Utd Draft: R1 - Fortitude vs EAP

With players at their career (not Utd) peak, who would win?


  • Total voters
    11
  • Poll closed .

Physiocrat

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Fortitude

---------------------------------------------Cole
-------------------------------Yorke
Hill----------------------------------------------------------------------Berry
-------------------------Charlton
---------------------------------------Crerand
Jones----------------------------------------------------------------Simpson
---------------------------Evans---------------Smalling
-------------------------------------Schmeichel

EAP



Fortitude Tactics

Fortitude believe I'll face a flat 4-4-2, as follows:

-----------------------------------Romero
---------------------Pallister----------------Stam
Brown-------------------------------------------------------------Heinze
----------------------Herrera------------------Eriksen
Young-------------------------------------------------------Poborsky
-------------------------------------Cantona
--------------------------------------Falcao

Beings as this is about overall peaks and not necessarily what each player did at Man Utd, I believe Edgar has quite a problem with Eriksen, whose best form flits from NT at CM and further forward into AM at Spurs and Inter; in a battle against Charlton, in particular, any midfield in the draft is going to have their hands full, let alone one who have Eriksen in there trying to match athleticism and probably even more importantly, stamina, with Charlton whose tireless movement, running and sudden bursts into full-power sprints has a massive, massive issue in terms of containment. Charlton is also the best immediate long or mid-range shooter in the draft and one of the best - if not the best - in the entire history of the sport. What this means is that he cannot be allowed to get his range or laid off from because the openings to then shoot are innumerable and have a high probability of hitting them mark with unstoppable velocity. Charlton, by himself, is a huge issue and problem to stop, and I thought it worth a paragraph to point out that Edgar has serious issues in this department with his personnel before extending to the bigger picture. Charlton is an ace card of immense proportion, and I feel that must be reiterated before getting onto other matters.

The intention with my side was to match the tenets of United's storied past and what embodies and personifies us as a club - flying wingers; aggressive play; unpredictability in attack; creativity, and the ability to turn the pressure up and up until the dam bursts; Charlton may be the ace card, but I have another hot shot shooter in Gordon Hill; oodles of creativity and unpredictability in proven, treble-winning pairing of Yorke-Cole and the ceaseless driving runs of Busby Babe, Johnny Berry, all of these players fed by a very precise through ball and forward passer in Paddy Crerand.

My onus is on having Edgar contend with what my side brings to the table; I believe he has a plethora of obstacles to get through to get a foothold on the game - if my team is driving his back, as I intend them to, what he has left is a need to try and hit me on transitions, to do that, he has to have a high quality of passer and/or dribbler from deep to attempt to intialise those attacks.

His side is not blessed with pace, nor does he have any reliable deep-passers in either defence or midfield - Eriksen will struggle mightily with the pace of this game, so his ability to buy time and affect it will be severely diminished. I did feel as though Edgar's team sets mine up for wave upon wave of attack, because even in winning the ball back, getting it out of feet and doing something penetrating and threatening with it, is very difficult for them as a unit. For all the cunning of Cantona, he needs a foil to tee him up or interact with him to really be able to express himself and in Edgar's team, I envisage Cantona cutting a very lonely figure who has too many bodies on and around him to be able to get his head up, affect play and find the one option Edgar has to score goals other than Cantona himself.

When his wide-men aren't focused on mine, they have little in their respective careers to state they can be goalscorers in this company. Granted, Poborsky had the wonderful lob vs Schmeichel for his country, but that was in a set up Edgar doesn't have the means to effectively recreate with his personnel.

To make matters worse, my backline will play high and condense the pitch wherever possible; Jones is deployed to spoil, first and foremost; his job is to be the athletic equal of Young whilst providing solid cover for Hill to go forwards and not bother too much with tracking back. Again, if my team is performing as I would like, Young will be preoccupied with working backwards with little time or chance to go in the other direction, isolating Edgar's forwards who will have little supply or opportunity to work.

Danny Simpson had the season of his life when Leicester won the league. He was the staple right-back for them that season and performed solidly and dependably, certainly enough for me to be satisfied he can go out and keep things testy for Poborsky, who is more likely to drift infield than go wide, anyway.

I like the relentless drive of my side, and I'll back that to be a serious problem for Edgar's side, who I don't think are built to go again and again again against tricky and cunning attackers. Stam and Pallister want bigger, more direct opponents, not two flies buzzing around constantly setting beguiling traps and one-two's that negate all that brawn and size. Jaap loved 1-1 tussles and was brilliant at charging down individuals. Pallister's pace is also renowned, but both of them are suited to long, lengthy tussles against a brilliant individual, not an intricate, clever, staccato pairing who will seek to use the lack of acceleration both have against them. I actually feel as though my pairing are the worst for them to deal with in the entire draft, for the fact they are a proven pairing who have a storied track record of playing through the best defences the world had to offer in 1999.

Edgar also has 4 CB's across his backline. Brown and Heinze did do solid jobs as FB's, but both of them are going to want to tuck in (especially Heinze) than go out and be isolated against tricky wingers. Between his CB's having to keep both eyes on Yorke-Cole at all times, and his FB's wanting to tuck, there will be ample opportunity for my wingers to play key roles in this match. Berry vs Heinze, would be, imo, a mismatch even if it was 1 vs 1 wide - a little, tricky winger is the stuff of nightmares for Heinze, and his penchant for going to ground to early would be exposed more than once in that contest. Once free of Heinze, the CB then has to decide whether to try cover space or stay tight to his man; Andy Cole's number #1 skill was his absolutely world class movement... there are inlets for this whether that back 4 goes compact or tries to match man for man.

A me-centric write up, but I believe that my threats out do his across the pitch and his team won't have enough of the ball, nor the ball-playing ability to stop or turn the tide. Charlton is at home no matter whether Herrera is trying to be in his face or confident enough to try and hold position, so yeah, one, two, three, four, five obstacles too many for Edgar's defence to contend with, and not enough on the other side of the ball to be effective, especially with so much ground to then try and cover getting back up the pitch. That won't be sustainable over two halves, physically or mentally.

Finally, I should mention my Pele-lite (for that season) in Yorke; in the form of his life, this guy is a real trickster for Edgar. Stam should rightfully be on him, but the tandem of Charlton and Yorke is the stuff of nightmares, with the latter being ready and able to set up the former at any given moment. As stated further up, there are more ways than one for my unit to be effective, and Yorke dragging Stam into deep waters is definitely a component worth mentioning in its own right. Yorke doesn't have to score in this game to have done a blinding job of contributing to other dangerous players being tee'd off to do so.

If you don't know of Gordon Hill, I implore you to watch these to get a gist of the player and the threat he offers, especially in terms of reading play and arriving with one time shots at the opportune moment:


Johnny Berry:


Carrick before Carrick in Crerand:


As can be seen above, it is imperative Edgar tries to stop both Charlton and Crerand, but the tandem penetration is absurdly difficult to contain - these two also know each other's game inside out, so more perfect synergy to go alongside the front pairing.

EAP Tactics

Formation: Classic 4-4-2

Tl;dr Why I'd win: Better defence and attack with comparable midfield.

A solid defence:
- Sergio Romero who's the most capped GK in Argentine NT history. Despite being mostly De Gea's backup, he was solid in his appearances including Europe League Finals. Composed, calm, good reflexes and shot stopping ability and decent ball distribution from the back.
- Jaap Stam & Gary Pallister - Two players who rank amongstTop 5 in all CBs in United history. The beast of a Stopper paired with the the calm and classy style of Pallister complements each other well.
- Gabriel Heinze & Wes brown: Brown was a top talent who never achieved/maintained his peak due to injuries. Was solid in the 2008 backline.

A industrious & creative midfield:
- Eriksen's passing & Herrera's POTY winning industriousness fits right into the mold of classic 4-4-2 midfield engine. Both able to contribute to at both ends of the pitch and able to drive the ball forward. Good blend of workrate and passing ability.
- Classic wingers in Young & Poborsky. Quick on flanks, able to motor up and down all game, good crossing/passing.

Lethal Attack:
- No into needed for Cantona. Cantona was a classic second striker powerful and skillful in both creating and scoring. His expansive style compliments the natural goal scorer in Falcao.
 

Šjor Bepo

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fortitude still on windows 95 with this formation picture :lol:

not the biggest fan of his defence but edgar midfield is shocking so its a win for fortitude, charlton would have a field day
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Horrendous midfield 2 that against a Goat no less. Shame as the rest of the team is spectacular.
 

Chesterlestreet

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Missed the deadline.

Anyway, would've voted @Fortitude.

The score doesn't reflect the overall strength of the teams - obviously not - but rather the fact that EAP has a huge problem here in the middle of the park. Simple as that, really - the rest of it isn't enough to make up for that.
 

Enigma_87

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Do you all not rate Herrera even in his POTY peak?
He's probably your best midfielder, although I do rate Spurs Eriksen, but that doesn't say much.

Shame as defence is one of the best in the first round and Cantona / Falcao is pretty good pairing.
 

harms

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Do you all not rate Herrera even in his POTY peak?
He's a very good player but not good enough to stop that Charlton/Crerand pair with no help from Cantona and little help from Eriksen. And the latter is certainly a good pick for this draft but not for a 4-4-2! Even if you were to pair him up with Keane it's going to be questionable.
 

Demyanenko_square_jaw

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I gained a new appreciation for Poborsky after watching most of the last strong Czech national team era games in order, a few years back. He has a case for being their best from 96-04 and often had more to offer as an attacking and link-up player than Nedved, who he certainly didn't look less talented than. Hard working, good skills, tricky without overestimating himself, usually good decision-making. Interesting that he didn't manage to translate that consistently to club level, but perhaps just a comfort zone player.
 

Šjor Bepo

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I gained a new appreciation for Poborsky after watching most of the last strong Czech national team era games in order, a few years back. He has a case for being their best from 96-04 and often had more to offer as an attacking and link-up player than Nedved, who he certainly didn't look less talented than. Hard working, good skills, tricky without overestimating himself, usually good decision-making. Interesting that he didn't manage to translate that consistently to club level, but perhaps just a comfort zone player.
he was great for the national team, not so much at club level....flopped both at Lazio and United, was decent at Benfica but never really close to his national form. shame
 

Demyanenko_square_jaw

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I actually remember him being really well received when he came in halfway through the season at Lazio around the same time Eriksson resigned to join England. That disrupted them and a lot of players lost form, but he got a good amount of credit for settling right away and being a main contributor (in playing quality, not numbers) to stopping them falling too far down the table. Second season, yeah, not so good, but the whole team was inconsistent that year after losing Veron and Nedved, so i give more slack than the failure at United; I at least got the impression there it was somewhere he could have succeeded with better timing of the transfer. Still, definitely a disappointing club career.