Marcus Rashford (Out) | Ornstein: United want to keep, will only consider substantial bids

[didz]

Garnacho to the left, somebody like Andringa/Olise/Neto on the right, depends on what type of player we are after - we'd get shagged for money as usual though. It always sets the players up to fail.

I appreciate the sentiment of getting Garnacho on the left and reinforcing the right instead, but you are aware that you just named three players with about 30 PL matches between them this season, right?

Did you miss out a zero here? Martinelli was 20GA behind Rashford last year. He’s also behind him this season, playing for one of the most attacking teams in the league, who have 25 more league goals than we do (nearly double).

I missed out "PL" before goal contributions - my bad. As I said, I'd rather Rashford hit form again with us, but my point is more that if we got good money for Rashford (and we really ought to be getting very good money if he does want to go) then we might find that the left wing position could be filled by a player around the level of a Martinelli if we could then strengthen other areas. Garnacho being one such candidate.

We've seen how hard it is for us to attack with much conviction when Rashford does go off the boil, so I can understand the point of view that we could move him on and strengthen the overall quality of the squad. Him going off the boil for the second season out of three does make it something worth considering.

 

[Irwin99]

Its bizarre. I watched Doku today, who everyone has been raving about, and he’s not even close to Rashford’s level. People genuinely seem to want to sell the best left winger in the league with no seeming plan as to who might possibly replace him.

Generally, this forum needs a severe reality check on how many left wingers are actually better than Rashford. If most people had their way, we’d have two Antony’s chugging up and down the wing, earning consistent praise for tracking back usually after they themselves had given the ball away, whilst providing the square root of 0 in terms of actually putting the ball in the net.

Doku is 21 years old. Like Garnacho he's still learning and although i don't really have an opinion on him you do cut some slack for kids that age.

If there are people guilty of underrating Rashford on here (true) then there are people guilty of severely overrating him too. One post said that he could finish the season with ten-fifteen goals yet but is that really good enough for an elite level striker on 350K a week especially when he's been dire for most of the season? Unless things change between now and the end of the season this will be his second bad season in three years. It's not a good look for a player on such an enormous salary and with well documented disciplinary issues.

This is the heart of the issue. Fans want Rashford to be a level on par with Mbappe, Henry in his prime, or Salah, and it probably just isn't going to happen at this stage. His goals were absolutely crucial to us getting top 4 last year and we need him for the rest of the season but i'm just not seeing an elite level talent who will win us league titles. Taking the money and reinvesting it in a player who will work better with EtH's tactics and system wouldn't be such a bad idea if its done well.

 

[JJ12]

I appreciate the sentiment of getting Garnacho on the left and reinforcing the right instead, but you are aware that you just named three players with about 30 PL matches between them this season, right?



I missed out "PL" before goal contributions - my bad. As I said, I'd rather Rashford hit form again with us, but my point is more that if we got good money for Rashford (and we really ought to be getting very good money if he does want to go) then we might find that the left wing position could be filled by a player around the level of a Martinelli if we could then strengthen other areas. Garnacho being one such candidate.

We've seen how hard it is for us to attack with much conviction when Rashford does go off the boil, so I can understand the point of view that we could move him on and strengthen the overall quality of the squad. Him going off the boil for the second season out of three does make it something worth considering.

Yeah, all 3 have immense talent. Medical staff will need to do their due diligence but those are the type of players I would like.

 

[BenitoSTARR]

https://fbref.com/en/players/829aa60c/Mathys-Tel

I know it’s not everything but for the few mins he’s played I’d be happy bringing Tel in.

 

[Gavinb33]

Doku is 21 years old. Like Garnacho he's still learning and although i don't really have an opinion on him you do cut some slack for kids that age.

If there are people guilty of underrating Rashford on here (true) then there are people guilty of severely overrating him too. One post said that he could finish the season with ten-fifteen goals yet but is that really good enough for an elite level striker on 350K a week especially when he's been dire for most of the season? Unless things change between now and the end of the season this will be his second bad season in three years. It's not a good look for a player on such an enormous salary and with well documented disciplinary issues.

This is the heart of the issue. Fans want Rashford to be a level on par with Mbappe, Henry in his prime, or Salah, and it probably just isn't going to happen at this stage. His goals were absolutely crucial to us getting top 4 last year and we need him for the rest of the season but i'm just not seeing an elite level talent who will win us league titles. Taking the money and reinvesting it in a player who will work better with EtH's tactics and system wouldn't be such a bad idea if its done well.

If he got 15 league goals that's a solid return for an attacker in terms of league goals

 

[Doracle]

I appreciate the sentiment of getting Garnacho on the left and reinforcing the right instead, but you are aware that you just named three players with about 30 PL matches between them this season, right?



I missed out "PL" before goal contributions - my bad. As I said, I'd rather Rashford hit form again with us, but my point is more that if we got good money for Rashford (and we really ought to be getting very good money if he does want to go) then we might find that the left wing position could be filled by a player around the level of a Martinelli if we could then strengthen other areas. Garnacho being one such candidate.

We've seen how hard it is for us to attack with much conviction when Rashford does go off the boil, so I can understand the point of view that we could move him on and strengthen the overall quality of the squad. Him going off the boil for the second season out of three does make it something worth considering.

He hasn’t really gone off the boil this season (save for a spell in November/early December when he looked like he was unable to control a football). The team is just playing substantially worse overall, which means that he is getting less of the ball and particularly isn’t getting the type of through balls he thrives upon. Stick him in a functional team and he’d have 20+GA already.

Also, as you say, we’ve seen how hard it is for us to attack when he’s off the boil, despite us having spent c. £250m on attackers over the last few years, all of whom have been poor/average. Why would it make sense to take out the one player who we know can produce 40GA in a season in a semi-functional team and take a chance on another expensive signing, rather than looking to strengthen the areas which have been weaker and, in all likelihood, see Rashford produce in a functional team?

 

[JeffFromHK]

We should definitely sell him if PSG is foolish enough to offer us anything more than 60M.
Rashford is a "final product" player who contributes very little outside of goals and assists, and when his goals and assists dry up (which seems to happen once every 2-3 years), he contributes nothing.

 

[didz]

He hasn’t really gone off the boil this season (save for a spell in November/early December when he looked like he was unable to control a football). The team is just playing substantially worse overall, which means that he is getting less of the ball and particularly isn’t getting the type of through balls he thrives upon. Stick him in a functional team and he’d have 20+GA already.

Also, as you say, we’ve seen how hard it is for us to attack when he’s off the boil, despite us having spent c. £250m on attackers over the last few years, all of whom have been poor/average. Why would it make sense to take out the one player who we know can produce 40GA in a season in a semi-functional team and take a chance on another expensive signing, rather than looking to strengthen the areas which have been weaker and, in all likelihood, see Rashford produce in a functional team?

I think the bolded is very generous. To my eye, he was poor from the Brighton loss to boxing day. Obviously he's back on a bit of form now and that's probably why we're hearing stories of interest. Hopefully it continues today!

As to the question of why it could make sense to take him out, I believe I already answered that in my previous post with reference to the possibility of improving the overall quality of the squad rather than trying to directly replace him. And that is the kind of thing that teams do as part of a rebuild pretty regularly.

 

[hobbers]

£60m offer snap their hand off

 

[Mainoonited99]

Let me put it in the simplist terms, ignoring for a sec his valyation and instead taking the smallest value quoted on here...

Whether or not 60m is a good deal or a bad deal, if that opens up 300m of FFP allowance then that is immense.

I know it's how football works (amortization etc) but it's such a false economy. Only football and wall street can turn £60 million into £300 million out of thin air. This upwards spiral isn't sustainable, and at some point the whole thing is going to pop.

 

[Tony247]

Pay him to leave

 

[P-Ro]

£60m offer snap their hand off

You're never getting close to £60m for Rashford. With that kind of fee you could get a world beater midfielder like Mount.

 

[hobbers]

You're never getting close to £60m for Rashford. With that kind of fee you could get a world beater midfielder like Mount.

I'd sell Rashford for £60m and throw Mount in for free at this point. Though that'd probably put PSG off.

 

[Adisa]

I would pay good money to see him leave.

 

[Lu Tze]

Let's hope PSG aren't watching this one.

 

[InfiniteBoredom]

1 more league goal, what an argument...you're just proving my point. Last year Kvara played for the best team in the league, got 25 goal involments in Serie A, and 31 in all competitions. Now Napoli are struggling and so is he.

Rashford had the better season last year in a much stronger league, in a team that wasn't dominating like Napoli at all.

This season they almost have identical stats.

And the point was made that we can’t replace Rashford’s goals because supposedly someone like Kvara can’t match the production. We don’t know that, because in a similar situation right now in a struggling team, he is matching the production, while playing far less selfishly,
the stats and the eye test attest to this.

https://fbref.com/en/players/dea88efd/Khvicha-Kvaratskhelia


https://fbref.com/en/players/a1d5bd30/Marcus-Rashford

 

[Heinzesight]

Is their no.9 going to continually go to ground cheaply and con the ref?

 

[AndySmith1990]

He's rotten

 

[LordSpud]

Sell Rashford buy Kane

 

[Lash]

Today is a great example where we'd be better with someone who would challenge and harass defenders, Luis Diaz-style. The amount of times I saw absolutely zero challenge from him or press, was just infuriating.

 

[BenitoSTARR]

£90m then

 

[OldSchoolManc]

If PSG watched that along with the rest of this season, they would be crazy to offer anything over 50 million

 

[PizzaPlanet]

Let's hope PSG aren't watching this one.

First place I go when I hear we are in for a player is the forum of the team he's currently playing for.

And Rashford is one of the absolute greatest players in the galaxy there's no doubt in my mind about that!

 

[Irwin99]

If he got 15 league goals that's a solid return for an attacker in terms of league goals

He's playing better than he did a bit back but 15 goals is probably looking a bit unrealistic. Again though, we're looking at that as 'solid' and not really outstanding.

 

[AbusementPark]

Embarassing the way he fell to the ground multiple times today holding his head and face, then huffs and gives away a foul when he doesnt get his way. Left United exposed down the left yet again when Shaw went off. He is playing more with the team rather than just going for glory like the beginning of the season and happy we got the win in the end.

 

[Superunknown]

I want to hear who we'd be replacing him with before we move him on. I've been burned by this club too many times before.

 

[Teja]

Him as the direct option one side and then an Eze type who can drift inside would be a logical long term solution.

Yes - this is key. We can't have to many players who want the ball to feet. You need someone who's putting in work to stretch the defence through off the ball running.

Imagine the Nasri, Rosicky, Ozil, Giroud attack that Arsenal ran for a bit. That's a bit similar to what we'd get with Garnacho, Bruno, Olise, Hojlund.

 

[Ricardo de la Vega]

Ship him off to PSG; Real will take Mbappe and we'll grab Kvaratkshelia on a discount deal from Napoli he's had a poor season for them but is a wonderful player.

 

[Xaviboy]

https://x.com/GaryClownFace/status/1759285191246270594?s=20

Anyone see this

 

[Ricardo de la Vega]

https://x.com/GaryClownFace/status/1759285191246270594?s=20

Anyone see this

That is absolutely shocking I didn't notice it earlier.

 

[Seveneric]

Might sound like 'no shit Sherlock', but only if a worthy replacement has been earmarked and is available.

For all his faults, a misfiring Rashford is still better than selling him and potentially wasting the money on some shit waste like Antony.

 

[Ricardo de la Vega]

Might sound like 'no shit Sherlock', but only if a worthy replacement has been earmarked and is available.

For all his faults, a misfiring Rashford is still better than selling him and potentially wasting the money on some shit waste like Antony.

Apparently Nico Williams has a £43 m release clause active, Rafa Leao would be availalbe at the right price, Kvaratkshelia would be raw but full of potential. There are replacements there - Antony was a very weird signing.

 

[Wilt]

https://x.com/GaryClownFace/status/1759285191246270594?s=20

Anyone see this

Un fecking believable

£350,000 a week, taking Utd for mugs ….get rid ASAP

 

[Livewire1974]

https://x.com/GaryClownFace/status/1759285191246270594?s=20

Anyone see this

He ain't interested anymore. Hopefully PSG offer a big pile of cash.

 

[Chairman Steve]

https://x.com/GaryClownFace/status/1759285191246270594?s=20

Anyone see this

I‘ve seen more effort put in at charity matches

 

[V.O.]

https://x.com/GaryClownFace/status/1759285191246270594?s=20

Anyone see this

You'd barely get away with that in Soccer Aid.

It was looking like his attitude had at least improved a bit since the Belfast episode, but you still don't have to look very far for some shocking examples.

 

[NotChatGPT]

He’s shown it at this level more often than whatever we can probably get on the market is more the point. Even in this poor season, I’d still back him to finish with 10+ PL goals. I think people underestimate how hard it will be to find even that from a LW on the market. And that’s without considering that we know he can hit much more next season if he’s on it. We can count on him in the biggest of games, home and away. What we don’t need is some teenager with a fee tricks to come and replace Rashford, they will probably fail and we’d become a far less faired attack.

His overall performances are poor and he's averaging a goal every 435 mins in open play..With 1170 mins of Premier League football remaining this season, it seems fairly unlikely that he's going to finish the season with 10+ goals.

Also, we don't have to replace players like for like in order to become a better team.

 

[Rozay]

His overall performances are poor and he's averaging a goal every 435 mins in open play..With 1170 mins of Premier League football remaining this season, it seems fairly unlikely that he's going to finish the season with 10+ goals.

It’s fairly unlikely because he’s in poor form now. If at any moment he wasn’t - him getting another 5 goals is not unlikely at all. Because that is his capability, which has been my point throughout.

If people want to get rid because he’s not always playing at that level, then I imagine the idea is to get someone who will. Which won’t be easy. All I see are a bunch of likely 8 goal wingers being mentioned, and that will be with them drawing praise and considered to be playing well. At present, I’m inclined to take Rashford who I expect to post 8 goals if he has a shite season, and double that if he’s on it, rather than Mitoma or Williams who I expect to get 8 at their best.

 

[spwd]

https://x.com/GaryClownFace/status/1759285191246270594?s=20

Anyone see this

Fecking disgusting. Get the cnut out the club

 

[Rozay]

You make it sound like Rashford regularly does these things.

I don’t think we’ll sell him, I doubt the new regime would have the balls to do it. Even if it made sense buisness wise with say a 120 mil offer and getting his wages off the books. I just can’t see it happening. He is as many have said the poster boy and given his work outside of football it would be a hell of a thing to move him on.

Rashford regularly scores against top teams. My issue with Rashford is not so much his brilliance, but the rubbishness on the market. We will spend 80m and get a player who excites us for a little while, because he is new, but when it’s said and done - his excitement probably won’t produce a better statistical output than Rashford will get this season - and definitely not what he will get in a good season.

I look at players like Luis Diaz for example. Unanimously praised by all, and I imagine people would say he’s worth 80m odd. I’d be surprised if he has more goals than Rashford this season, and for sure, Rashford back in form would blow his figures away completely.

To get rid of Rashford, I’d want a mature player who can come in and guarantee 15+ goals in the league alone. Not a prospect who will score 4 goals for the next few seasons. We need goals. I can’t see many players who I would back to do that. Some are old, and not available, like Salah, Son or there is Mbappé, Vini and Leao. Anything else will fall into the Sancho, Antony bracket of signing who might if we are lucky become top players, but often fail and flatter to deceive. We might get industry and running, but we’d get an output that isn’t good enough.

If Garnacho was 22 and looked like he could score near 20 in the league then I’d be all for getting a 6 goal younger winger to develop. But we need one forward in their absolute prime years who can be expected to deliver. And if we feel Rashford is no longer that player, fine, but then at least go and get someone who is.