Keane would break a young Ronaldo. He was incredibly fragile and SAF learned by experience. Can't see Keane putting an arm around a player for crying in response to a bollocking. Keane just doesn't have the diplomacy. Jose would at least charm half the dressing room
Would Roy Keane excel at managing an elite team?
- Thread starter luke511
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Not sure I agree with this narrative that Keane was a prick to everyone 24/7 in his playing days. There's a reason they all respected him. He cared for them & protected them (see Nev vs Vieira) as much he demanded from them. Keane valued effort.
https://talksport.com/football/3899...-goals-greatest-manchester-united-stats-news/
Roy Keane said:
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Elite players will only let you shout at them so long as the person shouting is still earning their respect through results, player development etc. I can’t see the latter in particular being a strength of keane, he’s got a history of belittling players
They respected him because he was an ultimate winner. There’s a big difference between playing with someone like that or trying to play for someone like that
It's hard to say. One thing is for sure he would upset a lot of people but I guess that is a question for recruitment then, get the people with the right attitudes, which if you do that then you have a group of players that will do well.
I think Keanes biggest problem would be how to apply his standards. Not every good player will respond well to be called out for a single mistake. Keane made plenty in his career, let's not pretend he was a gold plated diamond for every minute of his playing career.
I think people would be surprised that Keane isn't the only ex player that would call people out like that though. There is that story of Giggs questioning Ronaldo and pinning him to a wall. Secretly Ole will be happy because Keane is doing his dirty work for him, all he has to do is let the players know that in a way Keane is right. At least Ole doesn't have to play bad cop. I think that's where Keane would fit it. Assistant suits him more than Manager.
I think Keanes biggest problem would be how to apply his standards. Not every good player will respond well to be called out for a single mistake. Keane made plenty in his career, let's not pretend he was a gold plated diamond for every minute of his playing career.
I think people would be surprised that Keane isn't the only ex player that would call people out like that though. There is that story of Giggs questioning Ronaldo and pinning him to a wall. Secretly Ole will be happy because Keane is doing his dirty work for him, all he has to do is let the players know that in a way Keane is right. At least Ole doesn't have to play bad cop. I think that's where Keane would fit it. Assistant suits him more than Manager.
I think Jose has made plenty of enemies with players too along the way and I'm not sure Jose was the smiling cool cat at Porto that he became at Chelsea when he had the media and Chelsea fans worshiping at his feet for a while. He was known as a master of the dark arts during his Porto days and was often causing controversy. The super fame he had at Chelsea i'm sure relaxed him and changed him no end. I'm not knocking Jose and he has done amazing things, but I just feel he has similar traits to Keane that stop him from being considered a truly elite manager despite his huge successes. Jose's record of not being able to stop the rot in a team that goes on a run of defeats while automatically hitting the self-destruct button every time and doing everything in his powers to make a dressing room and board turn on him quickly when things go south, is straight out of the Keane book of management. And that trait is why neither of them last more than a couple of years in their previous jobs.
I think Keane's days as a manager are numbered for sure and football probably needs a pundit now who explodes on the TV every now and again for entertainment purposes, and is not in any hurry to leave his current handy number.
Mourinho was a truly elite manager though. To stick Keane in with him is insulting.
Like I said, Mourinho's man management/toxicity only became an issue during/after his spell at Madrid. His relationship with his players were fine before that - despite his various other controversies. Toxicity has pretty much followed Keane around his entire career though. Admittedly, as a captain he made a great drill sergeant under the guidance of a great manager like SAF.
Well I think you can reverse that and say it's insulting to stick Mourinho in with Keane considering Keane is the greatest captain of the premier league era and Mourinho never even played the bloody game. Who would you rather at your club? A bloke who dies on the pitch for you for 10 years and wins you trophy after trophy, or a bloke who makes it all about him and will stay 2 years max and spend the next 10 years budget on a few 30 years olds with 1 good season left in them? But I realize we are talking about management here but it depends on your definition of toxic as a manager. Is jumping around celebrating in your opposing managers face every time your your team scores a goal, even though you've spent hundreds of millions more than them not a little toxic like Jose used to do in his first stint at Chelsea? His team at Porto was famous for diving, trying to influence refs, time wasting at the end of games etc etc.
As a man I rate Keane far higher than Jose. As a manager I feel Jose's record is slightly overrated when you consider he took over Chelsea at a time when there was no FFP where he would buy players he didn't need just so Fergie couldn't get them. I believe if Diego Simeone came to Newcastle and was allowed to spend the Saudi blokes millions without a cap on his spending, I believe he would win the premier league for the next 10 years in a row. His football would bore everyone to death but it would be a winning machine. And at least Simeone is someone who gives youth a chance, so I would class Jose and Simeone as really really top managers but nowhere near the level of a Klopp or a Fergie who are truly elite managers. It's a bit like when Robbie Williams used to compare himself David Bowie or The Beatles due to similar record sales. He's found a way to sell as much records as The Bealtes but he's got there by cheating. Doesn't write his own songs and doesn't play any musical instruments but the history books will remember the record sales.
Anyways back to Keano, yes too much of a headcase to ever be a top manager. We will probably see him again sometime though as manager of some International team trying to increase their profile such as Tonga, Tobago or Indonesia or something.
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I don't think Keane believes in himself as a club manager.
See below.
Ole is a different type of man manager. He's exhibiting at least some understanding of how to handle modern players.
I think his issue is football has really changed from when he grew up - players he would have played with in his formative years would not have been playing for the money/lifestyle and personalities around the dressing room would have been very different. Now management seems almost totally about managing egos and allowing the coaches (of which top teams have armies of) to take the nuts and bolts of training sessions and lead opposition analysis. You have to pander to players because higher powers want them happy because they are worth money, Keano would just implode in that environment.
Respect from the players. Just like Zidane. He played at their level and won more than most of the current bunch despite their golden run in Europe.
And what's Roy Keane bringing to the party that the likes of Benitez and co couldn't?
I'm not sure he's any worse than Ole to be honest. It's easy to imagine that he'd somehow be a hurricane of anger and vitriol if he'd taken on the United job, but I still doubt it. That being said, neither should be a candidate for the job given their managerial records.
No. He'll fail miserably and very quickly. He can't control his emotions or anger when bad results happen. He'll insult and slaughter his players and will lose the dressing room very, very quickly.
And therein lies the issue in modern football and footballers.Why would elite players be afraid of Roy Keane? They're not children
The elite players in football are far, far more valuable and rarer than good managers. Only Pep and Klopp are an exception. It's the managers job to keep the elite players on his side.
Sometimes maybe good, sometimes maybe shit
He’d be an absolute disaster.
No chance. Not only because of the obvious reasons being put forward here but I don't believe he has the adequate knowledge of the modern game to manage an elite club. Hardly warrants a discussion imo.
Didn't he say he'd have punched De Gea in the face at halftime on Friday?
I think Ole has shown that he's got a bit more potential than Roy in his time at United. Keano may well have the ability but his attitude and relentless demand for perfection sinks his ship everytime because he doesn't have the tools to accept that not everyone is a good as he was.
I love Keano the player. Keano the manager and pundit not so much.
His coaching style of shouting at everything with a pulse is hugely outdated and one that even SAF only used when necessary.
He comes across quite narcissistic in his attitude towards players, everything is a negative regarding their application, desire, ability. Everything is sub-standard to when he played the game.
And when the team plays well it’s just ‘well that’s what should be happening - crack on’
It’s novel but doesn’t bare results or long lasting relationships with players.
His coaching style of shouting at everything with a pulse is hugely outdated and one that even SAF only used when necessary.
He comes across quite narcissistic in his attitude towards players, everything is a negative regarding their application, desire, ability. Everything is sub-standard to when he played the game.
And when the team plays well it’s just ‘well that’s what should be happening - crack on’
It’s novel but doesn’t bare results or long lasting relationships with players.
I wouldn't be taking that on face value. His management career is over (in all likelihood) so saying this as a pundit who is expected to present the fireworks, is par for the course. Was he ever physical with his players? I doubt it. Verbally aggressive here and there no doubt, but probably no more than Fergie.
I don't think Ole had shown anything more as a manager when he got the job. And very little since.
Brian Clough punched Keane in the face according to a few accounts. It's very clear that Roy took in a lot of what are now archaic management principles and believes they work because they worked on him. Times have changed and players no longer respond to that. This is probably the biggest reason his managerial career is over. I can accept that as a pundit he's likely been instructed to let it all hang out.
We'll agree to disagree about Ole since he's taken over at United.
I doubt he would be, but I think he obviously was a wonderful captain.
I think assistant coach did suit him though, he is a kind of coach that players would fear, but wouldn't necessarily have a role in the tactics.
He is someone that would be good in terms of, if a player is playing poorly at half time, going into the dressing room with Keane there you would know you needed to put in a performance the second half.
I think assistant coach did suit him though, he is a kind of coach that players would fear, but wouldn't necessarily have a role in the tactics.
He is someone that would be good in terms of, if a player is playing poorly at half time, going into the dressing room with Keane there you would know you needed to put in a performance the second half.
Fair enough mate.
No. Not dissimilar to Jose, he's out of touch with the modern game and the modern player.
The same - but he’s a nice chap. Massively underperforming squad, out of the top 4, never should have gotten the job on merit, will never manage a top club again. Just like Keane.
No. At best he'd be a worse version of current Mourinho falling out with players and having his favourites despite them performing badly
Maybe 25 years ago but certainly not now. Just screaming at players & calling them shit doesn’t work anymore. For every 1 player he’d get the best out of he’d kill the confidence of 10.
He’s got absolutely no tact so there is absolutely no chance he could be a manager of a coffee shop, never mind an elite professional team. It’ll always end in players becoming disillusioned with his way of doing things.
Can't see it, don't think the players would stand for it either. It's not a bad thing he doesn't hold back but you have to keep some things private and show some composure
Yes. He should take over from Klopp.
No I don't think Roy Keane would excel at managing an elite team. I think he knows as well, and so is carving a career with Nev and co at Sky Sports.
I actually had to switch the channel over the other day when he was on that rant at half-time, it was a bit too much.
It got me wondering if the lockdown had got to him - and then I realised nah it's just Roy Keane!
I actually had to switch the channel over the other day when he was on that rant at half-time, it was a bit too much.
It got me wondering if the lockdown had got to him - and then I realised nah it's just Roy Keane!
Even in private, I doubt the players will be able to endure his rants whenever his team is losing. He just goes over the top and no player will endure to be insulted that often.
I disagree. For example Keane never got on Forlan's case even though he had a long dry streak at the start of his career.
Forlan always gave his all despite not scoring so Keane backed him.
He liked Ronaldo and Ronaldo has spoken on how much of an influence Keane was on him when he joined United .
I would think it is likely Keane respected Ronaldo from the start because he could see he was a winner and would make every effort to be the best player he could .
I wonder sometimes about how some United fans get annoyed when Keane is critical of our players when it is obvious he does so because they deserve it and they are not doing what it takes to get United back to the top .
Doubt.
But I wouldn't feel surprise if he excell with certain top team. Depends on the team, profile of players and "right" timings.
Generally he'll fail but may success with certain "situations".
But I wouldn't feel surprise if he excell with certain top team. Depends on the team, profile of players and "right" timings.
Generally he'll fail but may success with certain "situations".
So let’s just imagine Keane, Pogba and Raiola together - Roy is from a different era - he isn’t able to control himself - would not be able to deal with today’s social media hungry players or the ability to toe the corporate/commercial line for the board......
He is though, great on tv as a commentator because he can say whatever he feels and he kind of gets away with it because of who he is....much better at being controversial than that twat Souness
He is though, great on tv as a commentator because he can say whatever he feels and he kind of gets away with it because of who he is....much better at being controversial than that twat Souness
Never.
Roy would create turbulence in a vacuum
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Was that really much different back in the day?
I mean, I can't see any manager who coached say Pele winning out if one or the other had to go.