Would a world-class defender be the best attacker in the Conference? Would a world-class attacker be the best defender in the Conference?

[altodevil]

How big is the gulf in quality?

I think you could fairly assume their first-touch and passing, reading the game, would make any world-class player of any position (bar keeper) the best midfielder in the Conference/Vanarama (whatever it's called now).

But what about making a defender an attacker and vice-versa - too much intricacies involved for them to still be the best?

What about in league 2?

 

[meamth]

How big is the gulf in quality?

I think you could fairly assume their first-touch and passing, reading the game, would make any world-class player of any position (bar keeper) the best midfielder in the Conference/Vanarama (whatever it's called now).

But what about making a defender an attacker and vice-versa - too much intricacies involved for them to still be the best?

What about in league 2?

Yes. obviously.

They will take the game on their shoulders and carry the team.

I mean there are reasons why they are paid so much money.

On the other hand, in their defence if they didn't perform, it's a team game ffs.

 

[Piratesoup]

Van Buyten could still run rings around amateurs, nevermind an actual world class player.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

Love these crazy hypothetical threads that keep coming up. Great thought experiments.

To answer your question, I think so, but I don't have any concrete evidence to back it up.

 

[Ali Dia]

Would Messi be a world class defender in the conference? I’m going to say no but he’d be able to get forward and wreck the place on a regular basis

Would ronaldo? No but he’d score a load of headers from set pieces and he’d also get forward and wreck the gaff

 

[Ramshock]

I've seen this happen personally in youth football. Had a kid who was a NCAA College standard and got a full scholarship for 4 years. He was the star of the select first team I was coaching but loved football so much he would want to play sometimes with the second group I had. I would play him as a CB or a Sweeper and he just destroyed the other teams from that position. He would start the ball from a deep position and work his way up with passes and dribbles and would often score 5 or 6 a game until I took him off. After a few months of this we both decided it wasn't doing him any good and wasn't exactly good for the other kids he played against.

 

[meamth]

I've seen this happen personally in youth football. Had a kid who was a NCAA College standard and got a full scholarship for 4 years. He was the star of the select first team I was coaching but loved football so much he would want to play sometimes with the second group I had. I would play him as a CB or a Sweeper and he just destroyed the other teams from that position. He would start the ball from a deep position and work his way up with passes and dribbles and would often score 5 or 6 a game until I took him off. After a few months of this we both decided it wasn't doing him any good and wasn't exactly good for the other kids he played against.

That's just from American soccer, there is your answer OP.

 

[11101]

Conference? Yes. Their reading of the game, timing and technique would be so far ahead.

Quite often at lower levels you see good defenders running out for their mates' social teams and scoring for fun. I did it for a couple of seasons.

 

[WeePat]

[Irrelevant point] would be the best CF in the history of the conference, maybe even League 1 and 2.

 

[altodevil]

Would Varane be top scorer in the conference if he had to stay in the opponents half all game? Would his team win the league?

 

[meamth]

Would Varane be top scorer in the conference if he had to stay in the opponents half all game? Would his team win the league?

In a real scenario he would he placed at CB or MF.

Yes he'd be a top scorer.

But, this is a team game. Winning something is all about the team.

 

[Tom Cato]

Phil Jones would absolutely wreck everyone on this forum in any position on the pitch.

I know that fans make it a sport to label players as shit, but I often feel like the sheer skill you would need to possess to even be looked at by a Premier League club is severely underrated

 

[tomaldinho1]

How big is the gulf in quality?

I think you could fairly assume their first-touch and passing, reading the game, would make any world-class player of any position (bar keeper) the best midfielder in the Conference/Vanarama (whatever it's called now).

But what about making a defender an attacker and vice-versa - too much intricacies involved for them to still be the best?

What about in league 2?

Vanarama football is vastly improved from where it was a decade or so ago, teams are way fitter but it's a different style of football, much less technical and more physical. Someone like VVD or Varane who are technically superior, fast and physical enough and could lead a line whilst their conditioning would initially be levels above. You do have to factor in how quickly they'd regress though without elite coaching, access to facilities, suddenly on 5k a week so no personal chefs etc.

 

[WeePat]

Phil Jones would absolutely wreck everyone on this forum in any position on the pitch.

I know that fans make it a sport to label players as shit, but I often feel like the sheer skill you would need to possess to even be looked at by a Premier League club is severely underrated

I'd fancy my chances against Phil Jones.

 

[Ali Dia]

I've seen this happen personally in youth football. Had a kid who was a NCAA College standard and got a full scholarship for 4 years. He was the star of the select first team I was coaching but loved football so much he would want to play sometimes with the second group I had. I would play him as a CB or a Sweeper and he just destroyed the other teams from that position. He would start the ball from a deep position and work his way up with passes and dribbles and would often score 5 or 6 a game until I took him off. After a few months of this we both decided it wasn't doing him any good and wasn't exactly good for the other kids he played against.

There was a kid like this in my class in school. Ireland underage, trials in England with big clubs and all that. P.E soccer matches were just pointless. He was a dirty player, relentless, big and fierce in the tackle too so everybody really hated playing him. He didn’t make it. Played Gaelic for Galway underage too I think and then just stopped. Miles fitter, stronger and more competitive than everyone else at that age group. He’d get the ball and start running up the pitch like playing fifa in easy mode. I reckon that’s what pro defenders must feel like with Haaland these days

 

[0le]

I think many players would meet the criteria. The more interesting question is how many players which started out in the conference actually went on to play at the highest level and win the biggest honours. I can think of Vardy and Smalling.

 

[Oranges038]

Is there a filter for shit threads?

 

[Lee565]

Prime ramos would be beast

 

[youngrell]

I'm going to say no.

We get to see the difference between PL players and non-league quite regularly in the FA Cup. The gap is not so wide that it is a guarantee for me.

 

[Scottynaldinho]

Every now and then you see "conference level" players in the PL, Bebe being our own. In reality, even Bebe would be an all time great in conference.

The gulf in quality and exposure is huge.

 

[Tomuś]

Depends on the instructions and the allroundedness of the given attacker but I think they'd do alright as the more attacking of the CBs or fbs.

I just imagined Ronalfo hustling and bustling with some shithouse uncle Keith up front.

 

[Gio]

It depends. Some world-class defenders will be tremendous all-rounders, while others are exceptional defensively but not quite as strong in other aspects of their game. I imagine the likes of Thiago Silva, Van Dijk and Ramos could play well in just about any position and at any level, never mind at the Conference. By contrast I reckon the likes of Chiellini and Godin for example could do a job up top in the Conference, but they're probably poorer finishers and weaker at taking on players than at least a few of the best attackers at that level. Obviously there is a big gap between the Premier League and the Conference, but then there is a far bigger gulf between the Conference and amateur football.

 

[#07]

Honest to God, the gap in levels is ridiculous. Someone like Rio Ferdinand would've looked like Zidane at the lower levels of English football.

Its shocking how big the gap is. You ever played casual football with someone who used to be in academy but never made it? I have. F'n shocking. You feel like you're playing in clogs on a field of tar compared to what you're seeing. Then listen to those guys talk about the pros they used to watch or train with. The levels are mad.

The shocking thing to me is players like Vardy who make it up through the ranks and end up being top level players. I find those kind of stories crazy.

 

[pacifictheme]

Jamie carragher played an attacker for England schoolboys and was very good. He scored loads at youth level as a striker.

So yes.

 

[largelyworried]

Yeah totally. Football is like a hyperactive form of natural selection. Hundreds of millions is spent finding and filtering out the best of the best on a global level, and then each player has hundreds of thousands spent on coaching and training them from aged 10 up. The result is that world-class players are truly in a million.

There might be one or two ways in which you can get one over on a world class player. Lots of conference strikers could outjump Messi at centre back, for example, and a handful of players in the conference might outpace an older slower defender. But reading of the game, technique, fitness, mental resilience etc are so much higher with top level players that they would just rip it up at a low level.

 

[Thiagoal]

Is there a filter for shit threads?

It’s called self control

 

[Ramshock]

That's just from American soccer, there is your answer OP.

To be fair a lot of my kids were Mexican and European. This particular kid was Mexican.

 

[giorno]

The correct answer is it wouldn't matter. Any world class outfield player would be prime Di Stefano on steroids at that level...

 

[Chipper]

[Irrelevant point] would be the best CF in the history of the conference, maybe even League 1 and 2.

Better than Jamie Vardy who scored 31 in 36 at that level?

 

[WeePat]

Better than Jamie Vardy who scored 31 in 36 at that level?

No idea why he's been masquerading as a LB his whole career. He should be a striker. He's one of the best finishers currently in the PL.

I was obviously being facetious before but he could likely be a very good striker at any level, let alone in the 4th and 5th tier.

 

[Trequarista10]

Hmm it depends on the player. Firstly they'd have to readjust their natural instincts/positioning, which can be learnt and trained to an extent but undoubtedly players have a preference and natural reactions playing a part too. Secondly, although many skills would be transferable, there would other skills that aren't. Some CBs may make good target men, but would their finishing or dribbling in tight areas be good enough? Some full backs would probably be good wingers at lower levels.

From my experience watching lower league games, the most common thing you see is an older attacking player/winger/former box to box midfielder, who drops down a level and plays as a holding midfielder, relying on their positioning and reading of the game, and being the focal point for building possession.

 

[Lord SInister]

The likes of Ramos, Pique, Harry Maguire, would probably be comfortably be 20 goals a season strikers.

 

[InfiniteBoredom]

There's a clip of Henry talking to Rio about Messi, recalling one incident in training where he felt wronged by an uncalled foul by Guardiola in a 7v7 half pitch game, took the ball off the keeper, dribbled past all of the other team and scored.

Of course, that's a bit of an extreme example as he is Messi after all, but it would be what happen if any top defender play in the Conference. Just the sheer strength alone would allow them to swat people aside and walk the ball into the net.

 

[horsechoker]

Conference league Varane!
Conference league Varane!
Conference league Varane!

 

[Red Pumpkin]

Van Buyten could still run rings around amateurs, nevermind an actual world class player.

Funny you mentioned van Buyten. As far as I know a decent chunk of top league CB are converted strikers, some of them playing as a strikers until the age of 20 before dropping back in order to keep a regular spot in the team. They could certainly have made it as strikers in the lower leagues.

Of the top of my head: Van Buyten, Lucio, Lustig, Benatia, Maguire. Probably lots, lots more.

You'd imagine Ibrahimovic, Toni and Drogba would have been top notch stoppers, yet others like Klose or Berbatov would use their ball reading qualities.

 

[Nevilles.Wear.Prada]

Remembered reading somewhere the difference between epl and championship is not the gulf in physical nor technique. Its the mental quickness amd decision making. All things kept the same, messi ronaldo will wreak havoc with their far superior coaching, tactical know how and experience. Even out of position. Sure messi not great on the air but remember the strikers will be marking him now.. He will zip pass them drawing more midfielders to himself and pick people off.

 

[horsechoker]

Remembered reading somewhere the difference between epl and championship is not the gulf in physical nor technique. Its the mental quickness amd decision making. All things kept the same, messi ronaldo will wreak havoc with their far superior coaching, tactical know how and experience. Even out of position. Sure messi not great on the air but remember the strikers will be marking him now.. He will zip pass them drawing more midfielders to himself and pick people off.

But could he do it on a cold Tuesday night in Stoke?

 

[Nevilles.Wear.Prada]

But could he do it on a cold Tuesday night in Stoke?

I knew someone going to say that. You couldn't resist it could you cnut

 

[dal]

Yes.

 

[Dargonk]

I'd say basically any world class defender could, and the majority of attackers. Though I would think there would be some attackers that wouldn't have the work rate/positioning to be the very best defender in the league.