so. Come back in the summer lads when silly season starts again.

 

[tomaldinho1]

It’s almost comical how much I was looking forward to seeing Dorgu LWB and Dalot RWB and how I dared to hope for a few overlapping runs, a cross or two, maybe even a cut back, just the hint of balance. Then seeing how we lined up and just knowing we’d be crap.

 

[alexthelion]

He needs to stop stalking the sidelines. What kind of message is he sending to the players?

Yes, he should just sit on his arse like Ole did.

 

[stevoc]

Because ETH would serve up performances like that claim it was acceptable, because we got the win, so he clearly didn’t know the standard required.

Ole would also serve up shit and claim everything was okay afterwards.

Both managers admitted when performances were bad at times. They obviously weren't going to do it when their job was on the line. Right now Amorims job is as safe as houses, let's see if he's so candid in 6-12 months time if he's still struggling.

 

[UnitedSofa]

It's all about next season. We've clearly written this one off. No CL via league, no real aspiration to win a cup.

But it can't all be "jam tomorrow"... right now he needs to avoid this current season being a complete shit show. That first half today was absolutely as boring and listless as the nadir of the LvG era.

We have to see progress, or at the very least we have to be entertained. Give us just a little excitement now, show some of your creativity and ingenuity, so that we can all believe what you're selling.

No real aspiration to win a cup?

Fought till the end today and unbeaten in the EL - what on earth are you talking about?

 

[UnitedSofa]

 

[Marcus]

My only concern is whether Amorim's approach only works in a weaker league setting. I hope I am wrong and that getting our players to instinctively play his way will be the road to success.

 

[Red00012]

He needs to stop stalking the sidelines. What kind of message is he sending to the players?

This place

 

[Ronaldo's ego]

Only 87 more until we click.

 

[NoPace]

Yeah agree. I thought the whole idea of appointing a director of football (do we actually have one now that Ashworth has been binned?), was that he directed the formation that the team would play, and identify the players required. If we sign players for Amorim's 3-5-2 or whatever it is, and then he gets the bullet in the autumn, it would effectively mean we have to appoint another manager who plays the same system, or rip it up and start again wasting another 2 seasons. This to me is the reason why Ashworth didn't want Amorim and why Liverpool shyed away from him after some initial interest.

I think this isn't going to be a huge problem for us, sort of by accident, because our presumably long-term #10s - Garnacho and Amad - are actually wingers. And the young wingbacks we buy like Dorgu and the next one can probably age into being more defensively solid, very attacking fullbacks.


Let's say our only big buy this summer is Gyokeres or another striker. if our first XI in the medium term is:

----------Gyokeres---------
-----Garnacho-Amad
--------Bruno-Ugarte
Dorgu----------------Dalot/WB
--Licha-DeLigt-Yoro---

that's just adding one midfielder (and it can maybe be Mainoo) and dropping a CB away from:

-------------Gyokeres---------
Garnacho--------------Amad
---------Bruno-Mainoo--------
-------------Ugarte----------------
Dorgu----------------Dalot/Mazraoui
----------Licha--Yoro------------

and it's not like anyone is horribly out of position. If we had a bunch of pure #10s instead of wingers, it would probably be a bigger risk.

 

[Chief123]

FFS, stop this shitty formation.


...................Onana....................
Maz......De Ligt.....Yoro.......Dorgu
................Cas.....Ugarte...............
.....................Bruno.......................
Amad..........Hojilund............Garna

There’s absolutely zero chance you will see this formation or any variation of it. Amorim would have to be sacked for you to see something like this.

It’s this system or nothing while we have Amorim.

 

[Rusholme Ruffian]

The cup games home and abroad are really masking our disastrous league form.

Games are games, this is all a process of the players getting used to a new way of playing, and the manager getting used to the job. I'd argue that Europa League games are our most important at the moment anyway, so it's surely a good thing that we're winning those?

 

[joedirt87]

Apparently he was stubborn at Sporting too, but in the end things turned out well. We’ll just have to hope they do here too. Some of his decisions frustrate me even though I’m fully behind him. The stats show that we are better with a winger in one of the wing back positions, so he needs to move to that and be more proactive. Also Leicester’s wingers were pinning our WBs back in the first half meaning we had 5 defending vs 3 and were outnumbered elsewhere. This wasn’t something he did at sporting and I hope he stops allowing it here too. We need to be more aggressive in our setup.

Yeah he has to take the shackles off and start to push this team to be much more attacking. We sit way too deep, we have our supposed wingbacks defending it making it a back 5 all the time and we leave way too much space in the midfield. The wingbacks obviously aren't working and I don't think the two inside 10s are working either. I don't see him trying this but I would like to see him play Bruno as a central 10 that gets inside the box and then add a midfielder like Eriksen to try help and control things with the wingbacks actually taking up that attacking space.

 

[UnitedSofa]

Yeah he has to take the shackles off and start to push this team to be much more attacking. We sit way too deep, we have our supposed wingbacks defending it making it a back 5 all the time and we leave way too much space in the midfield. The wingbacks obviously aren't working and I don't think the two inside 10s are working either. I don't see him trying this but I would like to see him play Bruno as a central 10 that gets inside the box and then add a midfielder like Eriksen to try help and control things with the wingbacks actually taking up that attacking space.

I’m sure the shackles are off but the team is just too piss scared to go forward

 

[Flying_Heckfish]

No real aspiration to win a cup?

Fought till the end today and unbeaten in the EL - what on earth are you talking about?

We've hardly chucked money at it, have we?

It's clear Amorim needs investment, but he didn't really get it.

Hopefully, that's part of a wider culturte change for the longterm., rather than an extremely serious cashflow issue,

Not arguing that the team aren't fighting for a cup win - they can prove that themselves. But I think for the board it seems like a "bonus", rather than the objective, at least in the short term. Again, hopefully that's strategic. We need a long term vision.

 

[JE-365]

It was a shocking how he decided to play Dorgu on the right despite of already have Amad who can exploit the width on the right, but leave no player on the left who can exploit the width.

L10 Mainoo with Dalot as LWB is basically zero width. It makes zero sense especially when playing against the lesser side (no disrespect to Leicester). Neither players have the capability to exploit the space and the width. That’s why in first half, we only look more threat on the right because there were players who could exploit the space and the width on the right.

Garnacho came on was the difference because he can exploit the space and the width on the left.

If Dorgu plays as left wingback with Mainoo as L10, it makes more sense because based on the first half Dorgu can exploit the width. But Mainoo as L10 and Dalot as LWB is just doesn’t make sense.

 

[baskinginthesun]

I’m sure the shackles are off but the team is just too piss scared to go forward

It certainly feels that way. It seems often our forwards make runs and will require a one or two touch pass from the player in possession to unleash them. But, it ends being 3 or 4 touches, the run is off and now the ball gets recycled back to the defense who then inevitably hoof it to the same player (now marked) who made the run 30 seconds ago.

 

[sparx99]

It certainly feels that way. It seems often our forwards make runs and will require a one or two touch pass from the player in possession to unleash them. But, it ends being 3 or 4 touches, the run is off and now the ball gets recycled back to the defense who then inevitably hoof it to the same player (now marked) who made the run 30 seconds ago.

That’s where the familiarity with the system is a key part. Players have to take a second to think and then the chance is gone.

Garnacho surely got the hairdryer treatment for taking that shot rather than squaring the ball.

 

[Wheato]

I was at the game tonight, and I was looking at our formation, and it is all wrong. Out of possession, he insists that everybody gets back, so at various points in the game, we had a flat back 5, and there was only 1 Leicester player in our half. So our midfield and forwards are completely overrun, because it is 9 against 5. So they were just playing it around us, and we couldn't get the ball back. And when we did get the ball, we had no options, because everyone was double marked.

I'm not a coach, or a specialist tactician, but if half of your team is the wrong side of the half way line, you aint gonna cause the opposition any problems. You'll probably be lucky to get a shot on goal, if you can even get the ball back.

We've got too many players in our own half. Which is why our build up play is so slow, there are no options to play it forward. Everyone is dropping back to receive the ball, but when they take it on the half turn, there are no options to play it forward.

We make rubbish teams look good, because we are making it so easy for them.

 

[roseguy64]

The Overlap one? Where Rooney said he was at Carrington recently and saw Rashford after a fitness session (can't remember exactly what he called it) and he hadn't even broken a sweat? Everyone else said after such a session you'd be gasping.

Pretty sure that's not what Rooney said

 

[FriedClams]

I was at the game tonight, and I was looking at our formation, and it is all wrong. Out of possession, he insists that everybody gets back, so at various points in the game, we had a flat back 5, and there was only 1 Leicester player in our half. So our midfield and forwards are completely overrun, because it is 9 against 5. So they were just playing it around us, and we couldn't get the ball back. And when we did get the ball, we had no options, because everyone was double marked.

I'm not a coach, or a specialist tactician, but if half of your team is the wrong side of the half way line, you aint gonna cause the opposition any problems. You'll probably be lucky to get a shot on goal, if you can even get the ball back.

We've got too many players in our own half. Which is why our build up play is so slow, there are no options to play it forward. Everyone is dropping back to receive the ball, but when they take it on the half turn, there are no options to play it forward.

We make rubbish teams look good, because we are making it so easy for them.

I agree with what you say, my thinking is that he is trying to install defensive solidity first, and the patterns of play will emerge. If I’m not mistaken, this is the approach he took with sporting too.

 

[Nevilles.Wear.Prada]

The worst thing is, if he'd gone to Liverpool or City you just know they'd be absolutely flying and we'd be ruing whichever managerial choice we made instead.

The club is fecking cursed.

Nah mate.

 

[Greck]

It's got nothing to do with formations. How does the system suddenly start working when we go a goal down? It's the mentally and physically weakest United team in ages. I'll never get over Ten Hag building a team without regard to physical demands of the league and the mentality needed to play at Old Trafford. We have forwards who can't create separation in the final third or love to go missing. We're actually lauding performances where they don't even get on the end of one threatening opportunity or try a shot. Then Yoro, Onana and Bayindir have given away momentum sealing goals in the midst of comebacks. Our defenders are prone to lapses, can barely read interceptions and can be as unpolished as they come.

 

[Ronaldo's ego]

He won’t be here this time next year, quote me on that.