this is worse than RR.
Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach | Thread locked during matches
- Thread starter sewey89
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Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) discuss United's fantastic win away against Athletic Club in the semi-final of the Europa League.
They also pick out the positives of United's 4-3 loss away at Brentford, and Nik reviews a day out at Old Trafford watching Manchester United Women qualify for the Champions League.
So we just keep losing matches until we learn rather than adapt to the strengths of the team?
Yeah that's the thing. People are still treating us losing to Brighton as some unacceptable result but they are clearly more well drilled in their own system, more athletic, and far more dangerous in the final third. It's not rocket science why we look second best.
This thread should be closed during games. In saying that, I'm really disappointed with that result, these unforced errors keep rearing their ugly heads and doesn't look like he can iron them out.
So what are the strengths of the team?
This club is finished anyway. Doesn't matter who is in charge.
Just stick with him and see what happens.
Just stick with him and see what happens.
Conte who's often described wrongly as dogmatic has moved consistently between formations depending on the team he has.
Amorim hasn't invented football to insist on one formation so early in his career.
Amorim hasn't invented football to insist on one formation so early in his career.
I get that we don’t have the players to be challenging for trophies, but I do not believe for one minute that this squad can’t get comfortably into the top half.
Brighton isn’t a team of stars or world class players, but as a team they seem to know what they’re doing.
Whether it’s lack of quality players, shortage of time on the training ground, the owners, or the previous managers, we’re soon going to run out of excuses.
Ruben simply has to be getting a better tune out of this squad.
Brighton isn’t a team of stars or world class players, but as a team they seem to know what they’re doing.
Whether it’s lack of quality players, shortage of time on the training ground, the owners, or the previous managers, we’re soon going to run out of excuses.
Ruben simply has to be getting a better tune out of this squad.
The formation being the issue is a somewhat lazy take. Conte and Tuchel have had success playing similar systems. Amorims 3-4-3 is just a variation of the current meta top teams implement. Inverting full backs, creating a box midfield and 5 attackers.
The issue is the players weren't good enough under Ten Hag and aren't good enough now. Our owners have no money and we can't sell players. I think Amorim is great but he isn't a miracle worker. He needs backing.
The issue is the players weren't good enough under Ten Hag and aren't good enough now. Our owners have no money and we can't sell players. I think Amorim is great but he isn't a miracle worker. He needs backing.
Wingers, a number 10 in Bruno. Players used to a back 4. Clearly not this formation, we can’t just keep losing games like this.
We need some insanely good summer transfer window or he is done by Christmas.
You think WINGERS are a strength of this team? Christ
Every game we get overrun in midfield. Something’s got to give as the current set up is just not working with this set of players.
If we are fine with finishing outside top 10 come the end of the season, then keep going this way without any recruitment. If Ineos wants to show they mean business and drag us to where we belong, then they have to find a way to get the manager some new players this window.
If we are fine with finishing outside top 10 come the end of the season, then keep going this way without any recruitment. If Ineos wants to show they mean business and drag us to where we belong, then they have to find a way to get the manager some new players this window.
Great, let’s hope he gets a tune out of Antony, Onana, Hojlund, and Zirkzee then. Or if he can’t, let’s get a guy in who definitely can, otherwise this is all a waste of time.
Players look lost and the manager looks lost. We're going backwards.
This is the kicker for me — how are we playing with 5 defenders; an uninspiring/safe midfield duo of Mainoo and Ugarte, and still conceding like crazy?
Amorim is somewhat hamstrung by the selection of players he has at his disposal, but if he’s married to playing 3atb he HAS to be playing with the best possible options as wingbacks.
Why?
In the league the difference between sticking with his plan this season or abandoning it will be a midtable finish versus a worse midtable finish. And that's if we imagine changing formation magically provides short term improvement, which isn't in any way guaranteed given the players were bad in the previous system too.
Winning the game today would have taken us from 13th to the giddy heights of 11th. That's how low the stakes are for us in the league for the rest of this season. So now is exactly the time to try improving on his actual plan rather than being pragmatic.
Oh right, so the team setup that seen Ten Hag sacked
No I mean what do you mean by people like me?
Many comments make the same mistake that we are making in Sevilla, the squad is rubbish on every side of the pitch... they don't play as a team and there are no decisive players! United hasn't been United for a decade, I'm sorry but that's what I think! I've been a die-hard fan since I was 20 and I'm 38 and I don't miss a single game! The team stinks, if you throw out Amorin another one will come who will do the same.
Why? Because we keep losing games at OT.
We knew we’d have to put up with a huge storm. I get losing to every bang average team at home is difficult to take, but we have to give this guy a number of years. He’s inherited a dogshit team.
Well fecking 3-4-2-1 isn’t fecking working is it?
I think he's gone this season, the majority of United's poor results has been heavily dependent on team selection.
I don't think the system is the fundamental issue, there have been instances in games where the ideas are very transparent but Amorims coaching ability to comprehend who's feasible for what position has been absolutely horrendous. He's mis-profiled several players across various positions and the only one he's got right has been Amad.
Also to clarify I don't think that Amorim deserves to be sacked and it's not entirely my will he goes even if United finish in a poor league position. But I can't see INEOS keeping him, the fact they haven't said anything about his tenure is confirmation. It's no different to when Sir Jim was asked on repeat occasions if he trusts Ten Hag and the silence spoke more loudly than anything else. Amorim will be sacked unless he improves results judging by the executives behaviour.
He's doing a poor job. EtH with a squad ruined by injuries did a better job. If his whole philosophy doesn't pan out he'll leave us in a bigger mess than any other manager has done before.
I'm of the opinion that losing games badly is not worth the psychological damage it does to a team no matter how much it may be because you try to switch to a system you like as a manager.
I know hindsight is 20/20 but there is something to be said for the more pragmatic approach LvG and Mou put on display. Even if some of the footie was terribly dull as a result. We need to stop the bleeding before we can heal.
I know hindsight is 20/20 but there is something to be said for the more pragmatic approach LvG and Mou put on display. Even if some of the footie was terribly dull as a result. We need to stop the bleeding before we can heal.
Ye it’s called rebuilding. That’s exactly what I suggest. We’ve been through managers and is hasn’t worked. People moaned when ETH changed his style, he shouldn’t need to. He’s not even had a transfer window where they’ve spent for him yet. And as for the formation not working, yes because 4-2-3-1 clearly worked under ETH where we was conceded over 20 shots every game and getting leathered 7-0 of our rivals. And explain how we was lucky to beat city? Game of 2 half, they edged the first and we completed controlled the 2nd half.
Has he got Amad “right”? Or is it just a case of our best player by some distance, showing he’s a good player?
The fact that he hasn't tried Garnacho at either WB spot is a bit annoying for me.
But other than that I'm not sure what obvious answer there is apart from throwing some Youth lottery tickets into the team.
People calling for Amorim to be sacked. Cop on ffs.
What's he supposed to do with this squad. People will say that he should change to a different formation to suit the players but they have proven they aren't much better in other set ups.
And we don't have money to spend so we will most likely have to keep some of these players meaning they have got to get used to the way Amorim wants to do things.
What's he supposed to do with this squad. People will say that he should change to a different formation to suit the players but they have proven they aren't much better in other set ups.
And we don't have money to spend so we will most likely have to keep some of these players meaning they have got to get used to the way Amorim wants to do things.
He needs to take accountability. As much as the squad isn't ideal, performances for he most part have been dreadful. We saw early indications of an "idea" but that has largely evaporated.
Oh right, let’s never play a formation which clearly suits the majority of teams and us with different tactics because one manager played them.
The squad is poor. But we don't have money to fix it. So where does this go
Every manager we have had, besides Ruud for the very few games he managed, does not seem to understand the importance of midfield. Just go with 2 DM's, this team cannot defend nor score enough goals to win games if we concede.
Brighton are only 9th themselves. They just have better players. We are so far behind the top 6 in the league, we're comfortably a bottom half side now.
It’s a big catch 22 because if he moves Amad deeper, he’s got nobody really to play in the right no.10. But then repeatedly playing two conventional fullbacks as wingbacks and expecting something different than what we see week in week out is a bit of insanity
What are Hojlund, Zirkzee, Antony, Onana, and Dalots strengths?
Too many of the forward players not good enough.
Full backs, wingers and strikers besides Amad all below the standards.
Full backs, wingers and strikers besides Amad all below the standards.
Again, so?
We suck. We're going to lose games regardless of what he does.
So what's the point of him being "pragmatic" and abandoning his plan, when the only potential upside in the league at least is a slightly better mid-table finish? It's not worth it when he's made clear it would come at long term cost.
Our approach has been different when playing against the top sides, but when we're expected to take the game to the opposition, we struggle. Has Amorim, both today and against Southampton, fielded a team capable of playing on the front foot and providing creativity? I don't think he has. Neither Dalot nor Mazraoui should be starting as wing-backs at home, and Ugarte and Mainoo shouldn’t be paired together, as they simply don’t offer enough in terms of creating chances.
Now, I’m not saying Amorim should be replaced, but I did question the defensive setup before the match, and the fact that we've scored only one goal, and that from a penalty, makes me feel like my concerns were justified.