Onana has not worked out. We need a new keeper.

[Jund]

Lads, please stop comparing DDG's first season to Onana's first season. This is ridiculous. Onana is 27, should be two steps away from being the finished article.

 

[ti vu]

De Gea had a defence and midfield in front of him though and Onana is pretty much playing without one thats the difference, in 2020/21 De Gea with a defence and midfield in front of him managed to let in 10 goals as we were knocked out in the group stage.

You know 2 of the 10 conceded goals belongs to Henderson, right?

I am wondering whether you're truly Man United fan now. Because it's easy to recall that game and Henderson appearance. After all, that result against the inexperienced weakest in the group team with already 2 defeat was the key to us crashing out of CL after winning the first two 2 games.

Edit: 8 from De Gea included: an unfortunate own goal by Martial from a corner kick; 6 shots inside the box when opposition were all unmarked. You can blamed DDG for not making himself big against Neymar and Justin Kluivert goals, or not be able to "properly" save the well taken free kick consolation goal because he saw it late; but those are nowhere comparable to the howler like Bayern first goal, and 2 freekicks.

 

[Partridge]

He needs to be replaced ASAP, he creates nervousness throughout the team as seen last night after his clangers, we said the same last season about the defence because of de gea errors

Maybe give Massimo taibi another crack? He wasn't this bad.

 

[gaffs]

The point being despite people are calling Onana useless and saying we should have kept De Gea Onana is actually performing better than De Gea did over the same number of games last season.

These kind of stats mean nothing.

Clean sheet records are just as much about the outfield team as they are the goalkeeper - perhaps even more so.

Onana has made so many howlers already.

 

[gaffs]

That's a new one. Manager too scared to play a player, in case he's good.

Any other manager would have at least seen what Bayindir could do by giving him some game time, especially in light of the AFCON coming up.

But Ten Hag is personally invested in Onana doing well, given he chose to go back and signing another one of his old boys.

Look back at what Fergie did to Jim Leighton. Poor FA Cup final in 90 and dropped him. Leighton's mistakes were arguably far less than Onana's. And remember, Fergie signed Leighton from Aberdeen, so there is a parallel there.

Ten Hag won't do that because of the fact he has signed so many duds, as well as alienating and excluding others, he needs Onana to come good.

 

[gaffs]

I say that because the fans at his last club weren’t exactly praising him. So until we see him play the jury is out.

So we signed two dodgy keepers?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Any other manager would have at least seen what Bayindir could do by giving him some game time, especially in light of the AFCON coming up.

But Ten Hag is personally invested in Onana doing well, given he chose to go back and signing another one of his old boys.

Look back at what Fergie did to Jim Leighton. Poor FA Cup final in 90 and dropped him. Leighton's mistakes were arguably far less than Onana's. And remember, Fergie signed Leighton from Aberdeen, so there is a parallel there.

Ten Hag won't do that because of the fact he has signed so many duds, as well as alienating and excluding others, he needs Onana to come good.

Nah, that’s a really crazy conspiracy theory. He’s only invested in Onana doing well because he thinks he’s a better keeper and, after a rocky start, needs to show some faith in him to try and build him up a bit. His one and only motivation is creating a winning team. The idea that he would knowingly freeze out better players in case the players he signed look bad is nuts.

 

[golden_blunder]

So we signed two dodgy keepers?

Well that’s why it’s still “jury out” for me

 

[gaffs]

Nah, that’s a really crazy conspiracy theory. He’s only invested in Onana doing well because he thinks he’s a better keeper and, after a rocky start, needs to show some faith in him to try and build him up a bit. His one and only motivation is creating a winning team. The idea that he would knowingly freeze out better players in case the players he signed look bad is nuts.

He is personally invested in him because he doesnt want to be shown up to be wrong, again.

Let's say Beyandir comes in at the weekend and had a blinder against Newcastle, or is even just competent. Where does that leave Onana?

 

[USREDEVIL]

Go get Jordan Pickford. He's good. Yes im srs.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

He is personally invested in him because he doesnt want to be shown up to be wrong, again.

Let's say Beyandir comes in at the weekend and had a blinder against Newcastle, or is even just competent. Where does that leave Onana?

It won’t happen (Onana is going to start on Saturday) but if any player comes into the team and plays amazingly then ETH will obviously give that player more game time. It’s in his best interest to do that. As I said, to imply he would sabotage himself by doing the opposite is nuts.

 

[davidmichael]

The whole Onana/De Gea debate is pointless as there’s occasions that we’d be worse off with the ball to De Gea’s feet whilst there’s times we’d be worse off with Onana’s hands but one thing I’m certain of is we’d be better off with Heaton as our number one this season or even keeping Henderson, it’s another occasion where we’ve got rid of better than what we bring in down to a foreign name and piss poor scouting/recruitment.

 

[gaffs]

It won’t happen (Onana is going to start on Saturday) but if any player comes into the team and plays amazingly then ETH will obviously give that player more game time. It’s in his best interest to do that. As I said, to imply he would sabotage himself by doing the opposite is nuts.

Why are you so sure that Onana starts?

If Ten Hag signs a 50mil keeper that he has no personal tie to, and he had dropped the clangers that Onana had, he would be benched by now.

If Bayindir comes in and plays well, Ten Hag has another 50mil problem on his bench, to go with 350k a week Varane, 60mil Mount, 85mil Antony and Sancho training with the kids.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Why are you so sure that Onana starts?

If Ten Hag signs a 50mil keeper that he has no personal tie to, and he had dropped the clangers that Onana had, he would be benched by now.

If Bayindir comes in and plays well, Ten Hag has another 50mil problem on his bench, to go with 350k a week Varane, 60mil Mount, 85mil Antony and Sancho training with the kids.

This “personal ties” stuff is mad. Surely you can see that? I mean you’re even undermining your own point by mentioning the way Varane and Mount (both players he signed) have been benched by the likes of McTominay and Jonny Evans!

 

[gaffs]

This “personal ties” stuff is mad. Surely you can see that? I mean you’re even undermining your own point by mentioning the way Varane and Mount (both players he signed) have been benched by the likes of McTominay and Jonny Evans!

Name me a manager who has gone back and signed more players that he has personal experience with than Ten Hag?
It is one thing signing players, it is another signing them from your old clubs because the manager is effectively vouching for them. That is why I believe that Ten Hag has got no choice in giving Onana chance after change.

Now, there is an argument for saying that Ten Hag shouldn't be put in the position where he has to go and sign so many of his old boys. We dont know if that is because he is insistent on these players, or of the scouting/recruiting department is inept.

Ten Hag didn't sign Varane.

I think Mount is a victim of Ten Hag realizing that the dual 8s dont work. He abandoned that idea after seeing the team was wide open against Wolves, Spurs and Forest.
Although, we are no more solid with McTominay, as we saw last night.

 

[samlee86]

Yes but we work our asses off every year to get top 4 (as a title challenge is not realistic yet) and then he goes and blows the CL group for us so its not great really, regardless of what he has done in the league (in which the primary focus again is to get CL for next year)

*and Nick Pope and Sam Johnstone.

EDIT - as an aside David Raya would probably have more, or at least the same as Onana (who has 5) as he has 4 and Ramsdale has 2.

De Gea got most last season, Onana is a complete disaster, there’s no denying it

Who won the golden glove last season?

The point is, we could have Bob the Builder in goal and we would still have a decent defence.

Just goes to show DDG had very little to do with winning the golden glove and Onana will most likely win it this season.

As for Onana, he’s a complete mess and needs replacing asap.

 

[Lee565]

Go get Jordan Pickford. He's good. Yes im srs.

Would-be against this as he is definitely an upgrade on what we have seen from onana

 

[RuudtheRed]

Was Onana as error prone last season with Inter? I don't understand how he could have an almost perfect performance in the CL Final and then do that in the Galatasaray game. The pressure at United is probably insane compared to what he's been used to.

 

[lex talionis]

We’ve fukked ourselves with the signing of Onana and it seems unlikely that we can find a club to dump him to. And I would add Mount but that’s another thread. Even if the hatred of De Gea was so great among the fanbase — which it wasn’t — that we had to get rid of him, we could have gone with Henderson and applied the funds we spent on Onana more intelligently. I’m no huge fan of Henderson, but I don’t remember Henderson making these kinds of mistakes over and over.

And I hope by now it’s understood here that the argument that a modern keeper would have a transformational impact on our attack always was idiocy.

 

[ti vu]

We’ve fukked ourselves with the signing of Onana and it seems unlikely that we can find a club to dump him to. And I would add Mount but that’s another thread. Even if the hatred of De Gea was so great among the fanbase — which it wasn’t — that we had to get rid of him, we could have gone with Henderson and applied the funds we spent on Onana more intelligently. I’m no huge fan of Henderson, but I don’t remember Henderson making these kinds of mistakes over and over.

And I hope by now it’s understood here that the argument that a modern keeper would have a transformational impact on our attack always was idiocy.

Even with hindsight, Henderson is not that well thought plan. He has become injury prone which is an issue by itself. Also he had burned the bridge with the club. It would be bad to keep a player with this difficult character for a unproven talent level. What if he lost out after coming back from an injury, to a back up GK we bought, then throw a tantrum mid season?

Also he got us some money from his transfer. It's the matter of using the fund to get a decent stop gap GK if we have recruited better.

 

[ayushreddevil9]

I don't think this team can move forwards with him in the goal. If you keep letting saveable goals in then it takes away any sort of confidence from the team.

 

[Sgreddevil]

Unless ETH has a personal agenda and doesnt want to be proven wrong in his choice, most managers would have at least given Bayindir a chance to prove himself in the next game. He can simply come up with the reason that he wanted to take Onana out of the spotlight for the next game.
If Bayindir performs, he has reason to continue using. If Bayindir doesn't, he can put Onana back for next game after the spotlight has faded.
However ETH seems to be a stubborn person, I doubt that will happen for next game. Let's see.

 

[DRJosh]

Maybe give Massimo taibi another crack? He wasn't this bad.

That Southampton howler still gives me nightmares

 

[DRJosh]

Unless ETH has a personal agenda and doesnt want to be proven wrong in his choice, most managers would have at least given Bayindir a chance to prove himself in the next game. He can simply come up with the reason that he wanted to take Onana out of the spotlight for the next game.
If Bayindir performs, he has reason to continue using. If Bayindir doesn't, he can put Onana back for next game after the spotlight has faded.
However ETH seems to be a stubborn person, I doubt that will happen for next game. Let's see.

Agreed. I think it’s a question of risk and return.

My sense is that ETH struggles to understand or appreciate when taking risks might actually be good and when it isn’t the best idea. There is nothing much to lose with having Bayindir in goal against Newcastle given that he is an accomplished keeper. I’ve never been a fan of just relying on one keeper for all competitions.

However there was a lot to lose in going gung-ho against Galatasaray and not having any cover at the back when our attacks broke down which led to us giving away free-kicks needlessly and the goals.

 

[Dans]

Agreed. I think it’s a question of risk and return.

My sense is that ETH struggles to understand or appreciate when taking risks might actually be good and when it isn’t the best idea. There is nothing much to lose with having Bayindir in goal against Newcastle given that he is an accomplished keeper. I’ve never been a fan of just relying on one keeper for all competitions.

However there was a lot to lose in going gung-ho against Galatasaray and not having any cover at the back when our attacks broke down which led to us giving away free-kicks needlessly and the goals.

That's one of Bruno's biggest weaknesses. And if you know your keeper is dodgy on free kicks, have the presence of mind to not make those stupid fouls on the edge of the area.

 

[Son]

In the league Onana is in the top 3 keepers for shots saved and in the top 2 for save percentage. Impressive and outperforming his expected goals against.

We could argue while he was the reason for us going out of Europe he’s also one of the main reasons we might still get Champions League next season.

 

[Son]

Agreed. I think it’s a question of risk and return.

My sense is that ETH struggles to understand or appreciate when taking risks might actually be good and when it isn’t the best idea. There is nothing much to lose with having Bayindir in goal against Newcastle given that he is an accomplished keeper. I’ve never been a fan of just relying on one keeper for all competitions.

However there was a lot to lose in going gung-ho against Galatasaray and not having any cover at the back when our attacks broke down which led to us giving away free-kicks needlessly and the goals.

Dropping statistically one of the top three keepers in the league this season for an unproven player?

Onana needs a game to get some confidence back and he’s our man. We stick by him. He’s already better than De Gea last season.

He makes more saves more often and hasn’t had anything like the defensive unit to support him De Gea had last season.

Would we have conceded less goals with Onana between the sticks last season? Yes going on statistics so far in his United career.

De Gea made clangers too in the cups so even on that part.

 

[AndySmith1990]

Go get Jordan Pickford. He's good. Yes im srs.

Jordan Pickford is actually a pretty good keeper. We could do far worse. But plenty would be opposed to it simply because he's English

 

[Zlatan 7]

In the league Onana is in the top 3 keepers for shots saved and in the top 2 for save percentage. Impressive and outperforming his expected goals against.

We could argue while he was the reason for us going out of Europe he’s also one of the main reasons we might still get Champions League next season.

Do you watch football matches or just look at spreadsheets.

 

[Mwooyo]

I honestly think people are misunderstanding this Onana thing. Yes, Onana sold us out for all 3 goals yesterday. Hell, he has conceded shady goals in the CL right from the Bayern game. However, we are ignoring a more serious thing. We are conceding a lot of shots in the box...alottt!!. It doesn't matter which keeper we have, as long as we continue conceding the number of shots we currently conceding, we will not win the big matches. Even if we had prime Neur, (we would beat Galatasaray for sure) we would still get beaten by Mancity, Real Madrid, Bayern Arsenal, etc, just because we give away a lot of shots and these teams have players who take higher quality shots.

To fix manutd, we need to fix this high number of shots thingy and the root problem lies in....wait for it...the midfield. We are conceding a lot of shots because we DON'T control games. We don't control games because we don't have midfielders who keep the ball. We have midfielders who force the ball and are too direct. Bruno is top of that list...behind Bruno, we have Mctominay. When we didn't have Mctominay, we had Casemiro who is also too direct. People don't want to hear it but Bruno is the number 1 reason we struggle to control games. He gives the ball away a lot and even worse, he gives them away in central areas. Ball turnovers in central areas are catastrophic. Wingers out wide can lose the ball, but having your midfielders do this is criminal

There is NO way you will control a game if you keep giving the ball away a few moments after winning it. We DO NOT control games...that's why we concede so many shots. The Galatasaray game was soo back and forth, and so was the Everton game or the Luton game, etc. You win titles nowadays by controlling games. You CAN'T win titles with this ping pong football we are playing. Hate it or love it, we would control the game better with Amrabat, Mainoo, and Mount. The moment we add Bruno, we will have more chances created but we will lose control. We make the Bruno problem worse when we add Mctominay or Casemiro into the mix, all of a sudden, 2 out of our 3 midfielders treat the ball like it's a bomb. It's therefore no surprise that our games are back and forth...and every single DM we have played is struggling. Amrabat is a good player, but playing him in that midfield alone where he has massive spaces to cover is suicidal. Even Mainoo can not cover that space. We need to ditch Mctominay immediately and if we are serious, Bruno would also be dropped. Unless we start controlling games, it doesn't really matter who is in our Goal,
we will not win the prem or the CL

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Basically we had a keeper that was good with his hands but bad with his feet and now we have one that is good with his feet but bad with his hands.

We just need a keeper who is good with both, like Alisson.

Wrong. Now we have a GK that bad with his his feet and bad with his hands.

When he was pressed he basically just hoof the ball just like DDG used to be.

 

[Gordon Godot]

I honestly think people are misunderstanding this Onana thing. Yes, Onana sold us out for all 3 goals yesterday. Hell, he has conceded shady goals in the CL right from the Bayern game. However, we are ignoring a more serious thing. We are conceding a lot of shots in the box...alottt!!. It doesn't matter which keeper we have, as long as we continue conceding the number of shots we currently conceding, we will not win the big matches. Even if we had prime Neur, (we would beat Galatasaray for sure) we would still get beaten by Mancity, Real Madrid, Bayern Arsenal, etc, just because we give away a lot of shots and these teams have players who take higher quality shots.

To fix manutd, we need to fix this high number of shots thingy and the root problem lies in....wait for it...the midfield. We are conceding a lot of shots because we DON'T control games. We don't control games because we don't have midfielders who keep the ball. We have midfielders who force the ball and are too direct. Bruno is top of that list...behind Bruno, we have Mctominay. When we didn't have Mctominay, we had Casemiro who is also too direct. People don't want to hear it but Bruno is the number 1 reason we struggle to control games. He gives the ball away a lot and even worse, he gives them away in central areas. Ball turnovers in central areas are catastrophic. Wingers out wide can lose the ball, but having your midfielders do this is criminal

There is NO way you will control a game if you keep giving the ball away a few moments after winning it. We DO NOT control games...that's why we concede so many shots. The Galatasaray game was soo back and forth, and so was the Everton game or the Luton game, etc. You win titles nowadays by controlling games. You CAN'T win titles with this ping pong football we are playing. Hate it or love it, we would control the game better with Amrabat, Mainoo, and Mount. The moment we add Bruno, we will have more chances created but we will lose control. We make the Bruno problem worse when we add Mctominay or Casemiro into the mix, all of a sudden, 2 out of our 3 midfielders treat the ball like it's a bomb. It's therefore no surprise that our games are back and forth...and every single DM we have played is struggling. Amrabat is a good player, but playing him in that midfield alone where he has massive spaces to cover is suicidal. Even Mainoo can not cover that space. We need to ditch Mctominay immediately and if we are serious, Bruno would also be dropped. Unless we start controlling games, it doesn't really matter who is in our Goal,
we will not win the prem or the CL

Midfield is still a massive problem. But that doesnt change the Onana problem. His issue is not the number of shots he faces, its that he cant do the basics. Both awful goals against Galatasary from free kicks some way out, once went about a 50cm past his foot and the other was straight at him. He is not good enough.

 

[Vault Dweller]

He's done a lot better recently in the league but aside from one game in the CL he has basically cost us a chance of getting out of the group. So many goals he's conceded are pathetic from a supposedly top level goalie.

 

[arnie_ni]

Instead of putting all the blame for tbe goals on Onana for all the goals we need to be asking why the wall had a massive hole in it on the first one that allowed the ball through, why Martial flicked his head toward the ball on the 2nd like he was going to head it away but didnt bother to actually jump to it, and where were the defence on the 3rd one when we somehow ended up with Mainoo being the furthest player back trying to put a challenge in.

If the players in front on Onana had have done their jobs properly tonight none of those goals would have been scored.

You mean the wall the keeper constructed?

 

[Mercurial]

People so want to invest in sweeper keeper they can't see the glaring flaws Onana is bringing. He is likeable nevertheless, and that's a redeeming quality if he is with us for 5 or so more years.

 

[fps]

Onana is Taibi if given a full season.

 

[arnie_ni]

Nevertheless, my main point on him is that we can't properly use his distribution yet as AWB, Dalot, Maguire, Lindelof, Amrabat, Mc Tominay are not confortable to receive... That's really difficult

As so many of us tried to explain before he was bought. The outfield needed upgraded or a ball playing keeper will be worthless. We bought the star but don't have the tree to put it on.

 

[arnie_ni]

On the first one he couldnt have known that the wall would open up a huge gap for Ziyech to shoot through so what was he supoosed to do, if the wall did its job that goal is never scored therefore the wall is at least equally at fault if not fully.

On the 2nd one Martial put him off by flicking his head like he was going to head it clear but didnt actually jump, that should have been an eaay headed clearance by Martial so he is at fault there and also why was it Martial in there anyway.

On the 3rd goal the entire back 4 went missing and left poir Kobbie Mainoo to have to try to defend it on his own.

Im sure if you go back and look through the mistakes Onana has made the majority will be shots that he only had to face because the defense didnt do there jobs right in the first place, any keeper would struggle with a back 4 that goes missing and doesnt do its job properly.

the wall.didnt open. It went around thr wall through the opposition players. He didn't have any united players behind them

 

[arnie_ni]

The point being despite people are calling Onana useless and saying we should have kept De Gea Onana is actually performing better than De Gea did over the same number of games last season.

If you ignore europe

 

[Wrecking ralf]

He’s been utterly shite! I’ve never seen a keeper make a worse start to life at the club or any club for that matter.

De Gea had a similar start if I recall. Not sure stats wise how different they have been. Be interesting to see a comparison given how De Gea turned out to be one of the best in the world at his peak.