[SteveW]

It seems Utd and Roma are in talks for selling him for good in January already?



but... the trick is to play the personnel at their strength, not exposing their flaws? Roma is packed in the midfield and their defensive line stays low, so that he is simply asked to defend and he is doing it well

The guy was talking about his attacking ability. He was our best CB at playing a high line because he has loads of pace. He was always the guy who handled quick attackers like Vardy.

 

[Ekeke]

There's a rumour today that we will block a 25 million January sale for Rojo because of his 'resurgence in form'

Loaning Rojo and keeping Smalling might have been a better option however I can see why it didn't happen.

If true I simply cant defend that. A bit like Rojo and De Gea's goal.

I wouldnt be bothered if we sold him for £2.5 million

 

[Stacks]

Rojo and Jones should always have been sold before Smalling but 2 of the 3 had to go so we can try something new because they have for the most part has their chance and not formed dominant partnerships

 

[Andersons Dietician]

When it comes to Smalling I’m sure it was said he had the offer from Roma asked Ole what his position was in the team and Ole couldn’t guarantee him a starting position and Smalling probably felt he’d be behind Maguire, Lindelof and Tuan so decided he wanted to leave. The club didn’t force him out, Smalling did what he felt was best for him.

I don’t blame Ole either on that decision as the club invested in Lindelof a younger defender who has shown at times to be pretty good so Ole trying to get the best out of him.

As for Smallings skills on a ball, bar Shaw Smalling has probably played the only defence splitting passes out of defence I can remember seeing over these last few years and in this I include Maguire and Lindelof. He also showed his best form in a high line defence for LVG and proved to be almost unbeatable in a 1 on 1.

Is there better out there yes, would We have to pay over 50 mil to get better, probably.

 

[MadDogg]

For a long time he was described as really mistake prone, despite rarely making mistakes. When that started to look a bit silly he became the defender who's always pulling shirts and giving away penalties, despite rarely giving away penalties or even getting booked. When that started to look stupid he became the defender who can't pass the ball and ruins our style of play, despite the fact that the quality of the players in front of him was the main reason for our football being shite. He's plays the same simple enough passes the worked absolutely fine for someone like Vidic throughout his career. But they suddenly started pretending we'd be playing like a Guardiola team if only our 2 CBs could pass like midfielders. There was always a new criticism designed to maintain his status as a "Chuckle brother"

It's all just stupidity. He's a really good defender and has been for years. It was completely inevitable that once he got out of the echo chamber he would be considered a quality player. He always has been one.

Nah, Vidic was far better on the ball than Smalling is. Especially in the second half of his time with us he regularly played great diagonal balls to put wingers and fullbacks into great attacking space. He wasn't as good playing through the centre, but still comfortably better than Smalling there as well.

 

[Oldyella]

There's a rumour today that we will block a 25 million January sale for Rojo because of his 'resurgence in form'
.

Christ..

 

[Ekeke]

Nah, Vidic was far better on the ball than Smalling is. Especially in the second half of his time with us he regularly played great diagonal balls to put wingers and fullbacks into great attacking space. He wasn't as good playing through the centre, but still comfortably better than Smalling there as well.

More long balls, less accuracy overall partly because of that. Also less passes in general than Smalling makes

 

[flappyjay]

The moment he makes his first mistake the pitch forks will be out

 

[roonster09]

If only Vidic was just passing the ball to nearest player, he would have had much better pass completion percentage.

 

[sillwuka]

100% correct. Casual football watchers turned him into a meme. "Chuckle brothers", "I'm Chris Smalling and I'm Phil Jones" etc. Most just went along with it for laughs and it eventually just became the accepted view. Why would a players own support ridicule him if it wasn't true at the end of the day? It's because we haven't been winning and one of the least stylish players in the squad was a convenient scapegoat for an entitled fanbase.

For a long time he was described as really mistake prone, despite rarely making mistakes. When that started to look a bit silly he became the defender who's always pulling shirts and giving away penalties, despite rarely giving away penalties or even getting booked. When that started to look stupid he became the defender who can't pass the ball and ruins our style of play, despite the fact that the quality of the players in front of him was the main reason for our football being shite. He's plays the same simple enough passes the worked absolutely fine for someone like Vidic throughout his career. But they suddenly started pretending we'd be playing like a Guardiola team if only our 2 CBs could pass like midfielders. There was always a new criticism designed to maintain his status as a "Chuckle brother"

It's all just stupidity. He's a really good defender and has been for years. It was completely inevitable that once he got out of the echo chamber he would be considered a quality player. He always has been one.

Couldn't agree more with what you've said @SteveW

He should have been the player to partner Maguire going into this season. I'm certain we would have seen a more organised defence but as long as Ole is here he won't get the chance.

If you go out to buy someone of similar quality it's costing you no less than £45 million we always sell at a cut price and he will go for less than £10 mil due to our inability to sell players close to their market price!!

 

[Revaulx]

100% correct. Casual football watchers turned him into a meme. "Chuckle brothers", "I'm Chris Smalling and I'm Phil Jones" etc. Most just went along with it for laughs and it eventually just became the accepted view. Why would a players own support ridicule him if it wasn't true at the end of the day? It's because we haven't been winning and one of the least stylish players in the squad was a convenient scapegoat for an entitled fanbase.

For a long time he was described as really mistake prone, despite rarely making mistakes. When that started to look a bit silly he became the defender who's always pulling shirts and giving away penalties, despite rarely giving away penalties or even getting booked. When that started to look stupid he became the defender who can't pass the ball and ruins our style of play, despite the fact that the quality of the players in front of him was the main reason for our football being shite. He's plays the same simple enough passes the worked absolutely fine for someone like Vidic throughout his career. But they suddenly started pretending we'd be playing like a Guardiola team if only our 2 CBs could pass like midfielders. There was always a new criticism designed to maintain his status as a "Chuckle brother"

It's all just stupidity. He's a really good defender and has been for years. It was completely inevitable that once he got out of the echo chamber he would be considered a quality player. He always has been one.

Absolutely spot on.

Other players have been the subject of irrational scapegoating over the years, but that’s usually been by way of overstating their weaknesses and ignoring their strengths. Nani’s an obvious one. Lukaku also, but that’s complicated by irrational support from Jose fanboys. People have carried it a great deal further with Smalling by having to make stuff up about him.

 

[roonster09]

100% correct. Casual football watchers turned him into a meme. "Chuckle brothers", "I'm Chris Smalling and I'm Phil Jones" etc. Most just went along with it for laughs and it eventually just became the accepted view. Why would a players own support ridicule him if it wasn't true at the end of the day? It's because we haven't been winning and one of the least stylish players in the squad was a convenient scapegoat for an entitled fanbase.

For a long time he was described as really mistake prone, despite rarely making mistakes. When that started to look a bit silly he became the defender who's always pulling shirts and giving away penalties, despite rarely giving away penalties or even getting booked. When that started to look stupid he became the defender who can't pass the ball and ruins our style of play, despite the fact that the quality of the players in front of him was the main reason for our football being shite. He's plays the same simple enough passes the worked absolutely fine for someone like Vidic throughout his career. But they suddenly started pretending we'd be playing like a Guardiola team if only our 2 CBs could pass like midfielders. There was always a new criticism designed to maintain his status as a "Chuckle brother"

It's all just stupidity. He's a really good defender and has been for years. It was completely inevitable that once he got out of the echo chamber he would be considered a quality player. He always has been one.

Good post, I will never understand why people club him together with Jones.

 

[flappyjay]

Absolutely spot on.

Other players have been the subject of irrational scapegoating over the years, but that’s usually been by way of overstating their weaknesses and ignoring their strengths. Nani’s an obvious one. Lukaku also, but that’s complicated by irrational support from Jose fanboys. People have carried it a great deal further with Smalling by having to make stuff up about him.

It's surprising the number of United fans and forum members who don't know that he is rapid in a foot race. Most think he is actually slow.

 

[Hammondo]

Nah, Vidic was far better on the ball than Smalling is. Especially in the second half of his time with us he regularly played great diagonal balls to put wingers and fullbacks into great attacking space. He wasn't as good playing through the centre, but still comfortably better than Smalling there as well.

He wasn't a good passer, he was generally awkward with turning and that caused him problems. He was calm though, and as long as he wasn't under a lot of pressure he would do a fine passing job.

 

[Hammondo]

If only Vidic was just passing the ball to nearest player, he would have had much better pass completion percentage.

He didn't do much else, a few long balls and thats it.

 

[luke511]

I think he'd be great next to Maguire, two aerial monsters. It'd be like his partnership with Blind but maybe even better?

 

[Ekeke]

If only Vidic was just passing the ball to nearest player, he would have had much better pass completion percentage.

Making 1 extra long ball per game in 09/10 clearly transformed our season

 

[roonster09]

Making 1 extra long ball per game in 09/10 clearly transformed our season

Yeah, long balls are the only passes which means player didn't pass to the nearest player.

 

[Ekeke]

Yeah, long balls are the only passes which means player didn't pass to the nearest player.

Its better to pass the ball to the nearest player than the opposing team or out of play

 

[Bepi]

100% correct. Casual football watchers turned him into a meme. "Chuckle brothers", "I'm Chris Smalling and I'm Phil Jones" etc. Most just went along with it for laughs and it eventually just became the accepted view. Why would a players own support ridicule him if it wasn't true at the end of the day? It's because we haven't been winning and one of the least stylish players in the squad was a convenient scapegoat for an entitled fanbase.

For a long time he was described as really mistake prone, despite rarely making mistakes. When that started to look a bit silly he became the defender who's always pulling shirts and giving away penalties, despite rarely giving away penalties or even getting booked. When that started to look stupid he became the defender who can't pass the ball and ruins our style of play, despite the fact that the quality of the players in front of him was the main reason for our football being shite. He's plays the same simple enough passes the worked absolutely fine for someone like Vidic throughout his career. But they suddenly started pretending we'd be playing like a Guardiola team if only our 2 CBs could pass like midfielders. There was always a new criticism designed to maintain his status as a "Chuckle brother"

It's all just stupidity. He's a really good defender and has been for years. It was completely inevitable that once he got out of the echo chamber he would be considered a quality player. He always has been one.

That’s it... and of course at Roma he is not asked to win the league or the cl, so that he can stay in his comfort zone as a player without being exposed week in week out at the highest level... but again, my point was meant to say that he still seems very able to play for a top 4 team in the PL and City is playing two DMs as CBs right now.

 

[roonster09]

Its better to pass the ball to the nearest player than the opposing team or out of play

Sure.

 

[Adam-Utd]

It must feel at home for Smalling in Serie A. Like a fish in water.

Young people didn''t get a chance to see what a real defending look like, when Serie A at their best at late 80's and 90s. That's why some of them can't appreciate Smalling.

The obsession of ball playing centre backs is what's done this.

Good defenders are now seen as 2nd rate talents. The likes of John Stones getting in ahead of him in the England team, it's truly bonkers.

While yes it would be wonderful if every defender was as good as a midfielder on the ball, but in reality it's harder to find a proper centre back that can dominate a forward.

Smalling was that type, he handled the bigger forwards like Kane better than any of our other CB's.

While Maguire may handle that now, his slower acceleration does cause him issues if he loses the initial duel. For me Smalling should never have gone, but I get why Ole let him go.

 

[gajender]

Smalling is decent defensively not someone great as few of the posters in this thread keep repeating ,as a back up he is Ok but not a starter for me,, if Lindelof and Maguire fail to step up this season buy new CB's but Smalling is not the solution for certain.

 

[Oldyella]

Vidic was a little better on the ball but not much. But then he didn't need to be given he had Scholes and Carrick dropping deep to take the ball of him, and Rio and Evra either side if he did want to shuffle it sideways.

Not sure it's fair to compare any of our current players against their counterparts in our most successful ever period.

 

[roonster09]

The obsession of ball playing centre backs is what's done this.

Good defenders are now seen as 2nd rate talents. The likes of John Stones getting in ahead of him in the England team, it's truly bonkers.

While yes it would be wonderful if every defender was as good as a midfielder on the ball, but in reality it's harder to find a proper centre back that can dominate a forward.

Smalling was that type, he handled the bigger forwards like Kane better than any of our other CB's.

While Maguire may handle that now, his slower acceleration does cause him issues if he loses the initial duel. For me Smalling should never have gone, but I get why Ole let him go.

Yeah, Smalling and Maguire would have been very good pair. Both very dominant aerially, both very strong physically. Small lacks ball playing skills which Maguire is good at. Maguire lacks pace, which Smalling would have covered. Apart from that, both were good goal threats from set pieces.

 

[Renegade]

Smalling is decent defensively not someone great as few of the posters in this thread keep repeating ,as a back up he is Ok but not a starter for me,, if Lindelof and Maguire fail to step up this season buy new CB's but Smalling is not the solution for certain.

we’ve been buying new CB’s for almost 5 seasons straight.

Rojo, Bailey, Lindelof & now Maguire. The one season we never, Jose had a tantrum. The other season we never was 15/16 we used Blind there and had our best partnership since Rio and Vida. How much money are we going to spend till we get it right at centre back. Smalling isn’t world class or the long term answer but you’d think the new players would be able to replace him if he was so bad.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Yeah, Smalling and Maguire would have been very good pair. Both very dominant aerially, both very strong physically. Small lacks ball playing skills which Maguire is good at. Maguire lacks pace, which Smalling would have covered. Apart from that, both were good goal threats from set pieces.

Yep, with Tuanzebe coming into to keep them fresh it could have worked really well.

I've never been a fan of CB's that aren't aerially dominant, Lindelof just seems to much of a push over.

 

[gajender]

we’ve been buying new CB’s for almost 5 seasons straight.

Rojo, Bailey, Lindelof & now Maguire. The one season we never, Jose had a tantrum. The other season we never was 15/16 we used Blind there and had our best partnership since Rio and Vida. How much money are we going to spend till we get it right at centre back. Smalling isn’t world class or the long term answer but you’d think the new players would be able to replace him if he was so bad.

Until we get it right just because we have spent poorly doesn't make Smalling a better player than he actually is , despite our recent struggles we should be striving to create a team capable of competing for all major honours I just don't see Smalling playing major role there its time we start building towards that.

 

[Renegade]

Until we get it right just because we have spent poorly doesn't make Smalling a better player than he actually is , despite our recent struggles we should be striving to create a team capable of competing for all major honours I just don't see Smalling playing major role there its time we start building towards that.

I get that, but in the meantime we’re neglecting important attacking positions in the market.

 

[gajender]

I get that, but in the meantime we’re neglecting important attacking positions in the market.

I agree with this but only partially as we have tried to address almost every area of the pitch but as most of signings have failed due to various reasons we are always coming short during transfer window, ideally last Summer we should have prioritised attacking positions instead of splurging on Maguire and could have gone after less expensive option than Wan-Bissaka with a skill set better suited for modern fullback role.

 

[A-man]

Yep, with Tuanzebe coming into to keep them fresh it could have worked really well.

I've never been a fan of CB's that aren't aerially dominant, Lindelof just seems to much of a push over.

How about Tuanzebe? He is definitely not dominant in the air, maybe on level with Bailly.

 

[Adam-Utd]

How about Tuanzebe? He is definitely not dominant in the air, maybe on level with Bailly.

I can't say I've seen enough of him in top flight football to make a judgement, but so far from the games he's played for us he looks comfortable in the air.

Obviously won't be Smalling/Maguire levels, but as long as you contest them that's what matters.

 

[Lynty]

I can't keep up to be honest.

Smalling was a good prospect. Then he was an average squad option. Then he was abysmal. Then actually for a season, he was good. Then he was a liability. Now he's possibly better than Lindelof and Maguire?

I don't think Smalling has changed at all, fans opinions are just fickle.

 

[A-man]

I can't say I've seen enough of him in top flight football to make a judgement, but so far from the games he's played for us he looks comfortable in the air.

Obviously won't be Smalling/Maguire levels, but as long as you contest them that's what matters.

Just found it strange you don’t like CBs who aren’t dominant in the air, and at the same time set your hope in Tuanzebe. He is definitely not dominant in the air, some may even say he is poor.

 

[Stacks]

The obsession of ball playing centre backs is what's done this.

Good defenders are now seen as 2nd rate talents. The likes of John Stones getting in ahead of him in the England team, it's truly bonkers.

While yes it would be wonderful if every defender was as good as a midfielder on the ball, but in reality it's harder to find a proper centre back that can dominate a forward.

Smalling was that type, he handled the bigger forwards like Kane better than any of our other CB's.

While Maguire may handle that now, his slower acceleration does cause him issues if he loses the initial duel. For me Smalling should never have gone, but I get why Ole let him go.

I agree with all this. Second rate managers who are not worldly renown for any spectacular philosophy be it attacking possession or what, are now turfing perfectly good defenders to fulfill their delusions of being Pep. We see it with England too who are not exactly a great passing side. Its not as if these CBs play these great passes like Rio did or even Terry. Pep eventually reverted back to Kompany who is a Brutish defender because his other CBs were whack.

 

[Sky1981]

So.... we sold smailling for peanuts. Paid 80m for a player who's only marginally better than him?

 

[Andersonson]

100% correct. Casual football watchers turned him into a meme. "Chuckle brothers", "I'm Chris Smalling and I'm Phil Jones" etc. Most just went along with it for laughs and it eventually just became the accepted view. Why would a players own support ridicule him if it wasn't true at the end of the day? It's because we haven't been winning and one of the least stylish players in the squad was a convenient scapegoat for an entitled fanbase.

For a long time he was described as really mistake prone, despite rarely making mistakes. When that started to look a bit silly he became the defender who's always pulling shirts and giving away penalties, despite rarely giving away penalties or even getting booked. When that started to look stupid he became the defender who can't pass the ball and ruins our style of play, despite the fact that the quality of the players in front of him was the main reason for our football being shite. He's plays the same simple enough passes the worked absolutely fine for someone like Vidic throughout his career. But they suddenly started pretending we'd be playing like a Guardiola team if only our 2 CBs could pass like midfielders. There was always a new criticism designed to maintain his status as a "Chuckle brother"

It's all just stupidity. He's a really good defender and has been for years. It was completely inevitable that once he got out of the echo chamber he would be considered a quality player. He always has been one.

100% spot on.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Just found it strange you don’t like CBs who aren’t dominant in the air, and at the same time set your hope in Tuanzebe. He is definitely not dominant in the air, some may even say he is poor.

I said in rotation, and I haven’t seen tuanzebe manhandled in any situations yet.

I believe he did pretty well in the championship so I expect he got tested plenty in that league

 

[A-man]

I said in rotation, and I haven’t seen tuanzebe manhandled in any situations yet.

I believe he did pretty well in the championship so I expect he got tested plenty in that league

Heading the ball is not one of his best attributes. Last game it looked like Newcastle targeted him in the air, and when Carroll came on, Ole finally had to move him out to FB position.

 

[manunited1919]

The football geniuses, whech include Ole and also some ex-players, insisted you need to build from the back, and used that as the main argument to spend $130m in our defense, while ignoring our midfield & attack. They also thought (better said they still think) Smalling was not qualified to be part of the future rebuild project, because he “can’t pass”. As @SteveW said on his brilliant post, Smalling was scapegoated. But not just by fans, also there’s a group of ex players.

I know what SAF would have done with a team which can’t score enough goals: he would have bought some WC strikers. There were so many times he fixed issues with our team by finding us a Saha, a Chicharito, or a RVP. He knew how to fix a team.