Hopefully for the national team and his sake he will take note of Sancho and move out of city fast. These few years wasted will impact on him hitting his potential.
Phil Foden - What Is His Potential?
- Thread starter Davs
- Start date
Not sure what that has to do with what I said JP.
Look at it this way, how many 2000 born players are making an impression in the top 3 leagues in Europe?
I'm simply sharing the information that during the time frame used in this tweets, one player was injured and he was replaced by a player that is about a month out of the arbitrary age.
Its not an arbitrary age in this conversation. Reiss Nelson is a December 99 too but fact is they belong to a different development year in European football. You qualify the UEFA u17 etc tournaments by being that age or under that age on the 1st January the year the tournament is held.
Dude, I just shared a piece of information about one of the player in the tweet and the 18 years old player that replaced him. If you don't want the information it's fine.
OK, no problem. Thank you for the information. Although you missed that Monaco played a 2001 when they got smashed recently
I didn't miss it.OK, no problem. Thank you for the information. Although you missed that Monaco played a 2001 when they got smashed recently
Monaco have used 5 players born in 2000 or after, Massengo(2001), Badiashile(2001), Geubbels(2001), Pellegri(2001) and Diop(2000).
Give youth a chance, what can go wrong!I didn't miss it.
Monaco have used 5 players born in 2000 or after, Massengo(2001), Badiashile(2001), Geubbels(2001), Pellegri(2001) and Diop(2000).
My mate knows his brother very well.
I've met his brother a few times.
He's a United fan. Foden is the odd one out and the gist of the coversation was that he only supports City because he played for them. No idea about his Mum.
I think you are all expecting a little too much of Foden,too early.
He's operating in the engine room against players who have 10-15 years more experience and are physically stronger. He's built like a cocktail stick and expected to come up against players twice his weight and come out on top. It's clear he has brilliant potential and his technique and ability is already superior to some of those comes up against, but sometimes physicality wins over all of that. Having watched him last season and this, he's definitely getting there and he has bulked up a bit, but it doesn't happen overnight for an 18 year old kid.
The other youngsters who have come through have been mainly wingers i.e Sancho who are a little bit out of the rough and tumble of the middle of the park.
He's operating in the engine room against players who have 10-15 years more experience and are physically stronger. He's built like a cocktail stick and expected to come up against players twice his weight and come out on top. It's clear he has brilliant potential and his technique and ability is already superior to some of those comes up against, but sometimes physicality wins over all of that. Having watched him last season and this, he's definitely getting there and he has bulked up a bit, but it doesn't happen overnight for an 18 year old kid.
The other youngsters who have come through have been mainly wingers i.e Sancho who are a little bit out of the rough and tumble of the middle of the park.
It's hard to tell what his potential might be when he doesn't get to play in the first team other than the odd late sub when City is way ahead or a Carling Cup game (or whatever it's called now)...
Nothing unique about him given hes in the same era as Gomes and Gibbs-White.
Sale to the bundesliga, or two year loan.
And Curtis Jones.
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Does Angel Gomes need to leave United, like everyone is saying that Foden needs to leave City?
Gomes can't even get a sniff of game time in the first team (2 minutes of first team football over the last 2 seasons), is exactly the same age as Foden and was supposedly rated just as high a year or two ago.
Foden is getting significantly more exposure to the first team and looks to have much more of a future at City than Gomes does at United. I'm not seeing comments suggesting that Gomes needs shipping off to the Bundesliga.
Foden looks to have more of a future than any academy midfielder breaking through at United at the moment. He has the same minutes as Pereira and McTominay combined, despite being 3 years younger than both and having world class competition.
Gomes can't even get a sniff of game time in the first team (2 minutes of first team football over the last 2 seasons), is exactly the same age as Foden and was supposedly rated just as high a year or two ago.
Foden is getting significantly more exposure to the first team and looks to have much more of a future at City than Gomes does at United. I'm not seeing comments suggesting that Gomes needs shipping off to the Bundesliga.
Foden looks to have more of a future than any academy midfielder breaking through at United at the moment. He has the same minutes as Pereira and McTominay combined, despite being 3 years younger than both and having world class competition.
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its a lot easier to put a young player in when your doing well Foden at City compared to say Gomes here, however if they are good enough then play them, and ultimately depends on the player Foden might be happy building up the minutes and gradually getting more of a chance, cant ever be easy leaving a top team for any young player, but on the flip side look at Sancho and how game time has took him on. maybe a loan spell would be better for Foden, but its where he would go might be the problem. has he signed a new contract at City yet ?
Not yet as he's not ready for first team football but in a year or so he very well may need to.
He's on to make 30 or so appearances this season, with 9 or 10 of those being starts. I think that's fair enough progress for an 18-year-old.
What do you quantify as the top 3 leagues? Spain, England and Italy?
All 3 of those leagues don't play many young teenagers, in fact they barely play any young players at all. Most develop in France, Germany.
In first 5 games of each league you got the following:
Germany: U19's had 3,711mins
France U19's had 3,593mins
Spain U19s had 1,568mins
England U19s had 1,361mins
Italy U19s had 1,097mins
I disagree to be honest. Granted he's being coached by probably the best coach in the world and training with exceptional players. But he's really not getting much game time apart from the EL and presumably the FA Cup against mediocre teams. That won't really help his game time experience. Having said all that, I think it's pretty hypocritical for us to point at Foden when we have Angel and Chong stuck in the U23s. Personally I think exceptional talents like these should probably move to a tier 2/3 club and play regular football. I'd have no complaints if Chong/Angel decided to leave for first team football.
I use the UEFA coefficient rankings which have
1. Spain
2. England
3. Italy
Germany are a way of in 4th and France even further off in 5th.
I'd agree with that ranking.
Also, if we're being objective about Fodens playing time then you got to look at the big 5 leagues and compare playing times. There's 38 players aged 18 or younger who have minutes in their domestic league this season. Foden is 20th on the list in playing time. Not too bad really.
Here's something a little interesting about the list (didn't bother adding a few as they're from random countries).
French Nationality = 17 players / 4489mins
English Nationality = 6 / 1994mins
German Nationality = 6 / 594mins
Brazilian Nationality = 2 / 111mins
Serbian Nationality = 2 / 14mins
Italian Nationality = 1 / 79mins
Spanish Nationality = 1 / 157mins
Here's something a little interesting about the list (didn't bother adding a few as they're from random countries).
French Nationality = 17 players / 4489mins
English Nationality = 6 / 1994mins
German Nationality = 6 / 594mins
Brazilian Nationality = 2 / 111mins
Serbian Nationality = 2 / 14mins
Italian Nationality = 1 / 79mins
Spanish Nationality = 1 / 157mins
Worth noting that Monaco have played a good numbers of those French teenagers and perhaps not to the advantage of them.
They've played 6 French and 1 Italian and have been forced into it to some degree by injuries (some of those young players themselves also got injured).
Monaco is a very unusual right now though. Some sources have them as having 12 players unable to play their next match through injury plus 2 suspended due to red cards. Imagine taking 14 players out of our squad and see who we'd need to play. Even city who are essentially doubled up on all 11 first team positions would be fielding some odd names in that situation.
To be fair, 4 players would be in the first team even without injuries, Pellegri, Diop, Geubbels and Sylla. Pellegri was as good as Falcao in the games he played.
He has next to no chance in the present set up. Look at Anders Pererria. Does reasonably well in two different loan spells so it's all building up for him to be a first team regular. He actually starts first game (and maybe second, can't remember) but United hit trouble and you then don't see him for ages.
Clubs nowadays just go for the ready made article or what they think is ready made. Bonkers to think Fred and Bakayoko cost nearly 100m between them and they've both blocked the path of homegrown players.
How many games has Gomes appeared in this year? And how many minutes had gibbs-white played?
Don't know and it doesn't matter.
Good job Foden is not playing for Man Utd, as Mourinho only likes giants.
226 vs Foden's 267. Emile Smith-Rowe(Arsenal) is another comparable talent, he's played 312.
So he’s playing a similar amount of minutes to other young English talents then. Yet there seems to be no calls for Gibbs-white or Smith-Rowe to leave for more minutes. Why is Foden held to different standard to these players in terms of minutes required?
Probably holding City's poor record of bringing players through against them and concluding the same will happen to Foden, he also has a higher profile than the other two currently so more attention is on him. Personally I think Foden is in a good position right now but the most important thing is that there is obvious progression there. Picking up minutes here and there will suffice this season but it's no good if it's the same story next year, he needs to be more of a rotation player by then otherwise he would be better off elsewhere.
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Foden won the best player at the u17 World Cup. Gibbs-White and Smith-Rowe were both bench players in the same tournament.
I think Gibbs-White might get a start soon after what happened at the weekend. I think he deserves one anyway.
France is by far the best league when it comes to young players.
Germany is one step lower and usually buy their young players from others leagues with a lot of them coming from France.
Barca could've had Dembele for 15M if they had bought him for Rennes where his talent was already very clear instead of waiting for him to shine at Dortmund.
Foden was England's best player but that doesn't necessarely mean he is the best individual player of the 2000 generation
Germany is one step lower and usually buy their young players from others leagues with a lot of them coming from France.
Barca could've had Dembele for 15M if they had bought him for Rennes where his talent was already very clear instead of waiting for him to shine at Dortmund.
You realize that these kind of awards are meaningless? This is a short tournament where only the player of a winning team or at least a semifinal team can hope to win best player.
Foden was England's best player but that doesn't necessarely mean he is the best individual player of the 2000 generation
They’re not meaningless. They don’t prove anything conclusive but Foden is one of the elite 2000s, there aren’t many in the game that would disagree with that. He has to prove it in senior football now of course.
I don’t think Pep is handling him too badly personally. I think he definitely wants to develop him judging by his game time so far.
Gibbs-White probably has the best chance of meaningful game time this year. Smith-Rowe will only get cup and Europa games but will probably be loaned next year.
Should get a start tomorrow in a big Champions League game. I'd be disappointed if he didn't considering our injiry sotuatisi in midfield. Only way he doesn't is if Guardiola decides to bolster the midfield with Stones/Delph in there with Fernandinho
I would say that I can’t see how he’s going to get a meaningful run of games. Having seen his games for City this season and watched him for England 21s recently I definitely think he’s ready to play every week at PL level. It’s hard to see how that can happen at City currently.
I agree, but at 18 does he need a meaningful run of games, if he was 20 or 21 of say he does but at 18 I think playing cup games and last 20 mins of pen games is more than enough
No where near ready to play week in week out. Not physically strong enough, showed in the last game. Imagine playing for a lower side where he will be hounded and brushed off the ball. Has close ball control to do well but still lacking in physicality imo.