The Modern Draft: R1 - NoPace vs The Red Viper

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

vs

.......................................... Team NoPace ............................................................................... Team TRV ..........................................


Team No Pace

My Player's Peaks:
Falcao - 2009-13, 144 in 178 for Porto and Atletico Madrid.

Reus - 2011-15, 75 in 147 for both Borussias, named in the last 3 Kicker Bundesliga XI's, footballer of the year in 2012 for Germany, most assists in the league in 13/14.

Di Maria - 2013-2015, UEFA and FIFA team of the year in 2014 and the CL man of the match.

Rosicky - 2001-2003, Beat out a 29 + 30 year old Pavel Nedved for Czech Footballer of the year twice in a row.

Kroos - 2013-15, UEFA and FIFA team of the year and IFFHS World's Best Playmaker in 2014

T. Motta- 2010-2014, Serie A Team of the Year in 10/11 and Ligue 1 Team of the Year in 13/14, directly faced off and beat Xavi in his prime during peak Pep in Inter's 2010 CL 3-1 home victory

Filipe Luis - 2012-2014, 2014 BBVA team of the year; He and Courtois leave and Atletico went from conceding 26 in 38 to 22 in 25 this year.

Debuchy - 2011-15, Ligue 1 Team of the Year in 2012

Ledley King - 2002-2005 (but really this exact moment)

Sergio Ramos - 2012-2015, UEFA and FIFA Team of the Year each of the last 3 seasons

Casillas - 2008-11, Best Keeper in the World every year from 08-12 according to IFFHS.

Why I'll win in a nutshell:
-The only serious gulf in quality here is in the engine room, where Kroos-Thiago Motta vs Ramsey-Hargreaves is a mismatch. Over 90 minutes, that will determine control of what should be a match played mostly at a high-tempo.

Basic Tactics:
-I want a quick tempo game, the better to take advantage of his slow centre backs and positionally adrift engine room and my solid midfield and speedy defense.

-Formation is sort of a 4-2-3-1 but with Reus more advanced than Di Maria. Motta will drop in at times; Ramos and King are both fast and comfortable if pulled wider. Fullbacks will defend slightly narrow since through balls between CB and FB are more dangerous than wing play with his personnel. They'll still contribute offensively with their crossing skills and judicious overlapping.

Why I'll score multiple:
-My offense just makes sense: Reus and Falcao looking to get in behind and score, Di Maria and Rosicky couple creativity and tireless running, Kroos is the best passing CM in the world these days, my fullbacks are excellent crossers who will be freed to get involved by Motta's defensive work and the CBs pace and comfort working in wider areas.

-Terry and Cahill won't have Mourinho or the protection of a Matic in front of them. Rosicky and Di Maria will drag Hargeaves out of position and the protection just won't be there; Lichsteiner has been known to get caught upfield and Sirigu is a good but not great keeper. Marcelo, as brilliant as he is going forward, is (along with the CM's) another who wanders positionally.

-All in all, it's a defense ill-suited to dealing with my versatile attack and a predatory striker who abused Cahill in the 2012 Supercup for a hat trick, when they were both 26 and at their peak. Whenever he comes forward, I think the break will be on, especially on my right side against a wandering Marcelo and a slow Terry. Even if Terry gets out there, it'll still be Falcao vs Cahill 1 on 1 in the box.

Why I'll defend well:
-I like his attack, though I wonder if Cazorla and Iniesta aren't a bit too similar to really thrive together. His forward players were dangerous at their peak, but I do think he'll have trouble getting them chances with that Ramsey-Hargreaves midfield and those Chelsea CB's.

-His best chance to score is Iniesta and Cazorla playing through balls to Van Persie and Neymar. It's a good avenue. However, both King and Ramos have the agility to deal better than bruiser CB's with prime RVP and Neymar's movement and Motta has had some of best games of his career against Iniesta and Barcelona and is an expert at stopping those sorts of linkups. My fullbacks can tuck in a bit to clog up through balls into the channels between FB and CB, since there's no real width from his front 4. Not sure I'll keep him out but do think my personnel is well suited to dealing with his attack.

-Iker Casillas was incredible in his prime and a great fit to deal with the low, accurate shooting of Van Persie and Neymar.

-Reus is such a threat from wide that he'll pin back Marcelo or Marcelo will get forward often, have a productive game and Reus will roast Terry repeatedly in his spot.

-Di Maria, Rosicky and Kroos are aggressive passers. When a move fails, it will fail quickly and upfield, not with my players trying to link up in tight space. I think the result is I'll give up less promising counters than he will. My CB's are quick and his being slow will lead to more counters even occurring when the game gets stretched.

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Team The Red Viper

THE TEAM​

We will play a 4-2-3-1 formation. Salvatore Sirigu is the goalkeeper. The back four comprises of Stephan Lichtsteiner, Gary Cahill, John Terry and Marcelo. Lichtsteiner and Marcelo would play as full-backs who would overlap when needed. In central defense, we have the tried and tested combination of Terry and Cahill. Both complement each other's style quite well and have been amongst the best central defense pairing in the last couple of years.

Owen Hargreaves and Aaron Ramsey form the double pivot in central midfield. Ramsey would play in his natural box-box midfielder role while Hargreaves would play as a defensive midfielder/enforcer, who with his fantastic tackling and ball-winning ability, would help us win back the possession. Ahead of them is, the illusionist, Andrés Iniesta. Whats there to say about Iniesta? One of the best players in modern-era and as clutch as they come. He would play as the number ten in a free role and has complete license to roam all over the pitch. Alongside him on the right flank would be Santi Cazorla. Cazorla would play as the right sided-withdrawn attacking midfielder. A role, he played to perfection at Villareal, where he made a name for himself and won the Don Balón Award in 2006-07 which is awarded to the best Spanish player in La Liga.

Upfront, Robin Van Persie would lead the line for us, with Neymar playing off him as the left sided second striker/left wing-forward, the role he plays for Brazil NT and Barcelona currently. Van Persie would be the main striker, where he would play on the shoulders of their last defender and run the channels. Whenever Van Persie drops deep, Neymar would make those attacking runs and look to exploit the space between oppsition full-back and right centre-back.

THE TACTICS​

We will play possession based football. The entire front six is extremely comfortable in possession and all of them are very good passers of the ball. We would implement the pass and move philosophy. In Iniesta and Cazorla, we have two fantastic passers of the ball. With Van Persie running the channels and Neymar attacking the space between opposition full-back and right centre back, we would look to feed them with the through-balls from Iniesta and Cazorla. Van Persie at his peak was a fantastic finisher and he only needs half-a-chance to score. Same with Neymar who is a brilliant finisher. Marcelo would overlap and provide the width down that flank. Both him and Neymar have fantastic understanding between them which would come in very handy to dominate that left flank. Debuchy isn't the greatest of defenders and we would look to exploit that with Neymar attacking him from inside and Marcelo overlapping on the outside. Ramsey would be the x-factor for us in attack. Iniesta and Cazorla are masters at creating space and they would do so here as well. This would allow Ramsey to make runs into the box and finish off chances. All in all, there is plenty of goals and creativity going forward which would be nightmare to any defense to deal with.

Defensively, we would deploy a deep defensive backline to ensure we don't leave too much space behind our backline for the likes of Reus and Di Maria to run at. Whenever Marcelo goes to overlap, Hargreaves would cover for him down that flank and ensure we don't get outnumbered on counters. Iniesta was a brilliant at pressing and he would look to do the same here against Kroos. Iniesta would press Kroos and ensure Kroos doesn't get too much time and space on the ball to initiate and orchestrate the plays for NoPace. We would do this to ensure NoPace's transition is slower so that we can regain our shape when we lose the possession. Hargreaves would also help Marcelo out against Di Maria. Ramsey would stay close to Rosicky. Meanwhile, Lichtsteiner on the other flank would have a reserved role going forward as he would be up against Reus. He has the pace and physical ability to keep up with Reus and ensure he doesn't get to exploit as much as he could.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

@NoPace @The Red Viper

Game On. All the best to both of you!

 

[crappycraperson]

Two great writeups

 

[crappycraperson]

I am leaning towards noPace but there is a serious question mark over how he will tackle the threat on the left from Neymar, Marcelo and Iniesta. Motta will pretty much have to follow Iniesta around.

 

[BigDunc9]

Two great teams. I have noticed Red Viper is good at these draft games isn't he.

 

[NM]

Leaning towards no pace but saying Motta beat xavi in the 3-1 is laughable. I dislike that barca but having traveller half way around Europe by train meant that was a mismatch

 

[The Red Viper]

Just came online. Good luck, NoPace!

 

[VivaJanuzaj]

Reus on the right?

 

[The Red Viper]

Just read the tactics. You have made Terry look like he is some Sunday league defender!

I don't like Terry but he is one of the best defenders in the last ten odd years. Many players who have played against him consider to be one. The other day, Ronaldinho had him in his dream team and one of the best defenders he faced. Falcao was a very good striker but I don't know how you can bring the UEFA Super Cup match in 2012 and not include the fact that the centre back for Cahill that day was David Luiz and there was no John Terry alongside him. And, remember we will be considering the peak John Terry when he was even better than what he has been in the last couple of seasons. Chelsea's defense that day had no organization and had John Obi Mikel marshalling the midfield ffs. Hargreaves is a much much better midfielder than him. You can't understimate the importance of having a leader in the backline to organize the defense. That is what Chelsea's defense lacked that day.

 

[The Red Viper]

Leaning towards no pace but saying Motta beat xavi in the 3-1 is laughable. I dislike that barca but having traveller half way around Europe by train meant that was a mismatch

Also, we need to remember a couple of things. Motta wasn't the primary holding midfielder that day. He had a midfield general named Cambiasso alonsgide him and also Stankovic as well who support the defense a lot. That Inter 3-1 Barca game is overrated a lot to undermine Barca. People forget that Iniesta was missing that game and Barca had a legtimate penalty shout of Pedro disallowed. Not to mention, Ibra had a bad night and missed good chances. Inter were very good that day but it wasn't complete domination or anything.

 

[The Red Viper]

I am leaning towards noPace but there is a serious question mark over how he will tackle the threat on the left from Neymar, Marcelo and Iniesta. Motta will pretty much have to follow Iniesta around.

Yes. He mentions about Lichtsteiner being caught defensively but he has Debuchy who is a much inferior full-back to Lichtsteiner. With the link-up play of Neymar and Marcelo, and both have great understanding between them, he would be on backfoot throughout the game.

Also, how would he deal with Santi when he plays between the lines? Both Santi and Iniesta are great at one touch pass and move style. Both have great close control and are masters at drawing the opposition players out of position, thereby creating the space and then pass the ball the last moment. Iniesta and Santi would do that here as well and leave Motta in a no man's land most of the times.

 

[VivaJanuzaj]

Just read the tactics. You have made Terry look like he is some Sunday league defender!

I don't like Terry but he is one of the best defenders in the last ten odd years. Many players who have played against him consider to be one. The other day, Ronaldinho had him in his dream team and one of the best defenders he faced. Falcao was a very good striker but I don't know how you can bring the UEFA Super Cup match in 2012 and not include the fact that the centre back for Cahill that day was David Luiz and there was no John Terry alongside him. And, remember we will be considering the peak John Terry when he was even better than what he has been in the last couple of seasons. Chelsea's defense that day had no organization and had John Obi Mikel marshalling the midfield ffs. Hargreaves is a much much better midfielder than him. You can't understimate the importance of having a leader in the backline to organize the defense. That is what Chelsea's defense lacked that day.

You are right with everything you say apart from the bold part. NoPace has a point re Hargreaves not providing enough defensive cover. Mikel might be far behind Hargreaves overall as a footballer, but looking purely defensively he'll protect the midfield better than Hargreaves or Ramsey will.
NoPace will be lethal on counters here, I'm really not sure why Reus is being played at the right and not di Maria, but with two very offensive full backs like Marcelo & Lichsteiner, you'd want a better protection from either one defensive-ish full back or a proper DM.

Terry was indeed amazing at his prime, and Cahill isn't bad at any means, but against the counter this team will be very penetrable, and Terry at his prime was plenty of things but he wasn't fast, and Reus-di Maria & Falcao are fast.

TrV is too gung ho here, after plenty of criticism about his two offensive full backs he either needed to replace one, or get more protection from midfield, and he did neither. That team is brilliant going forward, but any team with some pace moving forward and creativity, while having the ability to soak the pressure and going forward will beat this tactic imo.

 

[Physiocrat]

My initial thoughts are that TRV's side would function better. NoPace is very narrow and has Reus on the wrong side. That said Cazola and Iniesta seem a little similar although Liechenstiener makes up for the narrowness a little in TRV's side

 

[The Red Viper]

-I like his attack, though I wonder if Cazorla and Iniesta aren't a bit too similar to really thrive together. His forward players were dangerous at their peak, but I do think he'll have trouble getting them chances with that Ramsey-Hargreaves midfield and those Chelsea CB's.

Cazorla played his best football at Villareal and then that season with Malaga when he had players similar to Iniesta in Cani and then Isco. And, I don't know how you can say that the forwards won't get enough chances.

You have two fantastic passers and creative players in Iniesta and Cazorla. Neymar himself is very good at creating chances as well. Considering that he is up against Debuchy, he would have a field day on that flank.

Motta has had some of best games of his career against Iniesta and Barcelona and is an expert at stopping those sorts of linkups.

Like, I mentioned above, the 3-1 game you are talking about is the game where Iniesta didn't play. And, he had Cambiasso alongside him. You don't have anyone close to Cambiasso's defensive nous and defensive ability in the team.

 

[crappycraperson]

You should swap Hargo and Ramsey around. I can't make up my mind here. I would have voted for Red Viper but I don't rate Hargo much. I also prefer the nopace's defensive set up marginally over Viper's.

 

[crappycraperson]

The two formations are also somewhat mirror images of each other

 

[The Red Viper]

You are right with everything you say apart from the bold part. NoPace has a point re Hargreaves not providing enough defensive cover. Mikel might be far behind Hargreaves overall as a footballer, but looking purely defensively he'll protect the midfield better than Hargreaves or Ramsey will. NoPace will be lethal on counters here, I'm really not sure why Reus is being played at the right and not di Maria, but with two very offensive full backs like Marcelo & Lichsteiner, you'd want a better protection from either one defensive-ish full back or a proper DM.

Hargreaves was brilliant defensively though. I can't believe you don't think he can provide enough defensive cover when he made a name for himself by doing that at Bayern alongside Effenberg and then later with England NT alongside Gerrard/Lampard.

This is him against Portugal:-


Look at how he stifled Cristiano and Figo, who was in the World Cup team of the tournament. Hargreaves was brilliant at that and that is what he will do here as well. Especially on that left flank along with Marcelo against Reus.

Terry was indeed amazing at his prime, and Cahill isn't bad at any means, but against the counter this team will be very penetrable, and Terry at his prime was plenty of things but he wasn't fast, and Reus-di Maria & Falcao are fast.

TrV is too gung ho here, after plenty of criticism about his two offensive full backs he either needed to replace one, or get more protection from midfield, and he did neither. That team is brilliant going forward, but any team with some pace moving forward and creativity, while having the ability to soak the pressure and going forward will beat this tactic imo.

Except its not gung-ho. It would have been gung-ho had I been playing a highbackline with space behind the defense to exploit. That would have exposed my backline. But, I am playing a deep backline and Lichtsteiner on the other flank isn't going to overlap like he does for Juve in a back five. He has defensive duties here and he can stick with them. Its amazing how he has been made out as some sort of loose cannon when in reality he has played extremely well in a back four. Thats how he made a name for himself at Lazio, which prompted Juve to buy him.

This is what Lichtsteiner had to say about Allegri's idea to shift to back four:- “I prefer to play as a four. I’ve always said that, even though I feel good in a three as well. It’s not new for me, because I played in a back four with Lazio. Even in the first part of Conte’s first season we played with four, it’s a bit easier for me.”

Even this season, when he played in a back four against Atletico Madrid in that very important match where they had to ensure they didn't lose, they kept a clean sheet against them and he was defending against Turan and Koke that game. Last week he played against Reus as a right back in a back four and did quite well. Reus was restricted quite well except for that brainfart by Chiellini where he slipped and gifted Reus the back fo finish it home.

 

[antohan]

TRVs attack is better suited to unlock the defence it faces.

There doesn't seem to be much of a midfield battle for control as both seem a bit gung ho there and not as bothered with the screening as they are with the creation and support to attack. TRVs midfield is better balanced overall (and yes, I rate Hargo, and yes he should be swapped with Ramsey).

 

[The Red Viper]

You should swap Hargo and Ramsey around. I can't make up my mind here. I would have voted for Red Viper but I don't rate Hargo much. I also prefer the nopace's defensive set up marginally over Viper's.

I need Hargreaves in that flank, which is why I have him so that he can cover for Marcelo and help him out defensively against Reus.

And, I like NoPace's team as well but I don't see how he can handle Iniesta. Its not like he has a Rijkaard or Roy Keane there. Its Motta who was good but far from being great to deal againsts someone of Iniesta's calibre. Iniesta at the top of his game absolutely annihilated Italy when the faced in the group stages.


Can't find the individual highlights but here is the compilation from 2012 Euros, where he was awarded the best player of the tournament award and was the man of the match in both the games against Italy.

 

[VivaJanuzaj]

Hargreaves was brilliant defensively though. I can't believe you don't think he can provide enough defensive cover when he made a name for himself by doing that at Bayern alongside Effenberg and then later with England NT alongside Gerrard/Lampard.

This is him against Portugal:-


Look at how he stifled Cristiano and Figo, who was in the World Cup team of the tournament. Hargreaves was brilliant at that and that is what he will do here as well. Especially on that left flank along with Marcelo against Reus.



Except its not gung-ho. It would have been gung-ho had I been playing a highbackline with space behind the defense to exploit. That would have exposed my backline. But, I am playing a deep backline and Lichtsteiner on the other flank isn't going to overlap like he does for Juve in a back five. He has defensive duties here and he can stick with them. Its amazing how he has been made out as some sort of loose cannon when in reality he has played extremely well in a back four. Thats how he made a name for himself at Lazio, which prompted Juve to buy him.

This is what Lichtsteiner had to say about Allegri's idea to shift to back four:- “I prefer to play as a four. I’ve always said that, even though I feel good in a three as well. It’s not new for me, because I played in a back four with Lazio. Even in the first part of Conte’s first season we played with four, it’s a bit easier for me.”

Even this season, when he played in a back four against Atletico Madrid in that very important match where they had to ensure they didn't lose, they kept a clean sheet against them and he was defending against Turan and Koke that game. Last week he played against Reus as a right back in a back four and did quite well. Reus was restricted quite well except for that brainfart by Chiellini where he slipped and gifted Reus the back fo finish it home.

The fact that he prefers that doesn't make him any less susceptible defensively really. I just don't rate him very highly defensively. I do rate Marcelo's defensive abilities higher than most people do, but I just think his role here will make his side too offensive.

As for Hargreaves, I had a plan to play him instead of Song behind Pogba and Yaya in a Pirlo-ish role, so I definitely rate him defensively, I just don't think that he is the right player for you with so many attacking quality from your opponent. Like I said, if you wanted Hargreaves in a defensive role you need to have one full back who is not offensive. It doesn't matter how highly you rate Lichsteiner and how much we misjudge his defensive abilities, his natural instinct is of an attacking full back, or at least his prime came as one which has to count here. In order for me to play Hargreaves in that role I took Ivanovic, who is miles better defensively than Lichsteiner, simply so Hargreaves won't need to play the defensive role. That's a waste of him. Effenberg is comfortably better than Ramsey, especially defensively so that comparison isn't too good, Bayern also played 5-3-2 a lot of time in that era with Lizarazu and Sagnol as the attacking full backs, and since they didn't think Effenberg-Hargreaves were good enough defensively they had 3 at the back. Right @Balu ?

 

[The Red Viper]

The fact that he prefers that doesn't make him any less susceptible defensively really. I just don't rate him very highly defensively. I do rate Marcelo's defensive abilities higher than most people do, but I just think his role here will make his side too offensive.

As for Hargreaves, I had a plan to play him instead of Song behind Pogba and Yaya in a Pirlo-ish role, so I definitely rate him defensively, I just don't think that he is the right player for you with so many attacking quality from your opponent. Like I said, if you wanted Hargreaves in a defensive role you need to have one full back who is not offensive. It doesn't matter how highly you rate Lichsteiner and how much we misjudge his defensive abilities, his natural instinct is of an attacking full back, or at least his prime came as one which has to count here. In order for me to play Hargreaves in that role I took Ivanovic, who is miles better defensively than Lichsteiner, simply so Hargreaves won't need to play the defensive role. That's a waste of him. Effenberg is comfortably better than Ramsey, especially defensively so that comparison isn't too good, Bayern also played 5-3-2 a lot of time in that era with Lizarazu and Sagnol as the attacking full backs, and since they didn't think Effenberg-Hargreaves were good enough defensively they had 3 at the back. Right @Balu ?

I didn't compare Effenberg and Ramsey. I simply mentioned how Hargreaves was supposed to be the defensive midfielder in that set-up. And, Bayern playing five at the back had nothing to do with Effenberg and Hargreaves not being good defensively. Its just that around then most of the teams in Bundesliga played that system and especially Hitzfeld who preferred that set-up at Bayern like he did with Dortmund earlier. Also, Balu can correct me if I am wrong but Bayern moved to a back four not so long after that when they bought Ballack.

 

[NoPace]

I am leaning towards noPace but there is a serious question mark over how he will tackle the threat on the left from Neymar, Marcelo and Iniesta. Motta will pretty much have to follow Iniesta around.

I'm sort of risking it. Lots of respect for Marcelo offensively but Reus vs Terry is too good to pass up when Marcelo does get past Reus.

Also, remember Ramos is good at moving wide defensively and King can then cover RVP, and Kroos is very used to being alone in central midfield if Iniesta does drag Motta around a bit.

My team is flexible and solid as a result.

 

[VivaJanuzaj]

I didn't compare Effenberg and Ramsey. I simply mentioned how Hargreaves was supposed to be the defensive midfielder in that set-up. And, Bayern playing five at the back had nothing to do with Effenberg and Hargreaves not being good defensively. Its just that around then most of the teams in Bundesliga played that system and especially Hitzfeld who preferred that set-up at Bayern like he did with Dortmund earlier. Also, Balu can correct me if I am wrong but Bayern moved to a back four not so long after that when they bought Ballack.

The DM's role in a 5-3-2 is much different than the DM role in a 4-2-3-1 with two attacking full backs. When NoPace will hit the counter you'll have Cahill-Terry and sometimes Hargreaves behind, facing at the very minimum Falcao & Reus. I can see you getting outpaced there often. If you had 3 CBs, Hargreaves would've been perfect for that setup, but with two attacking full backs, no other defensive minded midfielder and the pace going forward from the opponent - That's deadly stuff for you.

I really like your overall team, but if I were you I'd take my 12th pick and replace Lichsteiner for a RCB(maybe O'Shea?) and that team would've been perfectly balanced. Now, it's not, and you're facing the perfect opponent for it.

 

[antohan]

I didn't compare Effenberg and Ramsey. I simply mentioned how Hargreaves was supposed to be the defensive midfielder in that set-up. And, Bayern playing five at the back had nothing to do with Effenberg and Hargreaves not being good defensively. Its just that around then most of the teams in Bundesliga played that system and especially Hitzfeld who preferred that set-up at Bayern like he did with Dortmund earlier. Also, Balu can correct me if I am wrong but Bayern moved to a back four not so long after that when they bought Ballack.

Absolutely. I don't agree with VJ on him not being good defensively or requiring a defensive fullback.

I do agree with Hargo being a bit wasted as "cover for Marcelo". He is better than that and would perform better on the right against Di Maria (both in attack and defence).

 

[NoPace]

My initial thoughts are that TRV's side would function better. NoPace is very narrow and has Reus on the wrong side. That said Cazola and Iniesta seem a little similar although Liechenstiener makes up for the narrowness a little in TRV's side

Reus has played a fair amount on the right side, and that narrowness is combatted by Di Maria and Reus being on their correct sides and thus more likely to stretch play. Less cutting in, which neither is really about anyways.

 

[Balu]

Bayern also played 5-3-2 a lot of time in that era with Lizarazu and Sagnol as the attacking full backs, and since they didn't think Effenberg-Hargreaves were good enough defensively they had 3 at the back. Right @Balu ?

From 2002 on we played a back four, mostly a 442. The CL winning side in 2001 was the last 5-3-2 team and it was all a bit improvised with Andersson playing libero after Matthäus retired. I wouldn't judge Hargreaves on his debut season. He played a variety of roles and probably his best game in the semifinal against Real when he filled in for Effenberg who was suspended. Hargreaves certainly wasn't a defensive liability and he did a great job when Jeremies was out with his knee injuries. He was constantly moved around, right back, defensive midfielder, right sided midfielder. From 2003/04 onwards he usually played as the most defensive player though. At first in a flat midfield four next to Frings, then as the number 6 in a diamond with Schweinsteiger on the right and Ze Roberto on the left.

To cut it short, the role he's playing here is probably close to his peak role at Bayern. Not entirely sure why he's positioned on the left here though. I'd have it the other way round.

 

[crappycraperson]

I need Hargreaves in that flank, which is why I have him so that he can cover for Marcelo and help him out defensively against Reus.

And, I like NoPace's team as well but I don't see how he can handle Iniesta. Its not like he has a Rijkaard or Roy Keane there. Its Motta who was good but far from being great to deal againsts someone of Iniesta's calibre. Iniesta at the top of his game absolutely annihilated Italy when the faced in the group stages.


Can't find the individual highlights but here is the compilation from 2012 Euros, where he was awarded the best player of the tournament award and was the man of the match in both the games against Italy.

Iniesta's the only reason I have not voted against your team yet . I also believe that Neymar does not get enough credit on here. Since WC he has been very good.

 

[NoPace]

Now that I'm here, I'll point out that Rosicky is basically unmarked here and would be a massive headache for Cahill or Terry stepping up to deal with him.

And the keepers haven't been mentioned, but if the chances are similar, prime Casillas vs prime Sirigu will look like many a current United game with the Spanish keeper pulling off a great save or two and a win following.

 

[NoPace]

We saw Hargreaves as a central midfielder here in 06-07 and he ended up on the right for a reason. Played in a midfield 2 with more than one partner, the midfield was poor and had to be changed.

I believe Ramsey would be such a partner, especially at this level and with Kroos up against them and the cleverness of Rosicky and drive of Di Maria to deal with.

 

[The Red Viper]

Now that I'm here, I'll point out that Rosicky is basically unmarked here and would be a massive headache for Cahill or Terry stepping up to deal with him.

And the keepers haven't been mentioned, but if the chances are similar, prime Casillas vs prime Sirigu will look like many a current United game with the Spanish keeper pulling off a great save or two and a win following.

I have Ramsey to keep track of Rosicky's late runs. Also, this isn't man to man or one on one defending like it is in basketball. Hargreaves isn't man marking Reus here. He is there to keep an eye and ensure Reus doesn't get free reigns down that flank. Similarly I can mention that you have no one to keep track of Ramsey's runs when he makes those late runs into the box. Last season and even during the start of this season before he got injured his goal scoring record was brilliant. So, along with Iniesta and Santi, you have another player to worry about on the defensive end.

 

[NoPace]

I have Ramsey to keep track of Rosicky's late runs.

I'd take that matchup all day.

Ramsey isn't great defensively and really, apart from last season's 20 games, he hasn't been anywhere near the level you'd need to play well among players like this. Whoscored has him at under 7 for every season of his career but last year's (which again, half a season really) and he struggled again this year with many Arsenal fans wanting him benched.

 

[NoPace]

Leaning towards no pace but saying Motta beat xavi in the 3-1 is laughable. I dislike that barca but having traveller half way around Europe by train meant that was a mismatch

I just meant he marked him directly and played very well and his team was better that day.

 

[VivaJanuzaj]

Ramsey for me was always better offensively than defensively

 

[NoPace]

Ramsey for me was always better offensively than defensively

Absolutely. I think he's out of his depth here.

 

[Mani]

Though i like both set of players, i pick vipers team for this as it look more balanced.

 

[Physiocrat]

Gone for TRV due to his better balance.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

TRV wins.

Congrats @The Red Viper
Haed Luck @NoPace

 

[Cutch]

John Terry has won in a draft game for the first time i can remember

Well done TRV