Let's talk 'keepers: who do we buy and why?

[DSG]

Only keepers out there available for nothing or even cheap are bringing De Gea back or Meret abs if I’m honest I wouldn’t be against either of it means no more Onana in goal for us.

As for the outgoings you need to factor in PSR and what we owe out still on Onana, Antony, Sancho, Zirkzee and Hojlund which if my maths are right is around £39 million for Onana, around £32 million for Antony, around £15 million for Sancho, around £30 million for Zirkzee and around £43 million for Hojlund so we’d need that fee for each to not make a loss PSR wise so even moving them on means nothing for us transfer budget wise.

Because of how unlikely it would be in getting those fees in for those players it would mean we’d need to get big money for Rashford just to offset those losses which would really feck us transfer budget wise especially if we didn’t win Europa.

Yes, PSR will be a challenge. Isn’t Chelsea committed to Sancho for 25m? We’ll lose money on these deals for sure, but how much can we absorb through the player development, women’s team and training facility upgrades? I thought spending in those areas could be used to lower our losses? May need to sell Garnacho as well.

 

[DSG]

Maignan - Onana swap deal?

Would Milan do that??

 

[daba]

Would Milan do that??

I wasn’t being super serious but realistically Onana’s market value is probably about the same as Maignan’s due to the latter’s contract situation as you point out.

Italian clubs aren’t exactly in the best financial situations either at the moment, so losing their assets for nothing is a big risk. All it would need is Maignan to request a transfer and instantly Milan aren’t in a good negotiating position.

 

[MF1138]

It was completely mental how we not only hounded De Gea out of the club, but then how we fell in love with a keeper was known (or believed) to be brilliant with his feet but not highly regarded as a shot stopper. No doubt we would have found another ingenious way to waste the 50m we wasted on Onana, but at least in theory we could have spent the 50m we wasted on Onana on an area where we needed a real improvement.

Was insanity to allow the manager to change his mind last minute and then spend 50 million on a goalkeeper. We should have signed the deal with DeGea and brought in a viable challenger/replacement for no more than 20million max. But no, the nitwits we had in charge dumped our only viable first choice keeper, then went into the market leaving everyone knowing we were desperate.

 

[daba]

Was insanity to allow the manager to change his mind last minute and then spend 50 million on a goalkeeper. We should have signed the deal with DeGea and brought in a viable challenger/replacement for no more than 20million max. But no, the nitwits we had in charge dumped our only viable first choice keeper, then went into the market leaving everyone knowing we were desperate.

This is all such revisionism though. At the time, 9 out of 10 Utd fans were in agreement that keeping De Gea (even on reduced wages at 200-250k a week) was not the right move for the team and that we needed a more progressive keeper to take our playing out of the back to the next level. This felt like the biggest thing holding us back at the time so I was fully onboard with the Onana signing.

That clearly did not work out, which I actually place full blame on ETH for, as he simply couldn't get our in-possession structure to work and we still could not play out. Onana is still one of the best keepers in the world at playing out, but if the players in front of him can't find the right positions for him to find them or if he is being instructed to 'go long', then that isn't really on Onana.

One thing that obviously surprised us all is the lack of consistency in the rest of Onana's game. That is inexcusable and only our scouts and Inter fans would have been aware of this part of his game. If we saw this but overlooked it then I hope whoever made that call is no longer with the club, as being a goalkeeper at Man Utd is possibly the most scrutinised position in the Premier League and you need someone reliable in net. At the end of De Gea's time he seemed like he had lost that reliability, which a lot of people seem to be forgetting when they are commenting on this debacle.

 

[MF1138]

This is all such revisionism though. At the time, 9 out of 10 Utd fans were in agreement that keeping De Gea (even on reduced wages at 200-250k a week) was not the right move for the team and that we needed a more progressive keeper to take our playing out of the back to the next level. This felt like the biggest thing holding us back at the time so I was fully onboard with the Onana signing.

That clearly did not work out, which I actually place full blame on ETH for, as he simply couldn't get our in-possession structure to work and we still could not play out. Onana is still one of the best keepers in the world at playing out, but if the players in front of him can't find the right positions for him to find them or if he is being instructed to 'go long', then that isn't really on Onana.

One thing that obviously surprised us all is the lack of consistency in the rest of Onana's game. That is inexcusable and only our scouts and Inter fans would have been aware of this part of his game. If we saw this but overlooked it then I hope whoever made that call is no longer with the club, as being a goalkeeper at Man Utd is possibly the most scrutinised position in the Premier League and you need someone reliable in net. At the end of De Gea's time he seemed like he had lost that reliability, which a lot of people seem to be forgetting when they are commenting on this debacle.

Nine out of Ten is remarkably high. DeGea had plenty of supporters in his corner.

And no it's not revisionism, I thought it was a bad way to deal with the situation at the time. And there was a lot of annoyance with how we dealt with DeGea in the end.

Spending 50 million on a keeper you should at the very least be buying one of the three undoubted best keepers in the world and not someone who had a good year. We overpaid, it was clear at the time. It also appeared to be done on a whim at the time.

That he was so poor nobody expected but the way we went about replacing DeGea was amateur at best.

 

[davidmichael]

Yes, PSR will be a challenge. Isn’t Chelsea committed to Sancho for 25m? We’ll lose money on these deals for sure, but how much can we absorb through the player development, women’s team and training facility upgrades? I thought spending in those areas could be used to lower our losses? May need to sell Garnacho as well.

Depends who you believe mate as some reports say Chelsea will pay a penalty of £10 million to not sign Sancho permanently whereas some reports say no such clause exists, if we do get £25 million for Sancho then that’ll class as £10 million profit on him as we owe £15 million plus we’ll get his £300K a week wages off the wage bill.

In regards to the others we simply won’t sell them as no one will pay what we owe out on them so we’d make a loss on each one and we’re too close to PSR to do that so we’ll have to keep them another year and pay the yearly instalment then hope to move them for less the following year, I don’t think we’d sell Garnacho or Mainoo as Ineos know Amorim is hanging on by a thread and selling them would weaken us long term.

 

[mitchmouse]

Rumours that Martinez wants to leave Villa Park - would be my first choice (given we won't have millions to spend). Yes, he's as cnut, but he'd be our cnut.

If it's true that both City and Liverpool want new keepers, I'd make a cheeky bid. If all those fail, Nick Pope when James Trafford arrives at St James' Park.

Think it's important to get a keeper familiar and happy with the PL. Compare VdS with, say, Barthez. I admit than Edwin was very very special but even so...

 

[Wing Attack Plan R]

He pretty much single handedly cost us the Europa League win in the 2021 shootout and was awful when Sevilla knocked us out in 2023. He can't really be held up as some kind of standard bearer in Europe.

You have missed the point.

 

[Ghostrider318]

Rumours that Martinez wants to leave Villa Park - would be my first choice (given we won't have millions to spend). Yes, he's as cnut, but he'd be our cnut.

If it's true that both City and Liverpool want new keepers, I'd make a cheeky bid. If all those fail, Nick Pope when James Trafford arrives at St James' Park.

Think it's important to get a keeper familiar and happy with the PL. Compare VdS with, say, Barthez. I admit than Edwin was very very special but even so...

Martinez has been pretty poor in the second half of the season.

 

[stretford ender58]

James Trafford is a good shout, young agile brilliant shot stopper and a big Lad to boot, premier league experience and best keeper in the championship last season.

He is already a better keeper than Ronald McDonald and looks like a future England number one

 

[ROFLUTION]

James Trafford is a good shout, young agile brilliant shot stopper and a big Lad to boot, premier league experience and best keeper in the championship last season.

He is already a better keeper than Ronald McDonald and looks like a future England number one

Can he play it out safely?

 

[ROFLUTION]

Martinez has been pretty poor in the second half of the season.

Agreed. Too old. 32 now.

 

[stretford ender58]

Can he play it out safely?

Yeah he has good feet although he is definitely not a ball playing keeper, whatever that’s supposed to be anyway, but he is a good meat and Gravy keeper

 

[aeh1991]

Anyone of Trafford, Chevalier, Joan Garcia or Milinkovic-Savic would be financially realistic and a good competitor to Onana (though I hope he accepts a move to Saudi land)

 

[Wrecking ralf]

Joan Garcia looks really good. Almost De Gea in a way. I'd be happy with him

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Anyone of Trafford, Chevalier, Joan Garcia or Milinkovic-Savic would be financially realistic and a good competitor to Onana (though I hope he accepts a move to Saudi land)

We don’t need competition for Onana, we need his replacement. If Saudi don’t come in for him, then try and loan him out for the rest of his contract.

Garcia is an interesting one, as other clubs who are after him are looking at his as completion for existing keepers, rather than undisputed no 1 (Arsenal, Villa, Real).

If he’s good enough, we could have the edge in giving him the no 1 spot from the start.

 

[aeh1991]

We don’t need competition for Onana, we need his replacement. If Saudi don’t come in for him, then try and loan him out for the rest of his contract.

Garcia is an interesting one, as other clubs who are after him are looking at his as completion for existing keepers, rather than undisputed no 1 (Arsenal, Villa, Real).

If he’s good enough, we could have the edge in giving him the no 1 spot from the start.

yeah and out of those named, he arguably seems the most talented.

 

[KeanosMagic]

Szczęsny in goal for Barca and Sommer in goal for Inter tonight. I think we could do something similar by singing a cheap experienced goalkeeper this summer as a stopgap to replace Onana if our budget doesn’t allow spending a big fee of a new younger player.

 

[mctrials23]

Szczęsny in goal for Barca and Sommer in goal for Inter tonight. I think we could do something similar by singing a cheap experienced goalkeeper this summer as a stopgap to replace Onana if our budget doesn’t allow spending a big fee of a new younger player.

I would argue that its vital. Onana hasn't even been good at the things he was meant to be. Currently hes just a complete liability.

 

[aeh1991]

Remember when we had the chance to get Sommer on a free and everyone said he's too small. Then we signed Onana and you know the rest of the story...

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

Remember when we had the chance to get Sommer on a free and everyone said he's too small. Then we signed Onana and you know the rest of the story...

We just can't make footballing decisions.

 

[antohan]

This. Loads of keepers can offer that without breaking the bank.

Sommer showing how it isn't particularly hard or expensive to improve on Onana. Has been Swiss #1 for absolute ages yet never sold for more than €10M

 

[EtH]

Remember when we had the chance to get Sommer on a free and everyone said he's too small. Then we signed Onana and you know the rest of the story...

Yeah I just mentioned it in the CL thread. It’s kinda making me sick to my stomach watching him pull off save after save.

 

[Yagami]

Szczęsny in goal for Barca and Sommer in goal for Inter tonight. I think we could do something similar by singing a cheap experienced goalkeeper this summer as a stopgap to replace Onana if our budget doesn’t allow spending a big fee of a new younger player.

100%

Who knows. We could end up with another Edwin.

 

[davidmichael]

Remember when we had the chance to get Sommer on a free and everyone said he's too small. Then we signed Onana and you know the rest of the story...

It’s just a constant cycle of coach after coach and system after system and transfer after transfer with zero long term vision or planning, we constantly let whoever the coach is and non footballing people make all the decisions instead of allowing a Sporting Director to put a proper structure together and oversee it then the powers that be sack the coach and rinse/repeat.

 

[Top_Bins]

Szczęsny in goal for Barca and Sommer in goal for Inter tonight. I think we could do something similar by singing a cheap experienced goalkeeper this summer as a stopgap to replace Onana if our budget doesn’t allow spending a big fee of a new younger player.

Savic links today. Looks like we're looking at keepers.

 

[Kostov]

This is all such revisionism though. At the time, 9 out of 10 Utd fans were in agreement that keeping De Gea (even on reduced wages at 200-250k a week) was not the right move for the team and that we needed a more progressive keeper to take our playing out of the back to the next level. This felt like the biggest thing holding us back at the time so I was fully onboard with the Onana signing.

That clearly did not work out, which I actually place full blame on ETH for, as he simply couldn't get our in-possession structure to work and we still could not play out. Onana is still one of the best keepers in the world at playing out, but if the players in front of him can't find the right positions for him to find them or if he is being instructed to 'go long', then that isn't really on Onana.

One thing that obviously surprised us all is the lack of consistency in the rest of Onana's game. That is inexcusable and only our scouts and Inter fans would have been aware of this part of his game. If we saw this but overlooked it then I hope whoever made that call is no longer with the club, as being a goalkeeper at Man Utd is possibly the most scrutinised position in the Premier League and you need someone reliable in net. At the end of De Gea's time he seemed like he had lost that reliability, which a lot of people seem to be forgetting when they are commenting on this debacle.

Only the extremely naive and the ETH fan boys looked at that team struggling to score and create goals and thought a new ball playing GK will take us to another level playing out from the back or the biggest thing holding us back. Revisionism is not in question here.

 

[lex talionis]

Was insanity to allow the manager to change his mind last minute and then spend 50 million on a goalkeeper. We should have signed the deal with DeGea and brought in a viable challenger/replacement for no more than 20million max. But no, the nitwits we had in charge dumped our only viable first choice keeper, then went into the market leaving everyone knowing we were desperate.

Was insanity indeed. But to be fair, the fanbase raged against De Gea and jizzed themselves at the thought of a "modern keeper" coming to United. It was a mob mentality from the fanbase, one of the lowest points I can think of in all the time I have supported United. De Gea had made mistakes, no question about that whatsoever, but he was and is still a brilliant shot stopper. And for a very long stretch during our miserable stretch prior to the arrival of ETH De Gea was our only consistently outstanding player. But we kicked him to the curb a though he was trash. It wasn't just club management who treated Dave badly -- the fanbase hounded him out of the club. When I say "we", I don't mean every single one of us, but we are as much to blame as club management itself for trashing Dave.

 

[EtH]

Only the extremely naive and the ETH fan boys looked at that team struggling to score and create goals and thought a new ball playing GK will take us to another level playing out from the back or the biggest thing holding us back. Revisionism is not in question here.

It is revisionism. Dave was struggling and his limitations and timidity in and around the box were causing more problems for us than his poor distribution which was also an issue. He also had a lot more mistakes creeping into his game as the years went on which cost us in some big moments. He was viewed as a liability by many and rightly so as once a keeper so specialized in shot-stopping starts dropping clangers you’re not left with many positives to point to.

That said we were in dire need of a top quality striker and midfielder who can dictate as well. And still are.

 

[Orange Tree]

Remember when we had the chance to get Sommer on a free and everyone said he's too small. Then we signed Onana and you know the rest of the story...

I gave ETH and Murtough the benefit of the doubt. It's insane to spend that much when we needed a proper striker and another midfielder.

Summer 23/24 is one of our worst transfer windows ever.

 

[tidraKS]

Svilar is the best option out there. Very good reflexes, quite tall, hasn't yet extended with Roma.

 

[tidraKS]

Mile Svilar from Roma would be an excellent choice, young and improving but experienced enough and probably wouldn't cost more than 20/25M Euro at this point.

Is there any reliable link, I think he's very good too, would improve us instantly.

 

[iHicksy]

Agreed. Too old. 32 now.

Regardless if he's good or not, 32 is not old for a keeper. What a ridiculous thing to say. Most keepers peak in their 30;s.

Edwin was 34 when we signed him and played for another 6 years. At his peak.

Neuer is 39. Buffon played til he was 45. Courtois is 32, Becker is 32. Sommer is 35. Ederson is 31.

 

[bitcoin]

Mile Svilar from Roma would be an excellent choice, young and improving but experienced enough and probably wouldn't cost more than 20/25M Euro at this point.

According to Wikipedia, he’s 6’2” which is a bit on the short side for keepers for my liking.

Also, and this is purely conjecture, but he looks very fresh faced and the type who might get bullied in the PL?

Wouldn’t mind a huge, imposing, scary fecker in goal (someone who looks like Milinkovic Savic).

Obviously goalkeeping ability is paramount, but presence is a close second requirement imho.

 

[Kostov]

It is revisionism. Dave was struggling and his limitations and timidity in and around the box were causing more problems for us than his poor distribution which was also an issue. He also had a lot more mistakes creeping into his game as the years went on which cost us in some big moments. He was viewed as a liability by many and rightly so as once a keeper so specialized in shot-stopping starts dropping clangers you’re not left with many positives to point to.

That said we were in dire need of a top quality striker and midfielder who can dictate as well. And still are.

The entire team was struggling, a team that scored 58 goals that season. DDG's timidity and limitations on the ball was not holding a team consisting of a midfield with past it Casemiro, Eriksen, Fred, and an attack of Antony, Rashford. ETH was stupid to believe that a GK will somehow transform that dire set of options.

And yeah DDG dropped some clangers and any United fan with realistic views would have told you his decline was continued and also expected. Mistakes have been part of his game not just that year, and actually that last season was somehow better that the previous. His golden glove award backs that up even if it's not the greatest of achievements.

 

[ROFLUTION]

Regardless if he's good or not, 32 is not old for a keeper. What a ridiculous thing to say. Most keepers peak in their 30;s.

Edwin was 34 when we signed him and played for another 6 years. At his peak.

Neuer is 39. Buffon played til he was 45. Courtois is 32, Becker is 32. Sommer is 35. Ederson is 31.

I’ll give you those are good examples, but examples can probably be found in both directions (which is why many have retired around this age too), so it’s more about the assessment of Martinez at his current age. Having watched him much over the season I’d say he’s clearly declining compared to his heights.

 

[dinostar77]

Agreed. Too old. 32 now.

You do know we signed a 34 year old Van Der Saar?

 

[Enigma_87]

You do know we signed a 34 year old Van Der Saar?

We also signed 33 years old der Gouw, 32 years old Valdes, 30 years old Taibi, 31 years old Ricardo, so if we're counting at 20% success rate I don't think it's given the next 30 something goalkeeper will be success.

 

[Houdini]

Szczęsny in goal for Barca and Sommer in goal for Inter tonight. I think we could do something similar by singing a cheap experienced goalkeeper this summer as a stopgap to replace Onana if our budget doesn’t allow spending a big fee of a new younger player.

DDG?