Newcastle United & Mike Ashley

Skills

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https://mobile.twitter.com/btsportfootball/status/1084139792395370498

A bit of controversy around Rio's comments on Newcastle. So what's the situation at Newcastle at the moment? Apparently Ashley has wanted out for over a year now, but is struggling to sell the club.

Newcastle are a bit of weird club in my opinion. They're a club who people believe is bigger than they really are. They have a huge stadium and a loyal local fan base, but the club has close to 0 appeal outside of the North East of England. Stadium income has become less & less significant over the last 10-15 years for clubs.

Which is why I feel, Ashley is probably struggling to sell the club. If they really were a big deal, someone would've gladly taken them over either as a sugar daddy project or as a decent investment with the booming PL figures.
 
Pretty sure they were close to being sold a couple of years ago but it was shafted because of a relegation clause or something?

Either way I dont agree with Rio. Ashley has been at the core of the rotting of that club.
 
I kind of agree with Rio. Newcastle are a weird club, they're a bit like Liverpool but without the history. They have had some weird decisions over the years but always on the football side. Mike Ashley has given them money to spend but they have wasted it every time.
 
Looking at the clubs outside of the top 6, Newcastle are, for me, one of (if not) the biggest of the rest. They shouldn't be in a relegation scrap. Surely they can spend more than the likes of Fulham & Huddersfield.
 
It depends on how much they make vs. how much he takes out the club. Do they make enough to spend lavishly? You'd have to think with the TV deals, they'd have enough for a few signings at least.
 
Skills said:
https://mobile.twitter.com/btsportfootball/status/1084139792395370498

A bit of controversy around Rio's comments on Newcastle. So what's the situation at Newcastle at the moment? Apparently Ashley has wanted out for over a year now, but is struggling to sell the club.

Newcastle are a bit of weird club in my opinion. They're a club who people believe is bigger than they really are. They have a huge stadium and a loyal local fan base, but the club has close to 0 appeal outside of the North East of England. Stadium income has become less & less significant over the last 10-15 years for clubs.

Which is why I feel, Ashley is probably struggling to sell the club. If they really were a big deal, someone would've gladly taken them over either as a sugar daddy project or as a decent investment with the booming PL figures.
Click to expand...

The size of their fan base extends into parts of North and East Yorkshire as well, it does have huge upside potential with the loyal base that will always be there, that is what I think causes people to "overvalue" it as a club. You are buying what it COULD be, not what it is.

If you actually sort out the scouting on the youth side.of things as well you could have a potential HUGE talent pool to select from.
 
To be clear, when anyone talks about an owner pouring "their own" money into a club, they should exclusively be talking about money made outside of the club. When Rio suggests the 50m of transfer profit and TV money spent by ashley was his own money "because he owns the club" that's just disingenuous. Wijnaldum and Sissoko alone fetched the 50m he credited ashley with, not to mention parachute payments.

But, besides all that, the situation was of his own making. Years of terminal underinvestment only to give those accumulated funds to Schteve "hair island" McClaren. We'd been circling the bowl for years, a few decent signings - still none breaking our record for Owen in 2005 of 17m mind, a ridiculous bit of trivia in this gilded age - couldn't change much with that man in charge.

Frankly, Rio is a dunce. And I think a paid-for one as well. Read any of the responses by north east journos (Luke Edwards) to that tweet absolutely shredding his ridiculous statements.

edit: for what it's worth I don't think Ashley truly wants to sell the club but is using it as a distraction to excuse not spending. I think the bidders are real but being strung along unless they come up with a "too good to refuse" number like 500m or summat. This has happened 3 transfer windows in a row now so you have to question why it always seems to conveniently crop up.
 
11101 said:
I kind of agree with Rio. Newcastle are a weird club, they're a bit like Liverpool but without the history. They have had some weird decisions over the years but always on the football side. Mike Ashley has given them money to spend but they have wasted it every time.
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This is the part that people quibble with. What I've read is that he doesn't actually give them money, it's from inside the club, primarily player sales. Also, he has a monopoly on advertising inside the stadium for his Sports Direct brand for nothing.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
This is the part that people quibble with. What I've read is that he doesn't actually give them money, it's from inside the club, primarily player sales. Also, he has a monopoly on advertising inside the stadium for his Sports Direct brand for nothing.
Click to expand...

Whatever it is, their spending is usually around mid table levels. It's not like they haven't been buying anybody.
 
11101 said:
I kind of agree with Rio. Newcastle are a weird club, they're a bit like Liverpool but without the history. They have had some weird decisions over the years but always on the football side. Mike Ashley has given them money to spend but they have wasted it every time.
Click to expand...

Probably already been said but they've sold players for profit and he's kept that and not reinvested.
 
unchanged_lineup said:
But while having to get rid of good players at the same time that they'd be much better off if they'd been able to keep.
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Getting relegated twice in the last 10 years doesn't help that though. Nobody good hangs around for that. They're a mid-lower table team and have been for years, with the exception of a couple of good spells. Their fans think the good spells are the norm though.
 
11101 said:
Getting relegated twice in the last 10 years doesn't help that though. Nobody good hangs around for that. They're a mid-lower table team and have been for years, with the exception of a couple of good spells. Their fans think the good spells are the norm though.
Click to expand...
:rolleyes: No we don't. This is the same ridiculous, played out, uninventive caricature always brought out by people who get their opinions on football vomited down their throats from idiots like Richard Keys. Maybe you've got some fresh new material about VCRs always blinking 12:00 to lay on us too.

If your life depended on it you couldn't find one Newcastle United fan to remotely fit the "deluded geordie thinking they deserve top 4 every year" stereotype. If it was ever true that may have been in the KK and SBR days but the last 15 years should have put that tired, unfunny trope to death.
 
I thought Mansour nearly bought the barcodes before he settled for the Berties?
 
I think Newcastle generally are a pretty distinguishable brand compared to most clubs outside of the top 6. They're definitely in the top 10 biggest clubs in the country, comparable to the likes of Villa or Everton at least. You'd think they'd be a fairly attractive investment.

Ashley is a dickhead and Ferdinand is talking out of his arse. A major flaw many people have is being unable to admit when they are wrong, and he's definitely suffering from that.

the_box said:
:rolleyes: No we don't. This is the same ridiculous, played out, uninventive caricature always brought out by people who get their opinions on football vomited down their throats from idiots like Richard Keys. Maybe you've got some fresh new material about VCRs always blinking 12:00 to lay on us too.

If your life depended on it you couldn't find one Newcastle United fan to remotely fit the "deluded geordie thinking they deserve top 4 every year" stereotype. If it was ever true that may have been in the KK and SBR days but the last 15 years should have put that tired, unfunny trope to death.
Click to expand...

Great post.
 
 
Usually browse this forum as a guest but saw this thread so I had to register to give my take on my club. There seem to be a lot of misconceptions about Ashley’s ownership of Newcastle so I’ll try to clear them here. The general consensus among football fans and it was repeated by Rio is that he’s cleared up the club’s debt. This is categorically untrue, we are £144 million in debt according to the latest accounts. What he did was transfer the debt from a bank to himself therefore cutting out expensive interest payments, so this money still has to be repaid to him on top of what the club is worth. The only debt he paid off (or was forced to) was the one which related to St James’ Park, and it is not a choice he had – this payment was compulsory if John Hall ever lost majority shareholding. He didn’t do it out of the goodness of his heart.

I know Kevin Keegan and Alan Shearer aren’t popular among Man Utd but his treatment of two club legends has been diabolical. A lot of shit was spread about Keegan during 08/09, namely that he was demanding the earth from Ashley who didn’t give it to him. Keegan won his case against Ashley and Section 5.2 of the ruling stated that the club intentionally misled the fans and media about details of why KK left. Funnily enough, this wasn’t strongly reported in the media and these (wrong) accusations still persist about KK.

He’s also bought up the land behind the Gallowgate End at SJP and plans on building there, thus stopping the chance of SJP ever being expanded. This quite frankly is an outrage, and I haven’t seen any criticism of this outside of the local media. I know it’s a different kettle of fish at Old Trafford but just imagine if the Glazers did something permanent near OT to prevent the Main Stand from ever being re-developed.

Then there is the fact that he’s desecrated emblems of the club. SJP is literally falling apart, whether it’s for the normal punter or the executive areas – it’s all an embarrassment. The ground is emblazoned with Sports Direct logos and until a couple of years they did not pay for this privilege even though they were listed as a sponsor. Let’s also not forget the two name changes – first sportsdirect.com@ St James’ Park and then Sports Direct Arena. I’m sorry but I can’t imagine many of you being happy if OT was renamed and I’m not sure why it’s something that Newcastle fans should accept.

I’m also not sure where this notion comes in that he’s allowed the club to spend a lot of money – this is complete and utter garbage compared to what other (lower mid table) Premier League clubs have been spending. Rio’s point about him spending £50 million of his money to escape the Championship is nonsense, the club raked in £90m + in transfer fees that summer so it was the club’s money and Rafa has not seen sums like that since. He did it to protect his investment which is fine but I take offense at the fact that he cares about the club. John Hall was brutally honest about Ashley’s investment back in 2007, that he bought the club to showcase his brand abroad and everything he’s done suggests that is his only motive.

Oh btw, our commercial is income is shockingly low, it is somehow not much different to what it was in 2007 which is amazing considering the Premier League viewing numbers have gone through the roof all over the world in the last decade.
 
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kjs17 said:
Usually browse this forum as a guest but saw this thread so I had to register to give my take on my club. There seem to be a lot of misconceptions about Ashley’s ownership of Newcastle so I’ll try to clear them here. The general consensus among football fans and it was repeated by Rio is that he’s cleared up the club’s debt. This is categorically untrue, we are £144 million in debt according to the latest accounts. What he did was transfer the debt from a bank to himself therefore cutting out expensive interest payments, so this money still has to be repaid to him on top of what the club is worth. The only debt he paid off (or was forced to) was the one which related to St James’ Park, and it is not a choice he had – this payment was compulsory if John Hall ever lost majority shareholding. He didn’t do it out of the goodness of his hearts.

I know Kevin Keegan and Alan Shearer aren’t popular among Man Utd but his treatment of two club legends has been diabolical. A lot of shit was spread about Keegan during 08/09, namely that he was demanding the earth from Ashley who didn’t give it to him. Keegan won his case against Ashley and Section 5.2 of the ruling stated that the club intentionally misled the fans and media about details of why KK left. Funnily enough, this wasn’t strongly reported in the media and these (wrong) accusations still persist about KK.

He’s also bought up the land behind the Gallowgate End at SJP and plans on building work there, thus stopping the chance of SJP ever being expanded. This quite frankly is an outrage, and I haven’t seen any criticism of this outside of the local media. I know it’s a different kettle of fish at Old Trafford but just imagine if the Glazers did something permanent near OT to prevent the Main Stand from ever being re-developed.

Then there is the fact that he’s desecrated emblems of the club. SJP is literally falling apart, whether it’s for the normal punter or the executive areas – it’s all an embarrassment. The ground is emblazoned with Sports Direct logos and until a couple of years they did not pay for this privilege even though they were listed as a sponsor. Let’s also not forget the two name changes – first sportsdirect.com@ St James’ Park and then Sports Direct Arena. I’m sorry but I can’t imagine many of you being happy if OT was renamed and I’m not sure why it’s something that Newcastle fans should accept.

I’m also not sure where this notion comes in that he’s allowed the club to spend a lot of money – this is complete and utter garbage compared to what other (lower mid table) Premier League clubs have been spending. Rio’s point about him spending £50 million of his money to escape the Championship is nonsense, the club raked in £90m + in transfer fees that summer so it was the club’s money and Rafa has not seen sums like that since. He did it to protect his investment which is fine but I take offense at the fact that he cares about the club. John Hall was brutally honest about Ashley’s investment back in 2007, that he bought the club to showcase his brand abroad and everything he’s done suggests that is his only motive.

Oh btw, our commercial is income is shockingly low, it is somehow not much different to what it was in 2007 which is amazing considering the Premier League viewing numbers have gone through the roof all over the world in the last decade.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this post. I didn't actually know a lot of this stuff, so it's very enlightening.
 
the_box said:
:rolleyes: No we don't. This is the same ridiculous, played out, uninventive caricature always brought out by people who get their opinions on football vomited down their throats from idiots like Richard Keys. Maybe you've got some fresh new material about VCRs always blinking 12:00 to lay on us too.

If your life depended on it you couldn't find one Newcastle United fan to remotely fit the "deluded geordie thinking they deserve top 4 every year" stereotype. If it was ever true that may have been in the KK and SBR days but the last 15 years should have put that tired, unfunny trope to death.
Click to expand...
Top post that.. Mike Ashley is for me the same as Ellis was for Sunderland. Tried it didnt work so he stopped. Newcastle for me deserve much much better than that plonker.
 
It should be bloody obvious to anyone who's paying attention that Ashley is yet another of those unscrupulous barrow boys so often embraced by Britain's leaders, who give them licence to exploit and prosper.
 
If anyone did to our club what Ashley has done to Newcastle we'd be trying to string him up like Mussolini.
 
As much as I deplore Ashley as a businessperson/employer, you can't really blame him for not bankrupting himself trying to keep up with multi-billionaires. Newcastle fans deserve so much better, though.
 
Oscar.Z.Acosta said:
As much as I deplore Ashley as a businessperson/employer, you can't really blame him for not bankrupting himself trying to keep up with multi-billionaires. Newcastle fans deserve so much better, though.
Click to expand...
It's got feck all to do with that. Their transfer record is still £17m and TV money has skyrocketed. He's a crook.
 
Proper club. Passionate fans and an amazing atmosphere. Feel for their fans. They should have at least everton sized investment or west ham.
 
Some people just want to think they have an authority opinion on everything. Ferdinand has no clue what he's talking about, so why say it? Absolute clown show from him.
 
finance wise as a club they're in a far better state than when Shepherd and Hall had it but they've been mismanaged on the playing side for years under Ashley, I like Lee Charnley, he's a nice kid but should never be MD of a football club, when I worked there he was more or less Russell Cushings PA.

They got lucky for a few years when Graham Carr got lucky on scouting and made a fortune of a few of those players which was never reinvested pound for pound (it possibly would have been wasted but we'll never know)

I also don't believe Ashley actually wants to sell the club, if he did he would price it accordingly but I'm really surprised at the type of person trying to buy the club, the last thing NUFC fans should hope for is a consortium as I can't think of any clubs where a consortium has purchased the club and it's worked, QPR is probably the biggest failure of a consortium I can think of.
 
Ashley transparently cannot be bothered to run the club properly. It is just a marketing tool for him. The fans deserve better.
 
The biggest problem with NUFC is they still believe the Keegan/Robson era NUFC is where they rightfully belong, when in fact, where they rightfully belong is their role as a nothing cannon fodder club.

They are not a sleeping giant, they dont have huge potential, they need to accept what they are and deal with it.
 
I blame Rafa for not using his own money to sign new players. It's his fault they are in the relegation zone.
 
kjs17 said:
Usually browse this forum as a guest but saw this thread so I had to register to give my take on my club. There seem to be a lot of misconceptions about Ashley’s ownership of Newcastle so I’ll try to clear them here. The general consensus among football fans and it was repeated by Rio is that he’s cleared up the club’s debt. This is categorically untrue, we are £144 million in debt according to the latest accounts. What he did was transfer the debt from a bank to himself therefore cutting out expensive interest payments, so this money still has to be repaid to him on top of what the club is worth. The only debt he paid off (or was forced to) was the one which related to St James’ Park, and it is not a choice he had – this payment was compulsory if John Hall ever lost majority shareholding. He didn’t do it out of the goodness of his hearts.

I know Kevin Keegan and Alan Shearer aren’t popular among Man Utd but his treatment of two club legends has been diabolical. A lot of shit was spread about Keegan during 08/09, namely that he was demanding the earth from Ashley who didn’t give it to him. Keegan won his case against Ashley and Section 5.2 of the ruling stated that the club intentionally misled the fans and media about details of why KK left. Funnily enough, this wasn’t strongly reported in the media and these (wrong) accusations still persist about KK.

He’s also bought up the land behind the Gallowgate End at SJP and plans on building work there, thus stopping the chance of SJP ever being expanded. This quite frankly is an outrage, and I haven’t seen any criticism of this outside of the local media. I know it’s a different kettle of fish at Old Trafford but just imagine if the Glazers did something permanent near OT to prevent the Main Stand from ever being re-developed.

Then there is the fact that he’s desecrated emblems of the club. SJP is literally falling apart, whether it’s for the normal punter or the executive areas – it’s all an embarrassment. The ground is emblazoned with Sports Direct logos and until a couple of years they did not pay for this privilege even though they were listed as a sponsor. Let’s also not forget the two name changes – first sportsdirect.com@ St James’ Park and then Sports Direct Arena. I’m sorry but I can’t imagine many of you being happy if OT was renamed and I’m not sure why it’s something that Newcastle fans should accept.

I’m also not sure where this notion comes in that he’s allowed the club to spend a lot of money – this is complete and utter garbage compared to what other (lower mid table) Premier League clubs have been spending. Rio’s point about him spending £50 million of his money to escape the Championship is nonsense, the club raked in £90m + in transfer fees that summer so it was the club’s money and Rafa has not seen sums like that since. He did it to protect his investment which is fine but I take offense at the fact that he cares about the club. John Hall was brutally honest about Ashley’s investment back in 2007, that he bought the club to showcase his brand abroad and everything he’s done suggests that is his only motive.

Oh btw, our commercial is income is shockingly low, it is somehow not much different to what it was in 2007 which is amazing considering the Premier League viewing numbers have gone through the roof all over the world in the last decade.
Click to expand...
Good post. Ashley's a morally bankrupt leech who has had a similarly corrosive influence at Rangers.

Rio's comments are well wide of the mark and it doesn't reflect well on his punditry to wade in so uninformed.
 
I'm not clear on this Rio controversy. Is it suggested that Rio has been paid to spread lies to help Ashley sell the club?
 
I love Rio, he's probably my favourite ever player but he made an absolute show of himself with those comments. Was painful viewing.
 
Their transfer activity was pretty much underwhelming: conservative hirings by bringing players from small / demoted clubs that played consistently, and hiring Yoshinori Muto was baffling.

And why in the hell did they sold Merino? He had potential.

If you have limited funds, you must gamble with young potential, either from UE zone, either from U21 - U19's arround the world. If the young player has an X factor, great, if not, you can resell / loan him.
 
Who is the presenter talking to Rio? He gave a good account of himself I thought and his doing the house up before he sells it analogy was brilliant, completely over rio’s head who just said “well your house ain’t worth 60milllion”... completely over his head.

@Gio what has ashley’s influence at rangers been like?
 
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