The Impossible Draft R1 - Brwned vs Pat_Mustard

With players at career peak, who will win this match?


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Edgar Allan Pillow

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VS


....................................... TEAM BRWNED ................................................................................... TEAM PAT MUSTARD ...................................



TEAM BRWNED

Tactical Overview

The "Zona Mista" is an unconventional but thoroughly successful setup that Platini's Juventus played in the 80s, which was a modern update to the more well-known "Catenaccio" played by Inter in the 60s. Examples of Juventus playing it and how it was portrayed visually can be found in the 1985 and 1983 European Cup finals, and the 1984 Cup Winners Cup. More details on the specifics of the Juve setup can be found below:


The primary benefits of the system were that it was typically hard to break down, while getting the most out of its three key players: the immaculate libero, Scirea; the omnipresent playmaker, Platini; and the all-round attacking force of Boniek. It's a fluid setup, reliant on everyone in the team being comfortable in multiple areas of the pitch, reading the game quickly and moving in unison.

The most notable and possibly visually off-putting aspect of it is the lopsidedness of it - one wing back and one tucked in fullback, one wide midfielder and one withdrawn forward. Rather than having gaping holes all over the pitch, this simply meant that many of the team were multi-taskers - Tardelli might pull out to the vacant fullback position to cover a break, or Scirea might gallop up the wing. Bettega might fall back into a defensive position or he might act as a centreforward, while Boniek drifted into space.

Recognising the complexity of the system and the very specific requirements of each role, the team has been selected with all of those dimensions in mind e.g. favouring the "ultimate team man" Cha Bum-kun over the unstoppable maverick, Julinho. The "style of play" sections below provide plenty of detail on the role these players typically played, often with quotes are excerpts from articles expanding on that, and whose role they are occupying from the Juve team. A shorter overview can be found below:

Hapgood, as a pre-WWII fullback, loved that space Gentile played in between fullback and centre back where he could display his class on the ball but would always prioritise closing off any gaps. Moore loved having the freedom to defend proactively and sweep up anything that came in his large zone of play, while on the ball he was dictating the play from deep and moving up through that inside left channel. Amoros was a true dynamo playing alongside Platini in a similarly lopsided team with a narrow midfield, never disregarding his defensive duties but happily being a primary source of width and urgency in attack.

Kanté much like Bonini could do so much more than play as a holding midfielder, but as he's gained experience he has grown to excel there and his energy will be required all over the pitch. Coluna was the midfield general for club and country and relished the all-action role. Mazzola much like Platini was a formidable goal threat from midfield but above all else wanted to be involved in all phases of play, providing the impetus for the team driving forward. Cha Bum Kun played right across the frontline and was recognised by Lothar Matthaus among others as being the ultimate team player, offering that direct threat without sacrificing balance and energy much like Bettega.

Meazza much like Boniek played right across the attack and excelled at driving straight at opposition defences with mazy dribbles, incisive passing and a direct goal threat. Weah puts a different spin on the Paolo Rossi role, taking advantage of the abundance of goal threat around him to play the role of a complete #9, a focal point in the attack stretching the defence every which way.

Ultimately the system is designed with no opponent in mind. It's built to be flexible and fluid enough to deal with any number of scenarios, with genuinely complete footballers in almost every position, while giving the truly elite players in each zone the freedom and responsibility to work their magic.



TEAM PAT_MUSTARD

Formation/Tactical Synopsis: Possession-orientated 4-4-2 Diamond, with an emphasis on centrally-orientated attacking patterns.

This match has a certain fantasy Serie A vibe, with Brwned nailing his colours to the mast with a well-crafted mirrored Zona Mista tactic, and my diamond formation somewhat suggestive of Ancelotti’s earlier Milan teams. We’re NOT trying to go tiki-taka here, but we’ll aim to have the lion's share of possession here and play the match on the front foot.

Defence:


Three time IFFHS World Goalkeeper of the Year Jose Luis Chilavert takes his place in goal. Ahead of him Willi Schulz, rated world class on 6 occasions by Kicker Magazine in their bi-annual rankings, partners Diego Godin, who conveniently for me continues to elevate his reputation by the match during the current World Cup. Our attacking build up will generally be funneled through our two all-time great playmakers towards the scintillating Brazilian pairing up front, but outlets in the wide areas are still essential and to that end I’ve drafted two athletic attacking full backs in Bessonov and the legendary Facchetti. With Bonhof in particular also providing supplementary width, I feel I've addressed the most obvious potential weakness of the diamond quite well.

Midfield:

With arguably the greatest deep-lying playmaker of all time in Bozsik at the base of the diamond, and the elegant, lavishly gifted classic playmaker Gianni Rivera at its tip, we’re aiming to establish a meaningful edge in possession and midfield control. With two playmakers at either end of the diamond, it was essential to flank them with mobile, powerful ball winners. As a box to box midfielder who also played in both full back positions, Bonhof’s suitability for the role should, I hope, be clear. As ever when attempting to situate an older player in a modern formation, Edwards as the LCM may attract some more scrutiny. I’ll elaborate more in the match thread, but my own stance is that his old left half back role translates well to this LCM engagement, and his own attributes translate even more effectively: Colossal strength and stamina, formidable ball-winning prowess and a redoubtable, team-orientated mentality. More specifically, an acute awareness of his specific responsibility to defend against Brwned’s creative talismans Mazzola Sr. and Meazza, as illustrated by an excerpt from his book, published posthumously:



Attack:

Romario is quite possibly the best centre forward in the draft, and with the likes of Luis Ronaldo and Eusebio on the blocked list he’s a stylistic rarity, with most of the other standouts tending towards the target man category and few possessing Romario’s quicksilver, jinking genius with the ball at his feet. His partner Leonidas, the best player and top scorer at the 1938 World Cup, seems to have been cut from a similar stylistic cloth. Comfortable at inside forward as well as centre forward, he was famously agile and inventive, as well as being utterly prolific.

Restrictions

10s: Leonidas (BRAZIL) Benbarek (MOROCCO)

20s: Bozsik (HUNGARY)

30s: Edwards (ENGLAND) Schulz (GERMANY)

40s: Rivera (ITALY) Facchetti (ITALY)

50s: Bessonov (UKRAINE) Bonhof (GERMANY)

60s: Romario (BRAZIL) Chilavert (PARAGUAY)

70s: Naybet (MOROCCO)

80s: Godin (URUGUAY)


6 x EUROPE

4 x SOUTH AMERICA

2 x AFRICA

1 x ASIA


CL: Rivera, Facchetti

WC: Romario, Bonhof

CA: Romario, Godin[/QUOTE]
 

Edgar Allan Pillow

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TEAM BRWNED (CONTD)

Antonio Carbajal
Named the 15th greatest goalkeeper of all time, and the greatest North American goalkeeper of all-time by IFFHS. Played at 5 WCs - the only goalkeeper to do so. Named in the top 10 goalkeepers in WC history.
Conservative, calm, no-nonsense goalkeeper with great reflexes.

Eddie Hapgood
A virtual ever-present (and eventual captain) in one of the most dominant teams in English football: Chapman's Arsenal. They were the first English team to win 4 league titles in a 5-year span: the only teams to repeat that feat were Liverpool in the 80s and United in the 90s and 00s. Also captained England during a particularly acrimonious period, summed up by two games: "The Battle of Highbury" and the game against Germany when England were forced to give a Nazi salute. At the Battle of Highbury they beat Italy just a few months after they'd won the World Cup, underlining the quality of that England side - a side made up of 7 Arsenal players, underlining the dominance of that Arsenal team not only domestically but internationally.
In Jeff Harris' book, "Arsenal Who's Who", he describes him as being technically exceptional, elegant, calm and with great anticipation. Arsenal's assistant manager Bob Wall describes him as setting the highest possible standard in technical skill. Described in the Oxford Biography as having exceptional speed and outstanding heading, allied with his outstanding positioning, anticipation and timing of tackles, and setting the standard for "footballing fullbacks" thereafter. Remembered by many as being one of the few players that could contain the great Stanley Matthews, most notably in a charity game during WWII between Arsenal and an RAF XI, when Matthews was so subdued that Hapgood drew boos from the crowd for preventing them from seeing their hero dazzle with some magic. Initially he played as one of the back 2 in a 235 formation, he established himself as a legend of the game as a left full back in Chapman's "revolutionary" 325 and is at home in this inside-left position, capable of matching up one on one vs. Stanley Matthews or tucking in and acting as a third centre back. Ideal for the Gentile role of half centre back, half full back - pure defender.

Bobby Moore
In the space of three years he lifted three major trophies at Wembley: the FA Cup in 1964, the European Cup Winner's Cup in 1965, and the World Cup in 1966. Was the youngest player to be named the best player in England in 1964, came 2nd in the Ballon d'Or in 1970. Throughout his peak was not only an immaculate defender but the heartbeat of his team for club and country, most easily summed up by the fact he made the most passes in the 1966 World Cup final, despite playing on the same pitch as Beckenbauer, Charlton, Overath etc. Amongst those passes were two assists for Geoff Hurst.
A truly remarkable player best described by Jock Stein as the player who "knows what's happening 20 minutes before everyone else". Superb anticipation, exceptional positioning and wonderful timing made him one of the most difficult defenders to beat one-on-one - even George Best admits he struggled! He was the constant outball for club and country, continuously stepping into midfield to drive the game forward with crisp, clever passing and the occasional burst forward. With Hapgood happily tucking in alongside him, Moore has licence to burst forward as he sees fit - dictating the game from the back as he always did. He slips into the Scirea role like a glove.

Luis Pereira
Won league titles in Brazil and Spain, most notably winning the league title with Atletico in the last game of the season, finishing just above a Barcelona team with Cruyff, Neeskens and co.
A "modern" Brazilian centre back in the mould of Lúcio, he was aggressive, athletic and simply loved defending. A classic stopper very much at home alongside Bobby Moore, very comfortable occupying the Brio role.
(Tumbleweed...)

Manuel Amoros
Reached the semi-finals of the 1982 and 1986 World Cups with France, and sandwiched in between he won the 1984 Euros in the most dominant team in its history. Named the best young player in the 1982 World Cup. Named the 2nd best player in Europe in 1986, behind only Maradona. Won the league title 4 times in 5 years, first with Monaco in 1988 and then with Marseille in 1990, 1991 and 1992.
Across his career he played in either fullback position, midfield and even forward - perhaps the best example of his very well-rounded skillset. Loved going forward but as with any great fullback of his era, he took his defensive responsibilities very seriously. Used to playing as the main source of width playing in France's Carré Magique, best-known for its diamond in midfield. Here he'll be given responsibility to drive attacks, but his responsibility first and foremost is supporting a rock-solid defence - Antonio Cabrini would struggle to find a closer replacement.
(Tumbleweed...)

N'Golo Kanté
Finished 8th in the 2017 Ballon d'Or rankings, the highest finish for any defensive midfielder this century - higher than Vieira, Keane, Redondo, Gattuso, Makelele, Busquets, Alonso etc. Won back-to-back titles with Leicester and Chelsea in his first season at each club. Named the best player in the league in 2017, and the best player at Chelsea in 2017 and 2018 - first by the fans, then by the players.
Excelled as an all-action box-to-box midfeilder at club level and has gradually established himself as a top class holding midfielder for the national team. He'll do what he does: break-up attacks endlessly, launch counter-attacks and energise the entire team. Playing the Bonini role of "Platini's lungs", Kanté slots in perfectly.

Valentino Mazzola
The captain of Il Grande Torino, a team that dominated Serie A in the 40s, winning 5 titles in a row. Prior to joining Torino he played for Venezia, leading them to their only trophy in their history - the 1942 Coppa Italia. In the same season they finished 3rd in the league, just one point behind Torino. The following season Mazzola swapped sides, Venezia were relegated and Torino won the first of 5 consecutive titles. Was top scorer in one of those title wins, but he was so much more than a goalscorer - he was a complete player. Considered by World Cup winning coach Enzo Bearzot as the greatest Italian player of all time.
A remarkably multi-talented player and a born winner, so much so that when called upon to play in between the sticks against Genoa after the keeper was sent off, he kept a clean sheet and held onto the win. Two-footed, exceptional passing, formidable dribbling, clinical finishing, great heading and wonderful reading of the game, to say he was a handful on and off the ball is an understatement. On top of his supreme technical skill he was a charismatic leader, recognised by team-mates at the time and by World Cup-winning managers years later as a player who could carry the team and inspire others through sheer force of will. Here he'll be the team's main playmaker while being the main source of goals from midfield, and he'll relish both responsibilities as always.

Mario Coluna
The midfield general for the greatest Portugese team of all-time, winning 10 league titles, 4 Portugese cups and 2 European Cups. The first team to win the European Cup after di Stéfano's Madrid, they underlined their quality by winning back-to-back European Cups against Barcelona and Madrid, and reached a further 3 finals during the 60s. While Eusébio helped propel them to legendary status from 1962 onwards, he hadn't broken into the team by the time they won their first European Cup, where Coluna was the undisputed star of the team and a decisive scorer on the day. Also a key cog and the captain of the Portugal team that finished 3rd in the 1966 World Cup, being named in the team of the tournament.
Excelled as a cerebral inside forward, a cultured midfield playmaker and a deep-lying midfield general across his career, owing to his varied skillset and top class reading of the game. Combined with his impeccable all-round technique, he was a very powerful runner with a rocket strike, a fearless leader, and he never failed to put in the hard yards. In the Tardelli role he's responsible for doing a bit of everything - a role he excelled at in 1966, leading Portugal to their best performance in World Cup history.

Cha Bum-kun
Named the greatest Asian footballer ever, and the 60th best player in world history. Won two UEFA Cups and a German cup, scoring in a final of each. After beating Matthaus' Monchengladbach team in the 1980 final, the German legend called Cha the best attacker in the world. Years later he described Cha as a complete attacker and the face of Eintracht Frankfurt at the time.
Quick, direct, powerful runner, comfortable across the frontline, a potent creator and goalscorer, and, as Lothar Matthaus said, "the utlimate team man". Primarily a centre forward but very comfortable out wide, he slips into the Bettega role with ease - drifting across the pitch, running endlessly and providing a more direct goal threat when needed.

Giuseppe Meazza
Named the 21st best player in football history by IFFHS, and the best player of the pre-war era. Won conseuctive World Cups with Italy, being named the best player of the tournament in 1934 and leading the team to a second as captain in 1938 - one of only three Italians to appear in both tournaments. Named the 4th greatest player in World Cup history, At club level he won 3 league titles and an Italian Cup. Finished top scorer on 3 occasions and scored 242 goals in 365 games for Internazionale.
His supremacy is perhaps best summed up by the fact he's one of the few players in football history that has multiple signature goals - not tricks, but goals! Most known for his penchant to not only dribble past keepers and roll it into an empty net, Brazilian Ronaldo style, but to toy with the keeper in the prcoess - known simply as a goal "alla Meazza". He's also known for "La Foglia Morta", the dead leaf, making him an early pioneer of the curling, dipping free kick. And he had some training ground stories that would floor even Paul Scholes, revolving around an almost supernatural knack for overhead kicks. Alongside his remarkable goalscoring ability, he was also nicknamed "Il Genio" in part because of his boundless creativity. A complete forward who would undoubtedly revel in Boniek's role of probing here, there and everywhere, sprinkling magic as he goes, while providing an added goal threat (300 career goals for Meazza vs. 100 for Boniek).

George Weah
Named the African player of the century. Won the Ballon d'Or, FIFA WPOTY and African POTY in 1995 - the only player to win this hat trick of awards. Named in the FIFA World XI for three years in a row after the Ballon d'Or. Won league titles in Liberia, France and Italy, as well as domestic cups in France and England. And of course he scored that iconic goal against Verona.
Perfectly summed up in FIFA's bio: "Quick, skilful and boasting a powerful physique, fierce shooting power and deadly finishing skills, in his pomp Liberia's 'Mr George' was rightly considered one of the giants of the game." An all-round centre forward with a remarkable combination of skills, allowing him to score goals from any number of positions - including solo dribbles starting in his own box! Playing alongside a supreme goalscorer in Meazza rather than Boniek, he needn't be the pure finisher that Rossi was - instead he's the focal point of all attacks, holding the ball up, stretching the defence and scoring the occasional worldie.
 

idmanager

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If only Pat had picked Sandro Mazzola instead of Rivera, we could have had a father vs son classic.
 

Brwned

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Hmmm interesting one. Two teams revolving around their three midfield heavyweights trying to dominate in different ways. Couldn't quite figure out how Pat was going to setup but that shapes up very nicely.

Not sure there's anywhere with real space in this game. Amoros is free to meet Facchetti high up the pitch so it's really up to Cha and Meazza deciding between themselves to to stick or twist.

If Cha sticks with a tight midfield 4 he's encouraging Bessonov to overload that side, but him and Bonhof are the duo I'm most comfortable with taking a risk against. And if that frees Meazza from midfield duties then the potential counter attacks with him, Weah and one of the midfield runners is huge.

On the flipside if Cha pushes up against Bessonov you're leaving Meazza with a substantial burden against Bozsik but ultimately all outlets are being suffocated...for both teams. With the players in that midfield battle it's hard to see anyone getting free if they're spending all game keeping tabs on their opposite number.

Weirdly the one thing I'm comfortable with here is Pat's front 2. The back three are well equipped to deal with them and Moore is getting time on the ball to dictate the game against two non-entities in the defensive phase...but he's not getting through that midfield wall very often!
 

Brwned

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If only Pat had picked Sandro Mazzola instead of Rivera, we could have had a father vs son classic.
We've already got the battle of what is surely the two greatest footballers to die young from a plane crash in that midfield battle...I'm not sure Valentino could cope with another emotional dimension thrown on top!
 

idmanager

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We've already got the battle of what is surely the two greatest footballers to die young from a plane crash in that midfield battle...I'm not sure Valentino could cope with another emotional dimension thrown on top!
Oh wow, I didn't notice that.
 

Pat_Mustard

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A never-nude? I thought he just liked cut-offs.
Hmmm interesting one. Two teams revolving around their three midfield heavyweights trying to dominate in different ways. Couldn't quite figure out how Pat was going to setup but that shapes up very nicely.

Not sure there's anywhere with real space in this game. Amoros is free to meet Facchetti high up the pitch so it's really up to Cha and Meazza deciding between themselves to to stick or twist.

If Cha sticks with a tight midfield 4 he's encouraging Bessonov to overload that side, but him and Bonhof are the duo I'm most comfortable with taking a risk against. And if that frees Meazza from midfield duties then the potential counter attacks with him, Weah and one of the midfield runners is huge.

On the flipside if Cha pushes up against Bessonov you're leaving Meazza with a substantial burden against Bozsik but ultimately all outlets are being suffocated...for both teams. With the players in that midfield battle it's hard to see anyone getting free if they're spending all game keeping tabs on their opposite number.

Weirdly the one thing I'm comfortable with here is Pat's front 2. The back three are well equipped to deal with them and Moore is getting time on the ball to dictate the game against two non-entities in the defensive phase...but he's not getting through that midfield wall very often!
That's a very fair summary mate. There's no glaring mismatches here in terms of quality or even that many obvious possibilities for numerical overloads in key areas of the pitch as we're both fielding relatively narrow teams with plenty of bodies in the centre. From what I know of Hapgood, I agree that he and Moore in particular look like good stylistic fits to mitigate against the pace and agility of Romario/Leonidas, while conversely I think my left-sided axis of Edwards/Facchetti/Godin is a good bulwark against those dangerous Italian creators.
 

harms

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Pat's lack of width upfront tires in nicely against the 3 man defensive setup of brwned. Midfield battle looks juicy. Though brwned may have a slight edge in his right.
There is no fecking lack of width with Facchetti, Bessonov, Bonhof and to some extant Edwards in the side. Not every diamond lacks width.
 

Brwned

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There is no fecking lack of width with Facchetti, Bessonov, Bonhof and to some extant Edwards in the side. Not every diamond lacks width.
In general I agree but I'm not sure that's true in the context of this particular game. Both Weah and Meazza love drifting out wide and taking on centre backs 1 on 1 exposed in wide areas. If Fachetti and Bessonov are really providing the width here then the space in behind them is potentially catastrophic. And with Cha so adept at at making those back-post runs, Mazzola always ready to pounce...I can't see them taking those kinds of risks. From back to front this is a team built to capitalise on that kind of space in counter-attacks.

Instead I see it being something of a classic Serie A stalemate in large part because the fullbacks are playing conservatively and the "emphasis on centrally-orientated attacking patterns" creates a very clogged up midfield. Lack of width is an issue for both sides IMO - not by default, but in the context of this game.
 

Indnyc

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There is no fecking lack of width with Facchetti, Bessonov, Bonhof and to some extant Edwards in the side. Not every diamond lacks width.
I think EAP was talking specifically about the forwards.. Though I agree that there is enough width with the full backs

@Brwned can you give some more information on Cha Bum- Kun? Think he is playing a key role here for your system to work well
 

Brwned

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Just realised that in EAP's post, none of my quotes came through! :lol: You can find a lot of really good quotes in here for the likes of Hapgood, Mazzola, Meazza who obviously need a bit more info...

Antonio Carbajal
Named the 15th greatest goalkeeper of all time, and the greatest North American goalkeeper of all-time by IFFHS. Played at 5 WCs - the only goalkeeper to do so. Named in the top 10 goalkeepers in WC history.
Conservative, calm, no-nonsense goalkeeper with great reflexes.
UPI said:
"He was nicknamed 'The Ghost' for his cool and self-effacing style"
Source

Eddie Hapgood
A virtual ever-present (and eventual captain) in one of the most dominant teams in English football: Chapman's Arsenal. They were the first English team to win 4 league titles in a 5-year span: the only teams to repeat that feat were Liverpool in the 80s and United in the 90s and 00s. Also captained England during a particularly acrimonious period, summed up by two games: "The Battle of Highbury" and the game against Germany when England were forced to give a Nazi salute. At the Battle of Highbury they beat Italy just a few months after they'd won the World Cup, underlining the quality of that England side - a side made up of 7 Arsenal players, underlining the dominance of that Arsenal team not only domestically but internationally.
In Jeff Harris' book, "Arsenal Who's Who", he describes him as being technically exceptional, elegant, calm and with great anticipation. Arsenal's assistant manager Bob Wall describes him as setting the highest possible standard in technical skill. Described in the Oxford Biography as having exceptional speed and outstanding heading, allied with his outstanding positioning, anticipation and timing of tackles, and setting the standard for "footballing fullbacks" thereafter. Remembered by many as being one of the few players that could contain the great Stanley Matthews, most notably in a charity game during WWII between Arsenal and an RAF XI, when Matthews was so subdued that Hapgood drew boos from the crowd for preventing them from seeing their hero dazzle with some magic. Initially he played as one of the back 2 in a 235 formation, he established himself as a legend of the game as a left full back in Chapman's "revolutionary" 325 and is at home in this inside-left position, capable of matching up one on one vs. Stanley Matthews or tucking in and acting as a third centre back. Ideal for the Gentile role of half centre back, half full back - pure defender.
Stanley Matthews said:
"The dressing room erupted. There was bedlam. All the England players were livid and totally opposed to this, myself included. Everyone was shouting at once. Eddie Hapgood, normally a respectful and devoted captain, wagged his finger at the official and told him what he could do with the Nazi salute, which involved putting it where the sun doesn't shine."
Jeff Harris said:
"Hapgood's many splendid attributes included, being technically exceptional, he showed shrewd anticipation and he was elegant, polished, unruffled and calm."
Tom Whittaker said:
"Hapgood was an extraordinary youngster. Confident beyond his years, some people found him insufferable at times. But it was the supreme confidence in his own ability which made him such a great player."
Bob Wall said:
"He (Hapgood) played his football in a calm, authoritative way and he would analyse a game in the same quiet, clear-cut manner. Eddie set Arsenal players the highest possible example in technical skill and personal behaviour."
All above quotes from here
"Arsenal's success in the 1930s, which brought five league championships and three cup final appearances, was based on Chapman's strategy of sound defence and rapid counter-attack. Hapgood, as left full-back, played a key role in this system. Of average height and medium build, a non-smoker and teetotaller, he relied upon exceptional speed, precision in the tackle, excellent positional sense, and, despite his height, outstanding heading ability. He always strove for a high level of physical fitness, encouraged by Arsenal's advanced training methods. In the Arsenal defensive formation the full-backs provided cover for the ‘stopper’ centre-half, and in this role Hapgood shaped a new style of full-back play which contrasted with the crude physical methods employed by many full-backs of his day. His technique was to manoeuvre his opponent away from dangerous positions, dispossess with a well-timed tackle or interception, and set up an attack with a shrewdly placed, often short, pass. He rarely used the shoulder charge. His method was acknowledged by his most redoubtable opponent, the Stoke City and England right-winger Stanley Matthews, whose threat Hapgood contained more effectively than most: '[Hapgood] could give and take a pass; a classic player, one of the first footballing full-backs' (Miller, 35). His method became the benchmark by which future generations of full-backs set their standard."

Oxford Biography

Bobby Moore
In the space of three years he lifted three major trophies at Wembley: the FA Cup in 1964, the European Cup Winner's Cup in 1965, and the World Cup in 1966. Was the youngest player to be named the best player in England in 1964, came 2nd in the Ballon d'Or in 1970. Throughout his peak was not only an immaculate defender but the heartbeat of his team for club and country, most easily summed up by the fact he made the most passes in the 1966 World Cup final, despite playing on the same pitch as Beckenbauer, Charlton, Overath etc. Amongst those passes were two assists for Geoff Hurst.
A truly remarkable player best described by Jock Stein as the player who "knows what's happening 20 minutes before everyone else". Superb anticipation, exceptional positioning and wonderful timing made him one of the most difficult defenders to beat one-on-one - even George Best admits he struggled! He was the constant outball for club and country, continuously stepping into midfield to drive the game forward with crisp, clever passing and the occasional burst forward. With Hapgood happily tucking in alongside him, Moore has licence to burst forward as he sees fit - dictating the game from the back as he always did. He slips into the Scirea role like a glove.
Alf Ramsey said:
"My captain, my leader, my right-hand man. He was the spirit and the heartbeat of the team. A cool, calculating footballer I could trust with my life. He was the supreme professional, the best I ever worked with. Without him England would never have won the World Cup.”
Source
Jock Stein said:
“There should be a law against him. He knows what’s happening 20 minutes before everyone else.”

Luis Pereira
Won league titles in Brazil and Spain, most notably winning the league title with Atletico in the last game of the season, finishing just above a Barcelona team with Cruyff, Neeskens and co.
A "modern" Brazilian centre back in the mould of Lúcio, he was aggressive, athletic and simply loved defending. A classic stopper very much at home alongside Bobby Moore, very comfortable occupying the Brio role.
(Tumbleweed...)

Manuel Amoros
Reached the semi-finals of the 1982 and 1986 World Cups with France, and sandwiched in between he won the 1984 Euros in the most dominant team in its history. Named the best young player in the 1982 World Cup. Named the 2nd best player in Europe in 1986, behind only Maradona. Won the league title 4 times in 5 years, first with Monaco in 1988 and then with Marseille in 1990, 1991 and 1992.
Across his career he played in either fullback position, midfield and even forward - perhaps the best example of his very well-rounded skillset. Loved going forward but as with any great fullback of his era, he took his defensive responsibilities very seriously. Used to playing as the main source of width playing in France's Carré Magique, best-known for its diamond in midfield. Here he'll be given responsibility to drive attacks, but his responsibility first and foremost is supporting a rock-solid defence - Antonio Cabrini would struggle to find a closer replacement.
(Tumbleweed...)

N'Golo Kanté
Finished 8th in the 2017 Ballon d'Or rankings, the highest finish for any defensive midfielder this century - higher than Vieira, Keane, Redondo, Gattuso, Makelele, Busquets, Alonso etc. Won back-to-back titles with Leicester and Chelsea in his first season at each club. Named the best player in the league in 2017, and the best player at Chelsea in 2017 and 2018 - first by the fans, then by the players.
Excelled as an all-action box-to-box midfeilder at club level and has gradually established himself as a top class holding midfielder for the national team. He'll do what he does: break-up attacks endlessly, launch counter-attacks and energise the entire team. Playing the Bonini role of "Platini's lungs", Kanté slots in perfectly.
Paul Pogba said:
"My duo with Kante? It's so easy to play with 'NG'. He is everywhere. He must have 15 lungs."
Claudio Ranieri said:
"This player Kante, he was running so hard that I thought he must have a pack full of batteries hidden in his shorts. He never stopped running in training. I tell him: 'One day, I’m going to see you cross the ball, and then finish the cross with a header yourself.' He’s unbelievable."
Source

Valentino Mazzola
The captain of Il Grande Torino, a team that dominated Serie A in the 40s, winning 5 titles in a row. Prior to joining Torino he played for Venezia, leading them to their only trophy in their history - the 1942 Coppa Italia. In the same season they finished 3rd in the league, just one point behind Torino. The following season Mazzola swapped sides, Venezia were relegated and Torino won the first of 5 consecutive titles. Was top scorer in one of those title wins, but he was so much more than a goalscorer - he was a complete player. Considered by World Cup winning coach Enzo Bearzot as the greatest Italian player of all time.
A remarkably multi-talented player and a born winner, so much so that when called upon to play in between the sticks against Genoa after the keeper was sent off, he kept a clean sheet and held onto the win. Two-footed, exceptional passing, formidable dribbling, clinical finishing, great heading and wonderful reading of the game, to say he was a handful on and off the ball is an understatement. On top of his supreme technical skill he was a charismatic leader, recognised by team-mates at the time and by World Cup-winning managers years later as a player who could carry the team and inspire others through sheer force of will. Here he'll be the team's main playmaker while being the main source of goals from midfield, and he'll relish both responsibilities as always.
Mario Rigamonti said:
“He alone is half the squad. The other half is made by the rest of us together.”
Enzo Bearzot said:
“He was a player who could carry the whole team and was the greatest Italian player of all time.”
Source
Thesefootballtimes said:
"If not for the events of May 4, 1949, the name Valentino Mazzola would probably be placed amongst the very best players of all time. On that day, the members of Il Grande Torino, the first super-team to emerge after the events of World War Two, were almost all killed on a hillside near Torino – at the Superga Basilica – in an air disaster that claimed the lives of nearly all the starters of not only Torino, but the Azzurri, the Italian national team. It’s a date that lives in infamy for followers of calcio.

Torino played greedy football, as if the ball belonged to them; in their minds if the other team had the ball it must’ve be a mistake, they didn’t deserve it, and they pressed aggressively to win it back. Once the ball was back in the hands of Torino it was being pushed up the field to one of flanks through the star of the side and pin-up boy of calcio, Valentino Mazzola. The Italy hero always knew what to do with the ball, whether it was a pinpoint pass to a charging centre-forward or a blistering shot on goal, Valentino made the decisions. He rarely made mistakes."
Source
Forza Italia said:
"Due to his outstanding performances in his three years at Venezia, interest in taking the quick, skilful attacking midfielder to a bigger club was high and so it was that, in 1942, Torino president Ferrucio Novo spent the handsome sum of 1.2 million lire on bringing Mazzola to the Granata where he was to become an icon and, undoubtedly, the greatest player that has ever pulled on the claret jersey. Not only that but Mazzola could also be considered to be one of the most complete football players of all time.

Rarely has a player combined such finesse, determination, spirit and magnificent footballing ability to the effect that the Torino captain did. He possessed a terrific ability to beat an opponent with his quick feet and pace as well as excellent aerial ability and an accurate, powerful strike with both feet."
Source

Mario Coluna
The midfield general for the greatest Portugese team of all-time, winning 10 league titles, 4 Portugese cups and 2 European Cups. The first team to win the European Cup after di Stéfano's Madrid, they underlined their quality by winning back-to-back European Cups against Barcelona and Madrid, and reached a further 3 finals during the 60s. While Eusébio helped propel them to legendary status from 1962 onwards, he hadn't broken into the team by the time they won their first European Cup, where Coluna was the undisputed star of the team and a decisive scorer on the day. Also a key cog and the captain of the Portugal team that finished 3rd in the 1966 World Cup, being named in the team of the tournament.
Excelled as a cerebral inside forward, a cultured midfield playmaker and a deep-lying midfield general across his career, owing to his varied skillset and top class reading of the game. Combined with his impeccable all-round technique, he was a very powerful runner with a rocket strike, a fearless leader, and he never failed to put in the hard yards. In the Tardelli role he's responsible for doing a bit of everything - a role he excelled at in 1966, leading Portugal to their best performance in World Cup history.
Antonio Simoes said:
"His eyes alone talked to you. Both on the pitch and off it, Coluna was an example for the others. He was like a father at the head of the table. He didn’t even have to speak for everyone to understand how they should behave.”
Luís Filipe Vieira said:
“Mario Coluna won not only the appreciation of all who had the privilege of seeing him play, but also the respect of those who, not having seen him, heard him lauded as one of the greatest talents of his generation. He was and will always be a football genius who magnified football and took Benfica to a global dimension. He will forever be in our hearts"
Source
The Independent said:
"Coluna was always an exceptional all-round athlete, becoming the national high-jump champion at the age of 17 and excelling also at boxing, basketball, running and long jump; but it was as a footballer that he shone the brightest

Though he struggled at first to adapt to big-city life, the intelligent, industrious newcomer made an immediate impact on the pitch, his perceptive passing and endless stamina augmented by an explosive left-foot shot. He was called up rapidly to the senior team by the new Brazilian coach Otto Gloria, netting twice on debut in the 5-0 drubbing of Vitoria Setubal and collecting his first title medal in his introductory campaign.

Initially he was employed at centre-forward, then as an attacking inside-left alongside spearhead Jose Aguas. But soon he dropped deep into midfield where he influenced every aspect of the game so successfully that he was described as "The Portuguese Didi", after the famous Brazilian play-maker." Source

Cha Bum-kun
Named the greatest Asian footballer ever, and the 60th best player in world history. Won two UEFA Cups and a German cup, scoring in a final of each. After beating Matthaus' Monchengladbach team in the 1980 final, the German legend called Cha the best attacker in the world. Years later he described Cha as a complete attacker and the face of Eintracht Frankfurt at the time.
Quick, direct, powerful runner, comfortable across the frontline, a potent creator and goalscorer, and, as Lothar Matthaus said, "the utlimate team man". Primarily a centre forward but very comfortable out wide, he slips into the Bettega role with ease - drifting across the pitch, running endlessly and providing a more direct goal threat when needed.
Lothar Matthaus said:
"I played the 1980 UEFA Cup final for Borussia Monchengladbach against Eintracht Frankfurt, who had the legendary South Korean Cha Bum-kun as their forward. He was the face of Frankfurt then. He had pace, great technique, was a great dribbler and scored goals. And most importantly, he was the ultimate team man."
Source
Alex Ferguson said:
"The problem we couldn't solve was Tscha Bum. We could not stop him. He was unstoppable."
Gunter Netzer said:
"Cha would have been a starting forward for any club in the world. Asia has yet to produce another player of Cha's caliber."

Giuseppe Meazza
Named the 21st best player in football history by IFFHS, and the best player of the pre-war era. Won conseuctive World Cups with Italy, being named the best player of the tournament in 1934 and leading the team to a second as captain in 1938 - one of only three Italians to appear in both tournaments. Named the 4th greatest player in World Cup history, At club level he won 3 league titles and an Italian Cup. Finished top scorer on 3 occasions and scored 242 goals in 365 games for Internazionale.
His supremacy is perhaps best summed up by the fact he's one of the few players in football history that has multiple signature goals - not tricks, but goals! Most known for his penchant to not only dribble past keepers and roll it into an empty net, Brazilian Ronaldo style, but to toy with the keeper in the prcoess - known simply as a goal "alla Meazza". He's also known for "La Foglia Morta", the dead leaf, making him an early pioneer of the curling, dipping free kick. And he had some training ground stories that would floor even Paul Scholes, revolving around an almost supernatural knack for overhead kicks. Alongside his remarkable goalscoring ability, he was also nicknamed "Il Genio" in part because of his boundless creativity. A complete forward who would undoubtedly revel in Boniek's role of probing here, there and everywhere, sprinkling magic as he goes, while providing an added goal threat (300 career goals for Meazza vs. 100 for Boniek).
Vitorio Pozzo said:
"To have him in your team meant to start 1-0 up."
Luigi Veronelli said:
"I also saw Pele playing. He did not achieve Meazza's elegant style of playing. One day, I witnessed him doing something astonishing. He stopped the ball with a bicycle kick, elevating himself two meters from the ground. Then he landed with the ball glued at his foot, dribbled over an astonished defender, and then went on to score a goal with one of his hallmark shots, sardonic and accurate to the millimeter."
Peppe Prisco said:
"Meazza was great, unbeatable, even if he would occasionally run into a frightful crisis, caused by his intense sexual activity and his passion for the game. When he took over on the field, he did things that left the mouth ajar."
Giuseppe Meazza said:
"I'm not selfish on the field. I like that my team-mates score goals too, to the point I even get rebuked: 'You were supposed to shoot!' There is nothing worse than individualism."
ESPN said:
"The following season, he netted 24 goals for his club and continued to deliver at international level. He hit a first-half hat-trick to help Italy to a 5-0 win over France in January 1931, and the following month, playing against Hugo Meisl's Austrian Wunderteam, he scored what he would later describe as the finest goal of his career. Picking up the ball on the halfway line, he had embarked on a solo run into the penalty area. Pausing in front of goalkeeper Rodolphe Hiden, he drew him off his line - "like the bullfighter calls the beast," as the great journalist Gianni Brera put it - before evading a challenge, flicking the ball from right foot to left and placing it into the empty net. The goal helped Italy to their first ever victory over Austria."
Source
The Times said:
"His dash, intelligence and rapid and powerful shooting, coupled with his peculiar capacity for enticing the goalkeeper out of his goal, have won for him many admirers, who declare that he is unrivalled."
Source
ESPN said:
"It wasn't just his scoring talent that made him such a fantastic footballer, he also possessed skills on the ball that would even have Lionel Messi mesmorized. He was a complete footballer who used his passion for dancing the tango to assist him on the pitch with his trademark twists and turns. Though not the tallest player, he was excellent in the air, had a truly inspiring vision for the game across the field of play, and by playing with both feet, he was a brilliant passer of the ball. All these skills meant he could not only score countless goals, but he also provided many for his teammates too."
Source

George Weah
Named the African player of the century. Won the Ballon d'Or, FIFA WPOTY and African POTY in 1995 - the only player to win this hat trick of awards. Named in the FIFA World XI for three years in a row after the Ballon d'Or. Won league titles in Liberia, France and Italy, as well as domestic cups in France and England. And of course he scored that iconic goal against Verona.
Perfectly summed up in FIFA's bio: "Quick, skilful and boasting a powerful physique, fierce shooting power and deadly finishing skills, in his pomp Liberia's 'Mr George' was rightly considered one of the giants of the game." An all-round centre forward with a remarkable combination of skills, allowing him to score goals from any number of positions - including solo dribbles starting in his own box! Playing alongside a supreme goalscorer in Meazza rather than Boniek, he needn't be the pure finisher that Rossi was - instead he's the focal point of all attacks, holding the ball up, stretching the defence and scoring the occasional worldie.
Arsene Wenger said:
"Weah was a real surprise. For me it was like a child discovering a chocolate bunny in his garden at Easter. I have never seen any player explode on to the scene like he did."
Source
Arsene Wenger said:
"But it’s down to the fact that one thing that was common in George’s attitude [is being] strong mentally, absolutely unbelievably convinced that he has a mission."
Source
 

Brwned

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Cha Bum kun cant be a real player :lol:
The best! (Asian player)

Also a scorer of big goals...scored in a German cup final, scored in a UEFA cup final. His goal in the UEFA cup final was actually the decisive goal in one of the greatest comebacks in European cup history. 3-0 down from the first leg, he scores the 3rd goal in the 81st minute to send the second leg into penalties...and they won!

And he lived up to his name with a few rockets in his time! He was quite a similar player to Son Heung-Min, but with endless energy and a more direct quality to his game.
I think EAP was talking specifically about the forwards.. Though I agree that there is enough width with the full backs

@Brwned can you give some more information on Cha Bum- Kun? Think he is playing a key role here for your system to work well
Yeah I agree with that - Bettega brought a really odd mix of qualities in a weird position which ended up being a fundamental weapon in attack, and a crucial provider of balance in defence.

Honestly I think there's few players better suited to the role than Cha. He spent the majority of his career as a floating forward, but was perfectly comfortable playing on either wing. Loved to take players on, ran endlessly, was a very thoughtful passer and just had a sense for picking up dangerous positions. He was an attacking player - no doubt about it. But Matthaus' quote is right on the money - the most important thing was he was the ultimate team man.

Lothar Matthaus said:
"I played the 1980 UEFA Cup final for Borussia Monchengladbach against Eintracht Frankfurt, who had the legendary South Korean Cha Bum-kun as their forward. He was the face of Frankfurt then. He had pace, great technique, was a great dribbler and scored goals. And most importantly, he was the ultimate team man."
Source
Alex Ferguson said:
"The problem we couldn't solve was Tscha Bum. We could not stop him. He was unstoppable."
Gunter Netzer said:
"Cha would have been a starting forward for any club in the world. Asia has yet to produce another player of Cha's caliber."
He was really an all-action player, and a complete attacker. He would shuttle up and down that wing, support the midfield and fullback, race into the box - and he'd never stop. Here's a quick mention of him from Gio:

Cha Bum Kun
"He was unstoppable," gushed Alex Ferguson after Cha had helped Hamburg knock Aberdeen out of the UEFA Cup. Turbo-charged, jet-heeled and deadly in the air, the winger-cum-striker scored an impressive 55 goals in 121 games for South Korea. But it was in Germany where his reputation as the greatest Asian player of all-time was established. Jurgen Klinsmann - world class striker in his pomp - stated: "I am considered an accomplished footballer, but I am not at the level of Cha."
 

Brwned

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Bugger! I'm getting slaughtered...can't even blame it on the wacky setup given the recent wins with the W-M and whatnot.

What's tipping it in everyone's favour for @Pat_Mustard? The conversation about it's always the most interesting part of the games...we're not getting much going here!
 

Indnyc

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Bugger! I'm getting slaughtered...can't even blame it on the wacky setup given the recent wins with the W-M and whatnot.

What's tipping it in everyone's favour for @Pat_Mustard? The conversation about it's always the most interesting part of the games...we're not getting much going here!
I haven’t voted but suspect the formation graphic is causing it. Sometimes visuals make a lot of difference.

In the game itself I don’t think there is significant difference between the two teams
 

oneniltothearsenal

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I haven’t voted but suspect the formation graphic is causing it. Sometimes visuals make a lot of difference.

In the game itself I don’t think there is significant difference between the two teams
@Brwned

I was just going to say the formation graphic as well
IMO Kante and Coluna could have been moved further back. As it is it emphasizes the space in between Kante and the three defenders and makes it almost seem like a 3v3 with Rivera, Romario and Leonidas against your back three which is always going to favor the attackers even with a GOAT defender like Moore.
I think closing that gap and showing Kante closer to the three defenders and Coluna positioned closer to help out would have helped defensively. I think you'd want to highlight the job Kante could do on Rivera.
 

Enigma_87

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@Brwned haven't voted yet and I usually wait for the discussions so the drafters can present their teams, but to me it's the formation.

Zona mista isn't all that well appreciated (although there was one draft we saw it pretty often) and the small caps used for players visually create a lot of gaps in the formation whilst Pat's is easier on the eye.

Have to say I like your team and it's very well presented, the only doubts I have is how players like Kante and Cha are rated in all time format.

Pat's team on the other hand is very well constructed. He has Bozsik as a deep lying playmaker and Rivera as advanced one flanked by two energetic box to box midfielders so that's really mighty fine diamond.

That and Bessonov/Facchetti full back combo and Godin/Schulz CB pair seems complimentary and one of high quality.

Romario on top is also likely to draw few votes.

Your setup requires more explanation and selling as Pat's one is easier on the eye and that gameplan isn't really complicated to see it working.

Kudos for the player presentation - the best we've seen so far in the first round matches.
 

Brwned

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@Brwned

I was just going to say the formation graphic as well
IMO Kante and Coluna could have been moved further back. As it is it emphasizes the space in between Kante and the three defenders and makes it almost seem like a 3v3 with Rivera, Romario and Leonidas against your back three which is always going to favor the attackers even with a GOAT defender like Moore.
I think closing that gap and showing Kante closer to the three defenders and Coluna positioned closer to help out would have helped defensively. I think you'd want to highlight the job Kante could do on Rivera.
In terms of positions I don't think I could get it any closer to this...



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zona_mista

They line up with the lines almost identically, only Kanté's pulled deeper to make that gap a little smaller. Nothing I can do about the size of the circles and the perspective that gives, as far as I know! Hey-ho. If images are what matter it's not something to fuss over either way.
 

Šjor Bepo

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@Brwned formation pictures are pretty much your defensive lineup in the game so like in football you have to make the pitch as small as possible and you have your defender in one box and your striker in other, draft sunday league stuff :D
 

Fergus' son

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Great match, @Brwned at his best!

Still waiting to be convinced re a winner though, the summary above describing a stalemate looks pretty spot on to me at the moment!
 

Indnyc

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In terms of positions I don't think I could get it any closer to this...



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zona_mista

They line up with the lines almost identically, only Kanté's pulled deeper to make that gap a little smaller. Nothing I can do about the size of the circles and the perspective that gives, as far as I know! Hey-ho. If images are what matter it's not something to fuss over either way.


Something like this may look a bit more neater and attract more votes. The whole pitch looks occupied and it looks a bit more balanced even though everyone is more or less in the same position as your original picture.
 

oneniltothearsenal

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Went for Brwned in the end. Ultimately I think Kante can do a job on Rivera to limit service to Ro-Leo. The other key is that Moore imo is one of the 2-3 best CB's to marshal a counter to Romario + Leonidas type of combination.
Also love the Cha Bum-Kun pick. From South Korea he played 10 years in Bundesliga from 79-89. What makes that even crazier is that he was age 26 when he went to Germany so he played there from age 26 to 36. He scored 98 goals in 308 matches (no penalties) and only received one yellow card.
Really an interesting and pioneering footballer imo.

 

Pat_Mustard

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A never-nude? I thought he just liked cut-offs.
In general I agree but I'm not sure that's true in the context of this particular game. Both Weah and Meazza love drifting out wide and taking on centre backs 1 on 1 exposed in wide areas. If Fachetti and Bessonov are really providing the width here then the space in behind them is potentially catastrophic. And with Cha so adept at at making those back-post runs, Mazzola always ready to pounce...I can't see them taking those kinds of risks. From back to front this is a team built to capitalise on that kind of space in counter-attacks.

Instead I see it being something of a classic Serie A stalemate in large part because the fullbacks are playing conservatively and the "emphasis on centrally-orientated attacking patterns" creates a very clogged up midfield. Lack of width is an issue for both sides IMO - not by default, but in the context of this game.

Sorry I haven't been around much mate - had a busier than expected day.

There's not even a huge amount to argue about as we're broadly in agreement about the match. For all the attacking talent on show there won't be huge swathes of space available and it probably will be cagey enough. I'd disagree about the width issue though. Full backs gambling on getting forward is a basic tenet of modern football and I'm not willing to neuter the attacking output of one of the greatest full backs ever unless he was basically on a man-marking job against a Garrincha. As it is, that wing is only manned full-time on your team by Amoros. Both Facchetti and Amoros are excellent two way players but you'd back Facchetti to have the better match. Even if Facchetti does find himself stranded upfield when you counter (which is unlikely to happen that often), we've got a defensive colossus in Edwards to cover on that flank. I'm happy for Bessonov to play a bit more conservatively, both in light of Cha's goal threat and due to the fact that Bonhof is comfortable drifting out wide on that wing.

Speaking of Bessonov, I started making an all-touches video of him vs Atletico Madrid in the 86 ECWC final, hoping to profile him as an attacking full back, only to rage quit after half an hour when Baltacha went off injured and Bessonov switched to CB :mad:.
 

Moby

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Something like this may look a bit more neater and attract more votes. The whole pitch looks occupied and it looks a bit more balanced even though everyone is more or less in the same position as your original picture.
Looks infinitely better and a lot more accurate. The three defenders aren't having a tea party inside their own box for one .
 

Pat_Mustard

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A never-nude? I thought he just liked cut-offs.
Went for Brwned in the end. Ultimately I think Kante can do a job on Rivera to limit service to Ro-Leo. The other key is that Moore imo is one of the 2-3 best CB's to marshal a counter to Romario + Leonidas type of combination.
Also love the Cha Bum-Kun pick. From South Korea he played 10 years in Bundesliga from 79-89. What makes that even crazier is that he was age 26 when he went to Germany so he played there from age 26 to 36. He scored 98 goals in 308 matches (no penalties) and only received one yellow card.
Really an interesting and pioneering footballer imo.

Aye, Cha is a really refreshing pick. Looks a fine fit for the Zona Mista too.

I'd agree that Moore is a good stylistic fit vs Romario/Leonidas (Hapgood too from what I can gather about his style of play), but I'd counter that the sheer quality of my pairing, along with the calibre of service they'll be receiving from Bozsik/Rivera, makes them likely to get on the scoresheet in any match. A couple of my favourite Romario performances:

Tormenting possibly the greatest defence ever:


Jaw-dropping performance against Atletico. This is match highlights rather than an individual compilation for Romario but it's well worth a watch as it was a great game and Romario produced one of the finest displays of finishing I've ever seen:

 

Brwned

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Looks infinitely better and a lot more accurate. The three defenders aren't having a tea party inside their own box for one .
That just seems such a weird way to think about it... in no way are any of these formation graphics "accurate". The one from onenil has Weah in one box and three centre backs just outside the other...which legitimately never happens. The same is obviously true of my original one.

If visual appeal is what people are after that's cool, but accuracy...it doesn't exist in any graphics by anyone. If it was meant to represent people in the defensive phase than players would basically be on top of each other.

In any case, @Edgar Allan Pillow can you use onenil's graphic instead?
 

Pat_Mustard

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A never-nude? I thought he just liked cut-offs.
I'll take the liberty of stealing a profile post from Leonidas' No. 1 fan Annah.

In case some people have missed our on who Leonidas was I figured I'd just post this so one can appreciate just how highly rated he was.


Leonidas - The second son of Samba, after a certain still unpicked player, the Black Diamond/The Rubber man was voted as the 8th best Brazilian player of the 20th century by IFFHS - a point ahead of both Nilton Santos and Ronaldo. An odd inclusion some would say but when the Brazilans themselves choose their legends he is common sense. Both Folha de São Paolo and Placar Magazine[1997] included him in their first eleven when they collected an all-time Brazil team. His phenomenal goalscoring of a goal per game over a 13 year period, both for the National team and for his different club sides highlight his efficiency.

He won 8 times the stated championship was named Best player in the 1938 , 1940 , 1943 , 1945 , 1946 , 1948 and the 1949 Championships. His most memorable moments came at the 1938 World Cup where Leonidas showed phenomenal class being the top scorer with 7 goals and until 2010 the only MVP not being in one of the finalist teams, where the legends Sarosi and Meazza clashed together.

His most memorable moments came at the 1938 World Cup where Leonidas showed phenomenal class being the top scorer with 7 goals and until 2010 the only MVP not being in one of the finalist teams.

In Placar's "100 Craques do Século", rating the 100 greatest players in the history, Leonidas is ranked as a mighty respectable number 28.

When the Guerin Sportivo[Italy] published their list "I 50 Grandi del Secolo by Adalberto Bortolotti" Leonidas was placed even further up at place 26.

The words of Diego Lucero, an eye-witness, give portrait of Da Silvas character and breakthrough performance that is more precise than any. "As a player he was simply phenomenal. A classy yet effective dribbler, he cut through the enemy defense like lightning, and he shot at the enemy goal with the precision and power of a born goal-scorer.

The things Leonidas did in that first half of that historic game against Poland on July 5 in Strasbourg can be ranked among the most beautiful and brilliant plays in soccer history - artistic, rhythmic plays that carry the secret of soccer magic, and a grace that make the ball speak. Leonidas was a flash of joy and glory that easily danced through the entrenched Polish defense.

In that first half he made three goals, but then a deluge of rain set in, and the Polish managed to transform Brazils lead to a 4-3 lead into their favor. Then, Leonidas, living up to his name became a lion in battle, wreaking havoc in the mud on the players from the sunless land. At one point his foot got stuck in the mud. "The black Diamond" took his foot out of the shoe and kicked the ball with all his might to tie the game. In the end, Brazil won 6-5."

"Leonidas was the more phenomenal for being so small a center forward, though he began as an inside right. Of him, it was said by Jerry Wienstein, "He was as fast as a greyhound, as agile as a cat, and seemed not to be made of flesh and bones at all, but entirely of rubber. He was tireless in pursuit of the ball, fearless, and constantly on the move. He never conceded defeat. He shot from any angle and any position, and compensated for his small height with exceptionally supple, unbelievable contortions, and impossible acrobatics."
 

idmanager

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If visual appeal is what people are after that's cool, but accuracy...it doesn't exist in any graphics by anyone. If it was meant to represent people in the defensive phase than players would basically be on top of each other.
Nah, I don't think that's the case.
As long as it doesn't look very disjointed, it doesn't usually impact games.
Your picture does make it a bit tough to visualize the tactic in place though.
 

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Location
West Coast
Cha Bum has weird positioning in that formation @Brwned . Was he really a left midfielder ? From all the videos I've seen of him he always seems to be running through the middle and he seem a goal scoring forward. Meazza was obviously no winger and played pretty much the same position as V. Mazzola afaik. Pat's personnel for diamond formation is more or less excellent and I can't see it breaking down through the middle with his midfield & defense. I think team brwned lacks the tools to exploit the narrowness of Pat's formation and think Pat would narrowly nick a win here with a solitary Romario goal.