New Stadium or Revamp Old Trafford

Would you rather a new stadium or rebuild Old Trafford?

  • New stadium

    Votes: 670 49.9%
  • Rebuild Old Trafford

    Votes: 673 50.1%

  • Total voters
    1,343

Kostov

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I was more into thinking that a brand new stadium would be the best option, but now when you see what Real have done with rebuilding Bernabeu, I think a good rebuild can go a long way.
 

sullydnl

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One other factor is that where renaming Old Trafford would spark outrage among supporters, and Ratcliffe has already said doing so would be "heresy", you could probably sell the naming rights of a new stadium without much fuss.

Given that it would probably be the biggest naming rights deal in football history and something that would be renewed every decade or so, it would at least pay for a portion of the additional cost of a new stadium and add another revenue stream to the club in the longer term.
 

Lash

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I was more into thinking that a brand new stadium would be the best option, but now when you see what Real have done with rebuilding Bernabeu, I think a good rebuild can go a long way.
Same as me, when you look at something like Spurs' stadium - maybe even Everton's too, it seemed like the best option. Now seeing the Bernabeu, I think it is possible to keep the heritage, whilst truly modernizing.
 

Jimble

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One other factor is that where renaming Old Trafford would spark outrage among supporters, and Ratcliffe has already said doing so would be "heresy", you could probably sell the naming rights of a new stadium without much fuss.
maybe they could shoehorn it in by hiding the naming rights in plain sight

Old Spice Trafford
Old TrafFord Transit vans
 

stevoc

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The majority of what they listed can only really be addressed by a new build
But that's the thing, people need to forget about wishlists of features, because we quite obviously won't be getting a new stadium because A, the Glazers won't fund it and Ratcliffe won't fund it as a minority owner. And B, most owners would be very reluctant to demolish such an iconic historical stadium like OT. In the unlikely event someone else owns United in the next 5-10 years.

So basically if anything happens with OT we can be 99% sure it will be a renovation of some description. And with a renovation of an older stadium even an extensive one, some things are just not practical to incorporate, so we should all adjust our expectations/hopes accordingly instead of pining for a brand new template bowl that's unlikely to happen.
 

Red the Bear

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One other factor is that where renaming Old Trafford would spark outrage among supporters, and Ratcliffe has already said doing so would be "heresy", you could probably sell the naming rights of a new stadium without much fuss.

Given that it would probably be the biggest naming rights deal in football history and something that would be renewed every decade or so, it would at least pay for a portion of the additional cost of a new stadium and add another revenue stream to the club in the longer term.
The last thing any United fan should want is the stadium being named something like oreo United or any such name.
 

neon_badger

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thats horrific. Have a kip while game is on?
It's just one of our sponsors, it's a promotion for showcasing their hotels, they use the box a lot between games for meetings and stuff, it rarely includes a bed and is often more of a living room set up. The box is usually awarded as a prize to someone on matchdays, I'm sure other grounds that we aspire to be like have similar promotional boxes. It's a corporate business. The cricket ground over the road has two hotels both with pitch facing hotel rooms, admittedly a kip during a cricket match is perfectly reasonable.
 

astracrazy

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maybe they could shoehorn it in by hiding the naming rights in plain sight

Old Spice Trafford
Old TrafFord Transit vans
There you go, Ford. Name can stay the same, just incorporate the Ford badge for the remaining letters.

Old TrafFord

:lol:
 

The Red Thinker

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People keep saying this and I just can't see how the Bernabeu has retained any of its character. It's technically a renovation but is so comprehensive it doesn't seem like the same place.

I remember going to games at the old Wembley Stadium and I don't miss it in the slightest.

New doesn't have to mean soulless. It just needs to make references to the past and have some new character. While we all cherish memories of Old Trafford in its various 90's/2000's configurations there is massive opportunities for us to create a more intimidating arena that actually improves things on the football side too.
Ever been to the New Bernebeu? I have. Ever been to the old Bernebeu? I have. They FEEL the same. That’s the point!
 

sparx99

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Ever been to the New Bernebeu? I have. Ever been to the old Bernebeu? I have. They FEEL the same. That’s the point!
I have been to the Old Bernabeu. The new one hasn't been around all that long so not been yet. I know the seating with its steep configuration was retained so is that all it is? Old Trafford doesn't really have something like that worth retaining. If anything we could get steeper seating to create something similar to the Bernabeu.

I don't see why a new 'Old Trafford' couldn't 'feel' the same. Half of that is the fans embracing it and being allowed to bring in our banners and such like 'the impossible dream' one.
 

Red in STL

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Old Trafford in 1922, really shows the limitations of space with the railway line and the canal and boy it looks nothing like I ever saw!

 

Wheato

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It seems to be a popular misconception that "Old Trafford is falling down."

I'm a season ticket holder in the SAF stand and it is far from falling down. The stand was built in 1996 only 4 years before the Etihad was built. The East and West stands were renovated in 2000, and the quadrants in 2007.

The only stand that is older than 27 years old, is the Bobby Charlton stand. This is also happens to be the stand where the press and media sit, and where the away fans are, so it is easy to come to a conclusion that the ground is in need of immediate renovation, when you only see the oldest part of the stadium, where the toilets are not adequate, their is no space on the concourse and you are squeezed into a really small space. This is not the same in the rest of the stadium. The concourses in the SAF and Stretford end are huge.

And a leaking roof doesn't not mean a disaster. Brand new buildings have roof leaks if you don't clear the gutters and drains properly, the water backs up and overflows. This is more of a maintenance issue than an indication that something needs to be replaced. Can be easily rectified and they seem to have done so.
 

Intenhaagwetrust

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I'd it's a new stadium these leeches will sell the naming rights.

Keep old Trafford and do what Real Madrid have done
 

devilo

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If its possible redevelop Old Trafford. We are in enough debt as it is.
I was under the impression that redeveloping OT was arguably going to be more expensive than building a new stadium from scratch given what would need doing.
 

devilo

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I was more into thinking that a brand new stadium would be the best option, but now when you see what Real have done with rebuilding Bernabeu, I think a good rebuild can go a long way.
The lack of legroom is arguably one of the biggest issues with the current stadium, something that may not have been (as much of) an issue at the Bernabeu.

Considering the existing concrete terracing governs the legroom for each row of seats, i'm struggling to see how that can be fixed without demolishing and rebuilding the existing stands from the ground up, which would in theory cost more than building a new stadium from scratch.
 

Mainoldo

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I was under the impression that redeveloping OT was arguably going to be more expensive than building a new stadium from scratch given what would need doing.
We have to put the Manchester back in Manchester United. I think the planning etc of doing a new stadium in similar surroundings. Your better off just redesigning Old Trafford preferably from yesterday.
 

Rood

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It seems to be a popular misconception that "Old Trafford is falling down."

I'm a season ticket holder in the SAF stand and it is far from falling down. The stand was built in 1996 only 4 years before the Etihad was built. The East and West stands were renovated in 2000, and the quadrants in 2007.

The only stand that is older than 27 years old, is the Bobby Charlton stand. This is also happens to be the stand where the press and media sit, and where the away fans are, so it is easy to come to a conclusion that the ground is in need of immediate renovation, when you only see the oldest part of the stadium, where the toilets are not adequate, their is no space on the concourse and you are squeezed into a really small space. This is not the same in the rest of the stadium. The concourses in the SAF and Stretford end are huge.

And a leaking roof doesn't not mean a disaster. Brand new buildings have roof leaks if you don't clear the gutters and drains properly, the water backs up and overflows. This is more of a maintenance issue than an indication that something needs to be replaced. Can be easily rectified and they seem to have done so.
More or less agree that it's not as bad as some people (often those who haven't been there recently) make out, but still there has not been any major investment in the ground for almost 20yrs so it's well overdue by now

If we look at huge modernisation plans happening at Bernebeu and Nou Camp (with staggering costs of around €1bn each!) then it shows the kind of thing we should be aspiring to

But I doubt the 25% minority deal is going to bring enough investment to do anything like what the big Spanish clubs are doing so we can just expect a much smaller scale renovation
 

Herman Toothrot

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It seems to be a popular misconception that "Old Trafford is falling down."

I'm a season ticket holder in the SAF stand and it is far from falling down. The stand was built in 1996 only 4 years before the Etihad was built. The East and West stands were renovated in 2000, and the quadrants in 2007.

The only stand that is older than 27 years old, is the Bobby Charlton stand. This is also happens to be the stand where the press and media sit, and where the away fans are, so it is easy to come to a conclusion that the ground is in need of immediate renovation, when you only see the oldest part of the stadium, where the toilets are not adequate, their is no space on the concourse and you are squeezed into a really small space. This is not the same in the rest of the stadium. The concourses in the SAF and Stretford end are huge.

And a leaking roof doesn't not mean a disaster. Brand new buildings have roof leaks if you don't clear the gutters and drains properly, the water backs up and overflows. This is more of a maintenance issue than an indication that something needs to be replaced. Can be easily rectified and they seem to have done so.
I agree to an extent. However, I was sat in the SAF stand a couple of weeks ago and the seating on the first tier is so tight that its a torture device for anyone over six foot two. If they can't make it safe standing, tickets there should only be sold to short arses. At the weekend I was in the standing section, which is brilliant for watching football, but the tiny concourse in that corner is dangerously small and there is not enough space at the food and drink stand to meet demand. The latter bothers me less, I don't eat food at football but I would like to be able to get a beer at half-time without queuing for more than ten minutes. The toilets are full of wrong un's stood in a cloud of smoke. I don't want fancy bars or cheese shops, but its a grim space.

I'm all for renovating, but it wouldn't just be a case of adding another tier onto the Sir Bobby Charlton stand, they need to increase the footprint of all the stands to make more space.
 

giggs-beckham

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How hard can it be to put some columns and rsj's over the track and build over the fecker? Damn site easier than doing some cantilever type shit
 

Jeppers7

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Sadly major redevelopment is now years off. But yeah I’m sure all the worlds leading brands make do with 20+ year old hosting arenas with leaking roofs.

I think Jim Rat has got big questions to answer on why he gave the Glazers a lifeline and how and when he’s going to deliver on what is required.
 

Herman Toothrot

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Sadly major redevelopment is now years off. But yeah I’m sure all the worlds leading brands make do with 20+ year old hosting arenas with leaking roofs.

I think Jim Rat has got big questions to answer on why he gave the Glazers a lifeline and how and when he’s going to deliver on what is required.
Just feck off with this shite and keep it to the poisoned thread, yeah?
 

Rood

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I agree to an extent. However, I was sat in the SAF stand a couple of weeks ago and the seating on the first tier is so tight that its a torture device for anyone over six foot two. If they can't make it safe standing, tickets there should only be sold to short arses. At the weekend I was in the standing section, which is brilliant for watching football, but the tiny concourse in that corner is dangerously small and there is not enough space at the food and drink stand to meet demand. The latter bothers me less, I don't eat food at football but I would like to be able to get a beer at half-time without queuing for more than ten minutes. The toilets are full of wrong un's stood in a cloud of smoke. I don't want fancy bars or cheese shops, but its a grim space.

I'm all for renovating, but it wouldn't just be a case of adding another tier onto the Sir Bobby Charlton stand, they need to increase the footprint of all the stands to make more space.
Queues for a half time beer are no different even at brand new stadiums

People smoking in the toilets also not much to do with the state of the stadium
 

Utd7

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I was at the Bernabeu this week and came away impressed with how they transformed it from my previous visit in 2018 (pre-renovation). We should emulate what they did for OT.
 

MancunianAngels

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Isn't the big issue with a major rebuild that we'd have nowhere to play in the interim?

Madrid got lucky in a bizarre way as they could play in their smaller academy stadium during covid and were essentially not losing out during that time. They then only had 18 months or so playing with a reduced capacity.

Barca are able to play in the Olympic stadium.

London clubs (Spurs) have Wembley.
 

TrueRed79

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I was at the Bernabeu this week and came away impressed with how they transformed it from my previous visit in 2018 (pre-renovation). We should emulate what they did for OT.
Yeah but the Bernabeu doesn't have the issues that OT has. The railway line kills the whole structure of the stadium itself. Most modern stadiums have concourses around the whole site. The fact OT is backed up against a railway line in the first place is dumb planning. OT is way more cramped than the old Bernabeu as well. We are in need of a new stadium. No question in my mind. I get the sentiments of renovating, but it wouldn't be worth it for me personally. A new stadium right next door is 100% the way forward for the club. It makes way more sense than holding on to something that is well past it's sell by date.

Isn't the big issue with a major rebuild that we'd have nowhere to play in the interim?

Madrid got lucky in a bizarre way as they could play in their smaller academy stadium during covid and were essentially not losing out during that time. They then only had 18 months or so playing with a reduced capacity.

Barca are able to play in the Olympic stadium.

London clubs (Spurs) have Wembley.
We could build the new stadium while continuing to play at OT.
 

Red in STL

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How hard can it be to put some columns and rsj's over the track and build over the fecker? Damn site easier than doing some cantilever type shit
If it was easy it would have been done already
 

Red in STL

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Yeah but the Bernabeu doesn't have the issues that OT has. The railway line kills the whole structure of the stadium itself. Most modern stadiums have concourses around the whole site. The fact OT is backed up against a railway line in the first place is dumb planning. OT is way more cramped than the old Bernabeu as well. We are in need of a new stadium. No question in my mind. I get the sentiments of renovating, but it wouldn't be worth it for me personally. A new stadium right next door is 100% the way forward for the club. It makes way more sense than holding on to something that is well past it's sell by date.


We could build the new stadium while continuing to play at OT.
Do you seriously think that the planners/builders were thinking "that in a 110 years time the club will be fecked for because we built OT next to a trailway line?"
 

Dan_F

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More or less agree that it's not as bad as some people (often those who haven't been there recently) make out, but still there has not been any major investment in the ground for almost 20yrs so it's well overdue by now

If we look at huge modernisation plans happening at Bernebeu and Nou Camp (with staggering costs of around €1bn each!) then it shows the kind of thing we should be aspiring to

But I doubt the 25% minority deal is going to bring enough investment to do anything like what the big Spanish clubs are doing so we can just expect a much smaller scale renovation
It’s more outright investment than Barca, Real or Spurs got for their stadiums. I bet those three clubs would have loved £250 million pounds of cash investment, interest free.
 

antsmithmk

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People need to be careful what they wish for. If they do redevelop the ground or build new, do you think the average fan will see much of a benefit? Or will the money be spent on suites for entertaining...? The East stand itself is fine. The concourse isn't great but could be tarted up. Food and drink isn't too expensive considering. I just want to turn up and watch decent football. I'm not that bothered by suites for hob nobbing. £150 a ticket and your watching the same game from the same seats as the rest of us.
 

next_number_seven

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It's difficult to decide.

On the one hand, the soul and history of the club is entwined with the stadium. I like the idea that it's the pitch that George Best and Charlton and Cantona played on.

Also that Sir Matt and Sir Alex sat in the same dugout. I know the dugouts have changed but you get the idea.

I like the idea of grandfathers/grandmothers going with their grandchildren and saying I saw Best/Charlton/Cantona/Giggs/Rooney/Ronaldo score here.

The soul of a club is it's history and it's fans and the memories.

But at the same time, if you're planning for the next 100 years, we're better off building a brand new stadium right next door.
Aim for the best stadium in the world. 80,000 or 90,000 capacity. Best of everything.

A "red wall" bigger than Dortmund's "yellow wall". Huge standing section with cheaper tickets for young people/students etc..

Maybe downsize Old Trafford to 20,000 and have ladies and youth team play there. Keep the museum there and South Stand since that's the oldest part.
That way you keep the history at least.

I think it's a moot point anyway as I don't think the money's there.
 

MancunianAngels

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People need to be careful what they wish for. If they do redevelop the ground or build new, do you think the average fan will see much of a benefit? Or will the money be spent on suites for entertaining...? The East stand itself is fine. The concourse isn't great but could be tarted up. Food and drink isn't too expensive considering. I just want to turn up and watch decent football. I'm not that bothered by suites for hob nobbing. £150 a ticket and your watching the same game from the same seats as the rest of us.
Spot on
 

Jeffthered

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Revamp and upgrade. We need to be responsible too.. that stadium is built and provides an excellent foundation. Bernabeau looks amazing, shows what can be done.
 

Redplane

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Revamp and upgrade. We need to be responsible too.. that stadium is built and provides an excellent foundation. Bernabeau looks amazing, shows what can be done.
Perhaps, but consider it is now estimated that costs for that one have ballooned to about 1.5 billion euros. Now consider that they had no railroad track to deal with, a government that probably jumps through hoops for them, and (I'm guessing) way lower labor costs and less building code (incl. environmental) regulations to deal with in Spain.