The goalposts keep moving and the expectations get lower and lower. At this rate we'll be like 2006-13 Arsenal but without the pretty football- happy to finish fourth every season without seriously challenging for trophies.
Louis Van Gaal | 2015-16 Performance Thread
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So why are only two teams ahead of us ?
I admit I am beginning to see the arsenal mentality seep in more and more around the forum but we can't be near the top and honestly that bad.
But I was discussing results and performance and you told me it didn't matter until seasons end. So what's the point in discussing the team if we can't judge them yet?
Because you can't win every game so if the only joy people derive from football is results then they will ultimately e disappointed. Obviously nobody will be happy to be in the relegation zone but how many people have said they only care about entertaining football and don't mind if we win? I'll not hold my breath while I wait on you finding those posts.
Perhaps we've had a slightly kinder fixture list so far? We've only played one of last years top 6 away so far.
considering the last 2 years if we were top and playing shite I wouldn't give a feck.
Getting back on top is the priority, we aren't there yet. Every fan is different though.
I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to the whole results vs entertainment debate.
The reason it's too much to ask is because our rivals have either had much longer to build a squad or spent much more money doing so; in the case of the title favourites... Both; and in the case of Chelsea both with worse results in terms of points and performances. At the moment our fans are asking us to play quality Football, compete for trophies, completely re-build the squad and stick to our principles of playing youth; all whilst having changed from a manager who ran everything in the club for nearly 30 years, to a manager who sucked all confidence out of our squad, to a manager whose come in and steadied the ship.
Not only that but teams set-up differently against Leicester, Spurs and even Liverpool. They can go at teams and end up beating So'ton 6-1 or Swansea 3-0 or West Ham 4-1, because those teams will all turn up with the intent of going at them for the win. Most teams play us with 11 men behind the ball, which is partly because of our slow/laborious play, but also because a point is a great result. You could say we need to adapt our play style to encourage teams to attack us, but we shouldn't have appointed Van Gaal if we wanted anything other than him to steady the ship.
I don't have a huge concern that Spurs, Leicester or Liverpool will finish above us. However I said at the start of the season a solid 75 points (which we're currently on course for) in the context of our huge turnover of players would represent progress. A run in the FA Cup or Champions League would be a bonus, although I do agree anything but knockout stages of the CL would be a huge disappointment.
I hope so, however I am not so optimistic we will be able to bring 2 world class forwards in the summer. Lets see though, stranger things have happened. It will be the 3rd summer where such has been promised, and we're still waiting for the CB signing so anyway lets see.
Are all discussions on forum simply to judge players and results?
Anyway i don't think we completely agree nor completely disagree. Let's leave it at that.
Maybe just one will be needed up front. Say we managed to get Muller in, then Martial and Memphis really step up, things will look completely different.
Centre back, Stones or Laporte. There's not a huge amount needed compared to 6 months ago when so many changed got made.
The sytle of play is horrible right now but trying to be optimistic.
The style has been horrible ever since he was here apart from when he was forced to play Herrera in midfield lasts season.
We had ADM and Herrera last season, one failed cos he was a prick but also because of the manager and our style of play.
Lets not even talk about the treatment of Herrera, its clear such players who take risks are not wanted/favored by the manager.
So we can sign Muller... great we'll finish more of the chances we create, but since the midfield don't take enough risks we won't be a great side so the sooner either LVG changes his approach or is shown the door the better.
At least LvG was capable of waking up Issa Hayatou.
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We had that period last April where we looked brilliant. Then Jose parked the bus at the bridge and sneaked a one-nil win and it seems teams have known how to play us ever since. Van Gaal needs to find a way to break down the teams that park the bus. His record against the big sides is pretty good because they attack us. (Although even City rocked up at OT this season looking for a 0-0)
The Herrera treatment is poor, I agree. He's not a perfect manager but he's got his methods & we just have to wait & see what happens. If he thinks his team can dominate 80% of the ball and finish off the chances, leaving the opposition next to no chance of winning, then we will pick up trophies. The entertainment demanded by us supporters may never get filled by Van Gaal.
If we get knocked out of the CL today, he should be sacked, we had one of the easiest groups, And if we do, I`d say we should part ways after summer, and bring either Ancelotti or Pep, as I dont really trust him with spending money
No, instead they whinge about things the moment the manager does what they've been asking for. Really smart stuff.
In truth, it wasn't even about the negative football. It was the 0-0 which got the crowds goat. Which is fine, it's their prerogative. But pretending that it's negative football that annoys you in order to boo right after the manager changed things up (but didn't win) is contradictory.
Anyways, moving on to the manager.
Not really how it works. Upsets are part and parcel of football. You should beat every team below 4th place but it's never going to happen.
Of course, but I'm saying that the idea we could/should be top of the table, ceteris paribus, is hardly outlandish.
We didn't have to dismantle our squad for a start. That's something LVG chose to do not something he was forced to do and cannot be used as an excuse. Secondly, how much our rivals spend is irrelevant when we're talking about how we should be playing or whether we should be challenging. How many teams have actually outspent us in the last couple of years? Probably City and Chelsea so I'd say expecting to challenge for the title is a very reasonable demand. And to be fair, we are challenging although it's not down to our quality. And no one's demanding we play quality attacking that Arsenal or City play. That would be ideal but the current level is unacceptable. We barely look like scoring goals while still conceding chances. LVG had the entire summer to go out and solve our creative issues only for us to go out and buy a defender who can't attack, a midfield plodder, a past it midfielder, a winger who can't beat his man or do anything useful at all and Martial. Only Martial has helped the team and even he's being let down by crappy attacking play behind him.
The second para is a terrible excuse.
I dint know what the last couple of years has to do with anything. Squads are built over a 5+ year period... Not 2.
A lot would disagree that we didn't need a major rebuild.
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We'll get knocked out tonight and VG "sack watch" will pop up.
Can we restart this poll after tonight's game?
Yes, please.
Yeah I'd like to see this as well.
Not sure where to put this but thought it was relatively interesting. Shows United and Arsenal are doing the exact same in equivalent fixtures basically while City are doing worse then last year. Probably what's more disappointing is that despite after out first 10 games this season having like 10 points more then at that stage last season, we've let it be basically the same as last year just a few games later.
Well yeah, if you think we should be 2 or 3 points better of then sure. When the poster said "with this quality of squad we should be doing a lot better and league title has to be won", I imagine comfortably in the lead right now or something.
Personally, I think that points-wise/results-wise we are pretty much where we should be or I would have expected us to be given our squad.
I don't get him.
Why didn't he just line up like this against West Ham and PSV at home.
Wolfsburg away we should be playing two holding midfielders. But in the above games, we shouldn't.
Why didn't he just line up like this against West Ham and PSV at home.
Wolfsburg away we should be playing two holding midfielders. But in the above games, we shouldn't.
Our players are all over the place, Schweini is always in a weird position and Mata sometimes the deepest
We've actually looked a bit more positive today, although suddenly look more shaky in defence.
It doesn't help our shape when Fellaini's always quite erratic positionally as well.
Tactically stupid.
Bye bye. Ancelloti or pep in the summer please
Bye bye. Ancelloti or pep in the summer please
Exactly our supporters are all football managers. The way forward was to rely on our defence today and maybe snatch a goal or two at max. Now we are having to score 3.
If van gaal had played the 352 which we do when we have a lot of injuries then we would have bot conceded two. No but lets attack right? Because everybody is bored. Bet they are excited now.
Well everyone wanted attacking football, here it is.
The midfield looked suspect to me when I heard about and it's been even worse in practice. Fellaini has barely played as a central midfielder. He's spending most of the game as an attacker or a number 10, and Schweinsteiger is playing as the only CM and has been poor. We have to win today but that doesn't mean you play without a central midfield.
Lol another supporter. If anyone is going to rely on van gaal its guardiola.
Fellaini in midfield 
I suspect this might be why we play the style noone likes. We've been all over the place defensively, although it could also have to do with injuries to defenders.
A bit of both, I'd say.
Is he Frank Spencer in disguise....tactically we are an utter mess!!!!!!
Biggest 45 minutes of his managerial career at Old Trafford.