I don’t think that’s what he’s saying at all. He’s saying he can’t be a lone 6 hence why you play him in a double pivot. He isn’t saying we need a midfield destroyer next him hence why he didn’t play one with him at Ajax.
Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap
- Thread starter davidmichael
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
- Status
The only time I can remember it happening in the last 4 years was Fred and Dan James. AWB, Maguire, Fernandes, Telles, VDB, Cavani, Sancho, Varane, all joined at much later times than necessary.
No way
Take a look at my post above. Signing FdJ on his own will just be another Pogba situation.
Are you some kind of resident party pooper. First you complained about us making deals too late (on 14th of June), then you complain nobody is looking at De Jong. What's next?
Oh I see @pocco is battling you for that role actually.
And Dalot, the very same summer we signed Fred. Then Wan-Bissaka and Sancho were both done and came latee due to international commitments and injury, don’t try it! In fact, Varane was pretty much agreed for ages, with the World Cup then subsequent holiday being the only delay. He never began pre-season with Real Madrid.
And let’s be serious about VDB/Cavani who were signed during the pandemic in a summer with no pre-season anyway. VDB was even signed in time to play in our behind closed doors pre-season game anyway.
Yes, I almost mentioned Pogba, would probably end up being a very similar situation
Why, for stating facts?
Yeah, yeah, for stating facts..
FDJ is coming in time for our preseason.
So are Timber and Antony.
The preseason will be done with great care, concentration and conscientiousness.
Ten Hag is no hag.
So are Timber and Antony.
The preseason will be done with great care, concentration and conscientiousness.
Ten Hag is no hag.
Straight from ETH's mouth. Unless you know better?
WUM more like
So ETH said it will be another Pogba situation?
At this point it'd be typical that we end up not getting him and struggle throughout the summer.
Not many clubs could afford his fee+wage, there are only a few:
Real Madrid - they are overloaded with top class midfielders already, they don’t need him
PSG - Perhaps having renew Mbappe mega contract, they may not be able to get away with the rules with another big signing? They also have Varatti to play similar role
City - They already have plenty of good baller/playmaker in midfield, all they need is a backup ball winner for Rodri, and to replace Fernandinho
Liverpool - Doesn’t seem what they need. Plus they already spend 100m euros in Nunez, and they already have Thiago, Fabinho, Henderson
Chelsea - Doesn’t seem fit their style of play. Plus they already have Jorginho, Kante, Mount, Kovacic, there is no immediate need for him
Bayern - They have Kimmich and Goretaka, don’t think he will be their priority. Plus they will need to find replacement (Mane?) for Lewandowski. However, I could see they might do a swap move with Lewandowski and FDJ, given that if Bayern is willing to spend big on him (which I doubt)
Juventus - They will get Pogba instead
Last edited:
Except you are taking it out of context, yes noone is claiming that de Jong can play as a sole 6, however that does not convert into we must have a DM destroyer. ETH didnt play him that way, and Ajax dont play that way. Will we need someone to play in a double pivot with him? Of course, thats not the same thing though.
No doubt that we need a DM in addition to FDJ, we always knew we needed two midfielders. It would look beyond awful if we failed to get him in at this stage, after prioritising this deal and playing the "willing to pursue other targets" card despite the alternative being Neves who we now know would cost a similar figure.
I don't care how good of a coach ETH is, if Mctominay is a starter next season we are going to struggle to finish in the top 6.
I don't care how good of a coach ETH is, if Mctominay is a starter next season we are going to struggle to finish in the top 6.
Sancho was signed a year late. Cavani was signed on deadline day, the most obvious panic buy ever. If you think in general most of our signings have been swiftly negotiated so they've all had a good pre-season and are settled within our fully-prepared squad at the start of the season, that is just pure crap.
Maybe because De Jong`s agent have told other clubs that he already promised Ten Hag to come.
Pogba needed a partner to hold and cover and ETH said FdJ needs the same. He's explained pretty well what the issue is with FdJ, read the article in The Athletic that I posted and you will see that Barca had the same issues. If you look at the post I quoted from @Sparky Rhiwabon it was in relation to the need for another midfielder.
There just aren't many clubs around with money to spend on big transfers.
The only clubs likely to spend £60m+ on a transfer at the moment are Liverpool, City, United, Chelsea, PSG and Real Madrid. Transfers are now planned out well in advance and even these teams are likely to only sign 1-2 players at this value per window. Liverpool have signed Nunez, City have signed Haaland, PSG have renewed Mbappe and Real Madrid have signed Tchouameni. All of those clubs are pretty stacked in midfield and likely didn't think Frenkie De Jong would be available.
Lots of big clubs are struggling with short term finances for signings and can only afford small fees or loans with purchase options. Think Juve, Milan, Inter, Barca and even Spurs to a degree.
We are benefitting from this and having a relatively clear run at FDJ. I'm sure plenty of these clubs would like to sign him but other positions, renewals and making loans permanent have been more important to these clubs this window.
Nobody mentioned a 'DM Destroyer'.
I think anybody understands what he meant by a a 'proper DM', it's basically interchangeable with no.6 i.e. somebody that will sit deep in midfield. It could be a Carrick, Kante, Busquets, etc.
The good old "United has to pay 100M no matter what player fee"?
Sancho wasn’t signed a ‘year late’ ffs. What does that even mean? So if we sign Bellingham on the opening day of the window next summer he counts as a ‘late’ signing because he was ‘three years too late’ due to wanting to sign him initially?
And what I think is irrelevant, the facts speak for themselves. You’re just being a drama queen like most on here. Several of our signings feature on pre-season for us, and others are delayed due to international football. The window doesn’t end for everyone in July, except Manchester United, who are apparently the only club who is still working in August. We do our business at no different a speed to any other club. We also target a different calibre of player to most other clubs. People moaning that Spurs have done business already. I presume if they were trying to sign Frenkie De Jong instead of Djed fecking Spence, things would be the same.
I was always one to moan at how long our transfers take but even for my standards, our fans have hit new heights.
Pre season tour is 8th July, so we still have 3 weeks to get signings, I dont get why everyone is so riled up so early on.
All I see is, Spurs signing players, City, Liverpool and talking about their targets. City been working on Haaland since January.
People need to calm down a little, so what if other clubs have signed players, thats good on them. As long as we get a couple before pre season, it makes 0 difference.
If we bring a defensive minded midfielder then ideally we need to pair him with a player like De Jong, if we bring someone like De Jong we need to bring a defensive minded midfielder. The reality is that we lack three things a game breaker, a game manager and a defensively sound midfielder. There is no point arguing that we can't do this or that, that signing x will be like signing y. We need more than one profile in 100% of scenarios, we just need to pick a direction because it will inform the next.
It’s only a matter of time.
I dont have a subscription on Athletic. I'm sure ETH knows how he'll use him and who's best to partner him and if needed will push or ask for another midfielder. Of course it will be a problem if we get only De Jong in midfield. We can talk about the black scenarios like that all day long.
Come on now. You know we can only focus on one deal at a time
We were negotiating with Sancho the previous Summer, constant stories saying we are in talks but can't agree a fee. Same as Frenkie now. We didn't get it over the line so we signed him a year later. That's what a year late means. Same with Fernandes, we had half a season of near relegation form because we had the likes of Pereria as our number 10 because we couldn't get Fernandes over the line. We aren't in talks for Bellingham nor are we anything to do with him other than the BS rumours you could apply to endless midfielders. Bad example.
The facts speak for themselves, you're right: Maguire, Fernandes, Varane, Cavani, Telles all made their debut for us in a competitive game because we didn't get them in before pre-season. I know there are (fewer) examples on the contrary, just like there are lots of signings under Fergie that took months and that take other clubs months. But it happens far too often that it takes far too long and the facts are there to back that up. And we haven't even touched upon those signings that don't ever happen despite long drawn out talks.
You're right about me sounding like a drama queen, as we could announce De Jong in 2 weeks time and he'd get a decent pre-season with us. But my initial post was not hysterical, just that we've been here before where we either sign him unnecessarily late or not at all. And we 100% have.
This fanbase is just a little brainwashed by the whole financial side of things. Fair enough Maguire would take weeks as the quoted fee of £75m was far too much. But we just signed him anyway for £80m when we could have got him earlier and a full pre-season. The price for De Jong at the moment is fair but it's clearly our policy to draw it out, which from a footballing perspective makes no sense. Fans are brainwashed that it's necessary from a financial point of view.
Absolute joke of a team. They are interested in Bernardo Silva who will set them back by 90 millions Euro at least. Then they want Lewandowski and are linked to several other high profile players.
I think 70+15 euros gets it done.
Couldn't agree more,there is much different terminology now,6,8,double pivot but football doesn't change much,you need a strong midfield to be successful and in that win you need a ball winner who can protect the defence but must be able to pass a ball and a box to box creative player.
Bryan Robson used to love playing with Ray Wilkins because Ray would hold his position while Robbo could push up.
Ray wasn't a great tackler,Robbo was far better but Ray could win the ball by intercepting and anticipating,he had the ability to start attacks with his passing.
We haven't had the balance for some years now,De Jong could be the start of it but he can't do it on his own
I've confirmation De jong, Antony, Timber are done with Dumfries set to be completed soon. The current reporting in the media are all a charade to heighten expectations.
Hey am just a poster .....hahahaha.
Hey am just a poster .....hahahaha.
Not signing Sancho when his price was 120m but signing him when it dropped to 75m is not signing him a ‘year late’. As for Bruno, clearly we were not sure of the player initially, as reported. We then also lost Pogba to injury, but I don’t recall us locked in negotiations with Sporting but failing to sign him the summer before.
My point with Bellingham is that clearly we tried to sign him when he left Birmingham. We may sign him still one day, it won’t be a late signing.
You can name players who made their debut in a competitive game (which I perceive is something exclusive to Manchester United because the window ends for everyone else in July), but even post-Fergie - at least half of our signings are signed in time for a full pre-season. I cannot see that this is fewer than any other club. Ultimately, I don’t see us moving slower than anyone else, or missing out on players more than anyone else. The market is the market.
Stop being silly.
I agree with this and I think we will sign a couple others. Maybe Eriksen and sangare
Cool, that's all I meant by it being another Pogba situation. The Athletic article i linked is free to view I think, I don't have a subscription either but it opens for me.
should also be noted that Marti is Tier 3 on /r/barca
- Status