[Fortitude]

Yeah but we signed him at 22, on a first-team transfer fee and wages. There's not that much room to add that much more in terms of technique to a player at that point, most of the improvements are about consistency and awareness. A player might add specific skills that they didn't use before such as backspin long passes, more weak-foot play and the likes, but they don't massively change how they perform some of the basics.

Think even about like a Patrice Evra who was signed at age 25. He didn't have any massive improvement in technique over the following 5 years, he had a good enough base level and then massively improved his consistency and awareness, while some of his limitations (one-footedness) remained pretty much his entire career.

I honestly think that in some clubs and countries AWB wouldn't even be in an academy team in his late teens with how unnatural he seems with the ball.

I think 25, 26ish is when a player is no longer 'forgiven' for his flaws, but before then, things are generally expected to get better. I'm not saying players morph from one form to another, but that they can work on their weaknesses and carve out a style and niche for themselves and polish off certain aspects of their game. Do you remember the pre-season Rooney went away and worked on his heading? He came back one of the best headers of the ball in the whole league despite ending the previous season as nothing particularly special with the ball needing to be headed. Even if he's an outlier, there are aspects that you would surely hope to see honed if a player works hard enough on his game. Wan Bissaka, with intensive training on his passing, one-touch and crossing should see improvement - you drill enough and a breakthrough of sorts should materialise. I don't think players are done and ready for the scrap heap if they're not showing much at 22 or so, personally.

Having said that, Wan Bissaka isn't 22 anymore and there may well be not much he can do to develop from here on in, but I'd like to see what becomes of him under a strict coach over the remainder of the season - if he's exactly where he is now as a player, I'll be surprised.

 

[Andrew7582]

Dalot will be first choice now...

AWB can get the position back though. All he needs to do is learn to be more aggressive with the ball and put the occasional cross in. Dalot is hardly Cafu.

Have another look at some of the passes Dalot has been playing the last couple of games, especially with his left foot, AWB doesn't have that in his locker.

 

[MTF]

I've yet to hear an explanation as to why that exists. Is there another stadium with this 'feature'?

Isn't it the way the pitch heating was set up at Old Trafford?

 

[Siorac]

Isn't it the way the pitch heating was set up at Old Trafford?

I don't know but if so, it can clearly be done differently. It's just odd.

 

[Bwuk]

Dalot is miles ahead technically. I said it before Ragnick will phase out AWB. He’s too poor technically.

 

[IrishRedDevil]

I've yet to hear an explanation as to why that exists. Is there another stadium with this 'feature'?

Pitch was raised to sort the drainage issues.

 

[Devil may care]

Looked out of sorts, all gangly knees in possession, hope he isn't badly hurt from the fall at the end, I was surprised none of the players went over to check on him.

 

[Floyd]

How is he such a fantastic athlete as some of you are describing? I don’t see it. Not strong, average leap and if he is indeed very fast he’s hiding it well because I’ve never seen him at full pelt, he’s just casually jogging along. Gormless shit player.

 

[Roboc7]

This is the thing. You buy talent young and mould and develop it into something better than it was; we've taken him in the other direction and that should never happen.

He needs some serious coaching - one of the players who could have done with a pre-season amount of time to get some 1on1 coaching and drilling.

He can do better than today, but Dalot is going to have his ears pointed sharp knowing this is his chance to shine and take a starting spot. Wan Bissaka has to go away and have a serious think on what he wants to achieve here and put his everything into trying to improve.

But Ole and Woodward bought that kind of talent , patted themselves on the back and then bragged about how they picked him over 800 other right backs. The fact they’d spent £50m, massively overpaid and he needed lots of work to justify that fee and solve the RB problem long term was totally lost on them.

He has so much to work on and really don’t know how much time he’ll get now.

 

[sullydnl]

Have another look at some of the passes Dalot has been playing the last couple of games, especially with his left foot, AWB doesn't have that in his locker.

Indeed.

And Dalot isn't exactly a superstar fullback.

 

[Adisa]

Amazing he’s the first victim of that drop off. It’s insanely dangerous. Can’t believe shit like that doesn’t happen more often.

It's insane how steep that shit is. I cannot believe that for decades it hasn't been changed.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Indeed.

And Dalot isn't exactly a superstar fullback.

Can you also post Dalot vs Arsenal. I know Rangnick only had 1 training session last week but It's probably better to compare Dalot vs Arsenal under Carrick to Bissaka vs Everton under Ole rather than using the one vs Palace.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Dalot is not under a threat at all from Bissaka. Even today under Rangnick, I'm still not too pleased with Bissaka's general play on the possession. Bissaka is equivalent to Smalling when on possession of the ball.

 

[edgecutter]

Another Ole signing that looks way out of his depth here. Hope he is ok, but that performance did him no favours.

 

[girish]

This was how he played for Palace and somebody watched him play and decided he was worth 50m....


This is exactly how he's played at Utd for 2 years now. He's rubbish and with all that off fhe field driving ban stuff, he should just be shipped out of the club.

It's because of the tackles surely? With all the talk about bringing in British 'talent' when Ole took over, it's no wonder the people who made the decisions thought he was a good player.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Any update on the injury?

 

[Rajma]

The only player in the squad which I genuinely have a huge dislike for, cannot wait for him to get sold. Ed and Ole masters at wasting money down the drain.

 

[sullydnl]

Can you also post Dalot vs Arsenal. I know Rangnick only had 1 training session last week but It's probably better to compare Dalot vs Arsenal under Carrick to Bissaka vs Everton under Ole rather than using the one vs Palace.

Afraid not, I just happened to see someone else post those on twitter earlier and stole them from there.

 

[izec]

If Smalling was a RB, he would be Wan Bissaka. Tackling is the only thing he is good at. Midtable RB, simple as.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

If Smalling was a CB, he would be Wan Bissaka. Tackling is the only thing he is good at. Midtable RB, simple as.

I will correct it. If Bissaka has good positioning and good aerially, he would be Smalling. He's more limited than Smalling. No talent to be modern RB and no talent to play as CB in any football era.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Not like he has competition.

 

[AshRK]

I think we may need a rb next summer if not in January itself. I don't think Dalot is the answer and awb cannot attack.

 

[MattofManchester]

I'll ignore everything about his performance and focus on one aspect.

The goal.

He's walking. Like the ball is out of play for a throw or the ref has blown for half-time.
He's walking when VDB passes it to him.

He's not even paying attention to what's going on when it happens, which is a large part of how YB get the ball and score.
He just sticks out his leg and hopes for the best.

How as a footballer can you switch off after putting your team into a dangerous situation in the first place(not clearing the header)?

It feels like it's gone unnoticed by many, but that was utterly ridiculous.

 

[MattofManchester]

Awful shithouse of a player. TERRIBLE performance. Hopefully that clatter at the end sees him out for the season so others can get a crack at RB.

On the other hand, surely people like this should be banned?

 

[Cutch]

Amazing he’s the first victim of that drop off. It’s insanely dangerous. Can’t believe shit like that doesn’t happen more often.

It feels like we've been saying this for years. How can such an obvious health and safety risk be left ignored for so long. Has to be some sort of mitigation measures you could install to protect the landing

 

[Adisa]

If Smalling was a RB, he would be Wan Bissaka. Tackling is the only thing he is good at. Midtable RB, simple as.

Smalling would never get done at the backpost as often as this bloke.

 

[RuudTom83]

AWB will be aware of his limitations. You can feel he is trying to be more involved in the attack, but it’s never easy for him and it all gets a bit clumsy. Worrying times ahead for Aaron.

 

[Harry190]

Don't think this game will show anything. It's during training that the hard work is done.

 

[SAFMUTD]

He'll struggle a lot to get game time under Rangnick. I think he just lost his starting spot.

 

[Isotope]

It seems like he's not close to any player in the squad. He just seems lost this season.

 

[Abraxas]

In theory he should be good at playing more proactively because he has the pace to recover if he misjudges things, and he's quite good at nicking the ball. The problem is, he's going to look a sending off candidate in every match. His intelligence on the pitch is just not great is it?

Then when he does get it or win it high up the pitch he looks as bemused as we are that we spent so much on a bloke that only has a few of the necessary tools.

 

[kundalini]

Any update on the injury?

Rangnick said in his post match press conference that AWB received 2 knocks, one on his wrist and the other on his knee. They have to wait until tomorrow to see the extent of the injuries but he is hopeful that Wan-Bissaka will be able to train on friday and be part of the squad for the Norwich game.

 

[RedAlert7]

People saying tackling is the only thing he is good for, even his tackling has been atrocious over the past year. Sent off for overstretching in the first champions league game and has been missing the ball a lot more often when going in for his classic lunges.
Plus the only reason his tackling is even required most of the time is because of his poor initial postioning requiring him to make last ditch tackles. That on top of lacklustre tracking back, poor passing, heavy first touches, poor aerial ability and a real lack of ability to get past his man or put a good cross in makes him a terrible right back option.
I actually used to be a fan but was misguided by his tackling and always rated him higher than he is. He trived under ole a few times as there was matches where we sar back and countered meaning his part in the build up was minimal. However the modern full back has to be one of the best players on the pitch or the team falls apart. Not saying dalot is our answer but look at the full backs of the top 3 in the epl, bayern,psg and madrid, they're miles ahead of AWB. If dalot is unable to prove himself this season we should be looking for another right back in the summer

 

[432JuanMata]

For all the credit Ole got for transfers AWB for 50m and Maguire for 80m are woeful buys. Really is poor for me. Gets called great defensively but that’s untrue he is always out of sync with the line of the back 4

 

[harms]

Do you remember the pre-season Rooney went away and worked on his heading? He came back one of the best headers of the ball in the whole league despite ending the previous season as nothing particularly special with the ball needing to be headed. Even if he's an outlier, there are aspects that you would surely hope to see honed if a player works hard enough on his game. Wan Bissaka, with intensive training on his passing, one-touch and crossing should see improvement - you drill enough and a breakthrough of sorts should materialise. I don't think players are done and ready for the scrap heap if they're not showing much at 22 or so, personally.

Have you got similar examples with passing though? Heading in Rooney's case was way more about positioning himself and it was the first season when he had switched to a proper number 9 instead of a supporting striker. And yeah, even then it was an outlier. The same goes for Cristiano's goalscoring — he hardly learned anything new technically (if anything, his technique slowly began to deteriorate), it was about his movement & decision-making.

 

[432JuanMata]

Have you got similar examples with passing though? Heading in Rooney's case was way more about positioning himself and it was the first season when he had switched to a proper number 9 instead of a supporting striker. And yeah, even then it was an outlier. The same goes for Cristiano's goalscoring — he hardly learned anything new technically (if anything, his technique slowly began to deteriorate), it was about his movement & decision-making.

This is actually a good point. Some things you can just get good at practicing and others while you get better it is down to technical ability. If you are a average passer of the ball and say 25 you can practice it everyday and while you can and probably will improve you will never be a great passer of the ball

 

[Isotope]

Have you got similar examples with passing though? Heading in Rooney's case was way more about positioning himself and it was the first season when he had switched to a proper number 9 instead of a supporting striker. And yeah, even then it was an outlier. The same goes for Cristiano's goalscoring — he hardly learned anything new technically (if anything, his technique slowly began to deteriorate), it was about his movement & decision-making.

I thought Kyle Walker was just a speed merchant with non-existent footballing brain at Spurs. Then imho he improved into very good fullback at City.

Positioning, man-marking and heading are teachable. Vision and passing imho are still teachable even at not so young age. It's technique/skill that is much much harder to improve past certain young age, imho: crossing, (comfortable) ball control, running with the ball, and evading opponent or tackle with the ball.

 

[Jackal981]

This is the thing. You buy talent young and mould and develop it into something better than it was; we've taken him in the other direction and that should never happen.

He needs some serious coaching - one of the players who could have done with a pre-season amount of time to get some 1on1 coaching and drilling.

He can do better than today, but Dalot is going to have his ears pointed sharp knowing this is his chance to shine and take a starting spot. Wan Bissaka has to go away and have a serious think on what he wants to achieve here and put his everything into trying to improve.

Can imagine Dalot is laughing watching this shitshow of performance. Dalot weakfoot is better than his strong foot. And he always turns like titanic. Every player who defended him know he would only go outside to the right. He is becoming a caricature version of old RB Valencia. And to boot Ole kept picking him up because he is somehow one of his golden boys so he felt he doesnt need to improve to keep his starting position. Hope that day is over with RR

The only player in the squad which I genuinely have a huge dislike for, cannot wait for him to get sold. Ed and Ole masters at wasting money down the drain.

Yes for me too. His body language is appaling. He jogs around like he thought he is prime Cafu and leaves his teammates exposed. Good athlete my arse, he cant even run fast and jump to head the ball. At least McT with all his crapiness still show more fight than him. And faking his head injury when he didnt bother to jog back. He didnt even jump at that challenge, the one who jumped was VDB and YB player. His crossing is one of the worst from a player I have ever seen. I have seen Sunday League players ping better cross than him

 

[harms]

I thought Kyle Walker was just a speed merchant with non-existent footballing brain at Spurs. Then imho he improved into very good fullback at City.

Positioning, man-marking and heading are teachable. Vision and passing imho are still teachable even at not so young age. It's technique/skill that is much much harder to improve past certain young age, imho: crossing, (comfortable) ball control, running with the ball, and evading opponent or tackle with the ball.

I’ve used him myself as an example in this thread or, at least, in the one discussing AWB. But even he at Spurs had amazing athleticism and decent technique — he had certainly improved his passing but it was a steady development from a good platform to start with. And his biggest improvement came in terms of his tactical awareness.

 

[Isotope]

I’ve used him myself as an example in this thread or, at least, in the one discussing AWB. But even he at Spurs had amazing athleticism and decent technique — he had certainly improved his passing but it was a steady development from a good platform to start with. And his biggest improvement came in terms of his tactical awareness.

Come to think again, i agreed. Never thought Walker was this poor with the ball at Spurs.