Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach | Thread locked during matches

As a wise man once said, the shit smells worst right before the flush.

Amorim has come in in exceptional circumstances - just like the last bloke to lose 5 in 10 in 1932.

The last three performances have been unacceptable, which is frustrating because I genuinely thought we didn't look shit versus Arsenal (especially 1st half) and we definitely deserved to win vs City, who may also be dreadful at the moment, but to dominate(ish) at the Etihad is progress in my book.

At the very least, the main issue is blindingly obvious - set fecking pieces, both attack and defence. If anything is going to cost him his job, it's that.
 
freddie the red said:
Yet again there's a whole host of posters losing their minds and harking back to a time pre Amorim and thinking he's the problem. Thankfully there's still a few who get what the plan was with him prior to his appointment and what should be the on-going plan with him in situ.
The club has had a decade of poor recruitment, has had to deal with a host of individuals who have disgraced themselves with their deeds and attitudes and we arrived at "end of ten Hag" in a right mess.
The idea that the problem is the new manager is preposterous.
A supporter since '67, nearer 70 than 60, on the cusp of giving up on the club if the kept Greenwood or sold out to blood money, I will be done if they sack Amorim before he can turn over most of this lot and get in players in his own image.
If he gets that time and then fails then fair enough but if the club blinks before then I'm out.
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I actually want to know which posters think Amorim is specifically "the problem" and that he needs to be sacked or isn't the right guy. Just out of curiosity more than anything else
 
If we revert back to a 4231 Amorim is done and we are fully back in the 2 seasons of mediocrity, manager sacked, another 300m spent, ground hog day.

Someone has to take a decisive decision to implement a style of play and a system over a medium to long term. The reality is this season doesn’t matter, next season doesn’t matter. Every team who has gone on long term successive winning seasons has had a number of back to back growing pain seasons to get there.

Arsenal who are light years ahead of us in the process are still miles off winning a title.
Chelsea have spent 1.5 billion and been a laughing stock for what 3/4 seasons? And only now are begining to look like it’s coming to something.
Liverpool spent decades doing what we are doing now and was only until klopp had multiple seasons to implement his take on the club they became what they are now.
City spent their way to the top yes but it didn’t happen overnight there was a lot of trial and error.

If someone can point to a club that has been down in the dumps, changed a manager and suddenly became an instant juggernaut without any changes id like to know about it.
 
Oo0AahCantona said:
If we revert back to a 4231 Amorim is done and we are fully back in the 2 seasons of mediocrity, manager sacked, another 300m spent, ground hog day.

Someone has to take a decisive decision to implement a style of play and a system over a medium to long term. The reality is this season doesn’t matter, next season doesn’t matter. Every team who has gone on long term successive winning seasons has had a number of back to back growing pain seasons to get there.

Arsenal who are light years ahead of us in the process are still miles off winning a title.
Chelsea have spent 1.5 billion and been a laughing stock for what 3/4 seasons? And only now are begining to look like it’s coming to something.
Liverpool spent decades doing what we are doing now and was only until klopp had multiple seasons to implement his take on the club they became what they are now.
City spent their way to the top yes but it didn’t happen overnight there was a lot of trial and error.

If someone can point to a club that has been down in the dumps, changed a manager and suddenly became an instant juggernaut without any changes id like to know about it.
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Exactly
 
elmo said:
Maz played mainly at RCB under Amorim. Not sure what you’ve been watching.
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Wow, Elmo. You found a mistake. Nice job. Do you have a solution to our crap situation, or are you just out to deconstruct? (You are right about the RCB though - It would be Mazraoui-Maguire-Martinez then, and that would leave us with Mainoo in the pivot again. Damn.)
 
RDCR07 said:
And that’s you supporting the manager?
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Mate why are you so sensitive? I’m not allowed to have my own opinion?
All i’ve said is that I don’t think he will be get better results than EtH. That doesn’t mean I don’t support him this season and no, it also doesn’t mean I can’t call myself a fan. Stop gatekeeping.
 
VP89 said:
I actually want to know which posters think Amorim is specifically "the problem" and that he needs to be sacked or isn't the right guy. Just out of curiosity more than anything else
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We don't know, but I don't think he is the problem. He is probably a very good manager but unproven in the PL. Is he better than Iraola, Frank, and Silva? We don't know but a lot of fans think Amorim is Fergie 2.0 based on what he achieved in Portugal. If he needs 5-6 quality signings to make his magical system work you could say the same about Silva and Frank.
 
Even if we get relegated I'm fully behind Amorim who is sticking by his principles and is an intelligent man and is not shitting the bed and reverting to counter attack 4231 football. The predicament is not his fault, it's ineos and ten hag for putting us in this mess. None of these players are his players, Rangnick had the same problem turning up mid season and the players of Ole didn't want to work for his 4222 system and many judged Rangnick to be a terrible manager off the back of his interim role when he had no pre season and none of his own signings.

The only mistakes amorim has made is team selection and ignoring the fact we played best when we played zirkee as a false 9 and rashford up top. The cards he's been dealt with is some of the worst, none of ten hag signings are any value to the club after spending a tune of 600 million. Shame on those who wrote letters to ineos begging him to stay through the summer
 
JE-365 said:
He’s forced to come now not in the summer. The board should have known that Amorim plays 3421 system but we don’t have wingbacks and we have wingers who shouldn’t be playing as no 10. In addition, we have below average strikers. Somehow, they still forced him to come now rather than in summer to play this 3421 system. The board better has some plan to give him at least wingbacks and striker in January.
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Precisely.
 
The club are building from the ground up, I expect to see us as a selling club for a few seasons to build up money and clear debts.
Similar to how City done it buying all the youth players and selling them for big fees.
Amorim has inherited a decent team, who on their day can beat anyone, it just seems that they cant gel and work together.
Our transfer business has been poor for years now and we need to improve the squad.

On a positive note, we only need 6 wins to be safe this season from relegation.
 
Fully behind him lots of the players make terrible decisions

One thing that gets on my nerves is the wide players ALWAYS check back

After one minute under Amorim we saw the benefit of taking men on & delivering early (amad to MR)

Yesterday amad, our best player ATM, checked back a few times when the rasmus early ball was on
Dalot & co always do it
Garnacho lost the ball for the second goal checking back

Wolves put in early crosses & nearly scored a few times

Hope Amorim sorts this
 
We've had a lot of players come in since Rangnick made those open heart surgery comments.

Onana
Malacia De Ligt Martinez Yoro Mazraoui
Casemiro Eriksen Ugarte Mainoo Mount
Hojlund, Zirkzee, Amad Garnacho Antony

All gone
Fred, McTom, Martial, AWB, De Gea, Varane, Sancho, Donny, Elanga, Bailly, Pogba, Matic, Cavani, Mata, Ronaldo, Lingard and many more like Henderson...


Lindelof, Shaw, Rashford not featuring.

Dalot and Bruno remain from his time. Maguire had been phased out but has done ok coming back.

Not saying that's how to do it or spend but it's a total gutting in three windows costing 600m with some new from the u21 that needs another total gutting.
 
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How must Amorim feel. He gone from managing a top side, one that competes at top level in CL to this utter disaster.

As fans we must have patience with this man. He has proven that he is top class. Our players have proven, multiple times that they are losers. The likes of Rashford, Bruno, Maguire, Dalot have all underperformed for years and been part of sides losing 7-0 at Anfield plus more.

This season is yet another write off. ETH big problem in my opinion was accepting these players couldn’t do it. He not wrong but these players will fail you. Amorim must force these players to show they cannot do it and therefore must be sold. We will have to suffer before the light appears but those who come through will benefit from understanding systems and those that dont will be on their arse.

Of course some fan will always be impatient and seem more so online than in OT. We must absolutely back Amorim, until this worthless bunch of overrated frauds are gone.
 
Cathy Ferguson said:
We don't know, but I don't think he is the problem. He is probably a very good manager but unproven in the PL. Is he better than Iraola, Frank, and Silva? We don't know but a lot of fans think Amorim is Fergie 2.0 based on what he achieved in Portugal. If he needs 5-6 quality signings to make his magical system work you could say the same about Silva and Frank.
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Iraola won 1 of his first 10 at Bournemouth.
A year ago he was odds on for the sack.

Silva & Frank are Moyes level managers.
 
freddie the red said:
Yet again there's a whole host of posters losing their minds and harking back to a time pre Amorim and thinking he's the problem. Thankfully there's still a few who get what the plan was with him prior to his appointment and what should be the on-going plan with him in situ.
The club has had a decade of poor recruitment, has had to deal with a host of individuals who have disgraced themselves with their deeds and attitudes and we arrived at "end of ten Hag" in a right mess.
The idea that the problem is the new manager is preposterous.
A supporter since '67, nearer 70 than 60, on the cusp of giving up on the club if the kept Greenwood or sold out to blood money, I will be done if they sack Amorim before he can turn over most of this lot and get in players in his own image.
If he gets that time and then fails then fair enough but if the club blinks before then I'm out.
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The fact that the club didn't realise that any manager can win a cup. I know some will argue, but get the right draws and a bit of luck and you win a cup. Roberto Di Matteo won the CL. That shouldn't have come into the equation as to whether keeping ETH was a good idea. Instead they kept him, let him spend more of our slender transfer kitty and lo and behold ended up sacking him. Best thing would have been bringing Amorin to the club in the summer, or let Ruud carry on until this summer, have Amorin in place and do some bloody proper planning. This season is a write off unless we can somehow win the EL. They have to be discussing with the manager who he wants out and set the wheels in motion not let the players go off on holiday and then start scrabbling about. Tell whoever isn't wanted at the end of the season and help them find other clubs.
 
Dolf said:
Mate why are you so sensitive? I’m not allowed to have my own opinion?
All i’ve said is that I don’t think he will be get better results than EtH. That doesn’t mean I don’t support him this season and no, it also doesn’t mean I can’t call myself a fan. Stop gatekeeping.
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Agree. You can not say that Amorim has improved United already. It is early days, but there are no signs that this will go better than under ETH. Will Amorim win something with United like ETH did? I doubt that. And of course it is allowed to have a different opinion than most United fans.

I hope for the best for Amorim, but I just can not see it happen.
 
We need to wait until Amroim gets some of his players in the door and has a few transfer windows to shape the team. He did warn there will be a storm. Its just terrible decision making at the top again and I actually feel for the manager he has inherited a mess. He is a very good manager and seems a lot more likeable than Ten Hag.

Unfortunately these amateur mistakes will continue as long as The Glazer family own the club. We have been making the same mistake since Ferguson. Sack a manager but then hire one with a completely different playing philosophy from the next. Its a viscous cycle. As much as everyone was excited with INEOs. They still have to clear everything with those American clowns. I noticed Joel Glazer was still part of the decision making process regarding Ten Hag. Unless we get a full takeover . The club will continue down this path
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Fully agree. Obviously easier said than done as our name, contracts etc all have a big impact. But intent is key - maybe we could reach the end goal by making 3-4 great signings every summer but I don’t know if were capable of acing each signing and somehow I feel a whole host of changes may make the whole mental reset more probable.

Let’s face it, it’s not just the fanbase. This team is mentally broken. They are suffering under the pressure and look a depressed unit (in footballing terms not personally). I don’t know it 3-4 signings that we usually do every summer can change that. It’s a deep rot that set in by being a constant disappointment for a club this huge globally.
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Chelsea did very well the other summer on the sales front - people didnt expect them to sell a lot of the players they did and it allowed big changes. For me at this moment in time, the only players I see in a first 11 are Mazroui, Yoro, Martinez, Ugarte, Mainoo, Diallo. Be a tall order to get a keeper, left back, midfielder, left sides forward and striker in of starting quality who are all hits rather than misses.

And we’ve dug our own hole. Onana, Casemiro, Mount, Zirkzee, Antony have cost us nigh on £300m over the last few years. You just cant spend that much money on that kind of output and quality. No wonder we are tight on FFP whilst looking so bad on the pitch
 
Jezpeza said:
Chelsea did very well the other summer on the sales front - people didnt expect them to sell a lot of the players they did and it allowed big changes. For me at this moment in time, the only players I see in a first 11 are Mazroui, Yoro, Martinez, Ugarte, Mainoo, Diallo. Be a tall order to get a keeper, left back, midfielder, left sides forward and striker in of starting quality who are all hits rather than misses.

And we’ve dug our own hole. Onana, Casemiro, Mount, Zirkzee, Antony have cost us nigh on £300m over the last few years. You just cant spend that much money on that kind of output and quality. No wonder we are tight on FFP whilst looking so bad on the pitch
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The big issue we have is buying average players hanging on to them too long so they become below average players and therefore worthless. We do not know when to sell when a player has a good value. That is one of the reasons we do not have enough money in the kitty. Chelsea can sell youth players for millions, we sell ours for peanuts. There is something badly wrong.
 
Oranges038 said:
Iraola won 1 of his first 10 at Bournemouth.
A year ago he was odds on for the sack.

Silva & Frank are Moyes level managers.
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Amorim has 2 wins out of 7 in the league and lost to Iraola at OT. The players are shit and prove this on a weekly basis. Way too early to say if Amorim has what it takes.
 
Cathy Ferguson said:
We don't know, but I don't think he is the problem. He is probably a very good manager but unproven in the PL. Is he better than Iraola, Frank, and Silva? We don't know but a lot of fans think Amorim is Fergie 2.0 based on what he achieved in Portugal. If he needs 5-6 quality signings to make his magical system work you could say the same about Silva and Frank.
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He's definitely not the problem - he's working it out and needs a bucket load of time to do it.

I just want to be clear with anyone claiming people want Amorim out or aren't giving him patience, that we should do all of this but fairly critique the team as they play the games.
 
Cathy Ferguson said:
Amorim has 2 wins out of 7 in the league and lost to Iraola at OT. The players are shit and prove this on a weekly basis. Way too early to say if Amorim has what it takes.
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So he's already done more that Iraola did in his first 10 games.

The talk about Iraola is reminding me of how people were sucking off Ange a year ago. It won't last.
 
Bruno stupidly getting sent off gives me flashbacks to the end of other managers reigns... seriously complacent decision making coupled with players getting frustrated like they've already given up.

I hope for Amorims sake though that in this instance it's a catalyst for a serious change of attitude & prominent personel in the playing squad.
 
JE-365 said:
He’s forced to come now not in the summer. The board should have known that Amorim plays 3421 system but we don’t have wingbacks and we have wingers who shouldn’t be playing as no 10. In addition, we have below average strikers. Somehow, they still forced him to come now rather than in summer to play this 3421 system. The board better has some plan to give him at least wingbacks and striker in January.
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It’s fairly amazing how more isn’t being said about this. It was lauded at the time but Amorim wanted to stay at sporting until the end of the season but was told it was now or never - in doing so there’s a real chance that even if he makes the summer he will have zero time next year and if we have a bad start to next season he’s done.
 
I think the best thing that could happen to you is to not be in Europe next year. He needs time.
 
Zico1982 said:
Hi Ruben

If you are reading this, you must be really desperate for a solution to your problems.

Nevertheless. Here is my suggestion, what you should do to prepare for the Newcastle game:

Stick with Onana. Yes. I know, but Bayindir was even worse. Talk him up. Force him to watch his best Serie A moments ten times a day to get his confidence back.

Rip Bruno of his Captainship and let him fight for his place. He does not deserve special treatment anymore.

Move Anthony to the LWB-position. He is the only left-foot with the attributes to potentially do well there. Make him cross till he drops in training.

Let Amad or Dalot play RWB. It is obvious, that Dalot is wasted on the left. The guy can´t cross with his left foot if his life depended on it. Let them cross till they drop in training. I prefer Amad, because he will try to beat a man. We are lacking that.

Mazraoui was really good at LCB. Move him back there. If it ain´t broke, don´t fix it.

Maguire and De Ligt are both good in the middle of the back three, but don´t play them elsewhere. They are slow and will get exposed. (Play both for the Liverpool game though, where we will stand deep. They are really good at dealing with crosses.)

Keep Yoro in for speed. He has not been that good, but he needs to play to get anywhere. There is a good player in there.

Ugarte is out. That is a problem. He fits your system almost as good as Hjulmand did at Sporting. Talk to him about taking too many risks though. He is collecting way too many yellows, and that is hurting us now.

Casemiro is slow, but he is still the best option to replace Ugarte for the Newcastle game. He is also an asset on corners.

Mainoo has lost his mojo this season, and should be benched for a while. With Bruno and Ugarte out, your first instinct will probably be to go with Eriksen. Don´t. He is too slow to defend the Newcastle/Liverpool midfield, and he is also needed elsewhere. Let Martinez play here for the Newcastle game, He can pass, and he can win back the ball, which is what we need. We really need to get a new player in for this position in the January window.

Eriksen should finally get to play at 10, setting the attacking players up. This is his best position, and he can still do real damage here. We only got control/composure, after Casemiro and Eriksen came on yesterday.

For the other AM-position it is a toss up. If you go with Dalot at RWB, I would play Amad here, but I would rather see Amad on RWB. That leaves you with Mainoo, Zirkzee and Garnacho. I really miss Mounts skillset here, but we have to do with the players available. I would start with Zirkzee and bring Garnacho on at some point.

Rasmus is our best and only 9. He is starving at the moment, and you could see his frustrations with the service yesterday. He was really mad at Mainoo and Amad for not getting it right on a couple of occasions in the first half. Michael Owen called the 9 at United for the most difficult striker position in the PL at the moment due to lack of service. I think he is right. Set Rasmus up, and he will score.

This would be my starting 11 for the Newcastle game:

Onana
Yoro-Maguire-Mazraoui
Amad-Casemiro-Martinez-Anthony
Eriksen-Zirkzee
Højlund

Thats it, Ruben. Now it´s up to you.
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Why not just play Zirkzee with Hojlund, Erikson behind and go 352? Zirkzee will naturally drop in anyway to link with the midfield.

Not a United fan, but I honestly believe that's the way to go. Perhaps Mainoo in for Eriksen
 
United needs a massive rebuild. There is only 4-6 players to keep and out of these lot, 50% or more deserve to be bench or rotational players. Who deserves to be in the XI? Is Amad a XI? I think rotational. Is Mainoo a XI? Rotational at best. Ugarte potential could be XI? Onana is definitely a bench player. De Ligt potential XI, Maguire likely a bench player. Yoro definitely a rotational player. Hoijund and Zirkzee, I don't rate both so Hoijund could be a bench player. The rest can all be sold, I don't really care and it include Bruno. Amorim has a tough job on his hand, I think he underestimated what is needed to bring this club back from the death. Rangnick should have stayed as consultant and made responsible to the overhaul instead of giving ETH a say in the transfer. ETH really set us back 3 years with his massive spending on mediocre talents like Antony, Onana, Hoijund, Casemiro, Martinez, Malacia, Mount and etc.
 
Rúben is being given a free pass on a lot of the things Ten Hag was criticised for and I honestly believe that the sole reason is that one has hair and the other doesn’t.
 
VP89 said:
I think even he'll tell you that didn't mean to expect losing 3 on the bounce.
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I think it means getting the team to adjust to the new tactics, even if that means sacrificing some points - which is all that's happening.

The overreaction is crazy. Trust the process.
 
I'm struggling to get my head round the fact that people want him to change course to apparently suit the players we have, absolutely 100%no.

Frothing at the mouth to get rid of EtH then after less than 2 months questioning a new highly rated manager who will stick to his principles (something the old manager was slaughtered for not doing) and has repeatedly said there will be a storm but some of you can't handle it.

It really does feel like 1989,when we were struggling really badly and Fergie was in the process of implementing a cultural change and there was dissent everywhere attendances dropped, the new management team are trying to do the same, before anyone jumps on me for comparing him to Fergie I'm not, I'm just trying to get across the fact that huge changes are needed and that's what the club is trying to do and Amorim is their man to do it.
None of us enjoy watching the team lose every week but we have to get behind the manager he will be backed to move players on no matter who they are I've no doubt about that,for now we just have to suck it up.
 
I get that Amorim has his own preferred style but do we need to continue this "experiment" for another twenty league games? It's abundantly clear that it isn't working, the players do not suit the system, the results are suggesting a bottom half finish and confidence is being sapped with every passing second. Wingers are not wing backs, we cannot defend, we've kept one clean sheet in ten games and don't look like being capable of seeing a game out. Is it blind stubbornness to continue with this when it's clear that the players just aren't suitable and/or good enough? Or do you continue in the hope that some sort of reverse Space Jam happens and suddenly Andre Onana becomes a talented goalkeeper, Luke Shaw becomes the fittest man on the planet and Bruno Fernandes becomes a footballer and not a petty irritant? I don't think it's long, if it hasn't started already, till the media are on his back and questioning Amorim, his tactics and the results. Once that happens, he's facing a losing battle, regardless of what the fans think.

It's all well and good saying that we should wait till Amorim gets his own team but realistically, his own team probably takes closer to 3-4 years rather than the next two transfer windows. It's easy to say that he needs to sign players but as a part of that, we need to move players on. Ratcliffe is more interested in cutting Lynne in accounts' pay and will be charging her the electric to sit at her computer soon, we are quite unlikely to see him releasing and paying up players, I just don't see it happening, therefore, you need teams to take on the underperforming players that we have. Can you honestly see anybody paying Onana what we are? A queue of clubs to take on Shaw? Anyone remotely interested in the waste of space that is Antony? And don't even get me started on the enigma that is Lisandro Martinez and Casualty body double Mason Mount.

I like what Amorim has said and I like him but I do think it is fair that he is held accountable as much as everybody else is.

Ultimately, the club is broken, the Glazers still linger like a bad smell, they've been mightily clever and INEOS are their frontmen and INEOS themselves have come in and acted like a circus. Onfield, we are where we are after years of mismanagement and we now have a manager who won't/cannot change his system and pick up results.
 
sugar_kane said:
Rúben is being given a free pass on a lot of the things Ten Hag was criticised for and I honestly believe that the sole reason is that one has hair and the other doesn’t.
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He'll rightly get more leeway. Ten Hag was criticized because he wasted a lot of our money on expensive duds and for his inability to get a tune out of the squad after 2 full seasons. He has been here 10 games, it's but obvious that he'd need more time to implement his style of football.

Yes, in the the meantime results are important too and we shouldn't get too far behind. Pressure is an odd thing and I am not sure that our bunch misfits will be able to handle it if we keep losing games and are in a relegation scrap.
 
NicolaSacco said:
I think the best thing that could happen to you is to not be in Europe next year. He needs time.
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We don’t look capable of reaching European qualification places anyway; however, I totally agree with you. This is especially true if we try to clear the decks and ship more players out than we bring in. Operating with a small squad without European football and plenty of time on the training pitch.
 
Oranges038 said:
So he's already done more that Iraola did in his first 10 games.

The talk about Iraola is reminding me of how people were sucking off Ange a year ago. It won't last.
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Our players might be poor but are certainly better than what Iraola had when he started.

Are you happy with what Amorim has done so far? Any successful tactical changes you want to highlight?

My take is that the board must now back Amorim in the next 3 windows so that he can implement his 3421. The decision has been made. Way way too early to say if he will succeed. ETH was also successful in a minor league and so far Amorim hasn’t done anything special in my opinion.
 
Oo0AahCantona said:
If we revert back to a 4231 Amorim is done and we are fully back in the 2 seasons of mediocrity, manager sacked, another 300m spent, ground hog day.

Someone has to take a decisive decision to implement a style of play and a system over a medium to long term. The reality is this season doesn’t matter, next season doesn’t matter. Every team who has gone on long term successive winning seasons has had a number of back to back growing pain seasons to get there.

Arsenal who are light years ahead of us in the process are still miles off winning a title.
Chelsea have spent 1.5 billion and been a laughing stock for what 3/4 seasons? And only now are begining to look like it’s coming to something.
Liverpool spent decades doing what we are doing now and was only until klopp had multiple seasons to implement his take on the club they became what they are now.
City spent their way to the top yes but it didn’t happen overnight there was a lot of trial and error.

If someone can point to a club that has been down in the dumps, changed a manager and suddenly became an instant juggernaut without any changes id like to know about it.
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Great post!

Sacrificing the system and style of play to get decent results in the short term won't lead to long term success where we're challenging for league titles. When will some fans learn?
 
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