New European Football Format (From 24/25)

bosnian_red

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Similar for Europa League and conference league.

Thoughts? From playing it in football manager this past year, I actually like it to be honest. Aside from the unnecessary add of matches, 2 per team in the groups, another 2 for the playoff teams, but the format being a league system where everyone plays 1 home and 1 away against 2 random sides in each pot is fair for me. Gives everyone a chance to get some results or real tests.

Balancing the added fixtures again should be easy - just get rid of teams in Europe playing in the league cup. Give the other clubs a chance at a trophy and some European football every year. Unlikely to happen but seems a no brainer to me.
 

Vidyoyo

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It sounded fantastic until they mentioned every team that finishes in the top 24 has a chance of getting through to the knockouts. So 8 teams go out for finishing 'bottom' basically. The same as it currently is, except 2nd and 3rd place teams have a knockout round.

Edit: I can't math.
 

bosnian_red

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Vidyoyo said:
It sounded fantastic until they mentioned every team that finishes in the top 24 has a chance of getting through to the knockouts. So 8 teams go out basically. The same as it currently is.
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12 teams go out, 9-24 go in a playoff before the round of 16, top 8 skip into the round of 16.

I just like the mix of matches in the league phase more than the current group stage draw basically. This is more balanced.
 

Vidyoyo

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bosnian_red said:
12 teams go out, 9-24 go in a playoff before the round of 16, top 8 skip into the round of 16.

I just like the mix of matches in the league phase more than the current group stage draw basically. This is more balanced.
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You're right, I don't understand numbers apparently :lol:

I agree the mix of matches seems like an interesting change
 

Maluco

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I like that teams don’t “drop down” anymore. I think that devalued the other competitions when the losers fell into those.

Keeping everything separate is a much better way to retain the value of each individual trophy.
 

Camara

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I hate assymetric tables (e.g. you don't play home and away to the same teams) and it's even worse in this case as you don't even play every team.
You don't depend on yourself anymore, you will have to keep checking on what others are doing in their games and you won't have a chance to fight them directly as you won't be able to play them.

Imagine you are a mid table team and luck decided that you will play your rival away and instead you will play home vs the giant.
Not only your home game will be useless as the giant will trample you but you will have a single, away game vs your playable rival, where it will have advantage that came solely from a luck draw.
 

Sounds of the Aquarium

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i like the look of it. it needed a bit of refresh anyway.

there will be more bigger name ties earlier in the group stages.
8 different opponents so chances to play against some new faces.
The lesser clubs will get to play against some teams who will be a similar standing to them, will save some clubs from going through x amount of qualification rounds to then get spanked by the big boys. they will be able to score points and might see some unusual teams in the knockouts.
 

bosnian_red

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Camara said:
I hate assymetric tables (e.g. you don't play home and away to the same teams) and it's even worse in this case as you don't even play every team.
You don't depend on yourself anymore, you will have to keep checking on what others are doing in their games and you won't have a chance to fight them directly as you won't be able to play them.

Imagine you are a mid table team and luck decided that you will play your rival away and instead you will play home vs the giant.
Not only your home game will be useless as the giant will trample you but you will have a single, away game vs your playable rival, where it will have advantage that came solely from a luck draw.
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It's unlikely that a giant will be in pot 2 or 3... So you'll have 1 home game and 1 away game against pot 2 teams, same for the others. Of course within the pots like pot 1, there is differences like City being there among some other teams. Is there any word on how the pots will be made, is it still 7 league winners and the Europa League winner? Or are they going to do a more balanced ranking system where it's actual European football performances.
 

Telsim

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Maluco said:
I like that teams don’t “drop down” anymore. I think that devalued the other competitions when the losers fell into those.

Keeping everything separate is a much better way to retain the value of each individual trophy.
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I think the losers from the play-offs still drop down to the Europa League.
 

Red the Bear

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I don't like the sound of it but hopefully it's decent and if not they could always revert back to the old system like when they scrapped the two group system in the early 2000s.
 

Lennon7

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So assume this is just for the group stages? And the qualification for each competition remains unchanged ie top 4 goes into champions league?
 

Powderfinger

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It'll change things up at least, the group stage format has gotten very stale. There will be a lot more marquee ties in the group stage as you play two Pot 1 and two Pot 2 sides guaranteed. Matches overall will have more meaning. Getting into the top 8 is a significantly bigger incentive than winning your group under the current format. And to get into the top 8 you'll probably need 17-19 points from 8 matches so there won't be that much room for slipping up.

I do think its likely that they will eventually add more games, which I'm less enthusiastic about. Once you change to a true league format, which is essentially what the first stage now becomes, the argument for adding another game or two is much easier to make. And that's probably where many people want to go eventually.
 
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MegadrivePerson

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For those that have played it on football manager, generally how many points do you need to be in the top 8, and how many to be in the top 24?
 

Chipper

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MegadrivePerson said:
For those that have played it on football manager, generally how many points do you need to be in the top 8, and how many to be in the top 24?
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8th has been qualifying with 16 or 17.

24th usually has 9 or 10

It's almost always been coming down to goal difference.
 

Chipper

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Thinking on, I believe you need 13 points to absolutely guarantee that you make the top 24 if my maths are correct. We're talking a ridiculously unlikely scenario where you can't get through with 12 but still a possibility.

12 wouldn't be enough if every single team won 4 and lost 4, no draws at all in the group stage and your side had a bad goal difference.
 

bosnian_red

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Chipper said:
Thinking on, I believe you need 13 points to absolutely guarantee that you make the top 24 if my maths are correct. We're talking a ridiculously unlikely scenario where you can't get through with 12 but still a possibility.

12 wouldn't be enough if every single team won 4 and lost 4, no draws at all in the group stage and your side had a bad goal difference.
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Based on football manager, usually 10/11 is hit and miss, 12 usually safe (like your 38 points for survival which could fail but 99% of time you're good). 17/18 I'd say for direct qualification. 16 don't think is enough usually.
 

MegadrivePerson

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Chipper said:
Thinking on, I believe you need 13 points to absolutely guarantee that you make the top 24 if my maths are correct. We're talking a ridiculously unlikely scenario where you can't get through with 12 but still a possibility.

12 wouldn't be enough if every single team won 4 and lost 4, no draws at all in the group stage and your side had a bad goal difference.
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Thank you.

So essentially if you win your first four you'll almost definitely go through and if you win two more you'll likely be in the top eight.
 

Klopper76

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It's been worse since they scrapped away goals imo. It'll be an interesting change.

I miss the days of two group phases.
 

Red the Bear

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Klopper76 said:
It's been worse since they scrapped away goals imo. It'll be an interesting change.

I miss the days of two group phases.
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I liked that format as well but u guess you could rightfully make the argument that the second group stage lacked the urgent an outright knock out format would bring.
 

tomaldinho1

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Judas said:
The CL has become really stale and dull, I hated this idea originally, but I welcome the change now. It needed refreshing desperately.
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Don't think the issue was the format, more the concentration of money is ever more and more in the PL. it will be interesting to see how it works though, sad we won't be in it!
 

Red Star One

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tomaldinho1 said:
Don't think the issue was the format, more the concentration of money is ever more and more in the PL. it will be interesting to see how it works though, sad we won't be in it!
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I think the format was partially the issue for the very low stakes group matches, there were a lot of them that felt meaningless or the groups would be outright decided after 4 rounds, leading to some laughably unserious games. I welcome the change and think it should be more fun now.
 

Sylar

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I for one welcome this new format.

It should bring up more exciting ties in the group games.
 

Ole'sgunnarwin

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He doesn't mention what happens to the losers of the playoffs. I would hazard a guess that they do in fact go down to the Europa because of the way he emphasises that those lower than the playoff places are eliminated completely. Unsure though
 
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