Paul Pogba - Juventus player

Demyanenko_square_jaw

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I think we should let the Sofascore World Cup stats decide this one.

For regular starters:

1. Griezmann 7.43
2. Mbappe 7.34
3. Pogba 7.27

From the regulars, those three + Varane (7.13) were the only ones to get a green statistical rating. Interestingly, France 2018 and Argentina 2022 are the lowest rated World Cup winners since full tournament stats have been available (1966 +)

I guess that's it settled then.
 

RaddyRed

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Pogba organised his own barber to fly to Russia and half the squad got a hair cut in the hotel. That's what happened.

I remember reading it at the time and wondering how it was even news, but it must be important because I have remembered it.
 

Champ

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Standing in the Stretford End watching United dismantle St Etienne back in 2017, and it may have been the euphoria of seeing Zlatan score a hat trick, but Pogba was head and shoulders above anyone else on that pitch and at that moment I realized how special he really was.

Wasn't the only game he controlled for us, there were many many more. He had a supreme talent, one that I put into the bracket of players like Ozil and Berbatov, whereby people lazily assumed that they weren't affecting things or were being lazy players.

Yet they made things happen around them, they picked passes no one could, they produced moments of magic and in regards to Pogba, often had vision no one else on the pitch had.
But due to their style on the pitch, and with Pogba, off it, they get tagged with a viewpoint that sticks with many fans.
 

Pogue Mahone

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Standing in the Stretford End watching United dismantle St Etienne back in 2017, and it may have been the euphoria of seeing Zlatan score a hat trick, but Pogba was head and shoulders above anyone else on that pitch and at that moment I realized how special he really was.

Wasn't the only game he controlled for us, there were many many more. He had a supreme talent, one that I put into the bracket of players like Ozil and Berbatov, whereby people lazily assumed that they weren't affecting things or were being lazy players.

Yet they made things happen around them, they picked passes no one could, they produced moments of magic and in regards to Pogba, often had vision no one else on the pitch had.
But due to their style on the pitch, and with Pogba, off it, they get tagged with a viewpoint that sticks with many fans.
All of whom ultimately failed their biggest challenge because it takes more than talent and moments of magic to cut it at the very highest level.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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All of whom ultimately failed their biggest challenge because it takes more than talent and moments of magic to cut it at the very highest level.
Kinda harsh on Ozil, no? He succeeded with Germany (won the World Cup as a starter) and with Real Madrid (3 seasons with 25+ assists).
 

zaafi

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All of whom ultimately failed their biggest challenge because it takes more than talent and moments of magic to cut it at the very highest level.
Sounds eerily similar to a certain player of ours that you praise game after game, and insist is amazing for us. I love how this argument applies to every other player except Bruno.

Also, saying Özil failed his biggest challenge is ridiculous. Won La Liga, won World Cup, top assister in La Liga several seasons and in the Premier League, almost beating the all-time assist record in Premier League ever. Moments of magic really isn't how you should describe Özil.
 

Champ

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All of whom ultimately failed their biggest challenge because it takes more than talent and moments of magic to cut it at the very highest level.
I don't think you could be more wrong in my opinion.

These 'types' of players split opinion due to some people wanting different attributes from their respective positions.
However these players are often the game changers, the players that produce moments of magic in between playing at a general high standard.

Yet due to their ability to do this, people then assume that they should be performing these moments all the time, whilst simultaneously ignoring the benefits they bring to the team in their all round game.

Ozil for example was consistently the hardest worker at Arsenal, he ran the most, produced the most sprints, touched the ball the most, yet people still deemed him a 'luxury' player, very similar to Pogba.
 

Pogue Mahone

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I don't think you could be more wrong in my opinion.

These 'types' of players split opinion due to some people wanting different attributes from their respective positions.
However these players are often the game changers, the players that produce moments of magic in between playing at a general high standard.

Yet due to their ability to do this, people then assume that they should be performing these moments all the time, whilst simultaneously ignoring the benefits they bring to the team in their all round game.

Ozil for example was consistently the hardest worker at Arsenal, he ran the most, produced the most sprints, touched the ball the most, yet people still deemed him a 'luxury' player, very similar to Pogba.
All of them weren’t trusted by their managers when it mattered most. Which says it all really.
 

golden_blunder

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At the end of the day it doesn’t really matter what Pogba has done on the field. He’s going to remembered as a gigantic waste of money who was injury prone, and found out to be a cheat
 

Champ

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All of them weren’t trusted by their managers when it mattered most. Which says it all really.
I think their respective records speak for themselves to be honest.

Ozil is highly regarded and won countless individual awards, Berbatov and Pogba likewise.

Ozil and Pogba were integral parts of their national teams winning the world cup, I think their respective managers trusted them then.
 

DWelbz19

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Kinda harsh on Ozil, no? He succeeded with Germany (won the World Cup as a starter) and with Real Madrid (3 seasons with 25+ assists).
It’s harsh (and stupid) on all three. They all “cut it at the highest level”. Probably you could argue Berbatov less so.
 

jackal&hyde

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Pogba was a great footballer. We never were able to construct a balanced midfield to mitigate his few weaknesses. All we had to do was get a destroyer DM and a controller CM beside him, and let him be the maverick that he was. His combination of skill, technique and power was rare. Incredible talent
The irony was that we got that player in Casemiro just as we let Pogba go. We played him with McTom and Fred for the most part.

I think Pogba was/is one of the most talented mids I've seen but there were a number of issues, some with the club and not having a clear picture about squad building, some with very toxic influences on the player by his entourage, some with fans and media being obsessed with him and some with the player himself.
 

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Don't forget the dancing and haircuts also.
Maybe im not old and grumpy enough to understand this but what is the huge problem with this? Pogba stayed at home dancing with his family and called the barber over so he could get a silly haircut. Isnt that preferable to off field activities that other players might involve themselfs in? Im not against players going out or having a drink but i would think that staying at home is the better option?
 

crossy1686

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Maybe im not old and grumpy enough to understand this but what is the huge problem with this? Pogba stayed at home dancing with his family and called the barber over so he could get a silly haircut. Isnt that preferable to off field activities that other players might involve themselfs in? Im not against players going out or having a drink but i would think that staying at home is the better option?
I was joking, but the dancing for France against Switzerland when they were 2-0 and thought the game was over springs to mind, although I actually see nothing wrong with that particular incident, I’m sure it boiled piss everywhere. Also, I believe Rooney said somewhere that Pogba and Lingard were dancing in the changing room after a loss and he couldn’t understand why they were so happy.
 

Stadjer

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I was joking, but the dancing for France against Switzerland when they were 2-0 and thought the game was over springs to mind, although I actually see nothing wrong with that particular incident, I’m sure it boiled piss everywhere. Also, I believe Rooney said somewhere that Pogba and Lingard were dancing in the changing room after a loss and he couldn’t understand why they were so happy.
When i read Pogba and Switzerland in one sentence my mind springs to this :drool:

 

Gabriel Djemba-Bebe

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Sounds eerily similar to a certain player of ours that you praise game after game, and insist is amazing for us. I love how this argument applies to every other player except Bruno.

Also, saying Özil failed his biggest challenge is ridiculous. Won La Liga, won World Cup, top assister in La Liga several seasons and in the Premier League, almost beating the all-time assist record in Premier League ever. Moments of magic really isn't how you should describe Özil.
You do realise he's got you on mute don't you? He said he muted you months ago and yet you still keep replying to him like you're trying to get a rise out of him :lol:
 

Mr Pigeon

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Pogba organised his own barber to fly to Russia and half the squad got a hair cut in the hotel. That's what happened.

I remember reading it at the time and wondering how it was even news, but it must be important because I have remembered it.
It was news because news nowadays is absolutely anything. I think the BBC had three whole articles about Harry Styles cutting his hair last week for goodness sake.

This is what killed his career at United for me; the fact that our glorious bosses such as Woodward probably encouraged this stuff because it worked well on social media. Imagine you're Paul and you have all of the talent and intelligence in the world, but you like posting on Instagram whenever you take a shit. Instead of a Fergie figure at the club telling him to tone it down and focus on the football he was having Woody say "yeah, do the dab thingy again! We might not be competing for trophies but our engagement online is the highest in the world!"
 

Son

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Standing in the Stretford End watching United dismantle St Etienne back in 2017, and it may have been the euphoria of seeing Zlatan score a hat trick, but Pogba was head and shoulders above anyone else on that pitch and at that moment I realized how special he really was.

Wasn't the only game he controlled for us, there were many many more. He had a supreme talent, one that I put into the bracket of players like Ozil and Berbatov, whereby people lazily assumed that they weren't affecting things or were being lazy players.

Yet they made things happen around them, they picked passes no one could, they produced moments of magic and in regards to Pogba, often had vision no one else on the pitch had.
But due to their style on the pitch, and with Pogba, off it, they get tagged with a viewpoint that sticks with many fans.
I always loved watching Pogba for us personally. Never had a problem with him only his agent and the fact he often was flirting with other clubs.

As a footballer he was insanely talented and his long balls especially and some of his drives through midfield are works of art. Nobody in the current United squad can do some of the things he could.

Great footballer just a shame his body let him down. His family and agent didn’t exactly help the guy either. Granted you are stuck with your family.
 

Stadjer

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I always loved watching Pogba for us personally. Never had a problem with him only his agent and the fact he often was flirting with other clubs.

As a footballer he was insanely talented and his long balls especially and some of his drives through midfield are works of art. Nobody in the current United squad can do some of the things he could.

Great footballer just a shame his body let him down. His family and agent didn’t exactly help the guy either. Granted you are stuck with your family.
Fully agree. Before Pogba became injury prone and started to look quite sluggish, watching Pogba was by far the most entertaining part of watching Manchester United games. He was one of the few players capable of some moment of magic.
 

Son

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Fully agree. Before Pogba became injury prone and started to look quite sluggish, watching Pogba was by far the most entertaining part of watching Manchester United games. He was one of the few players capable of some moment of magic.
Pogba is a victim of the new style of football. Jordan Henderson is a good example. Won everything with liverpool but compared to Paul Pogba it’s laughable to consider him in the same category talent wise.

Super limited as a footballer but he was bought to do a limited set of things and did them well. You wouldn’t pay for tickets to see him though.

Had Pogba arrived in the 90’s or early 00’s he could have became a legend of the game.

We’ve seen in the past decade very few players are actually all that talented especially between the ages 25-30 all footballers seemed to be trained with limited systems in mind.

I can barely think of anyone within those years who have pogbas ability apart from maybe Bruno and Rodri if we can even count a CDM. Someone feel free to say some names because there are so few world class footballers in those years.

We saw in the World Cup just how poor the top level of football is right now. City and Bayern (though I’ve seen much better past Bayern sides) are the two exceptions but otherwise it’s kinda all mediocre in the sport currently.

In my opinion a bit of a low ebb for the sport despite the Saudis and others throwing dumb money around for above average players.
 

Canagel

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Pogba is a victim of the new style of football. Jordan Henderson is a good example. Won everything with liverpool but compared to Paul Pogba it’s laughable to consider him in the same category talent wise.

Super limited as a footballer but he was bought to do a limited set of things and did them well. You wouldn’t pay for tickets to see him though.

Had Pogba arrived in the 90’s or early 00’s he could have became a legend of the game.

We’ve seen in the past decade very few players are actually all that talented especially between the ages 25-30 all footballers seemed to be trained with limited systems in mind.

I can barely think of anyone within those years who have pogbas ability apart from maybe Bruno and Rodri if we can even count a CDM. Someone feel free to say some names because there are so few world class footballers in those years.

We saw in the World Cup just how poor the top level of football is right now. City and Bayern (though I’ve seen much better past Bayern sides) are the two exceptions but otherwise it’s kinda all mediocre in the sport currently.

In my opinion a bit of a low ebb for the sport despite the Saudis and others throwing dumb money around for above average players.
I wouldn't take Rodri over Pogba.

There are plenty of matchups in international football in which he made Kroos, Modric, KDB and many others considered the best of their generation look ordinary let alone Rodri.

If we are talking about just ceiling there hasnt been a more gifted midfield player than Paul Pogba in the last 8 or so years. I'll stand it by it and nobody will convince me otherwise.

His contemporaries are judged through a different lens, their stinker games are ignored while their top games are over lauded while for him it was the opposite. Its that simple. the English commentators are also part of the reason. He would put a chance on a plate for Zlatan, Rashford, Lingard or Lukaku on the regular without the commentators saying a word while they would salivate over the aforementioned players for the doing same actions.

He is also the only midfield player in history Ive seen get compared to different players with widely differing attributes. Like Ive seen him blasted for not working hard in defence like Kante, not controlling a midfield like Pirlo and not scoring like KDB. How does that make any sense??

It took me some time to find the answer because it confused me for a long time but I have concluded the answer is as follows:

People dont hold them to the same standard they held Pogba to because they cant do it all like him.

I mean why dont you critize Rodri or Kroos for not sliding in through balls to strikers. Yet Pogba would play in the same CM position as them in a pivot and register higher through ball numbers.
Logic would dictate if they were better they would register the same amount of through balls. They dont because they cant. Its that simple.

there was a graphic showing after he returned from surgery during covid that can be verified that no midfielder had done more through balls in the PL in the 2019/20 campaign. He also played the same CM role in France's Euro 2021 run and was top of the pile for through balls registered.

He did the Pirlo role in his first season here pulling strings while laying chances on a plate at the same time. You lauded Pirlo for how he controlled a game but you didnt critisize him for not laying chances. Why? Becuase he wasnt able to. You judged him on one thing. But you attacked Pogba for not creating chances and getting onto the end of them at the same time.


Objectively speaking there is no way that one can conclude he was a flop for Manchester United. Just look at this Goal article.

https://www.goal.com/en/news/paul-p...es-best-ball-winner/fghnyyybb5901jou5d97nq79o

But Paul Ince and Paul Scholes were attacking him and said he doesnt give a shit so he must have been shit.

There was also a similar article a year earlier that came out when Mourinho was tearing the dressing room apart and the club was in a toxic situation that he was in fact topping most midfield metrics not only in the team but accross the whole league. Ball winning with a bunch of ball winners. chance creator with a bunch of chance creators. Most dribbles completed with a bunch of wingers like Adama Traore. Its kind of crazy.
 
Last edited:

KeanoMagicHat

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Pogba is a victim of the new style of football. Jordan Henderson is a good example. Won everything with liverpool but compared to Paul Pogba it’s laughable to consider him in the same category talent wise.

Super limited as a footballer but he was bought to do a limited set of things and did them well. You wouldn’t pay for tickets to see him though.

Had Pogba arrived in the 90’s or early 00’s he could have became a legend of the game.

We’ve seen in the past decade very few players are actually all that talented especially between the ages 25-30 all footballers seemed to be trained with limited systems in mind.

I can barely think of anyone within those years who have pogbas ability apart from maybe Bruno and Rodri if we can even count a CDM. Someone feel free to say some names because there are so few world class footballers in those years.

We saw in the World Cup just how poor the top level of football is right now. City and Bayern (though I’ve seen much better past Bayern sides) are the two exceptions but otherwise it’s kinda all mediocre in the sport currently.

In my opinion a bit of a low ebb for the sport despite the Saudis and others throwing dumb money around for above average players.
Pogba has had a far better career than Henderson.
 

TsuWave

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I believe Rooney said somewhere that Pogba and Lingard were dancing in the changing room after a loss and he couldn’t understand why they were so happy.
This was the rest of the Rooney quote - by the way:

In his column for The Times, Rooney hailed Pogba as the best player of the Euros prior to France’s exit in the round of 16, but recounted one occasion when his “old-school” instincts got the better of him.

“I do remember one time, coming into training at United the day after a defeat, still feeling very annoyed and walking into the dressing room with Michael Carrick,” he said.

“We found Jesse and Paul dancing in there with the music on. I went over, turned it off and took the speakers out of the dressing room – because that’s my mindset, that’s how I’ve grown up in football.

Paul and Jesse accepted it, because I was the senior player, but in hindsight, they were not doing anything wrong, not hurting anyone, and it was just my old-school mentality kicking in.

“As Rio Ferdinand has said, players of our generation just have to get used to this generation and what has changed.”

Despite that incident, Rooney claims Pogba’s attitude was exemplary from the minute he arrived at Old Trafford.

“After he returned [from Juventus] in 2016, we had a season together under Jose Mourinho. Then, as before, Paul’s application was always fantastic, and his mentality was spot on.

“He wanted to win, he was a strong character, committed to the team. You should ignore all the silly criticism that comes his way. All that stuff about his hair-cuts and dancing – it’s irrelevant. None of it has anything to do with the player that Paul is.”

Rooney added: “People can have their opinions about Paul’s football, that’s fine, but some jump to conclusions about his character without knowing him.

In my experience as a team-mate, the actual work he puts in every day on the training ground is first class. As long as that doesn’t change, then the stuff he does off the pitch – which has slowed down anyway – does not matter in my opinion.”
 

DickDastardly

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“We found Jesse and Paul dancing in there with the music on. I went over, turned it off and took the speakers out of the dressing room – because that’s my mindset, that’s how I’ve grown up in football.





“After he returned [from Juventus] in 2016, we had a season together under Jose Mourinho. Then, as before, Paul’s application was always fantastic, and his mentality was spot on.

“He wanted to win, he was a strong character, committed to the team. You should ignore all the silly criticism that comes his way. All that stuff about his hair-cuts and dancing – it’s irrelevant. None of it has anything to do with the player that Paul is.”
But, isn't that contradictory?

"His mentality was spot on." ----> But when you lose a game, the next day you're dancing with music on, what's the mentality there?

"He wanted to win" -----> yeah, but he didn't mind losing.

Maybe i'm old school as well.
 

TsuWave

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But, isn't that contradictory?

"His mentality was spot on." ----> But when you lose a game, the next day you're dancing with music on, what's the mentality there?

"He wanted to win" -----> yeah, but he didn't mind losing.

Maybe i'm old school as well.
You read “clouds in venus” and concluded “dinosaurs must exist there!”