You're arguing a point I've never actually made as the only point I've made - so... Good luck arguing the voices inside your head I suppose - I'm flattered you've dressed them up like me I must have made an impression of sorts
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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And I’m sure it would be true - all PL managers know more than fecking @haram about physical conditioning. Not to mention the army of conditioning staff they have.
I agree it's horrible, but if Ole wanted Longstaff get him, that way we can judge him properly, right now he has a midfield barely fit for the championship, and we are playing as such.
If that's the case why did the best captain of probably the last 20 years for Manchester United assume David Healy should be able to score goals in the premier league because if you score goals you can do so at any level?!
It's a stupid comment because both example are bloody stupid!!!
No, yours is a stupid example, mine isn’t. I get what you are trying to do here, you’re just doing it very poorly.
I'm also sure managers will take risks when it comes to picking up short term results, which is what Ole did but it's just not sustainable.
We can assume this is what he's doing with Rashford who's looked crap since Henderson took out his ankle.
Moving in circles here and repeating myself - but since it didn't reach through to you the first time I'll give it another shout: it is sustainable if you have proper depth / alternatives able to pick up the pace once attrition sets in. It's actually the recipe for success - what seperates great teams from merely good ones - being able to push your players to their limits getting their best out of them while they're fit and then having great options available for when injuries inevitably sets in.
It's the latter we're missing - that's our main concern not the high-intensity game we're aiming for.
So what is this?You're arguing a point I've never actually made as the only point I've made - so... Good luck arguing the voices inside your head I suppose - I'm flattered you've dressed them up like me I must have made an impression of sorts
Our lack of results is down to things that cannot be instantly fixed - and hence must be endured. At least two of the games we lost points from this season were games where our dominance warranted three points - so yeah bad luck but luck usually evens out over time so even though it's bitter I'm not particularly worried about it. Our squad is probably the thinnest and least experienced in the league and we really should have had two more seasoned midfielders and a top-class attacker to replace those who left - in the final third we're something of a mess (though still improved from last year where we were absolutely abysmal in that area) and our attackers are far from being clinical enough - but is that down to Ole? I doubt it - he said he wanted five signings during the summer and even identified the weak areas of our team correctly - yet he only got three (of which one was an unproven youngster even) - so something tells me this was more down to either lack of available talent or the board not acknowledging how urgent it was replacing those who left (Lukaku and Herrera in particular).
So then it isn't sustainable if you don't have depth and capabilities to properly rotate? What is happening with us right now, please tell me. Tell me who the manager is as well.
It’s all just talk, the season has just begun, and the squad were playing one game a week. It is highly likely that Shaw was not worn out by the second game of the season, and the rest were not burnt out by the third or 4th.
What about City’s defensive crisis? Who’s to blame there? I can appreciate people want to be armchair experts on tactics etc, but people here are talking bollocks for my money by purporting to be experts on training regimes and the like, especially given that training is a part of the game you don’t even get to see so have no idea what happens.
No one is arguing with Maguire and AWB our defence is better but improving one line and making the midfield and attack worse is poor management.
Even before preseason we knew Herrera and Lukaku will be leaving. There is simply no excuse.
Using Ole’s words in couple of interviews hold no water either. He also said he’s happy with the squad and that he’s happy with the board.
Someone made the decision that the squad is good enough and that’s the job of the manager and the coaches. You can’t be serious that Woodward made the call that our midfield and attack was good enough - he’s not a footballing guy.
Also spending 150m is enough to fill 5-6 positions if needed, especially when you are shifting players.
You said that the board denied any further signings but that makes no sense, where is the actual evidence on that?
Yea, 2 weeks into the season and playing once a week. We should be rotating. Our players are worn out. Just stay in your lane as a fan and criticise what you see on the pitch and in the market. Talking nonsense about training patterns is a reach.
Well you still have to try and make the best of what you got - don't you? Sometimes your squad simply isn't good enough to reach the top but a good coaching staff still pushes it as far as it can go. Oh and I already have elaborated as to why I still remain hopeful - so let's not pretend that never happened. I can't be arsed beating a point through your skull spoon feeding you my objections as if you were an infant - I'm simply not that into you sorry
Then what value was he ultimately adding to the club?
It's not a reach because we know what Ole is trying to implement but it's just a fantasy that isn't going to work.
Ole didn't have his own staff in Molde and Cardiff? Do we force our managers to work with "our" coaches? Lvg had Giggs, Jose had Carrick in third season and Ole has Carrick, Phelan and Mckenna.
Jose's fall started with Faria leaving. Most of stuff in trainings assist managers do so isn't it better for manager to have his standard crew?
Jose's fall started with Faria leaving. Most of stuff in trainings assist managers do so isn't it better for manager to have his standard crew?
You don’t know nearly as much as you think you do about it.
I know that all of our players getting injured last season was down to the way we were running and that that's what Ole wants going forward. If people want to act like the injuries were a coincidence they are just deluded.
No you don’t.
And if you want to keep pushing the point that injuries are something we can magically avoid while at the same time challenging to be the best we can be - then claiming these injuries were down to our running despite presenting no factual evidence to back that claim up whatsoever all the while ignoring the fact that these injuries wouldn't even be that big a deal if we had some proper depth to our squad - ignoring the fact that your points have already been thoroughly refuted by several people in here while repeating the same nonsense over and over - then good luck with your delusions.
Are you a troll or for real?
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Herrera and Mata both pick up injuries. Lingard comes on after JUST being injured and gets injured again. Rashford injured but carries on playing with a bad ankle because we have run out of subs. There is people that think this happening in one half is normal and has nothing to do with the way we were playing around that time?
Do me a fecking favour.
When did I say we can avoid injuries completely? If you think there is no correlation between high intensity running and muscle injuries you are deluded. The Liverpool game was proof of how unsustainable it was.
So he wanted just Longstaff of all the midfielders in the world there is no other option B?
How do we know? And how do we know he wasn't promised Longstaff right up to the last, so Plan B wasn't needed? as there is nothing surer than the fact he will have wanted someone for the midfield.
Two players in Martial and Shaw notorious for either their lack of running or fitness issues both pick up muscle injuries in the same game, only 3 matches into the season? Give your heads a wobble.
Then how do we know that the board didn’t deliver? It’s not like we didn’t spend circa 50m on young British player in AWB.
Why people assume the board blocked some transfer this summer?
We took our time on Maguire so there were 80m left up the very end for a midfielder and CB if you like.
We signed additional youngster in Mejbri for what 10m pounds? I don’t get where that shortage of money comes from.
Unless Ole is into self harm then the board clearly didn't deliver a midfielder and striker.
The CB and RB were transfers we should have made the summer before, if we had the whole Jose meltdown, Ole overachieving to get the job, etc, probably would never would have happened.
It's the same for any manager who takes charge of a relegation-threatened team. You can train them, motivate them and instruct them to the best of your ability, but there's a limit to what you can achieve with Championship-standard players. You could have installed Pep in place of Ole that season and Cardiff would still have likely got relegated.
I'm not saying Ole is the second coming of SAF or anything, but to judge him on the little time he spent at Cardiff would be harsh considering the circumstances.
What’s your, seemingly expert, opinion of the defensive situation at City?
Oh, now you are going back to a game from February to explain our current injury crisis. Mata who you speak of was not even a regular in the team then. Lingard obviously rushed back but not ready yet - which is very different from the huff you have been spouting about intensity. And very different to the fact that we have since had a full pre-season to implement whatever ideas and have picked up injuries only a couple of games into the season. When do you propose we increase intensity? After a year or two?
In case you hadn’t noticed, players like Rashford, Lingard and Herrera play with a high intensity every game. That is their style. Lingard is famed for his running. In your capacity of underdog/black sheep defender - I’m sure you have used it to his defence at times on this very forum.
What is the right time to get a muscular injury without you blaming the manager out of curiousity? When exactly does it come down to ‘bad luck’ and ‘part of the game’?
That game was an example of the accumulation of sprinting and running when Ole began. 3 games into this season both Martial and Shaw pick up muscle injuries in the same game. Injuries are part of the game but so is managing the way your team presses or sprints.
That’s pure speculation, mate.
The player we have been mostly linked with - Dybala was either a SS or a #10.
Surely if we had a target other than Longstaff we would have heard about it.
For all of his shortcomings I doubt you can pin that on Woodward as he’s not the guy who decides what position the squad needs strengthening. Neither is the board. Even under Moyes we saw a scattered approach of going after one CM after the other. Also the Longstaff situation was clear way before deadline day. We still didn’t go for any Cm beyond that point.
The manager and his coaching staff knew perfectly well both Herrera and Lukaku would leave, if you don’t have the money for anything else then don’t buy Maguire but take 2 players for less - at the end the squad will be less barebones than it is now.
Playing your best giving it your all - which is what you have to do to make it to the top - is never sustainable in the long run but it's still a necessity. That's why you need a squad that's physically up for the task - and also depth to your squad, This is where United falls short these days - we barely have the quality to field a starting eleven capable of challenging - even when everyone's fit for duty we're not quite "there" - and once injuries or fatigue sets in our lack of quality becomes even more visible. Which is the exact point I've been trying to present you with - over and over and over again with you just repeating yourself as if nothing's getting through - that giving it your all is necessary in order to achieve anything and that injuries are a natural part of this - something all top flights are bound to experience - and hence not our main issue.
But apparently my arguments are like water of a duck's back to you so I'll just let you paddle about in your little pond me thinks.
You can give your all without being naive. Your point makes no sense.
I know it was an example of such, and only holds any value or relevance if we are discussing trying to introduce new methods too soon. Seeing as that is not the conversation, 9-10 months later, it is an arbitrary example used to supplement a point which is a lot more difficult to support.
3 games into the season, Martial and Shaw both pick up injuries in the same game. Bad luck. Unless Martial and Shaw run far more than everyone else in the league, what you are seemingly suggesting is that Ole just tells them to take it easy. Martial doesn’t sprint as much as Son at Spurs, for example. Even this season. I’m not sure what kind of workaholic you think he has transformed into. As I said, he has gotten injuries before Ole came, and has got one now. It might actually be a mystery if he were not a professional athlete.
No, but he's the guy who is tasked with buying the players, and there is not a chance you go from swapping Lukaku for Dybala and Mandzukic, to 'trusting Greenwood' to fill the gap, without major failings from someone, or not been able to get a deal for Longstaff done in a position we are desperate in.
I do not believe for one second Ole was told you have £140 million to spend, but you have to sell Lukaku, and get rid of Sanchez and Herrera as well to balance the wage bill, and then Ole choosing to spend the money on the players he did, it's rubbish, he clearly expected more, but we just couldn't get it done.
Hold on a second. Didn't he get the job whilst they had a January window and he signed a bunch of United boys?
I could be wrong but probably not. I know he definitely got gifted Zaha from us.
Simple.
Ed: I can't get this Dybala deal over the line, he wants too much wages and we can't sort out his legal fees.
Ole: It's fine.. Greenwood will have to do.
But this is another poor example. I mean we clearly didn't plan to get Dybala at the start of the summer otherwise we would have knew about his wages etch. So who the hell did we have in mind for upfront?
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