Television Star Trek

[SirAnderson]

If so then try the Expanse, Raised by Wolves, Project Blue Book, Foundation or even Halo.

ST Picard have Patrick Stewart, Brent Spiner, Whoppi Goldberg and many more... and somehow they still managed to F this up. It's actually somekind of achievement, if you'll think about it.

I've downloaded it already so will give it a try.

I have watched the Expanse already, don't care much for the next 2, Foundation I'm waiting for at least 2 season and the same for Halo, which hasn't even finished dropped season 1 completely.

I suppose it's better watching this as not a fan or follower of Star Trek then, based on how the fans feel its been messed up.

 

[Raoul]

If so then try the Expanse, Raised by Wolves, Project Blue Book, Foundation or even Halo.

ST Picard have Patrick Stewart, Brent Spiner, Whoppi Goldberg and many more... and somehow they still managed to F this up. It's actually somekind of achievement, if you'll think about it.

Its because they're trying to compete with various edgy Netflix like binge shows and have in the process completely forgotten the basics of what made Trek great. A ship, a captain and crew, encountering new things each week.

 

[SirAnderson]

Its because they're trying to compete with various edgy Netflix like binge shows and have in the process completely forgotten the basics of what made Trek great. A ship, a captain and crew, encountering new things each week.

Sounds like Orville. What's the variation they've made now? A storyline over the season rather than each episode a new encounter etc?

 

[Raoul]

Sounds like Orville. What's the variation they've made now? A storyline over the season rather than each episode a new encounter etc?

Yeah both of the first two seasons have been season arcs instead of individual episodes.

 

[SirAnderson]

Yeah both of the first two seasons have been season arcs instead of individual episodes.

Ah I see. Depending on how good the individual episodes are, and the growth of the characters over the season, I prefer season arcs, but that too has to be worth investing the time to see how it all plays out, like The Expanse.

I can see how something that is core to Star Trek in how you described it, can feel as a massive let down though. Some series just work best that way.

 

[Raoul]

Ah I see. Depending on how good the individual episodes are, and the grow of the characters over the season, I prefer season arcs, but that too has to be worth investing the time to see how it all plays out, like The Expanse.

I can see how something that is core to Star Trek in how you described it, can feel as a massive let down though. Some series just work best that way.

They can be effective if the writing is very good (see Enterprise seasons 3 & 4). Conversely, if the writing and characters are substandard, it can quickly ruin everything and make the show excruciatingly hard to watch (Discovery and Picard season 2).

 

[Van Piorsing]

Its because they're trying to compete with various edgy Netflix like binge shows and have in the process completely forgotten the basics of what made Trek great. A ship, a captain and crew, encountering new things each week.

It feels that way and it's a paradox Star Trek suddenly needs to compete with anything after achieving classic status long time ago, being closer to Space Odyssey rather than generic Netflix show.

New crew trained by Picard and Riker with help of Data, Worf & La Forge goes on a mission, some of them die in unexplained event by some phenomenon not encountered earlier, but the best cadets survive and trying to get back home while Picard organise a rescue mission to search for survivors while battling his old demons and responsibility for cadets that create stakes for him to remain as Federation's leader... he even goes on a deeper end and ask Q and Borg Queen for help in later seasons.

That kind of simple script is almost on the plate by auto pilot, yet they've created this thing in which new cadet Elnor is basically erased from developing his character because of the script which is just not worth it. Soji, Narek, Commodore Oh who had potential to be a somekind of villain... all looking like pointless characters now.

I'm really interested how 3rd season will do anything good after 2nd season dragging the entire thing into dead end.

 

[Raoul]

I'm really interested how 3rd season will do anything good after 2nd season dragging the entire thing into dead end.

Indeed. The very fact that they've had to scramble to bring the old TNG cast back suggests they know they fecked up in season 2 and are trying to right the ship to keep the show going beyond season 3.

 

[Van Piorsing]

Indeed. The very fact that they've had to scramble to bring the old TNG cast back suggests they know they fecked up in season 2 and are trying to right the ship to keep the show going beyond season 3.

It looks like rushed decision, even though it could have good intentions. Think we'll see couple of reunions, but if the script is rushed, this could easily drag the whole thing down, again.

Last episode of 2nd season better have good explanation and a bridge between seasons, or it will be disaster while waiting for another disaster with couple of reunions.

Raffi and Jurati belong into Friends sitcom. Kurtzman could just add a laugh track and think I would watch this just for banter.

 

[choccy77]

This week's episode...

 

[Norman Brownbutter]

Just watched this weeks episode...And then I watched Halos episode for this week. And this made Halo look like Dune.

 

[lilcurt]

Probably naive, but how are the actors who know what Star Trek should be just riding the wave with then and going along with it.

It goes someway to make STiscovery look good but by hook or by crook this season of Picard is doing just that.

 

[Amir]

Indeed. The very fact that they've had to scramble to bring the old TNG cast back suggests they know they fecked up in season 2 and are trying to right the ship to keep the show going beyond season 3.

Season three was confirmed to be the final one a while back. Also, it was supposed to be filmed back to back with season two, so I don't think the recent announcement about the old crew has much do with anything.

Still, they did feck the show up. Shame. Hope they at least have a good final season.

 

[Withnail]

This week's episode...

Spoiler

Bloody mind-meld journey into somebodies subconscious bollox for most of it. And what was the crack with Rios kicking a hole in the timeline to impress his new missus? Look at my spaceship! ffs He'd only reluctantly got her the brainwave device to save Picard, which he didn't have to show her materialising out of thin air or get her to use. She'd never seen anything like it but she had to use it as she was a Dr? A lot of silly little things this season have me asking myself WTF.

 

[choccy77]

Spoiler

Bloody mind-meld journey into somebodies subconscious bollox for most of it. And what was the crack with Rios kicking a hole in the timeline to impress his new missus? Look at my spaceship! ffs He'd only reluctantly got her the brainwave device to save Picard, which he didn't have to show her materialising out of thin air or get her to use. She'd never seen anything like it but she had to use it as she was a Dr? A lot of silly little things this season have me asking myself WTF.

totally, I really not sure what they were trying to achieve tbh

 

[dinostar77]

"New Trek" is a pale comparison to TNG, DS9, Voyager etc.

Picard season 2 started well amd.then went downhill fast. Its all very well that Paramount want to milk the Star Trek IP, but at the moment all they are doing is damaging it.

Also the Borg have gone from the most chilling species introduced in to Star Trek, to overexposed, overly used pantomime villian.

The two seasons of Stargate Universe were better than anything Discovery and Picard have put out combined. Yet a show like that got cancelled and this shadow of a scifi show continues.

Peak space based scifi show is now The Expanse. Foundation is a distant second and everything else trails behind in a galaxy far far away.

 

[Raoul]

Season three was confirmed to be the final one a while back. Also, it was supposed to be filmed back to back with season two, so I don't think the recent announcement about the old crew has much do with anything.

Still, they did feck the show up. Shame. Hope they at least have a good final season.

That's true, and frankly I wouldn't be offended if they go out in a blaze of nostalgic glory with the TNG cast in season three. I'm still trying to wrap my head around how season one was pretty good; leaving viewers hoping that they would build on that, only to disappoint in season 2.

There's a laundry list of problems with the show that have been exposed in 2.

- Stewart's quivering voice struggles to carry the show as its main protagonist. The audience is left somewhat baffled what has motivated him to leave Picard's retirement and do what he's doing.

- The writing has been horrendous, almost as bad as Discovery. You know Trek writers are running out of ideas when they default to "modern day Los Angeles" as their setting. Star Trek appears to be shot in the streets near where I live and that's not a good thing.

- The characters are completely flat and pointless. Examples include the tedious love interest among Rafi and Seven, & Agnes Jurari (who started out as a cerebral researcher at the beginning of season one only to turn into someone who delivers sassy quips. I wonder if the same writer is in charge of writing for the red head in Discovery because the characters seem very similar).

- Not nearly enough stuff going on in Space. Season one featured the likes of the Romulan reclamation site on a Borg cube, visits to various different planets etc. Season two features car chases on the streets of 21st century LA.

Ultimately, this is all down to terrible writing, which is down to bad hiring decisions by producers.

 

[Bobski]

Discovery and this are just pathetic. Fecking Enterprise and Scott Bakula blow them out of the water.

Agree with Dino about The Expanse, one of the best sci fi shows ever, I don't understand how people can be satisfied with New Trek with that as a comparison, or pretend that it is good.

 

[Mercurial]

Picard is as if they are milking an almost dead cash cow for a last pay day.

"New Trek" is a pale comparison to TNG, DS9, Voyager etc.

Picard season 2 started well amd.then went downhill fast. Its all very well that Paramount want to milk the Star Trek IP, but at the moment all they are doing is damaging it.

Also the Borg have gone from the most chilling species introduced in to Star Trek, to overexposed, overly used pantomime villian.

The two seasons of Stargate Universe were better than anything Discovery and Picard have put out combined. Yet a show like that got cancelled and this shadow of a scifi show continues.

Peak space based scifi show is now The Expanse. Foundation is a distant second and everything else trails behind in a galaxy far far away.

2 eps into foundation and its pretty nice so far. Expansion was just off the charts specially the fantastic space battles. As for trek, it's pretty much now the Orville.

 

[Bole Top]

nostalgia aside, S1 at best was "just" average to good. S2 is clearly worse than S1, which means rather underwhelming and even bad at times, but not to the point I'm going to give up - I will never to do that with any of the ST shows. Discovery gets criticized a lot, but Picard is pretty much the same thing, just with older and worse characters, even less space battles and no Klingons or any other familiar species. nostalgia is pretty much all Picard offers. fair enough if that was the intent from the start. S3 will bring even more old faces from TNG and could likely be the last time we saw Stewart in space. since I needed to wait about 17 years after Enterprise for another ST show, at this point I'm just grateful I'm even in position to watch three different ST shows in the same year.

it's easier to be pessimistic after Picard S2 and Discovery S4, but to me, Pike is actually the best captain after Sisko and Picard + he won't be in retirement age. if they aren't lazy with the writing and they stay away from time travel and anomalies, Strange New Worlds could actually be good.

 

[dinostar77]

The intent of SNW is to go back to trek storytelling of a hybrid of standalone epsiodes ala as done on TNG and some multipart overaching stories as told on DS9. Hopefully this will improve "new trek".

Personally not a fan of TOS era star trek, just not my thing, but will give SNW's a chance.

The Section 31 could be really good, especially if done right. If they went back to the original premise for Discovery with the show being an anthology and each season set in one of the eras of the trek shows we all know so well: TNG, DS9, Voyager, Enterprise, TOS.

Seeing how Section 31 behind the scenes influenced events portrayed in the shows could be really good, albeit expensive. I think thats why the original premise for discovery was dropped and why Bryan Fuller left. The very first epsiode of Discovery, is unlike the rest of the show that followed. Its a shame we wouldnt get to see Fullers idea on screen as it could have been awsome.

 

[SirAnderson]

About to start episode 7 of season 1 and I have enjoyed it. I been craving for some sci-fi space stuff, so it's served its purpose well so far. Some acting is a bit iffy here and there, but nothing too bad, and kind of see where the storyline is going, just a matter of seeing how they get there.

I do have the feeling that it will clearly end on a cliffhanger for season 2, which at least is about to end on the 5th of May so can binge that when its all out.

But again it seems to be the kind of series that will leave you hanging, and I expect season 2 to do the same, but will watch it regardless and then forget about it for a year or however long it takes for the next season to come out.

Also, glad its 10 episodes a season, instead of the 22 or 24 like some series, its just a good enough dose.

 

[Raoul]

Sadly, I found myself agreeing with most of the article.

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[Van Piorsing]

Sadly, I found myself agreeing with most of the article.

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Not be be too pessimistic, Jurati in latest episode gave us accurate representation of how Terminator's parody should look like.

Also, Rios looks like having a blast in the past.

 

[Raoul]

Not be be too pessimistic, Jurati in latest episode gave us accurate representation of how Terminator's parody should look like.

Also, Rios looks like having a blast in the past.

I'm fascinated at how they've somehow managed to ruin so many characters with trashy writing.

 

[Van Piorsing]

I'm fascinated at how they've somehow managed to ruin so many characters with trashy writing.

This gotta be most isolated story I've watched so far. They've basically trapped entire Star Trek in matrix... as for now hoping for a holodeck explanation and none of it happened. (Won't be surpised if the show will actually try to do this to save some of it's lore in season 3.)

 

[Bobski]

Sadly, I found myself agreeing with most of the article.

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Yes, mean spirited, nihilistic, obsessed with deconstructing characters and themes and repositioning them against the current social and political environment. It is badly written, you might be able to make interesting stories in that setting if the writing was up to scratch but it is woeful, part(badly done) pastiche of Marvel quips, GOT style attempts at shocking twists(badly done) extreme violence(badly done) . Look at the Expanse, having actual talented writers involved with the show, how it all meshed together beautifully, characters, action, overarching story lines, social-political commentary.

 

[Norman Brownbutter]

So I just finished the latest episode, Mercy.

Spoiler

And its as bad as all the rest. Fake drama, nonsense conversation and a back story for a character that turned out to do nothing but create a door so that he could open it for them...Wit???

Seriously, what was the point of that guy? Hes super into alien hunting because he saw vulcans as a kid. No one else is bothered about aliens except this guy. He even gets fired for yet another wild goose chase. So this is the only guy who would have investigated them. Yet not Guinan is rapping some shit about "that happened(seeing Vulcans as a kid) so this could happen(he lets them go)"? That would have made sense if he was going to help them going forward, but hes not. Hes fired and now hes off to pastures new. If he didnt see the Vulcans as a kid, there would be no need to let them go as no one was looking for them except for the guy who saw aliens as a kid. So the real point of this guy was really just to drag this fecking bullshit story out. Thats his only purpose.

 

[choccy77]

I'm fascinated at how they've somehow managed to ruin so many characters with trashy writing.

I watched the latest episode yesterday and I literally was thinking how everything is all over the place and how is it, that every single character, is in such a bad place. Even the cop they met is messed up.

Since Logan, it seems, all these new show's are taking on this formula and running with it for no real reason, other than it worked ONCE.

 

[choccy77]

So I just finished the latest episode, Mercy.

Spoiler

And its as bad as all the rest. Fake drama, nonsense conversation and a back story for a character that turned out to do nothing but create a door so that he could open it for them...Wit???

Seriously, what was the point of that guy? Hes super into alien hunting because he saw vulcans as a kid. No one else is bothered about aliens except this guy. He even gets fired for yet another wild goose chase. So this is the only guy who would have investigated them. Yet not Guinan is rapping some shit about "that happened(seeing Vulcans as a kid) so this could happen(he lets them go)"? That would have made sense if he was going to help them going forward, but hes not. Hes fired and now hes off to pastures new. If he didnt see the Vulcans as a kid, there would be no need to let them go as no one was looking for them except for the guy who saw aliens as a kid. So the real point of this guy was really just to drag this fecking bullshit story out. Thats his only purpose.

HAHA yeah its just a mess.

 

[FrankDrebin]

Alex Kurtzman is a hack bald fraud.

 

[Withnail]

It could do with more flashbacks and dream sequences

 

[Amir]

I'm 20 minutes into this week's episode, and it's so bad I'm already reading the latests posts in this thread.

 

[Reditus]

Up to episode 8 now

I actually was enjoying this season up to about the 4th episode but jaysus it’s gone south

 

[lilcurt]

Another episode with no space... This really isn't what Star Trek fans sign up for, is it?

I don't really get the point of any of this. Back in the day this whole series would have been a single episode and even then not the best received. You just know the payoff isn't going to be worth it.

 

[Big Andy]

Just catching up after missing last weeks and the week before episodes.
Wish I hadn’t bothered.

I grew up watching TNG whenever I stayed at my grandmas and her neighbour used to tape it for me and I’d watch them religiously.

Whatever I’m watching now, just isn’t Star Trek, it’s not even set in space ffs.

They should’ve had S3 as the second season, bring everyone back for a final hurrah, and call it quits.

Also, Young Picard is a complete jug eared fanny

 

[Norman Brownbutter]

If only we had known. The key to defeating the borg was staring us in the face the whole time. We just had to be friends...feck off show.

This might actually be worse that the screaming moron who stopped space flight in Disco. The borg, all the years of "...is irrelevant!" to be undone in the end by the simple question "What if we just asked people to join us instead assimilating them?". What happened to all that not being able to reason or negotiate or anything? You know, that stuff that made them an actual terrifying threat?

 

[WPMUFC]

I don't know if redlettermedia are saving up the episodes for a big video or they've hit the depression spiral and there's just no more words for a show this broken

Nu-trek is the Manchester United of TV??

 

[Van Piorsing]

I don't know if redlettermedia are saving up the episodes for a big video or they've hit the depression spiral and there's just no more words for a show this broken

Nu-trek is the Manchester United of TV??

Mike still probably been drinking to his uncalled feud with William Shatner, as for United, Jay Bauman looks more like Juan Mata at times than Rios.

On a serious note, I do hope Mike will torment Rich into watching new episodes.

 

[Hoof the ball]

Funny thing is, the Star Trek parody The Orville ended up becoming more Star Trek than the Star Trek shows!